See also: IRC log
<trackbot> Date: 29 January 2015
<LJWatson> who is on the phone?
<paulc> is on mute
<JF> scribe: JF
CM: anything missing from agenda?
CM: survey for HTML F2F meeting - HTML folk favored Redmond, and WepApps faovred Spain
no appetite to split meeting however, so wondering next steps
CM: stay tuned. Reminder if there are topics to bring up, speak up to get added to agenda
JB: thought there were already 1 or 2 items already surfaced for that agenda.
<paulc> There is no F2F Wiki yet
<paulc> So nothing has been recorded.
CM: not made a formal request to add anything to agenda
JS: me either
CM: discussed keyboard navigation focus stuff as a potential topic
JS: may have a better sense later today/this week
CM: assumption that there would be 1 breakout room, but assuming if we had any issues that they would be discussed more broadly
CM: observation that bugs were filed across multiple places. Liam was to bring feedback.
LQ: slightly delayed, but have
been reviewing the documents and suggesting some edits
... Shane and I had a brief call to discuss this, and Shane is
making some progress
SM: have been working on that. Discussion around creating a new component or not (being discouraged to do so)
<chaals> ACTION: Liam to rationalise alt doc bugs to a single component/etc [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/01/29-html-a11y-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-302 - Rationalise alt doc bugs to a single component/etc [on Liam Quin - due 2015-02-05].
LQ: confusion around last call and tentative req
CM: sounds like review is imminent - that we should be actively looking at your work
LQ: propose to add to next weeks agenda
[nods around the table]
<chaals> ACTION: shane to present alt doc changes [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/01/29-html-a11y-minutes.html#action02]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-303 - Present alt doc changes [on Shane McCarron - due 2015-02-05].
<chaals> close action-92
<trackbot> Closed action-92.
<chaals> action-273?
<trackbot> action-273 -- Léonie Watson to Look more closely at https://www.w3.org/bugs/public/show_bug.cgi?id=13508 and add comments -- due 2015-01-22 -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/273
Action-273
<trackbot> Action-273 -- Léonie Watson to Look more closely at https://www.w3.org/bugs/public/show_bug.cgi?id=13508 and add comments -- due 2015-01-22 -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/273
<LJWatson> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13508
LW: nothing left to be done - bug can be closed (and action item too)
<chaals> close action-273
<trackbot> Closed action-273.
LW: turns out support is quite reasonable - down to filing bugs at vendors, and not against spec
<chaals> RESOLUTION: close bug 13508
CM: asking Judy if Josh Meile has seen the MAUR
<chaals> close action-295
<trackbot> Closed action-295.
JB: yes, know that Janina and Josh have also been introduced
JS: yes have had some back-and-forth via email
<chaals> action-296 due in 1 week
<trackbot> Set action-296 Present substantive alt note bugs due date to 2015-02-05.
he will get back to us
JS: hope to have more news by next week
<Zakim> ShaneM, you wanted to ask about how long we need to wait
JB: Josh is ensuring that good guidance on Video Description - time is urgent(ish)
SM: wondering how long we need to wait
JB: initially took connecting Janina and Josh was 3 days
if JF can connect with Josh quickly that would be good
JS: we have a bit of time left
still, so waiting on Josh is not a huge issue. M. Cooper and JS
have agreed on a publishing schedule which may give us some
extra time
... going through a new process, so forcasting is still
inaccurate
CM: remaining action items on Chaals - delayed
JB: can the TF help any?
CM: there are 2 urgent ones, not huge, but will take some time still
CM and another one that still has some time
CM: sent out a message talking
about current work plan, and it is not clear if that is what we
will continue to work on
... one is longdesc - question whether that needs to be revised
- but does not feel like a high-priority work effort
... "html to platform accessibility APIs" and "using aria in
HTML" - do we work on them?
JS: can I give an update?
