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13:49:34 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/12/18-dwbp-irc
RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/12/18-dwbp-irc ←
13:49:36 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs 351
Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs 351 ←
13:49:38 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be DWBP
Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be DWBP ←
13:49:38 <Zakim> I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, trackbot
Zakim IRC Bot: I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, trackbot ←
13:49:39 <trackbot> Meeting: Data on the Web Best Practices Working Group Teleconference
13:49:39 <trackbot> Date: 18 December 2015
13:58:46 <phila> RRSAgent, make logs public
(No events recorded for 9 minutes)
Phil Archer: RRSAgent, make logs public ←
14:00:15 <phila> hi
Phil Archer: hi ←
14:02:14 <deirdrelee> Agenda: https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon20151218
14:02:35 <deirdrelee> chair: deirdrelee
14:03:23 <ericstephan> present+ ericstephan
Eric Stephan: present+ ericstephan ←
14:03:32 <deirdrelee> present+ deirdrelee
Deirdre Lee: present+ deirdrelee ←
14:03:36 <phila> present+ phila
Phil Archer: present+ phila ←
14:06:21 <Caroline_> we will be in the webex
Caroline Burle: we will be in the webex ←
14:06:50 <hadleybeeman> zakim, who is here?
Hadley Beeman: zakim, who is here? ←
14:06:50 <Zakim> Present: ericstephan, deirdrelee, phila
14:06:52 <Zakim> On IRC I see annette_g, yaso, riccardoAlbertoni, EricKauz, antoine, Caroline_, ericstephan, phila, Zakim, RRSAgent, deirdrelee, hadleybeeman, trackbot
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see annette_g, yaso, riccardoAlbertoni, EricKauz, antoine, Caroline_, ericstephan, phila, Zakim, RRSAgent, deirdrelee, hadleybeeman, trackbot ←
14:06:58 <EricKauz> present+ EricKauz
Scribe problem: the name 'EricKauz' does not match any of the 6 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Eric Stephan Deirdre Lee Phil Archer Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'EricKauz' does not match any of the 6 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Eric Stephan Deirdre Lee Phil Archer Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown EricKauz: present+ EricKauz ←
14:06:59 <hadleybeeman> present+ hadleybeeman
Scribe problem: the name 'hadleybeeman' does not match any of the 6 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Eric Stephan Deirdre Lee Phil Archer Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'hadleybeeman' does not match any of the 6 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Eric Stephan Deirdre Lee Phil Archer Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown hadleybeeman: present+ hadleybeeman ←
14:07:21 <phila> scribe: phila
(Scribe set to Phil Archer)
14:07:28 <phila> scribenick: phila
14:07:45 <phila> Topic: Preliminaries
14:08:02 <phila> PROPOSED: Accept last week's minutes http://www.w3.org/2015/12/11-dwbp-minutes
PROPOSED: Accept last week's minutes http://www.w3.org/2015/12/11-dwbp-minutes ←
14:08:17 <hadleybeeman> +0 (wasn't here)
Scribe problem: the name 'hadleybeeman' does not match any of the 6 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Eric Stephan Deirdre Lee Phil Archer Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'hadleybeeman' does not match any of the 6 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Eric Stephan Deirdre Lee Phil Archer Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown hadleybeeman: +0 (wasn't here) ←
14:08:17 <ericstephan> +1
Eric Stephan: +1 ←
14:08:23 <yaso> +1
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Scribe problem: the name 'yaso' does not match any of the 6 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Eric Stephan Deirdre Lee Phil Archer Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown yaso: +1 ←
14:08:32 <riccardoAlbertoni> +1
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Unknown riccardoAlbertoni: +1 ←
14:08:32 <antoine> +0 (wasn't here)
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Scribe problem: the name 'antoine' does not match any of the 6 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Eric Stephan Deirdre Lee Phil Archer Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown antoine: +0 (wasn't here) ←
14:08:35 <phila> +1
+1 ←
14:08:40 <deirdrelee> sc0
Deirdre Lee: sc0 ←
14:08:45 <ericstephan> Great turn out this week...wow
Eric Stephan: Great turn out this week...wow ←
14:08:46 <phila> Last week approved 2 publications
Last week approved 2 publications ←
14:08:50 <EricKauz> +1
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Unknown EricKauz: +1 ←
14:08:53 <phila> RESOLUTION: Accept last week's minutes http://www.w3.org/2015/12/11-dwbp-minutes
RESOLVED: Accept last week's minutes http://www.w3.org/2015/12/11-dwbp-minutes ←
14:08:55 <BernadetteLoscio> +1
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: +1 ←
14:08:58 <newtoncalegari> +1
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Unknown newtoncalegari: +1 ←
14:09:08 <Caroline_> +1
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Unknown Caroline_: +1 ←
14:09:12 <Caroline_> Present+ Caroline_
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Unknown Caroline_: Present+ Caroline_ ←
14:09:15 <laufer> present+ laufer
