User Agent Accessibility Guidelines Working Group Teleconference

23 Aug 2012

See also: IRC log


Greg_Lowney, Jim_Allan, Jeanne, Kim_Patch, sharper
Kelly, Jan, Mark


<trackbot> Date: 23 August 2012

<scribe> scribe: jallan

review changes to "What qualifies as a user agent"


<jeanne> These guidelines employ the following tests to determine if software

<jeanne> qualifies as a user agent. UAAG 2.0 divides potential user agents into

<jeanne> * platform-based application

<jeanne> * extension or plug-in

<jeanne> * web-based application

<jeanne> If the following three conditions are met, then it is a platform-based

<jeanne> application:

<jeanne> * It is a standalone application, and

<jeanne> * It interprets any W3C-specified language, and

<jeanne> * It provides a user interface or interprets a procedural or declarative

<jeanne> language that may be used to provide a user interface

sh: happy with this wording, platform-based is a good thing.


gl: like the approach
... definition of platform application.
... host a browser inside an application. e.g. can put a browser inside Eclipse.
... Eclipse is an application hosting application.

kp: should be changed to platform based application

gl: def of extension or plugin

kp: this was extended also

gl: ... so the browser inside Eclipse would be a plugin or extension to Eclipse
... so an extension or plugin may not be web orientented

js: right, most extensions deal with UI

kp: this is a good thing.

gl: are there languages that are neither procedural or declarative?

sh: this was to get around things that are rendered that don't modify the DOM. e.g. a UI done in Canvas that never modifies the DOM
... thinks this is still reasonable. things that masquerade like a UA, it should be a UA

js: thinks we are ok. but #3 has to be all three conditions. are we locking anyone out?

gl: is there really any difference between 1 and 3? differences seem subtle
... 1 and 3a are simular

sh: hesitate to remove language without Jan and Markku, this has been thrashed many times. should tread lightly.

all happy with language change "platform based application"

gl: would change word. we are talking about platform web-based application. it could be confusing

js: this is an informative section. It should not introduce confusion.

<jeanne> Resolution: Postpone discussion of User Agent tests until next week when Jan and Mark are presesnt

2.5.3 Action 500 & 545


kp: =1

sh: +1

Resolution: add new 2.5.3 from http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2012JulSep/0045.html to the document.

zakim: close item 2

decentralized extensibility

sh: was proposed html5. that anyone could create a new tag.


ja: thought it was removed from html5

in section 2.2.3 in hTML5 http://www.w3.org/TR/html5/infrastructure.html#extensibility

js: need to make sure that this will stay in the document. there is a WAI-HTML5 A11Y taskforce working on this.

<scribe> ACTION: jallan to ping wai-a11y-html5 taskforce about extensibility of html5 and css and otherstuff [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/08/23-ua-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-756 - Ping wai-a11y-html5 taskforce about extensibility of html5 and css and otherstuff [on Jim Allan - due 2012-08-30].

zakim: agenda?

<jeanne> close item-2

<KimPatch> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2012JulSep/0050.html

ACTION-743: Look at cleaning up glossary terms "serial access, sequential navigation" and linear navigation commands


kp: there is nothing that clashes.

js: adding Modality Independence Principle as a related resource to keyboard command, it was already part of keyboard

close item 7

open item 4

<jeanne> http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/2012/ED-IMPLEMENTING-UAAG20-20120816/


add to lauara ... She also use the user agent's preferences/options to redefine its keyboard shortcuts in the same way.

close action-750

<trackbot> ACTION-750 Look at IER from 2.3.5 and 2.1.9 and ensure the new 2.3.5 covers what was important from the now deleted 2.1.9 closed

close item 4

open item 6

change 2.11.1 user can have all recognized foreground and background images shown or hidden

gl: user should have independent control of each

<Greg> 2.11.A Foreground Image Toggle: The user can have all recognized foreground images shown or hidden. (Level A)

discussion of images, alt, 1.1 and 2.11

<Greg> from 6/21: [10:59] Greg Benefits of being able to turn off images include but are not limited to: (a) helping users avoid distraction; (b) increasing the amount of information that can be displayed at one time, including for people who do not make use of the images due to visual impairments, people who want to reduce the amount of scrolling, people who need to keep information on the screen...

<Greg> ...due to short-term memory...[10:59] Greg ...issues; (c) avoiding pain caused by high visual contrast; etc.

gl: wants ability to turn off images, replace with alternative content, or a place holder.

js: decentralized extensability is a dead issue in HTML5

sh: do we take into account microformats and other extensions?

js: what would we have to do with microformat...they are machine readable...not intended for humans.

sh: vcard creates human readable content, google example
... the semantics in the format are presentational and the UA know how to render them
... there is lots of information on the a11y of microformats.

gl: sounds like there are a11y issues.

<Greg> Microformat - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

<Greg> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microformat

<Greg> Although the content of web pages is technically already capable of "automated processing", and has been since the inception of the web, such processing is difficult because the traditional markup tags used to display information on the web do not describe what the information means.[2] Microformats can bridge this gap by attaching semantics, and thereby obviate other, more complicated,...

<Greg> ...methods of automated processing, such as natural language processing or screen scraping.

sh: will look into it further, to see if semantics can be related to a11y.

Summary of Action Items

[NEW] ACTION: jallan to ping wai-a11y-html5 taskforce about extensibility of html5 and css and otherstuff [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/08/23-ua-minutes.html#action01]
[End of minutes]

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$Date: 2012/08/23 18:41:59 $

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Found Scribe: jallan
Inferring ScribeNick: jallan
Default Present: Greg_Lowney, Jim_Allan, Jeanne, Kim_Patch, sharper
Present: Greg_Lowney Jim_Allan Jeanne Kim_Patch sharper
Regrets: Kelly Jan Mark
Found Date: 23 Aug 2012
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2012/08/23-ua-minutes.html
People with action items: jallan

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