W3C

- DRAFT -

W3C Audio WG Teleconference

15 Aug 2013

See also: IRC log

Attendees

Present
jernoble, olivier, chrislowis, [Mozilla], cwilso, gmandyam\, joe, Doug_Schepers
Regrets
Marcus, Jussi
Chair
Olivier
Scribe
Chris L

Contents


<scribe> Scribe: Chris L

<scribe> ScribeNick: chrislowis

<joe> I'm getting "this passcode is not valid"

<ehsan> oops, I disconnected instead of muting!

<joe> Is anyone else able to connect with 28346?

<olivier> joe, yes

<gmandyam> Also having trouble dialing in

<olivier> sorry to hear that gmandyam

<olivier> will ping w3c sysreq

<joe> I'm not able to connect from either of my phones

olivier: we have two things on the agenda

Review of Action Items - http://www.w3.org/2011/audio/track/

olivier: starting with a review of the action items

<olivier> http://www.w3.org/2011/audio/track/actions/pendingreview

olivier: we have 3 actions pending review.
... starting with http://www.w3.org/2011/audio/track/actions/57

<Zakim> cwilso, you wanted to agree that this is a better avenue for feedback.

olivier: I had a look and I'd like to cancel it. It's fine for it to say to contact the mailing list, and we can decide there whether it's an issue or not.

cwilso: I agree.

olivier: we'll close that one then.
... http://www.w3.org/2011/audio/track/actions/60 looks to be a non-issue.
... so will close.
... And finally, http://www.w3.org/2011/audio/track/actions/65

<olivier> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=22969

olivier: I've created the issue mentioned (to look into how much the Web Audio API is "inspired" by OpenAL)

<gmandyam> +q

olivier: we discussed that the OpenAL was licenced under something fairly liberal, but we may not need to worry about this. At some point we should go through this and satisfy ourselves.

gmandyam: is it our concern, the IPR issues around this?

olivier: Perhaps not, but I should talk to PSIG to make sure.

<gmandyam> My question is whether it is really the responsibility of this WG to determine whether OpenAL is compatible with W3C RF policy? Could the PSIG handle this?

<olivier> ACTION: olivier to contact PSIG to ask for the best course of action re bug 22969 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2013/08/15-audio-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-67 - Contact psig to ask for the best course of action re bug 22969 [on Olivier Thereaux - due 2013-08-22].

gmandyam: thank you for the clarification.

olivier: Action 66 is still pending on chrislowis, and is ongoing.

Web Audio API spec roles

olivier: I'm apologising for the mystery surrounding this agendum.
... the news that I need to announce is that our spec editor Chris Rogers has stepped down from his role at Google and won't be able to participate in the group in the foreseeable future.
... we received a message from Chris saying how proud he was for working with the group and mentioned people on this call by name and wished us all the best.
... needless to say, we must now realise that in W3C parlance, Chris R was the editor of the API, but as we know he was also the 'author' of the spec, not just the editor.
... usually at the W3C the 'author' of the spec is the group itself, and one or a number of editors edit the spec.
... so I think we will need to move in the future to a different model of working, which is more in keeping with other working groups.
... cwilso, could you explain a little about what this means in terms of Google's involvement with the WG.

cwilso: Yes, we've been working hard internally to make sure that this isn't an issue in terms of our involvement with the WG.
... I'll be stepping up my involvement with the WG in the future (but not in the immediate month).

joe: Chris R has played a huge role in this group, and he'll be missed.

olivier: From speaking to him, he may be involved in the future but that is not certain.
... however we have a spec that is in good shape for working on.

shepazu: I'd like to acknowledge the work Chris has done, we'd not be in the position we're in with audio on the web without him, and the community is very happy with what is now available.
... we have some people in this group who are audio experts, some who are browser experts, and some implementors who do not have as much audio experience. We need to find a new editor who can fill both roles, and that may mean looking for more than one editor.
... that person could be from inside or outside of the current group

olivier: I'm aware we don't have everyone on the call, so some of this may surface on the list in the next few days.

cwilso: I did want to say, that I have been talking to my management - I have the permission to offer myself as editor.
... I think that would look different to Chris R's involvment.
... I'd need to be more of an editor, with input from people on the digital audio aspects.