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Unknown laufer: present+ laufer ←
14:09:25 <laufer> +1
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Unknown laufer: +1 ←
14:09:26 <antoine> present+ antoine
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Unknown antoine: present+ antoine ←
14:09:35 <BernadetteLoscio> present+ BernadetteLoscio
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: present+ BernadetteLoscio ←
14:09:38 <phila> 2 new publications yesterday
2 new publications yesterday ←
14:09:38 <phila> http://www.w3.org/TR/dwbp/
14:09:40 <deirdrelee> Topic: BP & DQV update
14:09:45 <phila> http://www.w3.org/TR/vocab-dqv/
http://www.w3.org/TR/vocab-dqv/ ←
14:09:54 <hadleybeeman> phila: we have two new publications from last week
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Phil Archer: we have two new publications from last week [ Scribe Assist by Unknown hadleybeeman ] ←
14:10:14 <hadleybeeman> ...On this occasion, the editors (Newton and Riccardo especially) put a lot of effort into getting them ready to publish
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Scribe problem: the name 'hadleybeeman' does not match any of the 6 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Eric Stephan Deirdre Lee Phil Archer Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown hadleybeeman: ...On this occasion, the editors (Newton and Riccardo especially) put a lot of effort into getting them ready to publish ←
14:10:16 <BernadetteLoscio> hello!!!
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: hello!!! ←
14:10:19 <ericstephan> yeah for publishing!
Eric Stephan: yeah for publishing! ←
14:10:22 <hadleybeeman> ...They did thinks like link checking and validation and spell checking
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Unknown hadleybeeman: ...They did thinks like link checking and validation and spell checking ←
14:10:42 <hadleybeeman> ...It still took me a lot of time to get them ready for publication, but less than usual
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Unknown hadleybeeman: ...It still took me a lot of time to get them ready for publication, but less than usual ←
14:10:43 <phila> -> http://www.w3.org/blog/data/ Data Activity Blog
-> http://www.w3.org/blog/data/ Data Activity Blog ←
14:10:54 <hadleybeeman> ...Yesterday was a busy day for Data Activity.
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Unknown hadleybeeman: ...Yesterday was a busy day for Data Activity. ←
14:11:05 <hadleybeeman> ...The Spatial Data on the Web updated their Use Case doc.
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Unknown hadleybeeman: ...The Spatial Data on the Web updated their Use Case doc. ←
14:11:12 <hadleybeeman> ...They're close to updating their BPs
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Unknown hadleybeeman: ...They're close to updating their BPs ←
14:11:21 <hadleybeeman> ...Also, CSV on the Web became a recommendation
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Unknown hadleybeeman: ...Also, CSV on the Web became a recommendation ←
14:11:30 <hadleybeeman> ...They're still writing a primer, but they've finished their substantive work
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Unknown hadleybeeman: ...They're still writing a primer, but they've finished their substantive work ←
14:11:34 <hadleybeeman> ...So it was a good day
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Unknown hadleybeeman: ...So it was a good day ←
14:11:43 <deirdrelee> q?
Deirdre Lee: q? ←
14:11:52 <hadleybeeman> ...Eric is very close to publishing the DUV
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Unknown hadleybeeman: ...Eric is very close to publishing the DUV ←
14:12:03 <hadleybeeman> ...Big thank you to everyone involved in those documents.
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Unknown hadleybeeman: ...Big thank you to everyone involved in those documents. ←
14:12:20 <hadleybeeman> deirdrelee: So, dissemination? How can we help?
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Deirdre Lee: So, dissemination? How can we help? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown hadleybeeman ] ←
14:12:28 <ericstephan> yes congrats Phil! Great efforts
Eric Stephan: yes congrats Phil! Great efforts ←
14:12:30 <hadleybeeman> phila: I did the blog post above, so we can find all these things
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Phil Archer: I did the blog post above, so we can find all these things [ Scribe Assist by Unknown hadleybeeman ] ←
14:12:44 <hadleybeeman> ...There are several examples in the BP doc where we refer to the CSV on the Web stuff.
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Unknown hadleybeeman: ...There are several examples in the BP doc where we refer to the CSV on the Web stuff. ←
14:12:56 <hadleybeeman> ...It also refers to both of the vocabs we are working on
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Unknown hadleybeeman: ...It also refers to both of the vocabs we are working on ←
14:13:06 <hadleybeeman> ...Generally speaking, our work here is about improving the ecosystem for sharing data online
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Unknown hadleybeeman: ...Generally speaking, our work here is about improving the ecosystem for sharing data online ←
14:13:11 <hadleybeeman> ...These are all parts of it.
