W3C

- DRAFT -

SVG Working Group Teleconference

14 May 2015

Agenda

See also: IRC log

Attendees

Present
Thomas_Smailus, [IPcaller], heycam, AmeliaBR, stakagi, ed, Doug_Schepers, nikos_, [Microsoft], Tav
Regrets
Chair
Cameron
Scribe
Tav

Contents


<trackbot> Date: 14 May 2015

<AmeliaBR> All about Web Ex: https://www.w3.org/2006/tools/wiki/WebExBestPractices

<scribe> scribenick: Tav

Switching to webex

shepazu: Our phone lines die in late June. When do we want to transition?

heycam: Next week?

shepazu: Not here next week, better week after.

<AmeliaBR> https://www.w3.org/2006/tools/wiki/WebExBestPractices

AmeliaBR: TIps for how to use webex... not connection between IRC and phone bots.
... can't type in IRC to mute, etc. won't recognize phone numbers but should be more reliable

Smailus: Will we be able to do screen sharing?

shepazu: It can but isn't considered to be best practices at the moment.

Smailus: Can you send out info so we can get setup? Going through firewalls etc...

shepazu: Can call in or connect through computer. Sound quality OK for both.

SVG 2 Issues

heycam: We are looking at appendices?

<heycam> https://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/wiki/SVG2_Chapter_Assessment

<Rossen> https://svgwg.org/svg2-draft/svgdom.html#SVGObjectInitialization

<scribe> Done

<Rossen> https://svgwg.org/svg2-draft/implnote.html#issue1

Rossen: HTML5 svg documents stop rendering...
... Sounds like a bit of rewriting, not really something for discussion.

heycam: We know we need to update error processing so we don't blow-up with small errors.

AmeliaBR: Specific issue are wording. More general question is do we want to move to a more forgiving error handling?
... Worry about big changes first... wording later.

Rossen: Whole chapter needs editorial work.

heycam: This chapter hasn't seen much attention.

Rossen: Most of the issues just need someone to do them.

<ed> I don't think this appendix really describes what current implementations do in any case, so "requirements"

heycam: Are you going to look into updating error processing?

Rossen: Current wording doesn't align with DOM error processing.

heycam: Are you willing to do that?

Rossen: Yes.

<Rossen> action - Bogdan to attempt to align Error processing appendix with DOM/CSS error processing and recovery

<trackbot> Error finding '-'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/users>.

<heycam> ACTION: Bogdan to attempt to align Error processing appendix with DOM/CSS error processing and recovery [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/05/14-svg-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-3791 - Attempt to align error processing appendix with dom/css error processing and recovery [on Bogdan Brinza - due 2015-05-21].

<AmeliaBR> https://svgwg.org/svg2-draft/implnote.html#issue10

heycam: Interested in range-clamping...

hecam: Does CSS have rules for clamping?

AmeliaBR: Perhaps wording should be cleaned up. Main thing is don't clamp until the end... important for multi-step filter processes.

heycam: Maybe should be moved to filter spec.
... Out-of-range values during calculations may be implementation dependent.
... Not sure what to do with this section (C.4 Clamping...)

AmeliaBR: Hint, generally, try to preserve information as long as possible.

heycam: This is more about trying to keep in the range.... doesn't necessarily mean you should fall back to lacuna values.
... We should not fallback to lacuna values as suggested in wiki.

Smailus: Does this deal with overflow on coordinates?

heycam: This is more about color value and compositing.
... There are requirements somewhere about precision.

AmeliaBR: Difference between spec restrictions vs. practical limits.

Rossen: coordinates should be not be clamped...

Smailus: But we are using very large coordinates.

heycam: Is that precision vs. range.

AmeliaBR: We should have precision in this appendix.

heycam: I think it is in the next appendix.

Smailus: Precision and range are coupled so they should be talked about together.

<AmeliaBR> Precision section in Ch3: https://svgwg.org/svg2-draft/types.html#Precision

<Rossen> https://svgwg.org/svg2-draft/conform.html#issue1

heycam: We need somewhere to put what is allowed well now that the DTD is gone.

AmeliaBR: What we do is have categories and content models.

heycam: The blue definition boxes should include which child elements are allowed, this was taken from the DTD.

Rossen: Is the issue about collecting all the information in one place?

heycam: No, more about saying that a conforming document matches the blue boxes.

AmeliaBR: So we can just add a bullet point there saying that.
... If anybody wants to compile all the blue boxes into a document, that might be a good idea.

heycam: The scripts could be tweaked to do that. If people think it is important, I can do that.

Rossen: The indices point to the information.

heycam: It is not to hard for people to find already.
... The accessibility appendix, Rich was going to provide a rewrite. We'll ask him next time he's on a call.

<Rossen> https://svgwg.org/svg2-draft/eltindex.html#issue1

Rossen: Suggest to leave as is... it is not an issue to include filter effects etc. here.

Tav: I strongly agree.

<AmeliaBR> s/to live/to leave/

<ed> +1 to keeping the elements that were moved out to other specs

Rossen: Gut feeling that this is useful for developers and not users.

AmeliaBR: People will be looking for things and be puzzled if things that were here before are no longer hear.

heycam: I'll try to come up with something that will call out the things defined in other specs.. if it doesn't take too much time.

<Rossen> https://svgwg.org/svg2-draft/idlindex.html

Rossen: Remove appendix?

heycam: I can move the info.

<Rossen> https://svgwg.org/svg2-draft/feature.html

Rossen: Feature strings... everybody just returns 'true'
... Webkit code just handles just a couple of strings. You can pass bogus feature strings and it returns true.

AmeliaBR: If we remove this the we remove the idea of having a switch based on features.

Rossen: From browser point of view not so important... but non-browsers might require it.
... You can do this other ways with browsers, but taking it out of the spec could be a bit drastic as other might use it.

AmeliaBR: Because it hasn't been implement properly.. but for static viewers it is important.

heycam: Why include both parts?

Tav, for editing purposes. We want to include SVG 2 part but still include SVG 1.1 backup.

AmeliaBR: Currently used to see if foriegnObject supported.
... Uses required features as required extension are completely useless.

<Rossen> https://svgwg.org/svg2-draft/changes.html

<heycam> heycam: anyone who has a view on what to do with the Feature Strings appendix, please send a suggestion to the list and we can discuss next week

<heycam> heycam: let's try to get the "needing investigation" issues investigated in time for discussion at the F2F

Sorry, my Internet connection failed....

<heycam> heycam: I will send out a link to the F2F Agenda proposals page with a reminder

heycam: Not sure how...

trackbot, end telcon

Summary of Action Items

[NEW] ACTION: Bogdan to attempt to align Error processing appendix with DOM/CSS error processing and recovery [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/05/14-svg-minutes.html#action01]
 
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Default Present: Thomas_Smailus, [IPcaller], heycam, AmeliaBR, stakagi, ed, Doug_Schepers, nikos_, [Microsoft], Tav
Present: Thomas_Smailus [IPcaller] heycam AmeliaBR stakagi ed Doug_Schepers nikos_ [Microsoft] Tav
Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2015May/0019.html
Found Date: 14 May 2015
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2015/05/14-svg-minutes.html
People with action items: bogdan

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