<trackbot> Date: 28 July 2015

<clown> agenda: this

<clown> agenda: this

<scribe> scribe: joanie

Meeting for the next two weeks.

JS: As of next week and the following week, I'm on vacation.
... Do people want to meet anyway?

BG: Nah.

JD: I can go either way.

BG: I can also go either way.

CS: I would be happy to have the time. I'll be out August 10th through 23rd.

JS: I can hold the meeting on the 18th, but you won't be there.
... Can I leave it to you guys to work this out? Set up agenda and room, etc.?
... Any volunteers?

BG: I'll pass.

JS: Otherwise I'll send an email cancelling the meeting.
... I'll do that. If you all decide otherwise, you can set that up.
... I encourage you to look at your action items and do them, also see what's overdue, etc.

ACTION-1680/ACTION-1686: (All) Assign actions for mappings of aria-errormessage

<clown> action-1680?

<trackbot> action-1680 -- Joseph Scheuhammer to Draft aria-errormessage property for review - may be at risk in aria 1.1 though -- due 2015-07-16 -- CLOSED

<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1680

<clown> http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/aria/aria.html#aria-errormessage

JS: I had an action to draft the aria-errormessage text. It's at the URL above.
... And it's tentatively accepted as part of the spec, though it's still an editor's draft.
... Assuming it stays, we need to figure out how it's mapped.
... I'd like to create those actions right now.

<clown> ACTION: Cynthia to propose UIA mapping for aria-errormessage. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/07/28-aapi-irc]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-1691 - Propose uia mapping for aria-errormessage. [on Cynthia Shelly - due 2015-08-04].

<clown> action-1691?

<trackbot> action-1691 -- Cynthia Shelly to Propose uia mapping for aria-errormessage. -- due 2015-08-04 -- OPEN

<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1691

<clown> ACTION: joanie to propose ATK/AT-SPI mapping for aria-errormessage [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/07/28-aapi-irc]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-1692 - Propose atk/at-spi mapping for aria-errormessage [on Joanmarie Diggs - due 2015-08-04].

<clown> action-1692?

<trackbot> action-1692 -- Joanmarie Diggs to Propose atk/at-spi mapping for aria-errormessage -- due 2015-08-04 -- OPEN

<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1692

<clown> ACTION: Surkhov to propose MSAA+IA2 mapping for aria-errormessage [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/07/28-aapi-irc]

<trackbot> Error finding 'Surkhov'. You can review and register nicknames at <https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/users>.

<clown> ACTION: Surkov to propose MSAA+IA2 mapping for aria-errormessage [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/07/28-aapi-irc]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-1693 - Propose msaa+ia2 mapping for aria-errormessage [on Alexander Surkov - due 2015-08-04].

<clown> ACTION: JamesC to propose AXAPI mapping of aria-errormessage [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/07/28-aapi-irc]

<trackbot> Error finding 'JamesC'. You can review and register nicknames at <https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/users>.

<clown> ACTION: JamesCraig to propose AXAPI mapping of aria-errormessage [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/07/28-aapi-irc]

<trackbot> Error finding 'JamesCraig'. You can review and register nicknames at <https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/users>.

<clown> ACTION: James Craig to propose AXAPI mapping of aria-errormessage [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/07/28-aapi-irc]

<trackbot> 'James' is an ambiguous username. Please try a different identifier, such as family name or username (e.g., jcraig, jhawkins2, jnurthen).

<clown> ACTION: jcraig to propose AXAPI mapping of aria-errormessage [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/07/28-aapi-irc]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-1694 - Propose axapi mapping of aria-errormessage [on James Craig - due 2015-08-04].

New: (All) Need actions for mappings of aria-kbdshorcuts

JS: Similarly, we need actions for aria-kbdshortcuts.

<clown> http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/aria/aria.html#aria-kbdshortcuts

JS: URL for this property in the spec is above.

<clown> ACTION: Cynthia to propose UIA mapping for aria-kbdshortcuts [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/07/28-aapi-irc]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-1695 - Propose uia mapping for aria-kbdshortcuts [on Cynthia Shelly - due 2015-08-04].

<clown> action-1695

<trackbot> action-1695 -- Cynthia Shelly to Propose uia mapping for aria-kbdshortcuts -- due 2015-08-04 -- OPEN

<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1695

<clown> ACTION: joanie to propose ATK/AT-SPI mapping of aria-kbdshortcuts [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/07/28-aapi-irc]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-1696 - Propose atk/at-spi mapping of aria-kbdshortcuts [on Joanmarie Diggs - due 2015-08-04].

<clown> ACTION: Surkov to propose MSAA+IA2 mapping of aria-kbdshortcuts [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/07/28-aapi-irc]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-1697 - Propose msaa+ia2 mapping of aria-kbdshortcuts [on Alexander Surkov - due 2015-08-04].

<clown> ACTION: jcriag to propose AXAPI mapping of aria-kbdshortcuts [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/07/28-aapi-irc]

<trackbot> Error finding 'jcriag'. You can review and register nicknames at <https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/users>.

<clown> ACTION: jcraig to propose AXAPI mapping of aria-kbdshortcuts [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/07/28-aapi-irc]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-1698 - Propose axapi mapping of aria-kbdshortcuts [on James Craig - due 2015-08-04].

(Group briefly discusses that implications of the not-interactivity for a mapping via AtkAction)

CS: I've not yet read the spec text, but there may be some issues.

JS: I think there will be some further discussion about this.
... Dominic is in favor of this, as is Rich.
... James Craig started out against it. The last thing I read, he seemed like he was on the fence.

CS: I'll read through it.

