See also: IRC log
<tzviya> http://www.w3.org/2014/10/06-dpub-minutes.html
tzviya: reviewing minutes from last weeks
meeting
... any comments?
... minutes approved.
<tzviya> http://w3c.github.io/dpub-content-and-markup/
tzviya: minor update made to content and
markup document
... any more feedback on the doc?
... I shared this with some Wiley colleagues
<tzviya> http://sempublishing.sourceforge.net/
tzviya: people didn't know what SPAR was
<pkra> +q
tzviya: the SPAR suite of ontologies is
built for digital publishing
... link has descriptions
... there is a vocab for digital publishing
... and there's a bibliographic vocabulary
... lots are in RDFa
... would like to hear this group's feedback. It looks like someone has
already done much of the work we want to do
pkra: never mind :)
<ivan> David Shotton
ivan: He's at Univ. of Oxford
... he came into this from scholarly publishing perspective
... I don't know if he thought of this as more general
... looks more like libraries than trade
... by the way, I know him.
... I don't know how widely accepted/implemented this is
... most people in this group haven't heard of this
... so might not be easy step from academy to 'real world'
ivan: not sure why Tzviya says that they have done the work that we want to do
tzviya: they've done some.
... the document components ontology, for example
... intro / ack / figure etc
... overlaps my PF work
... the biblio work is relevant to Wiley's journal and book work
... I think this is worth exploring
<pkra> this sounds like echo from mic+speakers.
TimCole: I encountered this a while back
... connected to Paolo's work
... it's very focused on scientific use cases
... it overlaps with us but is much more extensive
... we can learn from this and leverage some of it
... but all of it would be overkill
tzviya: is it overkill?
TimCole: yes
ivan: let's be careful in separating the
different concerns
... DPUB is working to find the right mechanism by which a set of terms
can be put in a publication
... that mechanism is independent of set of terms we would use
... SPAR defines a bunch of terms
... from our point of view that's fine, but it's a different set of
problems
... the way we discuss things with PF
... is a simple, flat set of terms like chapter/section/
... but these guys have much more complex vocabulary based on complex
RDF data
... it's more document metadata rather than document structure
... it's like ONIX only for scholarly publishing
... specific vocabulary work is beyond what the group can do
... I see it's more important for library community
tzviya: that makes sense for individual
document component markup
... I think the bibliographic ontology is important for this group
... that's where library world and content world merge
... it's worth sharing this with annotations group as well
... a biblio entry has an identifier
... the reference to it relates to the identifiers they are working with
in the annotations world
... any other comments?
ivan: we can discuss at F2F
... many people are not on the call today who have strong views
tzviya: agree
tzviya: we'll come back to this as needed
pkra: there's a math structural semantics
group
... they are talking about speaking math
... a publisher might want to override the speech
... where it might be giving away the answer
... is this related to structural semantics?
... is it worthwhile connecting up?
ivan: math structural semantics group
tzviya: is this like saying four over five and the answer is 4/5
pkra: you might have to identify the
thousands in a number
... this is like informing user agents how to deal with different
content
ivan: this may be bigger than you imagine
... something bothers me
... we have discussion with PF
... we are honing into usage of role attribute
... the role attribute is for HTML
tzviya: it's an ARIA attribute used in HTML
ivan: can it be used in XML?
<pkra> http://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria/appendices
tzviya: I don't know
<pkra> 10.1.5. WAI-ARIA Attributes XML Schema Module
ivan: Peter has the answer.
pkra: better to use ARIA than homebrewed solution
ivan: let's clarify with PF
tzviya: markus will know
<TimCole> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/SCHEMA/aria-attributes-1.xsd
<TimCole> This xsd suggests it is intended for multiple vocabularies
<pkra> Ivan, as in MathML and SVG? :-)
lots of people: talking about namespaces
clapierre: we can use ARIA for SVG, MathML,
HTML
... that's the right approach
ivan: excellent
pkra: the other way round
... looking at Math side, I don't think there's a natural move toward
ARIA rather than homebrewed solution
... they might not want to depend on other WGs
tzviya: sounds like pronunciation lexicons
... or putting in local language
... I can indicate that in an english book this individual word is
french
... we're trying to indicate that this is math vs this is a question
... should this be a spelled-out word (four over five) vs fraction (four
fifths) ???
<clapierre> +1
<pkra> +1
tzviya: next step: clarify what Math is looking for. Are they looking for terms? or for pronunciation cues, or something else?
pkra: the discussion has just started.
tzviya: It's a good discussion to have
... could bring up during a11y discussion
<clapierre> agreed
pkra: one use case
... substituting a part of an expression
... how do you share that information with a user agent like an a11y
tool?
<pkra> +1
ivan: are there any syntactic problems here?
tzviya: that's an interesting topic, worth
exploring when we talk to PF
... we are through our agenda. any other comments?
... next week many of us will be at TPAC, so no call
... we will have a call on Nov. 3
clapierre: I will be at TPAC
... on thursday evening Benetech will have "born accessible" team
... at a local pub
tzviya: can you email group?
clapierre: yes
Julie: I won't be able to attend TPAC
... will there be remote participation?
ivan: yes
... Zakim will be attending our meetings
tzviya: Final agenda will come this week
... along with dial-in information
<Karen> See you in Santa Clara!
tzviya: thanks everyone.
<ivan> trackbot, end telcon