CM: they don't appear to be topics we are focused on - not on calls nor via list
by definition, if it is in HTML, it is open to the TF for review
JS: useful that it is reviewed
here - we can create a category of PF horizontal reviews, but
question the usefulness
... response from Steve that he is still working on using aria
in HTML
... may be a time lapsing issue - maybe some reminders
needed
CM: question is, should we be
working on these things directly, or leave them out?
... Steve F isn't on the call, but has suggested that he is
happy working directly inside the HTML WG
<janina> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-admin/2014May/0062.html
CM: we should coordinate with
Steve - we can move items to this group easily enough
... Stronger feeling that we NOT look at work outside of the
HTML WG scope
... this has impacts on things like Patent Policy, which
matters
... so we should not be taking on items out of scope
JS: we have addressed this in the
past (see URL)
... not acceptable to PF that these be HTML only work
efforts
<paulc> ACTION-299?
<trackbot> ACTION-299 -- Charles McCathie Nevile to Work with richs and make sure html/tf know about plans for accessiiblity mapping documents. -- due 2015-01-22 -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/299
JS: Steve has been working on
this on his time, but work on html to platform accessibility
APIs for example continues
... notes that Rich has been working on the document as
well
PC: last time we discussed this,
we had best advise HTML WG
... very little of the HTML work happening on this list or the
HTML list
... so suggest that if publication is coming, that perhaps
someone else did it
it would be good if PF did it directly
CM: sounds like PF wants them on
our work plan or a PF work plan
... historically, PF has done work on these things - and so
perhaps that is good - that PF continues to own this
JB: to +1 on coordination with PF
CM: to return to list of topic
items
... the alt document - it seems that it belongs here for
now
... any dissent?
DM: wondering if we need to talk to WCAG about this?
CM: very important
JB: strong interest in that as well from the co-chairs
<chaals> ACTION: chaals to contact WCAG chairs and work out how to coordinate discussion on alt doc [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/01/29-html-a11y-minutes.html#action03]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-304 - Contact wcag chairs and work out how to coordinate discussion on alt doc [on Charles McCathie Nevile - due 2015-02-05].
JB: have been encouraging Andrew and Josh to attend these meetings, or add to their agenda
<chaals> action-304 due in 4 days
<trackbot> Set action-304 Contact wcag chairs and work out how to coordinate discussion on alt doc due date to 2015-02-02.
CM: there are 4 items on the wish list
Focus management (aka accesskey)
transcripts, menus and footnotes
<Judy_> [Judy emphasizes giving them a specific meeting or portion of meeting to attend should be helpful]
are 4 topics we are looking at - none are really documents yet, but may become so
CM: any there we should dismiss? anything that isn't there that we should be working on?
<David> http://davidmacd.com/blog/html51-footnotes.html footnotes
JS: thought we had created a list, but not sure
CM: it maps to the things we
agreed - or that some have volunteered to work on
... think that date-pickers should be worked on
... we may also may want to look at "common panels" work -
leonie?
LW: would be good to get some imput from the TF - input would be welcome
CM: can assume that work will
happen outside of TF and PF
... both - it is straight HTML work
... that gives us a sense of where we are headed - goal is to
establish a scope for next 6 months of work
... hoping for resolution from director on longdesc by no later
than end of Feb.
JB: I am encouraging a timely resolution, and happy to convey your comment on that.
CM: anyone want to talk about
anything specific on this list?
... the ARIA implementation guidance piles loads of javascript
examples for keyboard trapping - so with regard to date-pickers
we need to involve the ARIA folk
... assertion is that lots of people are spending time making
keyboard shortcuts with JS - not very efficient
... wondering if anyone here can comment further
JS: ARIA is moving away from specificity to generality
<cyns> url?
