Digital Publishing Interest Group Teleconference

03 Aug 2015


See also: IRC log


Ivan Herman, Dave Cramer, Peter Krautzberger, Charles LaPierre, Alan Stearns, Heather Flanagan, Tim Cole, Alan Stearns, Julie Morris, Michael Miller, Brady Duga, Shinyu Murakami, Paul Belfanti, Ayla Stein, Bert Bos, Tzviya Siegman, Bill Kasdorf, David Stroup, Ben De Meester, Karen Myers


<trackbot> Date: 03 August 2015

<pkra> don't get him started ;)

o/ hello

<pbelfanti> Present

<scribe> scribenick: NickRuffilo

<ayla_stein> Present

<pkra> clones should be telepathically linked?

<tzviya> agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-digipub-ig/2015Jul/0078.html

<tzviya> http://www.w3.org/2015/07/27-dpub-minutes.html

Tzviya: "Minutes from last week, comments?"
...: "Minutes approved."
... "There were some emails about the ARIA described-at property. They are not officially the ARIA-taskforce will soon be the ARIA working group. They have invited the publishing community to join their meeting at."
... "The described-at is at risk for being removed. Deborah and the accessibility task force have done a good job writing about why it is important. If you have examples of how it's in use and the usability, please pass it along. If your org is using it, please attend! August 13th at 12:30 EST"
... "If people want additional background, let me know."
... "meeting is scheduled for 90 minutes, but this topic will be early in the agenda so publishers can get out after."

Pagination, prioritization, and other CSS excitements.

<tzviya> http://w3c.github.io/dpub-pagination/priorities.html
...: "The next item: 'Pagination, prioritization, and other CSS excitements."

(very excited) dave: "Hello..."

Dave: "As far as CSS priorities, we discussed in the beginning of July, there were some edits to GitHub, and I'm not sure where we go from here... Anyone? Thoughts?"

Tzviya: "A few people were talked to offline."

Dave: "I've been adding stuff about Math and I think there are a few more things we can do about that. There has been chatter about font-metrics API spec that could be helpful on the font side."

Brady: "I haven't yet provided my thoughts."

Peter: "I just wanted to ask if I should bother more people about font metrics. It's pretty clear that it really wouldn't do the job for us. The 2nd and 3rd path about the conversations, it isn't clear if we are talking about the same things..."

Alan: "Keep talking. We may not get to them in the 1st pass, but knowing where we're going is really important."

<pkra> *maniacal laugh* :)

Tzviya: "Brady, is there something specific you'd like to see or do you want to do it on the list?"

Brady: "I'll do it on the list."

<HeatherF> Since I'm trying to write out the requirements for a CSS design for RFCs, I'm watching this space with interest and not nearly enough knowledge!

<tzviya> priorities: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/15IsDMPwSXx197Iqe4I9xh7K8anmJ5c0-OFEG7w0LHYM/edit?usp=sharing

Dave: "I need to get my head back into this document and then. CSS and Houdini are coming up at the end of this month, so this will be a good guide for dicsussions with those groups."
... "Deadline: a week from Friday. August 14th. For having the document in order."

Ivan: "The experience we had was that having a published document has more weight. Do we want to publish a DRAFT of the document before the face-to-face? Is it worth doing, do you feel it can be done?"

Dave: "I'm always happy to publish."

Ivan: "Question is also to Alan. Is it good enough for the CSS working group? We did have issues not publishing enough the last rounds."

Alan: "Having a publicly available draft is most important for the Houdini working group. having an officially published draft, not sure how useful that is."

ivan: "The feedback on latinreq is that 'nothing happened therefore we believe everything is solved'."

Dave: "Should we publish a new working draft of LatinReq? Changes have been made."

Ivan: "it gives us visibility and beats some other bushes, which may be useful. I'll aim to have both documents ready to go to publish a working draft by the end of next week.

Portable Package Requirements

<tzviya> https://www.w3.org/dpub/IG/wiki/Portable_Package_Requirements

Tzviya: "Portable package document requirements. It has been transferred over to the wiki. We spoke at length last week. We've discussed what is required for a portable document. There are 3 states. Online, Offline [cached] and portable[network indepentent]. If we're living in a service worker world, then we can create it from the online state."
...: "The concept of metadata is either relevant to the package or separate. A manifest may not be a requirement. Navigation isn't necessarily relevant to the package. But having software that is able to consume information is what is most important. I do not want to be the only person editing this. We should have use-cases for all of these."

Nikc: "What is portable?"

Tzviya: "Online is online - offline is brief disruption. Portable is no network exists."
... "Online, Cached, and offline? Online, Cached, portable?"

Dave: "Is there an actual distinction here? If something is being accessed from an external server? And a 3rd case where there is no server connection. I think of a traditional epub as the portable document, but some things we're looking at are more like websites and cache."

