W3C

- DRAFT -

Accessible Rich Internet Applications Working Group Teleconference

21 Mar 2019

Attendees

Present
jamesn, Irfan_Ali, MarkMcCarthy, MichaelC, Joanmarie_Diggs, HarrisSchneiderman, Stefan, melanierichards, Bryan_Garaventa, jongund, Matt_King, matt-king, JaeunJemmaKu
Regrets
Chair
JamesNurthen
Scribe
melanierichards

Contents


<scribe> scribe: melanierichards

<joanie> https://w3c.github.io/html-aam/#el-sub

<joanie> No accessible object. Exposed by IsSubscript attribute of the TextRange Control Pattern implemented on a parent accessible object.

<jamesn> Please use this query for Issue Triage - the agenda link was wrong - https://github.com/search?l=&q=is%3Aopen+is%3Aissue+repo%3Aw3c%2Faria+created%3A%3E%3D2019-03-08+repo%3Aw3c%2Faria+repo%3Aw3c%2Faccname+repo%3Aw3c%2Fcore-aam&

melanierichards: joanie pasted in UIA mapping for sub

joanie: should there really not be an accessible object? blocked on that answer

melanierichards: will sync later

<jamesn> https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/918

jamesn: 1.2 for this issue? that ok with people?

joanie: seems fine unless turns out to be a big deal

https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/915

mck: I want to put a discussion of this on the agenda relatively soon

jamesn: I'll put 1.2 on it

<jamesn> https://github.com/w3c/accname/issues/48

jamesn: seems 1.2

bgaraventa1979: I'll look at that today

https://github.com/w3c/accname/issues/46

jamesn: 1.2, seems like a bug

CSUN - anyone have anything they want to raise to the group? (5 mins)

F2F Agenda (5 mins)

jamesn: Michael set up a page for the agenda, I added an outline agenda there

<MichaelC> https://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/wiki/Meetings/F2F_Spring_2019

jamesn: still more to add. Think about anything else you want to put on the agenda for F2F meeting, and add it
... there's an F2F candidate tag on Github
... f2fcandidate
... most presumably going to be role parity. Please all register so we make sure we have enough space for everyone, etc

TPAC 2019 - should we meet? (<5 mins hopefully)

jamesn: TPAC coming up in September, Fukuoka Japan

<MichaelC> https://www.w3.org/2019/09/TPAC/

jamesn: we think we would like to meet, it'll be a few months before ARIA 1.2 will be completely done. We feel like there'll be good reasons to meet

<bgaraventa1979> I hope to attend

jamesn: anyone else think they will potentially be able to meet?

mck: will definitely attend if we're meeting

<joanie> I will also attend if we're meeting

<HarrisSchneiderman> I will not be able to attend. My company is making me go to smashing conf in germany the week before that

melanierichards: should be +1

<jongunderson> I can't

melanierichards: (for attending)

<HarrisSchneiderman> smashing conf should be fun aside from the 8 hour workshop I'm giving ;)

jamesn: unless I hear privately from plenty more people that they won't be attending, seems like we can go ahead and meet
... please email Joanie and I privately with concerns

mck: I wonder if Japan would be a hard place for the NVDA people to get to or not

jamesn: probably not too bad, easier than US
... plan is currently to meet, we will let you know of any changes if we hear otherwise

Merge [Add Translatable Attributes section](https://github.com/w3c/aria/pull/906) (5 mins)

<jamesn> https://pr-preview.s3.amazonaws.com/w3c/aria/pull/906.html#translatable-states-and-properties

jamesn: adding translatable states and properties section [reads from spec diff]
... HTML specifies which attributes should be translated, seems like a good idea for us to do the same
... we can point translation tool to this part of the doc

carmacleod: I think we need to make it clear who is doing the translating. The author, the browser, the translation tool
... we translate all of our strings here, but you're talking about Google translate translating them

jamesn: could you propose something different?

joanie: we were talking about this and my reaction was initally very similar to Carolyn's, why is this being translated, why not being done by the author

<jamesn> can we reference the HTML spec for this https://html.spec.whatwg.org/multipage/dom.html#translatable-attributes

joanie: my understanding is that this is when the author hasn't translated it, we don't want the user agent to do it

jamesn: would it be helpful to put a reference to where defined in HTML spec?
... I think that puts it in more context

<joanie> +1 to referencing HTML

jamesn: I will change this, not sure which version of HTML we should reference

MichaelC: probably easiest to reference 5.2 for now and update based on guidance

<joanie> +1 to merging after reference has been added

melanierichards: I still wonder if, even with the reference, authors will still think it's the UA that does the translation

mck: [had thoughts about wording]

jamesn: if anyone has thoughts on wording, mind adding as a comment on the PR?

