See also: IRC log
<alvaro> Is there a more standard place?
<PhilA2> scribe: gwyn_sutherlin
<bhyland> dialing, my apologies.
<DanielBennett> hi yes Daniel Bennett
<bhyland> Chair: bhyland
<bhyland> Chair: PhilA
<bhyland> Scribe: Gwyn
<Owen> 301 is me
<DanielBennett> also would like to remind folks of the social media project during the call, please
<DanielBennett> hey Hudson
<PhilA2> -> Hudson Hollister presentation http://www.datacoalition.org/issues/data-act.html
<DanielBennett> is Hudson on IRC?
<DanielBennett> slides or video/
<DanielBennett> ?
<gwyn_sutherlin> hudson:begins presentation with background on data transpancy coalition
<gwyn_sutherlin> founded as voice for technical community and data community with gov't
<gwyn_sutherlin> founded april 2012 in US with legislative mandate
<gwyn_sutherlin> for focus on organizing data and making it open in 5 different areas with 'data act' pending in US congress
<gwyn_sutherlin> is only open data gov't law proposed and up for a vote in US with goal of changining the way reporting spending is reported
<DanielBennett> wow that means there are second acts acts
<gwyn_sutherlin> due to many complex layer, non-public, of data spending is inaccessible and non-transparant... goal it to change this
<DanielBennett> a real cliffhanger
<gwyn_sutherlin> coming to end of session in US congress, ans due to other legistlative pressure, this act will not be addressed this session and will have to be re-addressed in the next session
<gwyn_sutherlin> why is this important?
<gwyn_sutherlin> the legislative focus is important because of lack of standarization and publishing of gov't data
<gwyn_sutherlin> these are the problem the coalition is addressing through legislation
<gwyn_sutherlin> our webpage shows a youtube link explaning our aims
<gwyn_sutherlin> hudson: questions?
<gwyn_sutherlin> bhyland: as a co-chair of gov data working group, we work on best practices within org such as 'you-or-I', I didn' know how far along this project was
<PhilA2> Wendy Seltzer
<gwyn_sutherlin> ... con't... why is the w3 missing in these conversations? there is a gap between executives applauding these projects and yet no support later on? we have one of our champions has temporarily stepped back for personal reasons george thomas, a major loss. and asking jaffe, what can we do to get more support?
<gwyn_sutherlin> ...con't... connecting gov't, research, and industry, how can we connent these standards organizations and groups?
<PhilA2> -> Wendy's short bio http://www.w3.org/People/#wseltzer
<gwyn_sutherlin> are you reaching out to other standards organizations?
<gwyn_sutherlin> hudson: yes, but there is a gap between policy and technical expertise and advocacy. Also, we need to provide 'air support' for our champions. They need more public support, for ex. when there is a legislative proposal pending, this influences the executive branch
<Owen> W/re mandates, U.S. federal agencies already have a mandate to publish their strategic and performance plans and reports in machine-readable format.
<Owen> So the issue is how well they will do so.
<Owen> E-FOIA also requires agencies to make records available in whatever formats they are likely to be requirested.
<gwyn_sutherlin> hudson: the white house still opposed the data act, their finical office still opposes the act philosophically because they base standards on something else, and not open data.
<gwyn_sutherlin> bhyland: response: so it's just too much to comply. from my perspective we must do a better job of showing how it's less expensive and easy to make these changes. it takes time to write business cases.
<gwyn_sutherlin> hudson: it also takes cultural change, which you (we) are pursuing.
<gwyn_sutherlin> bhyland: who is paying?
<DanielBennett> go xbrl
<gwyn_sutherlin> husdon: membership pays, but it is complicated and members have political motivations. I am not a technical person I am a lawyer. My goal was to make the data regulation simpler. The task force realized the instiutional opposition ws immense.
<gwyn_sutherlin> hudson: congressional proposals needed techical community's support. I havea dual role-- in congress trying to convince them that tech industry will thank them and convince tech industry that congress wants this.