<Bill_Kasdorf> +1 to online, cached, and portable because "offline" implies both cached and portable states

Ivan: "What is the target of this specific document? I know there is 1 thing we ought to do - go back to the web-application group. We need to have clear uses/use-cases that some packaging format is necessary. Essentially saying that some sort of a packaging format is necessary. If that is the goal, then there are some issues in the list that are definitely exciting and interesting but not relevant for that specific issue - such as metadata (which is within the file and not an issue here)"

Tzviya: "Agreed - i think most of the things listed here are irrelevant to packages. It came about on the use-cases for packaging. They were hold-over from epubs. Such as rights-management which is not relevant to packaging. Stable links or a method for identifying the package as well as the components for the package."

Ivan: "And streaming..."

Tzviya: "So the next steps are to tease out what is important and useful to packaging."

Tim: "On that same vein. In reading the document right now, I'm unclear the definition of a publication. Notes that can be added - links that can be changed. There are some things on the list of items that bleed over into what might change a bit - update new components. Where is this and the idea of package relative to the dynamic nature of publications today."

Tzivya: "Even with an archived form, there is a method of update. Archive with a formal archive, we could have versions - version 1.0, but online could have a different version. "

Tim: "And when the resource comes online, the package needs a way to update."

<HeatherF> I'll look at it and see if I can come up with use cases.

Tzviya: "The archived media specification was put on hold."

Heather: "There was enough energy to get the group started, but not do any of the work. It can restart if people show a willingness to work, but I don't see it go any further. The draft they did is still available and we can use that."

Ivan: "It might be helpful, if nothing else, to get the terminology right. I know you have sent around the link, but please do it again. - to the mailing list."

Group Charter

<tzviya> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-ac-members/2015JulSep/0021.html

ivan: "reminder for the goal: we want enough votes to extend the group by just switching to the new charter. It would be the cleanest and best way. There is a rule at W3C that when there is a charter out, then 5% of the membership should be in favor of the charter. The practice says we should have 20 votes in. Of course, the important players should cast their votes. At this moment we have 13 votes in. "

...: "The practice/experience is that just waiting for votes to come in rarely works. We try to contact some members/AC reps to try to get them to vote. Members that I think are important. The most important thing is that everyone who is active on this group to get their votes in."
... "I have 5 people who are on the call who belong to members who have not yet voted... Ben, Dave, Mike Miller, Brady, and Alan"
... "Mike - you are the AC rep and can vote directly."

<astearns> I'll remind Carl today

<bjdmeest> I'll remind Erik today as well :)
...: "For the others, it's up to you to tell me if you want me to contact internally or I'll do it directly. Marcus and Bill need to vote. I will try to contact IBM, Rich's participation is important. Microsoft, mozilla, Rakuten... I have already contacted some others who have already voted. You tell me what I should do."

Brady: "I will handle it internally."

Alan: "I'll contact internally."

Ivan: "The fear I have - because I'm in France - isn't Pierre on vacation?"
... "If the votes come in, then we are done. For the image of it, we certainly need IDPF's vote. Marcus?"
...: "The more the merrier - as of no, no objections or critical comments only positive."


<tzviya> http://www.w3.org/2015/10/TPAC/

<HeatherF> +1

<brady_duga> +1

<astearns> +1

<ivan> +1

<clapierre> +1

<Bill_Kasdorf> -1

<dauwhe> +1 if trade publishing still exists in October

Tzviya: "If you're planning on goign to TPAC, please +q"

<pkra> -1
..: "+1...."


<HeatherF> There is a wiki page for travel logistics

<pbelfanti> If I can get travel approval

<tzviya> https://www.w3.org/dpub/IG/wiki/Oct_2015_F2F_Logistics_and_Details

Tzviya: "We can start putting ideas for sessions on the Wiki page above. Flight info, etc."

<Bert> +1 (forgot to press Enter :-) )
...: "we want to hear ideas for sessions - one session per taskforces. Who do you want to meet with? If this ends up being 1 day about accessibility, then one day about CSS we want to be more diverse... Alan says ArinBnB are much cheaper..."

<murakami> +1

Ivan: "I booked all flights - one flight jumped 300 euros in one day. Prices are going up

Tzviya: "Agenda items for next week? deborah - accessibility update?"

Charles: "I'm on vacation next week."

<HeatherF> that happens 47 minjutes into every call

<pkra> please breath slowly and ominously.

Heather: (darth vader) "We had some dsicussion at the face-2-face/..."

<HeatherF> yes

<HeatherF> At the NYC f2f, we talked about education

<HeatherF> Can we get an update on how to do more there?

<pkra> bye.

Nick: "Yes, lets have an agenda item update for next week on education..."

<ivan> trackbot, end telcon

Summary of Action Items

[End of minutes]

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