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Unknown hadleybeeman: ...These are all parts of it. ←
14:13:19 <deirdrelee> q?
Deirdre Lee: q? ←
14:13:24 <hadleybeeman> ...So, please: the usual blogs and tweets. But more importantly, using it!
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Unknown hadleybeeman: ...So, please: the usual blogs and tweets. But more importantly, using it! ←
14:13:36 <hadleybeeman> hadleybeeman: Big congratulations!
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Unknown hadleybeeman: Big congratulations! [ Scribe Assist by Unknown hadleybeeman ] ←
14:13:43 <newtoncalegari> present+ newtoncalegari
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Unknown newtoncalegari: present+ newtoncalegari ←
14:13:45 <hadleybeeman> deirdrelee: Do the editors want to say anything?
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Deirdre Lee: Do the editors want to say anything? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown hadleybeeman ] ←
14:13:56 <riccardoAlbertoni> no really, just thanks all
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Unknown riccardoAlbertoni: no really, just thanks all ←
14:14:00 <deirdrelee> Topic: Data usage Vocabulary
14:14:04 <ericstephan> http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/vocab-du.html
Eric Stephan: http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/vocab-du.html ←
14:14:05 <BernadetteLoscio> yes! thanks all!
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: yes! thanks all! ←
14:14:05 <phila> Topic: dataset usage Vocabulary
14:14:33 <phila> -> http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/vocab-du.html The DUV
-> http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/vocab-du.html The DUV ←
14:15:00 <phila> ericstephan: I felt last week that we had a doc that needed work but that we had good comments that helped Berndette, Sumit and I to make progress
Eric Stephan: I felt last week that we had a doc that needed work but that we had good comments that helped Berndette, Sumit and I to make progress ←
14:15:25 <phila> ... I now feel comfortable putting it in front of people seeking wide review
... I now feel comfortable putting it in front of people seeking wide review ←
14:15:38 <BernadetteLoscio> http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/vocab-du.html
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/vocab-du.html ←
14:15:45 <ericstephan> http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/vocab-du.html#Vocab_Overview
Eric Stephan: http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/vocab-du.html#Vocab_Overview ←
14:15:51 <phila> ... One of the things that we did was to add to the vocab overview section, we added 3 subsections
... One of the things that we did was to add to the vocab overview section, we added 3 subsections ←
14:16:03 <phila> ericstephan: What's misisng is links throughout the doc to make it more intuitive
Eric Stephan: What's misisng is links throughout the doc to make it more intuitive ←
14:16:21 <phila> ... Everyone commented last week, it's important to call out which classes and properties are relevant to that
... Everyone commented last week, it's important to call out which classes and properties are relevant to that ←
14:16:45 <phila> ... the other thing we did was to go through and make sure that we were reusing vocabularies
... the other thing we did was to go through and make sure that we were reusing vocabularies ←
14:16:47 <deirdrelee> q?
Deirdre Lee: q? ←
14:16:56 <phila> ... That was a good exercise in following BP on reusing vocabs
... That was a good exercise in following BP on reusing vocabs ←
14:17:19 <ericstephan> http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/vocab-du.html#relationship_vocabularies
Eric Stephan: http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/vocab-du.html#relationship_vocabularies ←
14:17:28 <phila> ... In addtion to the improvements to the model, in section 5 I added some links to what we were motivated by
... In addtion to the improvements to the model, in section 5 I added some links to what we were motivated by ←
14:17:55 <phila> ... My concern about bringing this to the citation community was... I'm keen to see if there are better directions for us to follow.
... My concern about bringing this to the citation community was... I'm keen to see if there are better directions for us to follow. ←
14:18:04 <phila> ... We should be sensitive to open data efforts
... We should be sensitive to open data efforts ←
14:18:15 <phila> .. Some of those links are to things universities are doing
.. Some of those links are to things universities are doing ←
14:18:31 <phila> BernadetteLoscio?
BernadetteLoscio? ←
14:18:37 <BernadetteLoscio> its ok!
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: its ok! ←
14:18:52 <BernadetteLoscio> please continue...
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: please continue... ←
14:19:25 <phila> ericstephan: Thanks riccardoAlbertoni for sharing his recommendation
Eric Stephan: Thanks riccardoAlbertoni for sharing his recommendation ←
14:19:41 <phila> ... using multiple classes in the doc can be confusing - anyone got better visual suggestions?
