See also: IRC log
<scribe> scribe: nigel
pal: Maybe we can close the loop
on the process issue
... Also possibly the aspect ratio issue
... And review the new issue on smpte:backgroundImage in case
we can close it straight away.
... So we can make some progress.
nigel: Agreed. So we'll focus on
IMSC 1.
... AOB?
group: none.
pal: Can we start with the
process question?
... In issue-92 nigel noted that the document still references
the 2014 process. It was
... mentioned that we automatically adopt the new process with
revisions, so it should
... be updated to 2015. I don't remember discussing it - maybe
it's not an issue because
... the changes are not meaningful to us this time, but in the
future, automatic adoption
... of new process documents in the middle of developing a new
document could be
... really disruptive.
nigel: I think this is really important - I couldn't find the source of this assertion either.
tmichel: As I recall the only
process change we approved was to 2014 but for the latest
... it was not discussed within the group.
pal: That matches my recollection too.
tmichel: Then if we want to adopt
the new process we should check with the group if
... everyone is happy with it. Who requested that we use the
latest process by the way?
nigel: I'm pretty sure that plh
asserted that having adopted the 2014 process we by default
adopt future versions as well.
... I can't see where that's written down though.
pal: I've searched through the Process document and can see no such thing.
nigel: Me too!
tmichel: It would be odd to me if it says that.
nigel: In that case it looks as though we have not agreed to adopt the 2015 process.
tmichel: Shall I investigate if we are required to move to the 2015 process or we can proceed with the 2014 one?
nigel: Yes please.
tmichel: Is the concern just for IMSC or also for TTML2 and WebVTT?
nigel: It's for everything - we
need to be clear which process we're working under.
... Also by the way I'm pretty sure there are no substantive
differences that would affect us with the 2015 process.
tmichel: It's not a major change like it was to adopt 2014.
nigel: There is actually a Latest Operative Version link so we need to go back and check which one we said we'd adopt: http://www.w3.org/2015/Process-20150901/
pal: Maybe it's simpler not to adopt unless we're compelled to, then we don't have to make any changes.
nigel: We have 2 choices (unless
we're compelled to move to 2015):
... 1. Stay with 2014
... 2. Propose to adopt 2015, use our Decision Process and then
adopt it and update our specs accordingly.
<scribe> ACTION: tmichel Investigate if we are required to move to the 2015 process [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/11/26-tt-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-451 - Investigate if we are required to move to the 2015 process [on Thierry Michel - due 2015-12-03].
tmichel: I'll be able to report back on this at the next telecon
pal: You can also put the answer in issue #92, which we may be able to close directly.
nigel: We need the info in the meeting also.
tmichel: I'll first find out the situation and then we can make a decision about changing the document.
pal: Sounds good.
https://github.com/w3c/imsc/issues/92
nigel: Shall we look at the aspectRatio issue?
pal: Yes, you mentioned to me that there may be some more feedback on this.
nigel: There's nothing formal yet
- a group is considering if it would be beneficial in addition
to ttp:aspectRatio also to signal a safe area,
... outside of which the document contains no regions. This
would allow for some scaling
... scenarios to be met that can't otherwise be handled.
... Until we receive something formal we can't formally respond
though.
pal: Okay then we can probably close issue #84 https://github.com/w3c/imsc/issues/84 next week.
nigel: Have I reviewed the note for that?
pal: Yes, and I think from your comments that you're happy so we can close it next week.
nigel: Yes.
pal: The next issue is regarding smpte:backgroundImage https://github.com/w3c/imsc/issues/97
nigel: Looking at this in detail,
the #image feature is defined by SMPTE-TT, but that
... has a weird referencing problem, in that it defines
conformance in relation to its
... section 5.7.3, but the backgroundImage semantics are
defined in a different section,
... being 5.5.3.
pal: So the bug here is in ST2052 §5.9.2 missing the reference to §5.5.2.
nigel: Agree - that's a bug in SMPTE-TT, but it doesn't help us here!
pal: We can just put a note that this bug exists.
nigel: Well that wouldn't help the formal problem.
pal: I think we're overthinking this - it's clearly enumerated as part of the vocabulary.
nigel: I'm not sure if it's a
note or something more formal but I would suggest
specifying
... that we mean to include the definition of
smpte:backgroundImage from ST2052 §5.5.3 in the vocabulary
supported by the #image extension.