<gwyn_sutherlin> phil:question: businesses opposition to standards fancinating.... based on my experience in UK, we had a consultation on open data and were met with friction because suppliers/vendors thought they might lose contract
<gwyn_sutherlin> hudson: this has not exactly, but we are at the beginning
<gwyn_sutherlin> bhyland: response: the contractors in defense, for example, have experience in the data standards, human & machine readable content, but in other areas they may have less and.... the complexities of institutional cultural play a role that need to be considered when making the pitch for change as well as efficicency
<gwyn_sutherlin> con't... w3 could recommend and help
<gwyn_sutherlin> phil q: based in DC?
<PhilA2> acl DanielBennett
<gwyn_sutherlin> Daniel: question: how can gov't data website have data readable for humans and machines with html5 for example with micro data availabilty... could you get a larger community around these possiblities, accessibility, human readability?
<gwyn_sutherlin> hudson: response: human readable component is essential for proposals to be accepted ex: XBRL in financial docs
<gwyn_sutherlin> daniel: in legislative standards I'm looking at micro data.. I'm not sure how far along things are here
<gwyn_sutherlin> hudson: we have pushed for these standards, and the tech community has been important here. that's why legistation is important. they need more support
<gwyn_sutherlin> daniel: an aside about US gov for non-US members, congress is a mess
<gwyn_sutherlin> thank you to bernadette for extra info on technical background
<Owen> PDF/A-3 allows for embedding or attaching other renditions of files, including machine-readable formats, e.g., XML.
<DanielBennett> thanks Hudson
<bhyland> +1 great overview, many thanks for sharing about your important efforts — may the force be with you ;-)
<DanielBennett> reminder that I would like to remind folks of social media project for our group
<alvaro> http://graves.cl/presentation.pdf
<DanielBennett> +1 Hudson's presentation
<gwyn_sutherlin> great pres hudson, thanks. interesting work
<gwyn_sutherlin> alvaro: from 'tetherless world', phd candidate in cognitive studies, looking at linked data...
<gwyn_sutherlin> alvaro: slide 3: linked data definition. gov't should use linked data because it allows you to publish in a structured manner, friendly, machine readable, connects with others
<gwyn_sutherlin> slide 4: challenges remain, such as getting people to use it and explore it. How do we get people to find errors fr exaples?
<gwyn_sutherlin> slide 5? linked data allows you to see the big picture and discover and detect anomalies
<gwyn_sutherlin> slide 6: an example
<gwyn_sutherlin> slide 7: discovering trends, shows graph of tempatures
<gwyn_sutherlin> slide 8: visualization is challening. there are some available such as google, etc... but they have limitations
<gwyn_sutherlin> slide 9: my solution is 'visualbox', it combines many features of other applications.. next slides take you through steps of using 'visualbox'
<gwyn_sutherlin> slide 12: ex of UK school system based on sparql query, slide shows query next slide shows visualization
<gwyn_sutherlin> slide 13: you can easily manipulate or change your query because of linked data
<gwyn_sutherlin> slide 16: you ability to dervive conclusions or ask complex questions is enhanced with visualization tool because of all the access to linked data
<gwyn_sutherlin> slide 17: can generate mixed and linked data with complex visualizations
<gwyn_sutherlin> slide 18: many examples of the types of visualizations possiblewith 'visualbox' [very pretty]
<gwyn_sutherlin> slide 19: more info on how to get 'visualbox'
<gwyn_sutherlin> alvaro: questions?
<gwyn_sutherlin> phil: thank you and very intersting.... this is a virtual service? how sophiticated? is it a virtual library or what?
<gwyn_sutherlin> alvaro: it is a service similar to Drupal
<gwyn_sutherlin> alvaro: it allows you to created multiple sparql endpoints and many visualization filters so you have many options
<gwyn_sutherlin> you have a testing area so you can test your query etc.
<DanielBennett> a job for xslt
<gwyn_sutherlin> phil: question: we at w3 focus like linked data, but the developer community doesn't as much, does visualbox allow you to bridge the gaps between different data?
<DanielBennett> and better yet, rdfa
<gwyn_sutherlin> alvaro: right now you have a table visualization based on csv
<gwyn_sutherlin> phil: can you mix linked and non-linked data or 4 and 5 star data?