... using multiple classes in the doc can be confusing - anyone got better visual suggestions? ←
14:19:42 <BernadetteLoscio> q+
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: q+ ←
14:19:55 <deirdrelee> ack BernadetteLoscio
Deirdre Lee: ack BernadetteLoscio ←
14:19:56 <phila> ericstephan: We were able to squeeze everything into the model
Eric Stephan: We were able to squeeze everything into the model ←
14:20:25 <phila> BernadetteLoscio: Thanks Eric for the report - I think you said everything. We still have sime improvements to make.
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: Thanks Eric for the report - I think you said everything. We still have sime improvements to make. ←
14:20:25 <ericstephan> Berna and I did a lot while balancing time zones!
Eric Stephan: Berna and I did a lot while balancing time zones! ←
14:20:35 <phila> ... We had some nice comments from the group and we're going in a good direction.
... We had some nice comments from the group and we're going in a good direction. ←
14:20:54 <phila> ericstephan: We were balanced between the 5 hour time difference with out schedule - which was an added challenge
Eric Stephan: We were balanced between the 5 hour time difference with out schedule - which was an added challenge ←
14:20:59 <laufer> q+
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Unknown laufer: q+ ←
14:21:14 <phila> deirdrelee: So we still have 40 mins for this call - would it be helpful to go thrpough specific issues?
Deirdre Lee: So we still have 40 mins for this call - would it be helpful to go thrpough specific issues? ←
14:21:17 <phila> ack laufer
ack laufer ←
14:21:58 <phila> laufer: We'll still have the domain definitions in the doc of other vocabularies, i.e. we seem to be defining properties for otehr vocabularies? I don't agree with this
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Unknown laufer: We'll still have the domain definitions in the doc of other vocabularies, i.e. we seem to be defining properties for otehr vocabularies? I don't agree with this ←
14:23:21 <deirdrelee> laufer: in the diagram, there are some arrows that have two ends, I don't like this
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Unknown laufer: in the diagram, there are some arrows that have two ends, I don't like this [ Scribe Assist by Deirdre Lee ] ←
14:23:27 <BernadetteLoscio> q+
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: q+ ←
14:23:30 <phila> laufer: (Some missed) - but Laufer is saying that he doesn't like defining domains and ranges for other vocabs
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Unknown laufer: (Some missed) - but Laufer is saying that he doesn't like defining domains and ranges for other vocabs ←
14:23:44 <phila> ... and some arrows are bidirectional which I don't like
... and some arrows are bidirectional which I don't like ←
14:23:47 <deirdrelee> ... it gives the impression one concept is inverse of the other and this isn't the case
Deirdre Lee: ... it gives the impression one concept is inverse of the other and this isn't the case ←
14:23:52 <BernadetteLoscio> q-
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: q- ←
14:24:09 <phila> ericstephan: In terms of the double arrow - that was our call - making the presentation more readable
Eric Stephan: In terms of the double arrow - that was our call - making the presentation more readable ←
14:24:11 <BernadetteLoscio> q+
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: q+ ←
14:24:17 <phila> ... It reduces the number of arrows
... It reduces the number of arrows ←
14:24:19 <antoine> I agree with laufer about the point on double arrows
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Unknown antoine: I agree with laufer about the point on double arrows ←
14:24:39 <phila> ericstephan: I thought we had taken out D&Rs on otehr vocabs
Eric Stephan: I thought we had taken out D&Rs on otehr vocabs ←
14:25:14 <phila> BernadetteLoscio: If we look at DCAT, they have domain and range restrictions on properties. They don't specify domain.
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: If we look at DCAT, they have domain and range restrictions on properties. They don't specify domain. ←
14:25:16 <BernadetteLoscio> http://www.w3.org/TR/vocab-dcat/
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: http://www.w3.org/TR/vocab-dcat/ ←
14:25:39 <deirdrelee> q?
Deirdre Lee: q? ←
14:25:42 <deirdrelee> ack BernadetteLoscio
Deirdre Lee: ack BernadetteLoscio ←
14:25:56 <phila> BernadetteLoscio: In section 5.1 they define class:Catalog and they give the range of dcterms
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: In section 5.1 they define class:Catalog and they give the range of dcterms ←
14:26:29 <phila> BernadetteLoscio: We're not re-specifying the classes and properties, we're just following DCAT
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: We're not re-specifying the classes and properties, we're just following DCAT ←
14:26:45 <phila> ... And the double arrows, they're inverse properties
... And the double arrows, they're inverse properties ←
14:26:50 <phila> laufer: No, hang on
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Unknown laufer: No, hang on ←
14:27:10 <phila> BernadetteLoscio: One that is inverse is oa:hasTarget...
