<trackbot> Date: 14 October 2015

Steven: Nick says he is in a meeting that has overrun, so let's start

XForms day 5th Nov

http://xmlamsterdam.com/2015/pre-conference

Steven: Looks like a good program, a full day
... registration is open.

Editing

https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xformsusers/2015Jul/0005.html

Steven: Nothing to report

public-xformsusers

Mark will join us on the 21st.

Correct namespace of XPath Functions?

https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-forms/2015Oct/0000.html

Erik: I actually clarified that recently in the spec. Let me check what I said.

Steven: The answer is basically"No" I think

Erik: Hmm, we don't actually spell it out.
... but you wouldn't have to change functions like count

Steven: We just need to point out the change in semantics when a funciton has moved from XForms to XPath 2.0

Erik: I don't see why he thinks that the ns prefix changes, let me just read it again

Steven: Do we still say "The XForms Function Library includes the entire [XPath] Core Function Library"?

Erik: There is a new wording

<ebruchez> https://www.w3.org/MarkUp/Forms/wiki/XPath_Expressions_Module#The_XForms_Function_Library

Steven: So we do say it!

Erik: No; so it's obviously not clear enough
... In practice in XF1.1, functions that are in XPath like count, can be used without a prefix, as can XForms-specific functions
... I don't think that in XF 1.1 you are required to put the functions in the XF: prefix

<ebruchez> XForms 1.1: count(), substring(), index(), etc.

Erik: I don't think that XF1.0 supported functions in namespaces
... In XF2.0 you can do the same

<ebruchez> XForms 2.0: count(), substring(), index(), etc. but also xf:index(), xf:case(), etc.

Steven: Is there an XPath namespace?

Erik: fn:
... Not sure what it does, or is required.
... let me look at the spec

<ebruchez> XPath 2.0 defines http://www.w3.org/2005/xpath-functions for functions -- associated with fn

Erik: Interesting. XPath2 defines functions associated with fn:

Steven: So we have an xf: for functions, XPath has fn:, and if you leave the prefix off, you get both sets.
... in XForms 2.0

Erik: The new way is that you SHOULD use a prefix for the XForms functions (but not the standard XPath functions), but for backward compatibility you can leave it off.
... Part of the reason is because of name clashes between XPath and XForms

Liam: In XPath 2 there is a concept of default namespace for functions
... you can use fn: but no need.

Steven: So we should use a xf: namespace, and import all XPath functions into it.

Liam: you could do that

Erik: We would use the XPath namespace, and allow the XForms functions not to need a prefix

Steven: Sounds a bit ad hoc
... What seems a better approach is to have all functions (XF and XP) in the XF namespace, and one extra namespace, XF1, for the backwards compatibiity functions from XF1.1

<ebruchez> can you write count(), and index()?

<liam> xf1:index(), index-of() is in XPath

Steven: So you never have to use a prefix except when you want to use one of the earlier versions of functions that are now in XPath

<ebruchez> count(), xf:index()

<ebruchez> xf:foo()

Erik: But we want to prevent future clashes

<ebruchez> foo() vs. xf:foo()

Steven: So it's like this - xf1: only contains all XForms functions, fn: only contains all XPath functions, and XF: contains both (less the clashes, where XPath functions are used, not the xf1 ones)

Erik: So we have two XForms namespaces

Steven: Yes

Erik: Yes, we need to introduce and document that
... to avoid future clashes.

<ebruchez> xf:count()

Erik: The alternative would be to say that all XPath is in fn:, only XForms functions in xf:

Steven: We don't have the right to add anything to the fn: namespace

<ebruchez> xf:foo()

Steven: xffn:foo()

<ebruchez> xf:foo()

Erik: I would prefer to use the XForms prefix

<ebruchez> xf:index()

Erik: so we put the union of functions in the NEW namespace, which would be the default namespace
... and then use xf: for the XForms-only namespace

Steven: I agree.

<scribe> ACTION: Steven to Repy to email on namespaces in XForms 2.0 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/10/14-forms-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2036 - Repy to email on namespaces in xforms 2.0 [on Steven Pemberton - due 2015-10-21].

<ebruchez> http:..../xforms-functions

<ebruchez> http://www.w3.org/2002/xforms-functions

Community Group

[General discussion of the sort of articles that should be on the CG pages, and of migrating to the CG wiki]

[ADJOURN]

This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.140  of Date: 2014-11-06 18:16:30  
Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/

Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Succeeded: s/TH/Th/
Succeeded: s/namespace/namespace?/
Succeeded: s/prefix/prefix for the XForms functions (but not the standard XPath functions)/
Succeeded: s/XFO/XFo/
Succeeded: s/Liam/Liam:/
Succeeded: s/XFO/XFo/
Succeeded: s/TH/Th/
Succeeded: s/n/N/
No ScribeNick specified.  Guessing ScribeNick: Steven
Inferring Scribes: Steven
Present: Erik Alain Steven Philip Liam
Regrets: Nick
Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xformsusers/2015Oct/0010
Found Date: 14 Oct 2015
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2015/10/14-forms-minutes.html
People with action items: steven