<trackbot> Date: 11 December 2014

<richardschwerdtfeger> meeting: W3C WAI-PF ARIA Caucus

* me too

ok

<richardschwerdtfeger> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-pfwg/2014Dec/0081.html

<mattking> zakim will not let me join on the phone

<mattking> it says the conference is restricted

<scribe> scribe: Stefan

<clown> action-1520?

<trackbot> action-1520 -- Jon Gunderson to Create a definition of "value" as per issue-679 -- due 2014-11-10 -- PENDINGREVIEW

<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1520

<clown> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-pfwg/2014Dec/0096.html

Rich: Jon was proposed to come back with proposal

<clown> Definition of "Value of a control"

<clown> The value of an element or form control is the information provided by

<clown> the user when they manipulate that control. The following list is an

<clown> example some of the properties that define values for controls :

<clown> * Value of the VALUE attribute for an INPUT element

<clown> * Value of the ALT attribute for INPUT[TYPE="IMAGE"]

<clown> * The text content of the selected OPTION elements in a SELECT box or

<clown> LISTBOX

<clown> * Child text node content of a TEXTAREA

<clown> * Value of ARIA-VALUETEXT attribute

<clown> * Value of ARIA-VALUENOW attribute

(Josef put description in)

Rich: did we put it in the glossary?

Joseph: widget values had nothing to do with names

Rich: we'd better put in glossary not to change the spec
... Michael, anything detailed as that acceptable in glossary?

Michael: Think so

Rich: should be break up terms?

Michael: definitely
... value less ambiguous if multiple references, value vs. control and so on

Matt: there is a difference between a control and a widget (anthology)

JC: widget can be anything, e.g. graph

Matt: value of button is used in name calculation .. but input name=tex don't use value .. confusion in name computation ahead

<clown> <input type="text" value="this is the text typed by the user:>

Matt: there are conditions where you use value in name calculation
... we should keep that distinct
... different label concepts for input type=text and <button> element, in the latter the labels come from content

(discussion about where the value comes from for different elements)

Josef: (cites name computation list for different elements)

Matt: label of a link comes from content, too

Josef: what is the value of a link?

<richardschwerdtfeger> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphical_control_element

Josef: but I agree with you Matt that this needs to be defined
... starting pint were form controls but I don't want this to be too restricted

Matt: don't be too generic here .. bottomless pit

Josef: we can take out the link to glossary reference :)

Rich: is there value defined in host language?

Josef: core acc. name doc does not refer to any spec. language .. it is just the core
... there is value attribute on all inputs .. but other elements not

JC: if you reference in JS you write "myTextArea.value" which is not the same as myTextArea.getAttribute("value")
... I think we can phrase it using the "'value' DOM attribute" or "'value' property", not the "'value' content attribute."

Josef: we have weired examples .. e.g. textarea

<clown> http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/accname-aam/accname-aam.html#step2E

Rich: let's check wording

(still discussion about button and its "value")

Matt: we have to list the differentcases

Rich: HTML itsself was not very consistent itsself

Joseph: we need more markup examples

Matt: we can distinguish between cases .. if vaue property is defined in host language attribute or not

<Zakim> jamesn, you wanted to ask what about other roles?

<Zakim> joanie, you wanted to comment on text equivalent as value

Stefan: http://www.w3.org/TR/html5/links.html#links-created-by-a-and-area-elements
... The href attribute on a and area elements must have a value that is a valid URL potentially surrounded by spaces.

Matt: name calculation thing is special cased always

<clown> "A literal that solidifies the information expressed by a state, property, role, or text content."

<clown> http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/core-aam/core-aam.html#mapping_additional_widget-value

Rich: if you say aria value is consistent with these properties we need to consitently update this
... know what to do for name calculation? Joseph: right
... remove from glossary? Joseph: you are breaking a link

Matt: who cares if somebody links to a pointless thing? Anyway, we have link checkers, don't we?

Joseph: W3C link checker has room for improvement ...

MC: That's why I double check links with some external tools, too

<clown> http://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria-1.1/#checkbox

MC: .. for broken links ..

Rich: keep action 1520 ? Joseph: think can close it ..

Joseph: delete from glossary

RESOLUTION: Close action 1520

<richardschwerdtfeger> ACTION: jcraig remove the link to the value definition in the glossary under role checkbox and look for other such references (we deleted the definition) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/12/11-aria-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-1543 - Remove the link to the value definition in the glossary under role checkbox and look for other such references (we deleted the definition) [on James Craig - due 2014-12-18].

<clown> #dfn-value

<clown> action-1424?

<trackbot> action-1424 -- James Craig to Propose spec text for generic/general/??? role (computed role of html:div, html:span, svg:g, etc) and clearly explain explicit usage of this role is not common, and clearly explain relationship to group and none role. -- due 2014-04-21 -- OPEN

<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1424

<mattking> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-pfwg/2014Dec/0028.html

<jcraig> action-1543: dc1e6d7..b2a7e8d master -> master

<trackbot> Notes added to action-1543 Remove the link to the value definition in the glossary under role checkbox and look for other such references (we deleted the definition).

<jcraig> close action-1543

<trackbot> Closed action-1543.

<clown> <input type="checkbox" role="section" aria-labelledby="foo">

<richardschwerdtfeger> zakime, bye

This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.140  of Date: 2014-11-06 18:16:30  
Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/

Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Succeeded: s/mytextarea.getAttribute/myTextArea.getAttribute("value")/
Succeeded: s/mytextarea/myTextArea/g
Succeeded: s/value DOM property/"'value' DOM attribute" of "'value' property", not the "'value' content attribute."/
Succeeded: s/attribute" of "'value'/attribute" or "'value'/
Found Scribe: Stefan
Inferring ScribeNick: Stefan

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Default Present: Rich_Schwerdtfeger, Joanmarie_Diggs, +1.703.978.aaaa, Michael_Cooper, Joseph_Scheuhammer, +49.322.110.8.aabb, Stefan_Schnabel, Fred_Esch, Matt_King, [Apple], James_Nurthen, [Microsoft]
Present: Rich_Schwerdtfeger Joanmarie_Diggs +1.703.978.aaaa Michael_Cooper Joseph_Scheuhammer +49.322.110.8.aabb Stefan_Schnabel Fred_Esch Matt_King [Apple] James_Nurthen [Microsoft]
Found Date: 11 Dec 2014
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2014/12/11-aria-minutes.html
People with action items: jcraig

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<dbooth> Topic: Review of Amy's report