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: One that is inverse is oa:hasTarget... ←
14:27:28 <phila> ... We have only 3 double arrows in the diagram.
... We have only 3 double arrows in the diagram. ←
14:27:46 <phila> BernadetteLoscio: oa:hasTarget and duv:gasUserFeedback are not inverse
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: oa:hasTarget and duv:gasUserFeedback are not inverse ←
14:27:57 <phila> ... I agree with you laufer but the otehr two are
... I agree with you laufer but the otehr two are ←
14:28:18 <phila> BernadetteLoscio: We had separate arrows in the diagram but it was too crowded so we used double arrows
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: We had separate arrows in the diagram but it was too crowded so we used double arrows ←
14:28:19 <phila> q+
q+ ←
14:28:30 <phila> BernadetteLoscio: I don't mind. it'snot a big thing.
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: I don't mind. it'snot a big thing. ←
14:28:50 <phila> laufer: In terms of D&R, I think it's wrong. If DCAT defines a range, it's the same as in the source vocab
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Unknown laufer: In terms of D&R, I think it's wrong. If DCAT defines a range, it's the same as in the source vocab ←
14:28:54 <antoine> yes we should probably fix it for the one double arrow we have in DQV!
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Unknown antoine: yes we should probably fix it for the one double arrow we have in DQV! ←
14:28:58 <phila> ... If we define a domain we're extending the other vocab
... If we define a domain we're extending the other vocab ←
14:29:34 <phila> ... for example, if we say dcterms:creator has a domain that we define that a reasoner might infer that
... for example, if we say dcterms:creator has a domain that we define that a reasoner might infer that ←
14:29:43 <phila> deirdrelee: Interesting discussion
Deirdre Lee: Interesting discussion ←
14:29:47 <deirdrelee> ack phila
Deirdre Lee: ack phila ←
14:30:19 <riccardoAlbertoni> +1 to phil
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Unknown riccardoAlbertoni: +1 to phil ←
14:30:24 <ericstephan> I like that Phil
Eric Stephan: I like that Phil ←
14:31:54 <laufer> q+
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Unknown laufer: q+ ←
14:33:08 <phila> phila: Repeated what was in his recent e-mail
Phil Archer: Repeated what was in his recent e-mail ←
14:33:13 <phila> ack l
ack l ←
14:33:26 <antoine> q+
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Unknown antoine: q+ ←
14:33:38 <phila> laufer: I disgaree with phila.If they are comments, OK, but if we have RDF that specifies the D&R a reasoner will concluse what we say
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Unknown laufer: I disgaree with phila.If they are comments, OK, but if we have RDF that specifies the D&R a reasoner will concluse what we say ←
14:33:45 <deirdrelee> ack antoine
Deirdre Lee: ack antoine ←
14:33:51 <phila> phila: I agree that's the theory, not sure if it's the practice
Phil Archer: I agree that's the theory, not sure if it's the practice ←
14:34:26 <phila> antoine: I understand laufer's point. But I think we should distinguish between where we actually do define a D&R and where we mean a commnet
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Unknown antoine: I understand laufer's point. But I think we should distinguish between where we actually do define a D&R and where we mean a commnet ←
14:34:33 <deirdrelee> q?
Deirdre Lee: q? ←
14:34:44 <phila> ... We could perhaps say "expected subject" or "expected object"
... We could perhaps say "expected subject" or "expected object" ←
14:34:51 <phila> ... That's how schema.org seems to be going
... That's how schema.org seems to be going ←
14:34:52 <laufer> q+
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Unknown laufer: q+ ←
14:34:55 <phila> ack l
ack l ←
14:35:17 <phila> laufer: It's not a problem to use any classes in the D&R if they're not already defined
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Unknown laufer: It's not a problem to use any classes in the D&R if they're not already defined ←
14:35:44 <phila> ... I agree that we can say 'expected class' etc. but I don't like it in the RDFS
... I agree that we can say 'expected class' etc. but I don't like it in the RDFS ←
14:35:52 <ericstephan> q+
Eric Stephan: q+ ←
14:35:52 <antoine> q+
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Unknown antoine: q+ ←
14:35:54 <deirdrelee> q?