<cwilso> I'd note that Apple has actually stepped up a bit in the last 6 months or so.

shepazu: Chris R has spoken in the past about working with people at Apple

jernoble: Eric Carlson and I worked with Chris R on the early versions of the spec, I don't know if we'll have the time to contribute to the spec as an editor, but I'll need to talk to people in my company.

olivier: one thing that we haven't put in place so far is an effective "patch" process.
... we tended to raise issues, and Chris would propose a solution based on his expertise, and we'd agree on it.
... perhaps a possibility is to have the whole group taking ownership of the spec, rather than sources of input - if we could get more patches and suggestions of prose that would help any future editor.

joe: some way of using bugzilla/a bug-tracking system to review and then close issues in a clear manner would help.

olivier: you're right, we have status codes already, but we haven't really enforced these.

<Zakim> cwilso, you wanted to mention that I think moving Web MIDI to github was a positive move in collaboration

cwilso: I think a patch-based system, specifically on github, would help. It certainly did with Web MIDI.

ehsan: I used to edit the spec directly and push my changes to the document, with Chris's go-ahead.
... we shouldn't put too much effort into reviewing changes, as they can be edited after the fact (as the spec is a working document).

(based on what I could hear on the call)

<cwilso> +1 that we do need to get github patches/issues to send emails to the group.

olivier: My concern is that the integration with github and the mailing list isn't great.
... I think it's possible, but I haven't been able to get it to work.

cwilso: we do need to make sure that patches, changes, issues send emails to the group - that's important.
... what I tried to do with WebMIDI is to gather up a larger set of changes, and send to the group.

olivier: I realise this is a big change to how we work.
... think about if and how, with the support of your organisation, you can volunteer to edit or contribute to the spec.
... I'll send a summary to the list of this meeting noting that cwilso has volunteered his time.

ehsan: How will this affect the vote on the data-race issue?

olivier: we have two good proposals to address that issue. What I'd like to happen in the next 2 weeks is for the third proposal to be documented, so that we can create a calendar for what we'd like to happen.

ehsan: it's important to us with regards to FF25, but that's clear.

cwilso: it would be reasonable to have your current implementation to follow your proposal, as it won't have a big impact on currently available applications.

ehsan: -- noisy --

joe: I'm also interested in not holding up the implementations, and if we can use something like roc's proposal in the interim then that seems like a good idea.
... I think we should push forward with a vote. If a third proposal can't be specified then we should at least consider it in its current state.

shepazu: just to make it clear, we (the W3C) doesn't vote, it reaches consensus. But the group can decide how to go forward.

olivier: yes, and if we reach a consensus, we don't *have* to vote, but we can use voting to break a dead-lock.

<olivier> ACTION: olivier to send calendar of how/when we want to go forward on the audiobuffer data races issue [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2013/08/15-audio-minutes.html#action02]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-68 - Send calendar of how/when we want to go forward on the audiobuffer data races issue [on Olivier Thereaux - due 2013-08-22].

*olivier acknowledges suggestion to take discussion to the list.

olivier: if there is no other comment, suggest we adjurn.
... hearing no objection, the call is adjorned.
... I'll coordinate about whether we have a call in one week or two depending on how things progress.

Summary of Action Items

[NEW] ACTION: olivier to contact PSIG to ask for the best course of action re bug 22969 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2013/08/15-audio-minutes.html#action01]
[NEW] ACTION: olivier to send calendar of how/when we want to go forward on the audiobuffer data races issue [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2013/08/15-audio-minutes.html#action02]
 
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Found Scribe: Chris L
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Default Present: jernoble, olivier, chrislowis, [Mozilla], cwilso, gmandyam\, joe, Doug_Schepers
Present: jernoble olivier chrislowis [Mozilla] cwilso gmandyam\ joe Doug_Schepers

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Regrets: Marcus Jussi
Got date from IRC log name: 15 Aug 2013
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2013/08/15-audio-minutes.html
People with action items: olivier

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