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<scribe> Scribe: Addison Phillips
<scribe> ScribeNick: aphillip
Ask the Korean HTML5 Interest Group what should happen if "word-break: keep-all" is used with "word-wrap: break-all"
kenny: more time needed
trackbot, close ACTION-9
<trackbot> ACTION-9 Publish list of bugs with status closed and then a separate list with bugs that there is potential working group objection for review at next meeting closed
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2010Dec/0017.html
(burning issue on <br>)
<scribe> ACTION: all: review closed HTML bugs and send any objections to the list by end of year (see: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2010Dec/0013.html) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/12/22-i18n-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - all
<aharon> zakimj, unmute me
aharon: one item I proposed was
to deal with <br> element
... html4 defined <br> as bidi whitespace
... not supposed to be used as paragraph separator
... people are not using <br> as defined in spec
... but as newline (i.e. a paragraph break)
... if used that way, then should not be bidi whitespace
... so many cases of obviously wrong ordering
... so proposed to fix as para separator
... two part proposal
... 1) make as default a bidi para sep
... 2) allow control over behavior of <br> using a bidi
break attribute
... new attribute rejected; didn't want to add
... originally not happy about changing because doesn't make
sense when used as it is "supposed" to be used
... eventually convinced HTML that there was a lack of
interop
... and it won't go away and so accepted
... so <br> now stands as para sep
... 1 week ago, someone noticed that IE7 and earlier treated as
para sep
<kennyluck> [That person is Simon Montagu]
aharon: but IE8 and later treat as whitespace in 'standards' mode
addison: change in IE not a reason to change spec?
aharon: if IE comes into consistent performance with Mozilla, maybe they would remove
<kennyluck> +1 to reopen the bug. They changed the spec by the reasoning that the spec should be aligned with IE, but this is not true.
addison: IE doing it or not is not the important issue
kennyluck: we are not giving them the right information about IE, so need to report correctly
aharon: so what do we want to recommend as a WG?
addison: what's the best thing to do for bidi support?
aharon: two reasons; one bidi and one interop
addison: compatibility is helpful in making our argument, but it isn't the same thing as being our argument
aharon: so you're saying: reopen. there is more interop, but still same case for bidi
addison: yes
kennyluck: open a new bug with focus on use case instead of solution basically a refined version of our issue2
aharon: there were two bugs, one
asked for bidi break attribute
... and there was reaction that there was no way that they'd do
a new attribute
<kennyluck> aharon: The good news is that paragraph separator and line seaprators start to get supported.
<kennyluck> br { content: PARAGRAPH SEPARATOR }
kennyluck: would this use case solve your use cases
<kennyluck> (the current default is br { content: \A } )
<kennyluck> (\A is bidi white space)
addison: so question before WG is: should <br> be whitespace or paragraph separator
kenny: no opinion
addison: think we should stick with paragraph sep
aharon: should remain paragraph
separator
... however we'd be in the minority on
public-i18n-bidi
<scribe> ACTION: aharon: write to i18n public groups and ask for opinion on whether <br> should be a paragraph separator or whitespace to be used to determin consensus [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/12/22-i18n-minutes.html#action02]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-10 - Write to i18n public groups and ask for opinion on whether <br> should be a paragraph separator or whitespace to be used to determin consensus [on Aharon Lanin - due 2010-12-29].
addison: do we want to cover any of the potential reopens today?
aharon: save for next time
next meeting: skip a week?
Next meeting 5 January 2011
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.135 of Date: 2009/03/02 03:52:20 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/Mantagu/Montagu/ Succeeded: s/new use case/focus on use case instead of solution basically a refined version of our issue2/ Succeeded: s/your issues/your use cases/ Found Scribe: Addison Phillips Found ScribeNick: aphillip Default Present: matial, aphillip, kennyluck, [Microsoft], Gwyneth, aharon Present: matial aphillip kennyluck [Microsoft] Gwyneth aharon Regrets: Felix Norbert Richard Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2010Dec/0019.html Got date from IRC log name: 22 Dec 2010 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2010/12/22-i18n-minutes.html People with action items: aharon all write[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]