<gwyn_sutherlin> daniel: thank you and great presentation. follow-up to idea of bridge between sparql endpoints and other types of data.... there should be a library to allow for that to happen and people in the middle should be able to see the data and then do as they please
<gwyn_sutherlin> particularly for gov't agencies
<gwyn_sutherlin> daniel con't: have you played with RDFa?
<gwyn_sutherlin> q: how are RDFa vs RDF different
<Owen> The form that Joe Carmel created that Daniel just mentioned is at http://xmldatasets.net/XF2/stratmlxform3.xml
<DanielBennett> and also: http://xmldatasets.net/homepage.html
<gwyn_sutherlin> alavaro: the plan for the future is have sparql as the query language, but to be able to incorporarte other data [is this right???]
<gwyn_sutherlin> bhyland: are you doing this as part of your phd project?
<DanielBennett> allows you to paste a URL of an XML page and it will transform it into HTML table and expose the metadata in human readable HTML text
<gwyn_sutherlin> alvaro: not exactly because many people don't use gon't data because of visualization. very few people publish using linked data, or know how to use it, for example in data journals, to I decided I will do this to move these things forward so I decided to create 'visualbox'
<gwyn_sutherlin> bhyland: so it is a product?
<gwyn_sutherlin> alvaro: it is much more general, because it just for visualization unlike loudspeaker.
<gwyn_sutherlin> bhyland: what are you using on the backend for the linked data?
<Owen> Here's a file to test at the URL Daniel provided: http://xml.gov/stratml/carmel/eGovIGRM.xml
<gwyn_sutherlin> alvaro: it's a more agnositc approach, you can have as many endpoints as you want and query as many as you want.
<gwyn_sutherlin> bhyland: you doin it on the fly? you're doin git all in real time?
<gwyn_sutherlin> alvaro: I have one that we renew one every week for instance.
<gwyn_sutherlin> bhyland: you're not storing everything in triple store, no persistent store?
<gwyn_sutherlin> alvaro: no
<gwyn_sutherlin> phil; thank you.
<PhilA2> http://dir.w3.org
<DanielBennett> reminder to everyone to please contact me with your interest in the social media paper
<DanielBennett> thanks
<gwyn_sutherlin> bhyland: an update about the directory. it's a community started in june 2011
<alvaro> thanks for having me
<gwyn_sutherlin> bhyland: open source, open standards compliant, RDF, we still have lots to do in terms of visualizations.
<PhilA2> Community Directory based on Callimachus (open source tool http://3roundstones.com/tag/callimachus/)
<bhyland> http://dir.w3.org
<gwyn_sutherlin> bhyland: we are working on regulatory groups links
<gwyn_sutherlin> bhyland: in terms of visualisations, looking at directory we use maps and we want input on what you'd like to see in the directory what the community wants
<gwyn_sutherlin> bhyland: in terms of linked data ethos, there shouldn't be one directory, but it is open source and we want people to use it, have the RDFa, use the data, continue to link it and know what is available
<gwyn_sutherlin> bhyland: questions?
<DanielBennett> thanks
<gwyn_sutherlin> phil: daniel
<bhyland> If you have further questions about the LOD Community Directory, please email the W3C public GLD WG <public-gld-wg@w3.org>
<gwyn_sutherlin> DanielBennett: put up notes on wiki for project on social media, please come forword, contact me by email to start working on different aspects.
<bhyland> Any suggestions you have about the directory & what you'd like to see are welcome. WE're going to refocus on improving the UI & workflow, including adding RDFa generation to be added so the site pro-actively slurps up RDFa rather requiring users to update the directory. Stay tuned.
<gwyn_sutherlin> DanielBennett: alternate meeting time?
<gwyn_sutherlin> PhilA2: will check on alternate meeting time
<DanielBennett> for the other time zone folks. look at wiki homepage
<gwyn_sutherlin> PhilA2: crossover project meeting coming up (see link) it focuses on policy.. coming up in DC.
<gwyn_sutherlin> PhilA2: closing and thanks to everyone.
<DanielBennett> thanks. happy new year. merry xmas. happy happy happy