W3C

– DRAFT –
ARIA WG

07 July 2022

Attendees

Present
chlane, dakahn, IrfanA, jcraig, MichaelC, scotto, valerie_young
Regrets
-
Chair
-
Scribe
IrfanA

Meeting minutes

New Issue Triage

spectranaut: https://github.com/w3c/html-aam/issues/422

MichaelC: it came to the attention of the APA for horizontal review. It is an ARIA issue which has details. HTML AAM editors needs to look into this issue.

scotto: this is something similar that we did for HTML attribute

MichaelC: we do not need to rush to this for 1.2. Perhaps Scot has an idea

scotto: I would not consider it as high priority. need to figure out the scope and priority

MichaelC: may be we do not need to track this.

scotto: I am subscribe to it.

MichaelC: in this case we can close this issue

scotto: I'll leave it open as of now

https://github.com/w3c/html-aam/issues/421

scotto: The reason I filed this issue that john has filed an issue that input file should not be a button by default in mapping.

scotto: I did find some issues about how it was being rendered.

spectranaut: do we need to add it in our agenda item?

scotto: yeap

https://github.com/w3c/core-aam/issues/128

spectranaut: this is an agenda item for today

https://github.com/w3c/core-aam/issues/127

spectranaut: a11y mapping on microsoft

jcraig: including ff and chrome on windows

spectranaut: we do not have milestone for this one.

scotto: creating a milestone on coreAAM makes sense

spectranaut: https://github.com/w3c/html-aam/issues/419

scotto: if I understand, 1.3 is full so this may need to be pushed for 1.4

spectranaut: agreed

New PR Triage

https://github.com/w3c/html-aam/pull/420

spectranaut: it needs reviews

scotto: we would be fine mapping the address to the group.

jcraig: you can add me as reviewer.

https://github.com/w3c/aria/pull/1762

Deep Dive planning

spectranaut: Aaron, do you want to discuss dialog when you are available?

aaronlev: we can schedule it for the 28th

Tidying up section "Characteristics of Roles"

https://github.com/w3c/aria/pull/1733

tracking issue for <dialog> & role=dialog

Columnheader roles do not work with the abbr attribute

scotto: this is an issue that I took over. I cameup with some proposal to resolve this and to provide some potential functionality in ARIA to associate some cells

scotto: I created a proposed text in the bottom of the ticket

scotto: if people like this idea, then i can make a PR to this

scotto: I have only partial testing results.

scotto: its getting specified in aria that we can use as an outline for expected behavior

jcraig: why do we want to use aria-label instead of header alternative?

scotto: abbr attr is supposed to provide a shorter text, if we use aria-label, there is always a conflict with various AT

<Zakim> jcraig, you wanted to say column header is not "children presentational: true" https://w3c.github.io/aria/#columnheader

spectranaut: is it for 1.3?

scotto: would not push for 1.3 anymore

scotto: creating this proposal for cell headers, right in HTML you can specify a number of column or row header. I propose that we write that up.

scotto: curious if we can specify it somewhere else?

jcraig: Looked attr name which is very long

<chlane> scribe/ chlane

<chlane> jcraig: Is this use case more broad than table cell headers?

<chlane> heading or fieldset alternative

<chlane> how to make a little more useful

<chlane> can we live with aria-label

<jcraig> chlane: I think this solves the problem re: buttons in header cells

<jcraig> chlane: we haven't been solving this with aria-label or aria-labelledby...

<chlane> aria label on col header

<chlane> either content is announced

<chlane> or subtree is overwritten

<chlane> subtree is overwittern

<chlane> jcraig: presentational true behavior

<chlane> scotto: subtree content is respected or the opposite is true

<chlane> scotto: see jcraig 's point

<chlane> scotto: be specific on how label works on headers

<chlane> scotto: could this be more useful on fieldset, legend, table caption

<chlane> Siri: it should not replace acc name

<chlane> should convey row header col header?

<chlane> ctrl-arrow

<chlane> this is what will be read

<chlane> I want accname, not another value?

<chlane> Siri: read whole content if you want to?

<chlane> scotto: intent to have the alt string read when navigating cells of table

<chlane> it should not change accname

<chlane> it should allow for an alternative to be announced

<chlane> would not be part of accName

<jcraig> <th aria-headeralternative="foo">Foo <button>sort</button></th>

<chlane> jcraig: when you land on header you want it to say foo

<chlane> but as navigating accross columns

<chlane> it is including the sort button

<chlane> scotto: that is one way this could be helpful

<chlane> aria-actions could be used as an alternative

<chlane> the use case more towards the code in the issue

<chlane> leave sort button out

<chlane> when the text of that string was 'my activities(all logged activity)'

<chlane> I don't meed to hear 'all logged activity' all the time

<chlane> should just hear 'my activities', 'my dates'

<chlane> as I read columns

<chlane> jcraig: in context where it is more appropriate to be terse

<chlane> scotto: I think this goes to how list items allow for aria-label

<chlane> intent was to allow for a terse representation of <li>

<chlane> someone should still be able to read the <li> text content

<chlane> more extended use case

<chlane> beyond col headers

<chlane> jcraig: whatever bike shed name we need a number of examples

<chlane> of where its useful

<chlane> on colheader it makes sense to read the whole thing

<chlane> but in cell use terse

<chlane> static list item, how are we going to call out when to use terse

<chlane> aria-label and aria-terse-label

<chlane> how does AT determine which to read/

<chlane> ?

<chlane> short or long

<chlane> scotto: may not agree with what I just said about list items

<chlane> fieldset legend

<chlane> long lengend for radio group

<chlane> navigating into cells, hear terse

<chlane> choose fav color

<chlane> jcraig: good one

<chlane> Voiceover summary

<chlane> reads position and structure

<chlane> Siri: shortcut, if different from col header users might not get same info

<chlane> scotto: it can be abused

<chlane> jcraig: hard to enforce

<chlane> fieldset legemd

<chlane> favorite could be shortened to 'fav'

<chlane> hard to enforce, validator rule

<chlane> scotto: authoring guidance

<chlane> scotto: have to finish testing on how the html attributes are not working

<chlane> spectranaut: list of general cases summarized

<chlane> scotto: further comments on cell headers are needed

<chlane> zakim. next agendum

Internationalization Wide Review: "Whitespace characters" underspecified

<chlane> https://gitlab.eng.vmware.com/a11yreporting/reporting-tool/-/issues/208

Minutes manually created (not a transcript), formatted by scribe.perl version 192 (Tue Jun 28 16:55:30 2022 UTC).

Diagnostics

Succeeded: s/elevator/validator/

Maybe present: aaronlev, spectranaut