Forms Working Group Teleconference

06 Mar 2013


See also: IRC log


nvdbleek, ebruchez, unl, [IPcaller]


<trackbot> Date: 06 March 2013

<alain> Hello! Yes I can.

Call times next week and the week after


<scribe> scribe: nick

<scribe> scribenick:nvdbleek

nvdbleek: For the Europe people due to DST the next two weeks the call will be one hour later

AVTs and deprecated child elements


nvdbleek: I already handled the wrongly deprecated the mediatype element of upload in favor of @mediatype

is plain wrong. I'll send another mail on this topic.

nvdbleek: For the other elements ili wants to make it more visible
... Would it be enough if we bold the deprecated word?

unl: I will have a look at other W3C specs

ACTION unl To have a look at how other specifications style deprecated elements/attributes and come with a proposal for styling in the XForms Sepc

<trackbot> Created ACTION-1936 - Have a look at how other specifications style deprecated elements/attributes and come with a proposal for styling in the XForms Spec [on Ulrich Nicolas Lissé - due 2013-03-13].

The xforms-script-language-not-supported-exception Event / The xforms-script-exception Event


nvdbleek: Discussed this a couple of calls ago, we thought of maybe dropping the script elements

alain: I think it is useful in actions

ebruchez: We found it very useful for javascript, and also use it to call XPath functions with side effects.. But we have a proposal to do it with an action element with an extra type attribute on the action element

nvdbleek: Script has the benefit of being an element in HTML

ebruchez: How do you do this in xsltforms?

<ebruchez> <xf:load resource="javascript:foo()"/>

alain: Not yet possible xsltforms, but it is useful in the future

nvdbleek: what happens if there is exception in javascript? Do you wrap it in an XForms element.

ebruchez: currently we don't
... The load hack is only useful for short expressions. But it supports AVT's in the script we don't have a way to pass in parameters

nvdbleek: if we allow the script element as a child of function then you have a way to pass in parameters

ebruchez: then you call the xpath function to invoke it?

<ebruchez> http://wiki.orbeon.com/forms/projects/client-side-api-for-custom-javascript-widgets

nvdbleek: Yes, oh but we don't have a way to invoke an Xpath function in an action. We also said that our functions shouldn't have side effects and certainly not change instance data

ebruchez: A plain script element is useful, but is missing some features like passing in parameters, getting the value back, ...

alain: I think XQuery is the only good solution for this

nvdbleek: I don't think a lot of XForms implementations have XQuery support

alain: I don't know if the script element should be in the XForms 2.0 time frame

nvdbleek: maybe postpone it
... Uli what do you think about it?

unl: I don't think we should postpone it, my only concern was the name of the script related events

ebruchez: the super long event name should go

unl: I was thinking of a compute exception with context info

nvdbleek: until now the compute exception is only send in binding expressions

unl: What do you send when an action fails

<ebruchez> http://wiki.orbeon.com/forms/welcome/xforms-error-handling

ebruchez: We implemented something new, because we want to recover from failing actions

nvdbleek: ebruchez we have an xxforms-action-error

ebruchez: We stopped sending the compute and binding-exception because they are stopping processing and don't make sense for us
... We dispatch those events, and they don't stop XForms processing

unl: That is not compliant to the spec then?

ebruchez: you are correct

nvdbleek: what do you think of an xforms-action-error event instead of the two events?

unl: I would reuse an existing event

ebruchez: any xpath expression can fail (with a dynamic expression)
... for the spec when xpath expression fails a compute exception occurs and processing stops
... but that is wrong

nvdbleek: Agreed, but reworking that will be a lot of work and not feasible for XForms 2.0

unl: Aggreed

ebruchez: Adding a general event like xforms-action-error and currently only use it for very specific cases, but broaden it in the future

<ebruchez> xforms-action-error

ebruchez: I find the name compute-exception not a clear name for me for an action that fails

unl: is it fatal?

ebruchez: It is an error, so it would not stop processing

unl: We should review all actions

ebruchez: We have for example the load action 'If the link traversal fails, then an implementation-specific means of conveying the link traversal failure occurs.'
... we only have a dozen actions, and not a lot can fail I think, beside xpath errors, and other just don't do anything on failure (e.g.: toggle with invalid ID doesn't do anything)
... xforms-action-error is a good name

nvdbleek: I also think that the name is better, and future proof

unl: are we with enough people to make resolution
... Could you send a proposal before

ACTION nvdbleek to write a proposal for the xforms-action-error event instead of the current script exceptions.

<trackbot> Created ACTION-1937 - Write a proposal for the xforms-action-error event instead of the current script exceptions. [on Nick Van Den Bleeken - due 2013-03-13].

tarckbot, end meeting

trackbot, end meeting

Summary of Action Items

[End of minutes]

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$Date: 2013-03-06 16:56:55 $

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Succeeded: s/depricated/deprecated/
Succeeded: s/Sepc/Spec/
Found Scribe: nick
Found ScribeNick: nvdbleek
Default Present: nvdbleek, ebruchez, unl, [IPcaller]
Present: nvdbleek ebruchez unl [IPcaller]
Regrets: Steven
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-forms/2013Mar/0001.html
Found Date: 06 Mar 2013
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2013/03/06-forms-minutes.html
People with action items: 

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