ACTION-1625: (Joseph, All) Update re: aria-interactive property.

<clown> action-1625>

<trackbot> action-1625 -- Joseph Scheuhammer to Add interactive property to core mappings that propogates from grid or table to all grid aria grid or table structural elements. the interactive property should have same mapping as defined in issue 633 -- due 2015-09-08 -- OPEN

<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1625

JS: This is a heads-up.
... The stuff related to grid and table is no longer relevant.
... But there is still some interest in having this property for other elements as a way to communicate "hands off" to ATs.
... But we need spec text before we can map it.
... James N is working on this text.
... So keep this in the back of your mind.
... I think James is going to present his text this Thursday.

ACTION-1660/ISSUE-714 (Joanie) ATK/AT-SPI mapping of aria-roledescription.

<clown> action-1660?

<trackbot> action-1660 -- Joanmarie Diggs to Propose the ATK/AT-SPI mappings for aria-roledescription. -- due 2015-06-30 -- OPEN

<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1660

https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/aria/aria.html#aria-roledescription

JD: I've already stated an object attribute in the comments. What additional information would you like from me?

JS: Ok, so I guess I need to check with Alex about IA2.

<clown> scribenick:

<clown> scribenick: clown

<joanie> https://developer.gnome.org/atk/unstable/AtkObject.html#atk-role-get-localized-name

JD: Having deja vu that we already talked about this.
... The URL above documents the loclaized name.
... It takes the name of the object and localizes it, not the role name.

JS: I may have mis-scribed.

JD: It takes a role like ATK_ROLE_CHECKBOX...
... And asks the UA for the localized name of that.

<joanie> <button aria-roledescription="Attach a file button">Foo!</button>

CS: It's similar to UIA's localized control type, which is up to the developer.
... And Apple has something similar.
... While I have misgivings, I think it's something that is needed.

JD: Take a look at the example in the spec for the "slide" description.
... That's being used for a role of "region".
... Does that mean that all regions are now slides?
... No. So the role description is associated with the element in question, not a particular role.
... Hence, the ATK role-get-localized-name() doesn't apply since that works with an ATK role.

JS: I get it. Okay, then we can't use ATK's role-get-localized-name() function.

<joanie> http://accessibility.linuxfoundation.org/a11yspecs/ia2/docs/html/interface_i_accessible2.html#acb64a9802aefaf4c61a78273aa3ee7d7

<joanie> scribe: joanie

<clown> JD: I'm looking at IA2 now, and see if I can get a link to get extended role.

JD: I *think* the API above might be appropriate for IA2.
... So in answer to your original question, Joseph, I'm not sure if IA2 has a need for an object attribute.
... As a result, I may need to check with Alex Surkov and James Teh.

JS: Ok, I'll update the due date to next week so you can do that.

ACTION-1662/ISSUE-714 (Alex) IA2 mapping of aria-roledescription.

JS: I did send an email earlier today. Basically asking if he's had time to consider it. I CCed Joanie. I mentioned the mappings might be similar, etc.

Bugzilla-28816 (All) Some ARIA roles lacking explicit a11y API role mappings.

<clown> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=28816

JS: To summarize things, Jason Kiss pointed out a list of ARIA roles which he noticed there was no explicit mapping in the spec.
... He thinks there should be official roles.

<clown> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=28816#c16

JS: It's bounced back and forth.
... (Reads from comment 16 of above URL)
... Alex is saying, use the role itself for the role property.
... And then expose it via xml-roles property.

CS: But that's not how ARIA works. We can talk about that for ARIA 2.0.
... This issue was dealt with in a meeting between HTML and ARIA in/around 2004 or 2005.
... This is the implicit semantics and strong native semantics. It's covered in both the HTML and ARIA specs.

<clown> http://w3c.github.io/aria/aria/aria.html#host_languages

CS: ARIA wins, except for several special cases which were discussed at the meeting in 2004/2005.

JS: Is the above URL the relevant part of the spec?

<clown> http://w3c.github.io/aria/aria/aria.html#implicit_semantics

CS: I think 7.4 or 7.5.

<clown> http://w3c.github.io/aria/aria/aria.html#host_general_conflict

JS: Do you know where it is in the HTML5 spec?

<tzviya> http://www.w3.org/TR/html5/dom.html#wai-aria

<cyns_> http://www.w3.org/TR/html/dom.html#wai-aria

CS: It's section 3.2.7.
... It's covered in length in both.
... I'm fine with opening this up for Web Apps, WAPA, ARIA 2.0.
... But for ARIA 1.x it's decided.

JS: Does that mean what Alex is saying and Firefox is doing is wrong?
... If you use role="banner", if you use it with a table element, the role is table.
... So they're defining the accessibility role based on the element.

CS: I think that's incorrect.
... What we do is map it to group and then expose it via localized role attribute.

<clown> <table role="banner">

JD: We have ATK_ROLE_LANDMARK.

JS: I encourage you (Cynthia) and Joanie to look at this bugzilla issue and discuss.
... If you'd like, I'll bring it up on Thursday.
... I don't think we can fit it in this week, so it will be towards the end of August.

This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.140  of Date: 2014-11-06 18:16:30  
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Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Found Scribe: joanie
Inferring ScribeNick: joanie
Found ScribeNick: 
Found ScribeNick: clown
Found Scribe: joanie
Inferring ScribeNick: joanie
ScribeNicks: joanie, , clown
Present: Joseph_Scheuhammer Joanmarie_Diggs Bryan_Garaventa Tzviya_Siegman Cynthia_Shelly
Found Date: 28 Jul 2015
People with action items: craig cynthia james jamesc jamescraig jcraig jcriag joanie surkhov surkov

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