... Ideally that would normative.
pal: I think it's unambiguous but if you had an issue reading it then we can add the note.
nigel: Okay I'll add a comment about this to the issue.
pal: Can we close the duplicate https://github.com/w3c/imsc/issues/93 ?
nigel: yes, no problem
<scribe> ... done.
pal: The rest are either for review or I have some actions to do for IMSC 2.
nigel: Andreas, are you going to migrate this to git?
atai: Yes, I need to check about the detail of how to do this. If I don't have enough information I'll come back to nigel and plh to ask for more.
nigel: Pierre, how did you do it for IMSC?
pal: I used a script that
converts a Mercurial repo to a git repo, so I just did
that.
... I created a local git repo, imported all of the IMSC 1
Mercurial repo into that, then I
... merged into that git repo the one that plh put up in
github, then pushed all my changes
... back into github.
... Did plh set up the repo on github already?
nigel: Yes he did, at https://github.com/w3c/ttml-webvtt-mapping
atai: He did not merge the repo.
pal: Yes, you have to do that
yourself. Create a local github repo, then use the
... Mercurial to Git script to move everything across, then
separately check out the
... github repo, and merge into the local copy of the github
repo the converted git repo,
... then push back upstream.
atai: That's feasible. My only question was how to restrict it.
pal: There's a git command that
allows you to pick a directory and delete all others, and
... make that one a root directory. I did that after the
Mercurial to git conversion.
... The command that re-roots keeps all history.
atai: Would you be able to describe this in a few lines?
pal: If you send me a reminder email I'll do that.
atai: Thank you! That's perfect.
pal: If you have branches that makes it really painful.
atai: We don't have any.
... Do we need to move anything else like the test suite?
pal: For IMSC?
nigel: They're moved already - they're in sub-directories of the top level.
atai: Pierre, Nigel and I did a presentation at IBC on TTML, EBU-TT-D and IMSC. Should we share the slides somehow?
nigel: Just natively?
atai: Maybe the easiest is to email it as a PDF to the list.
nigel: I did do that presentation
as chair of TTWG, so I don't mind sharing the slides.
... Maybe the best thing is to upload to the wiki?
pal: Yes, although I'd rather
avoid putting on the official TTWG wiki things that are
not
... official TTWG. My recommendation is for someone to host it
and send a link to the
... reflector. That would be my preference.
nigel: We did do the presentation
on the EBU stand so it might make sense to see if EBU
... can host the slides also.
pal: That would be a lot cleaner.
<scribe> ACTION: nigel Check with Frans about hosting the IBC slides on the EBU space, and send a link around. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/11/26-tt-minutes.html#action02]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-452 - Check with frans about hosting the ibc slides on the ebu space, and send a link around. [on Nigel Megitt - due 2015-12-03].
nigel: Looking at future
meetings, I've not put any in for 24th and 31st December,
with
... a restart on Jan 7. Hope that's okay with everyone.
pal: Yes, fine. I hope to publish a new CR of IMSC 1 by year's end, and see no blockers.
nigel: We need to merge all the
PRs next week and agree a resolution to proceed with a
... new CR. When do the PR review periods end?
pal: Some of them end on Tuesday.
nigel: Then we can put out a call
for consensus ahead of the meeting to avoid surprising
... anyone, and avoid falling foul of the Decision
Process.
... Okay, that's on the agenda for next week.
... That's all for this week, thanks everyone, see you same
time next week. [adjourns meeting]