Deirdre Lee: q? ←
14:36:03 <phila> ericstephan:
14:36:07 <deirdrelee> ack ericstephan
Deirdre Lee: ack ericstephan ←
14:36:28 <phila> ... This is a question to BernadetteLoscio - I remember the note about a usage. I'm confortable with leaving just as text
... This is a question to BernadetteLoscio - I remember the note about a usage. I'm confortable with leaving just as text ←
14:36:44 <phila> ... I wanted to put something in the text as well as the picture
... I wanted to put something in the text as well as the picture ←
14:37:28 <phila> BernadetteLoscio: I'm fine with textual expectations, remving domain from the table and using usageNote instead
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: I'm fine with textual expectations, remving domain from the table and using usageNote instead ←
14:37:39 <phila> ... dct:creator has a range of prov:Agent
... dct:creator has a range of prov:Agent ←
14:37:44 <phila> q+ to talk about provAgent
q+ to talk about provAgent ←
14:38:15 <phila> BernadetteLoscio: Not sure if it's going to look nice in the doc
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: Not sure if it's going to look nice in the doc ←
14:38:45 <laufer> we have to understand the inferences that come from these definitions
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Unknown laufer: we have to understand the inferences that come from these definitions ←
14:39:06 <deirdrelee> ack antoine
Deirdre Lee: ack antoine ←
14:39:11 <phila> BernadetteLoscio: I couldn't find info about D&R for CiTO
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: I couldn't find info about D&R for CiTO ←
14:39:38 <phila> antoine: If no D&R is not specified in the original vocab they probably have a reason for keeping it open.
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Unknown antoine: If no D&R is not specified in the original vocab they probably have a reason for keeping it open. ←
14:40:05 <phila> antoine: There might be ways to express that a property has an expected usage
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Unknown antoine: There might be ways to express that a property has an expected usage ←
14:40:19 <deirdrelee> ack phila
Deirdre Lee: ack phila ←
14:40:19 <Zakim> phila, you wanted to talk about provAgent
Zakim IRC Bot: phila, you wanted to talk about provAgent ←
14:41:30 <deirdrelee> phila: As far as I can see, prov has reinvented foaf, and they created provagent, from my understanding provAgent is reinvention of foaf:Agent
Phil Archer: As far as I can see, prov has reinvented foaf, and they created provagent, from my understanding provAgent is reinvention of foaf:Agent [ Scribe Assist by Deirdre Lee ] ←
14:41:39 <deirdrelee> ... and dcterms:agent
Deirdre Lee: ... and dcterms:agent ←
14:42:21 <deirdrelee> ... antoine mentioned datashapes, which is linked to wider work of application profiles, EC has been working on DCAT-AP, Andrea and JRC are working on GeoDCAT-AP
Deirdre Lee: ... antoine mentioned datashapes, which is linked to wider work of application profiles, EC has been working on DCAT-AP, Andrea and JRC are working on GeoDCAT-AP ←
14:42:51 <phila> https://kwz.me/Rn
https://kwz.me/Rn ←
14:43:01 <deirdrelee> ...it would be great if datashapes could agree on an approach and move forward
Deirdre Lee: ...it would be great if datashapes could agree on an approach and move forward ←
14:43:33 <deirdrelee> ... this links leads to a large set of shape expressions (shexs) that seem to be winning the day, a common way to define an application profile
Deirdre Lee: ... this links leads to a large set of shape expressions (shexs) that seem to be winning the day, a common way to define an application profile ←
14:44:16 <ericstephan> q+
Eric Stephan: q+ ←
14:44:17 <deirdrelee> ... which is what we're talking about here, it's not up to us to redefine provAgent. We don't mind if you use foafagent or dcterms agent, it doesn't change the semantics
Deirdre Lee: ... which is what we're talking about here, it's not up to us to redefine provAgent. We don't mind if you use foafagent or dcterms agent, it doesn't change the semantics ←
14:44:31 <deirdrelee> ... much happier to rely on work on datashapes based on this!
Deirdre Lee: ... much happier to rely on work on datashapes based on this! ←
14:44:34 <phila> ericstephan: I was talking to Jim Myers this week
Eric Stephan: I was talking to Jim Myers this week ←
14:44:36 <deirdrelee> ack ericstephan
Deirdre Lee: ack ericstephan ←
14:44:49 <phila> ericstephan: In the prov group they caled it aspects
Eric Stephan: In the prov group they caled it aspects ←
14:45:15 <phila> ... the way you're describing things about the shapes WG is right on track with where we're trying to go
... the way you're describing things about the shapes WG is right on track with where we're trying to go ←
14:45:21 <phila> ... We're trying to show uage patterns
... We're trying to show uage patterns ←
14:45:33 <hadleybeeman> I'm thrilled to hear we're so connected and getting so much feedback from other related work.