mck: for some readers, the purpose of doing all this may not be clear. I'll suggest in PR

Merge [Add the deletion and insertion roles (w3c#526)](https://github.com/w3c/aria/pull/916) (5 mins)

aaronlev: I copied from term, which inherits from section

<jamesn> https://raw.githack.com/w3c/aria/24b545eb68ee08246b52b214af6604835d5fb019/index.html#deletion

<jamesn> https://raw.githack.com/w3c/aria/24b545eb68ee08246b52b214af6604835d5fb019/index.html#insertion

<jamesn> A deletion represents the previous removal of content, or a potential future removal of content. Deletion is helpful for marking differences with a previous version of content, as well as suggestions from co-authors for removal of content.

mck: I'm struggling with "represents the previous removal of content". It's so ambiguous, the previous is previous in time, or the document? What's it in relation to?

jamesn: in my opinion, in context of the "potential future" it's clear

mck: what about "content that has been removed, or that is suggested for removal"
... well, it's not actually removed, it's marked as removed

jamesn: adding wordsmithing should go in PR
... sounds editorial
... can we agree to merge the PR with wording as is, or in a few days once people have gotten a chance to comment on wording in PR?

mck: I have questions about where all the states and properties are coming from

joanie: almost all of those are global
... I would argue that you're right, maybe aria-disabled shouldn't be global

mck: expanded not global

joanie: isn't global but supported on everything including section, might as well be global

mck: oh is this falling under section?
... don't we have other options under structure other than section?

carmacleod: application, document, presentation, range, group, section, section head, separator

mck: I want us to remember that these are candidates to inherit from that new phrase type role (abstract phrase, whatever we decide to call it)

jamesn: is inheriting from section good for now? Is text good, pending any wordsmithing over the next couple days?

joanie: the issue I accidentally added is "need to sanity check roles that support aria-expanded"
... like james said, nothing to do with Aaron's pull request

mck: is this a thing that should not label-able?

jamesn: potentially yes
... I think we'll go through the list when we decide on that and go through all the new stuff when we do that

joanie: how about everybody takes as a homework assignment, review Aaron's PR, add any wordsmithing comments, give Aaron a few days to review, and if we think it's ready to land, review briefly at an upcoming call to bless it

jamesn: I think we need to get into habit of working on PRs so that the meeting isn't the first time we're all looking at this

joanie: I think ok to discuss in multiple meetings briefly. Bring it to attention, give homework, discuss in next meeting

mck: I like bringing it to people's attention and letting them know about the potential issues, I think that's a great way to work

jamesn: next week will be "do we put this in or not?", not wordsmithing

Merge [Issue 876: add draft specification for role label](https://github.com/w3c/aria/pull/886) (5 mins)

<jongunderson> https://raw.githack.com/jongund/aria/issue876-role-label/index.html#label

jamesn: Jon's made some more updates

<jongunderson> https://raw.githack.com/jongund/aria/issue876-role-label/index.html#namecalculation

<jamesn> ecapsulation: name comes from the text value of the element node with role label that is the closest ancestor. Although this may be allowed in addition to "author" and "contents" in some roles, encapsulation is used only if higher priority "author" features are not provided. Priority is defined by the accessible name and description computation algorithm. [ACCNAME-1.1]

[Carolyn pointed out typo in the name encapsulation]

jamesn: comments other than editorial tweaks for the PR?

joanie: would it make sense to split out the name calculation stuff in a separate PR?

jamesn: I think it's related enough that we need to do them in the same place
... is it ready to merge?
... objections?
... we may find some issues when people try to implement, this is just the editor's draft

Discuss [Need role(s) for semantic emphasis (parity for strong and em elements)](https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/905) (10 mins)

Summary of Action Items

Summary of Resolutions

[End of minutes]

Minutes manually created (not a transcript), formatted by David Booth's scribe.perl version 1.154 (CVS log)
$Date: 2019/03/21 18:00:18 $

Scribe.perl diagnostic output

[Delete this section before finalizing the minutes.]
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.154  of Date: 2018/09/25 16:35:56  
Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/

Guessing input format: Irssi_ISO8601_Log_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Present: jamesn Irfan_Ali MarkMcCarthy MichaelC Joanmarie_Diggs HarrisSchneiderman Stefan melanierichards Bryan_Garaventa jongund Matt_King matt-king JaeunJemmaKu
Found Scribe: melanierichards
Inferring ScribeNick: melanierichards
Found Date: 21 Mar 2019
People with action items: 

WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines.
You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option.


WARNING: IRC log location not specified!  (You can ignore this 
warning if you do not want the generated minutes to contain 
a link to the original IRC log.)


[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]