RS: the one area that is "most expensive" to support a11y is the keyboard implementation
RRS: did fill gaps to make things focusable without putting into tab order
<chaals> [keyboard implementation is problematic outside accessibility, too… we have been trying to deal with it in DOM for a decade or so without success]
RS; what we lack is an easier way to do this - to make it easier for authors to not have to support keyboards all the time
RS; we need a design pattern that is less dependant on modality, and focused on outcome
RS: in Indie UI WG there has been a hiccup as we've lost some people, but goal is to abstract a further to aid authors
CM: there are bits and pieces
gathering all over - task to track them down and house in one
place
... example component will show a demo of HTML, CSS, and a ton
of JS built on top of jQuery - feels very heavy weight and is
addressed to keyboard stuff
CS: presume you are talking with Ben Peters
CM: yes
RS: It would be really good if we bring all efforts into one spot, as I beleive it ties into webapps
<cyns> +1 to RS
<Zakim> janina, you wanted to discuss date pickers
<chaals> [+1 to RS]
JS: continue to be interested in date-pickers - don't want to work alone, but happy to bird-dog work effort
CM: was under impression that this wasn't a priority earlier, but seems that may no longer be the case
JS: happy to be involved around that if we are moving it forward now
LW: have been working on an internal doc around date-pickers, so can start working on that here
<chaals> scribe: chaals
<paulc> Is there a summary of the work items that Charles will add to the work statement?
<JF_> CM: asking Janina and Shane to coordinate with DAvid and DPub
<JF_> SM: give to me, but give me 3 weeks at least
<scribe> ACTION: shane to talk to davidM and Dpub, and present footnotes here (do we need to do more, …) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/01/29-html-a11y-minutes.html#action04]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-305 - Talk to davidm and dpub, and present footnotes here (do we need to do more, …) [on Shane McCarron - due 2015-02-05].
<JF_> CM: paul asked a CfC on this? Anser is not yet, but closest progress indications is the Wish list items that have specific owners
action-305 due in 2 weeks
<trackbot> Set action-305 Talk to davidm and dpub, and present footnotes here (do we need to do more, …) due date to 2015-02-12.
<JF_> CM: the upshot is that we will talk about footnotes on this call in 2 weeks
<JF_> CM: anything else?
<JF_> JS: Canvas a11y progress has been impacted with the loss of Mark S.
<JF_> JS: this has raised some concerns - working on an email to that effect now
<Zakim> JF_, you wanted to ask about anything happening at CSUN
<JF_> JB: hope to have some more clarrifications
<JF_> CM: nothing formal
<paulc> See http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-canvas-api/2015JanMar/0000.html for Sam's email on lack of progress on Canvas API
<JF_> PC: asking Judy a question about the Canvas API - are you saying that you will respond to the link I posted on IRC?
<JF_> JB: believe there is a related thread, and I or someone will be responding on that
<JF_> there are multiple threads, so will be responding
<JF_> CM: ajourned
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.140 of Date: 2014-11-06 18:16:30 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/html platform accessibility guide/"html to platform accessibility APIs" and "using aria in HTML" - do we work on them?/ Succeeded: s/seems to be on track/I am encouraging a timely resolution, and happy to convey your comment on that./ Found Scribe: JF Inferring ScribeNick: JF Found Scribe: chaals Inferring ScribeNick: chaals Scribes: JF, chaals ScribeNicks: JF, chaals WARNING: No "Present: ... " found! Possibly Present: CM CS Cynthia_Shelly DM David David_MacDonald IPcaller JB JF JF_ JS Judy Judy_ Judy_alt LJWatson LQ LW Leonie Liam MarkS Microsoft P15 PC RRS RS Rich_Schwerdtfeger SM Sam ShaneM cabanier chaals cyns html-a11y https inserted janina joanie joined newtron paulc richardschwerdtfeger rubys sivoais trackbot zecho You can indicate people for the Present list like this: <dbooth> Present: dbooth jonathan mary <dbooth> Present+ amy Found Date: 29 Jan 2015 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2015/01/29-html-a11y-minutes.html People with action items: chaals liam shane WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines. You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option.[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]