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Unknown hadleybeeman: I'm thrilled to hear we're so connected and getting so much feedback from other related work. ←
14:45:37 <phila> ericstephan: That sounds timely
Eric Stephan: That sounds timely ←
14:45:57 <phila> ... The more we constrain models or have conflicts between D&Rs, the harder it is to reuse vocabs
... The more we constrain models or have conflicts between D&Rs, the harder it is to reuse vocabs ←
14:46:10 <phila> ... So the Shapes WG is an important part of this
... So the Shapes WG is an important part of this ←
14:46:43 <deirdrelee> q?
Deirdre Lee: q? ←
14:46:52 <phila> ericstephan: I'm wondering for now whether we should put in usage Notes
Eric Stephan: I'm wondering for now whether we should put in usage Notes ←
14:47:17 <phila> ... anda then if there are opportunities to express a shape in the new year we can leverage that
... anda then if there are opportunities to express a shape in the new year we can leverage that ←
14:47:18 <hadleybeeman> q+
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Unknown hadleybeeman: q+ ←
14:47:22 <phila> q+
q+ ←
14:47:24 <deirdrelee> ack hadleybeeman
Deirdre Lee: ack hadleybeeman ←
14:47:31 <laufer> The range of duv:refersTo has two classes: dcat:Dataset, dcat:Distribution If we have this in our rdf edfinition of duv, what we are saying is that the resource O in a triple "S duv:refesTo O" is a dcat:Dataset and a dcat:Distribution. And I do not thinnk that a resource could be a dcat:Dataset and a dcat:Distribution
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Unknown laufer: The range of duv:refersTo has two classes: dcat:Dataset, dcat:Distribution If we have this in our rdf edfinition of duv, what we are saying is that the resource O in a triple "S duv:refesTo O" is a dcat:Dataset and a dcat:Distribution. And I do not thinnk that a resource could be a dcat:Dataset and a dcat:Distribution ←
14:47:36 <phila> hadleybeeman: Is there anyone involved in both WGs
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Unknown hadleybeeman: Is there anyone involved in both WGs ←
14:49:59 <antoine> q+
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Unknown antoine: q+ ←
14:50:24 <deirdrelee> hadleybeeman: do they have a use-case document?
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Unknown hadleybeeman: do they have a use-case document? [ Scribe Assist by Deirdre Lee ] ←
14:50:32 <phila> -> http://www.w3.org/TR/shacl-ucr/ Data Shapes UCR
-> http://www.w3.org/TR/shacl-ucr/ Data Shapes UCR ←
14:51:28 <phila> q-
q- ←
14:51:35 <deirdrelee> ack antoine
Deirdre Lee: ack antoine ←
14:52:05 <phila> antoine: I'm not folliowing the shapes work, but DCMI put in some use cases, and Karen Coyle is very active
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Unknown antoine: I'm not folliowing the shapes work, but DCMI put in some use cases, and Karen Coyle is very active ←
14:52:18 <phila> ... I don't think we'll have any use cases that aren't already in there
... I don't think we'll have any use cases that aren't already in there ←
14:52:19 <phila> q+
q+ ←
14:53:39 <annette_g> It looks like Sumit is in the data shapes WG
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Unknown annette_g: It looks like Sumit is in the data shapes WG ←
14:53:40 <ericstephan> q+
Eric Stephan: q+ ←
14:53:42 <phila> ack phila
ack phila ←
14:53:54 <hadleybeeman> ack eric
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Unknown hadleybeeman: ack eric ←
14:53:54 <deirdrelee> ack ericstephan
Deirdre Lee: ack ericstephan ←
14:53:56 <phila> talked a bit about use cases and fulfilling them
talked a bit about use cases and fulfilling them ←
14:54:12 <BernadetteLoscio> and changing the arrows
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: and changing the arrows ←
14:54:23 <phila> ericstephan: So if we make the changes that laufer was asking for, i.e. making D&R restrictions into usage notes, can we vote for a publication?
Eric Stephan: So if we make the changes that laufer was asking for, i.e. making D&R restrictions into usage notes, can we vote for a publication? ←
14:54:28 <hadleybeeman> q+ to ask if we take out domain and range restrictions... will it affect how we judge conformance?
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Unknown hadleybeeman: q+ to ask if we take out domain and range restrictions... will it affect how we judge conformance? ←
14:55:00 <phila> deirdrelee: I'd think we should wait as we're running out of time
Deirdre Lee: I'd think we should wait as we're running out of time ←
14:55:00 <deirdrelee> ack hadleybeeman
Deirdre Lee: ack hadleybeeman ←
14:55:00 <Zakim> hadleybeeman, you wanted to ask if we take out domain and range restrictions... will it affect how we judge conformance?
Zakim IRC Bot: hadleybeeman, you wanted to ask if we take out domain and range restrictions... will it affect how we judge conformance? ←
14:55:02 <phila> ack hadleybeeman
ack hadleybeeman ←
14:55:29 <phila> hadleybeeman: If we take out D&R for a term, we still need to deminstrate conformance - how do we do that?
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Unknown hadleybeeman: If we take out D&R for a term, we still need to demonstrat conformance - how do we do that? ←
14:55:41 <antoine> q+
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Unknown antoine: q+ ←
14:55:43 <hadleybeeman> s/deminstrate/demonstrat
14:55:50 <phila> ericstephan: We need an answer for that
Eric Stephan: We need an answer for that ←
14:55:50 <deirdrelee> ack antoine
Deirdre Lee: ack antoine ←
14:55:50 <hadleybeeman> s/demonstrat/demonstrate
14:56:41 <phila> antoine: I'd say it's a good question. The formal semantics of the open world, we're not really imposing anything. Even if the world's triples say that a dataset is also a car, you're Ok as long as no one says it's not a cat
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Unknown antoine: I'd say it's a good question. The formal semantics of the open world, we're not really imposing anything. Even if the world's triples say that a dataset is also a car, you're Ok as long as no one says it's not a cat ←
14:57:58 <yaso> q?
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Unknown yaso: q? ←
14:58:24 <hadleybeeman> @antoine, I'm still a bit unclear on how that answers the question, but will be happy to see as the changes are made.
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Unknown hadleybeeman: @antoine, I'm still a bit unclear on how that answers the question, but will be happy to see as the changes are made. ←
14:58:50 <phila> phila: Suggests that we aim to vote to publish during our next meeting on 8 Jan 2016
Phil Archer: Suggests that we aim to vote to publish during our next meeting on 8 Jan 2016 ←
14:58:59 <phila> ... That gives us the break to review
... That gives us the break to review ←
14:59:23 <yaso> +1 to vote on 8 Jan..
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Unknown yaso: +1 to vote on 8 Jan.. ←
14:59:28 <phila> ... People who will be on holiday then can register their assent/against during the holiday
... People who will be on holiday then can register their assent/against during the holiday ←
14:59:57 <phila> phila: Notes to ericstephan that even if we vote now, it wouldn't be published until 5 Jan - we're talling about a 1 week delay in effect
Phil Archer: Notes to ericstephan that even if we vote now, it wouldn't be published until 5 Jan - we're talling about a 1 week delay in effect ←
15:00:04 <phila> BernadetteLoscio: I'm OK with this
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: I'm OK with this ←
15:00:19 <phila> ericstephan: I have snow and sleet here, so I can stay inside and work on this
Eric Stephan: I have snow and sleet here, so I can stay inside and work on this ←
15:00:26 <phila> deirdrelee: So with that...
Deirdre Lee: So with that... ←
15:00:56 <phila> ... We'll close up for today. Thanks everyone for the discussion on domains and ranges and where the Data Shapes Wg is
... We'll close up for today. Thanks everyone for the discussion on domains and ranges and where the Data Shapes Wg is ←
15:00:56 <riccardoAlbertoni> \me merry xmas/ vacation to all
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Unknown riccardoAlbertoni: \me merry xmas/ vacation to all ←
15:01:11 <laufer> bye all... nice weekend...
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Unknown laufer: bye all... nice weekend... ←
15:01:12 <yaso> thank all
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Unknown yaso: thank all ←
15:01:17 <yaso> bye!
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Unknown yaso: bye! ←
15:01:27 <phila> RRSAgent, draft minutes
RRSAgent, draft minutes ←
15:01:27 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/12/18-dwbp-minutes.html phila
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/12/18-dwbp-minutes.html phila ←
15:01:31 <annette_g> bye all, and happy holidays
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Unknown annette_g: bye all, and happy holidays ←
15:01:42 <phila> BernadetteLoscio: I'd like to say I think we did a lot this year - thanks everyone
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Unknown BernadetteLoscio: I'd like to say I think we did a lot this year - thanks everyone ←
15:01:50 <Caroline_> bye! Thank you! Great Holidays!!
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Unknown Caroline_: bye! Thank you! Great Holidays!! ←
15:01:52 <newton> bye all, nice holidays! :-)
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Unknown newton: bye all, nice holidays! :-) ←
15:05:12 <phila> https://www.force11.org/meetings/force2016/forms/pre-conference-meeting-proposals
https://www.force11.org/meetings/force2016/forms/pre-conference-meeting-proposals ←
15:09:00 <phila> RRSAgent, draft minutes
RRSAgent, draft minutes ←
15:09:00 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/12/18-dwbp-minutes.html phila
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/12/18-dwbp-minutes.html phila ←
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