Widgets Voice Conference

04 Mar 2010


See also: IRC log


Art, Bryan, Marcos, Robin, Arve, StevenP


<darobin> joining in a split second!

<scribe> ScribeNick: ArtB

<scribe> Scribe: Art

Date: 4 March 2010

Review and tweak agenda

AB: the draft agenda was posted on March 3 ( http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webapps/2010JanMar/0741.html ). Will add View Modes Media Features to the agenda since Robin posted an update today ( http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webapps/2010JanMar/0745.html ). Any other change requests?


AB: I have one: No call next week on March 11; next call will be March 18. Any other short announcements?

P&C spec: <span> element and dir attribute

AB: earlier this week Marcos submitted a proposal on how to address the <span> element and dir attribute ( http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webapps/2010JanMar/0715.html ).

MC: I'm waiting to see what the I18N WG says
... I added <span> and dir attr to the spec
... but I have not spec'ed he behavior
... we want to defer the proc model to a sepearate spec

AB: is that proving to be problematic?

MC: it's a bit complicated
... the bidi stuff that is
... if dir attr is set globally, need to set limits
... some stuff such as IRI interaction isn't clear
... for example <name> has a short name
... could have name in English and short name in Hebrew

AB: are you having a diaglog with I18N group?

MC: they were supposed to discuss it yesterday
... haven't seen their minutes yet
... Scott and Addison have been discussing it
... not clear how attrs are affected by direction

AB: what's the prior art?

... but I think it is underspecified

AB: other formats?

MC: SVG is likely
... so we could check it

AB: I would expect a lot of languages

RB: SMIL, XForms, etc.

<darobin> ... DocBook, TEI

AB: can we minimize the changes to P&C and defer all processing to the separate spec?

MC: yes, that's the intent but not clear if we can get that
... when an impl gets back a dir string, it's got additional semantics in it

SP: can't we just use CSS for this?
... CSS has a rule that matches bidi algorithm

MC: there is no style associated with config.xml
... that is also discouraged in some places e.g. HTML5
... the behavior we are looking for is indeed defined in CSS

SP: can't we just say the text included behaves the same rules as CSS

MC: yes, that is part of the solution
... but there are additional issues too

AB: let's pause to see if the I18N WG has posted their minutes from yesterday's discussion

MC: yes, sure

AB: I just checked their archive and see no postings on March 3 or 4

<Steven> http://www.w3.org/2010/03/03-pf-minutes.html

<Steven> is that it?

AB: OK, so what is the plan of action

MC: need to continue the investigation
... in my last email to them I asked them questions
... we need to get their answers

<scribe> ACTION: barstow followup with Richard and Addison re the <span> and dir attribute discussions [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/03/04-wam-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-506 - Followup with Richard and Addison re the <span> and dir attribute discussions [on Arthur Barstow - due 2010-03-11].

AB: the draft agenda includes a discussion on the Widget BiDi spec
... I presume there is no need to discuss that now

MC: yes, that's correct; we need to get feedback from I18N WG
... this is a new and complex area

AB: ok; understood; KUTGW

WARP spec

AB: the WARP PAG is still in progress and we may continue to work on the spec ( http://dev.w3.org/2006/waf/widgets-access/ ). Two questions here: what is the status of LC comment responses ( http://www.w3.org/2006/02/lc-comments-tracker/42538/WD-widgets-access-20091208/ ) and what is the status of the test suite?

RB: I think there is only 1 LC comment
... and it was from Dom and is straight forward
... I'll follow-up today

AB: my recollection is there are two but I'll need to do some searching

RB: I'll check too

AB: Marcos, you will object to WARP going to CR without a test suite?

MC: yes that is correct

AB: a question is, who is willing to work on the test suite?

SP: what's the problem with entering CR without a test suite?

MC: we have had problems with other specs because there was no TS
... it caused us to have to create multiple CRs


AB: so, is anyone willing to contribute to the WARP TS?

MC: we need another server to test against
... need that for cross-domain access

<darobin> [we can test with www and dev]

MC: think we can use dev.w3.org and then my server or RB's server

AB: so finding the servers doesn't seem like a big factor

MC: could potentially do everything on one server if diff ports are used

RB: could use www.w3.org and dev.w3.org
... so think we'll be fine

MC: ok; let's do it that way
... if RB could follow the pattern I used, that would be great

RB: I can help if you

MC: but I can help set up the infra
... but that's not the test cases

RB: understood
... if you set up the infra, I'll create the tests

AB: did I capture your agreements properly?

RB: yes

MC: yes
... are we talking about 20 tests or so?
... but could be more like 100

RB: seriously doubt it will reach that high

AB: thanks MC and RB

URI scheme spec

AB: Robin, did you respond to Julian Reschke's 25-Feb comment ( http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webapps/2010JanMar/0713.html )?

RB: not yet
... I will respond to the three comments

View Modes Media Feature spec

AB: earlier today Robin announced a new ED of the VMMF spec ( http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webapps/2010JanMar/0745.html ).

<darobin> http://dev.w3.org/2006/waf/widgets-vmmf/Overview.html

RB: it's really simple
... defines one media feature
... since it is a UI-related spec, we can't be overly constraining
... the spec says UA should make a "best-effort" attempt

AB: any comments?
... I like the simplicity
... as well as providing the freedom for the UA to do-the-right-thing
... what about a heads-up to CSS WG and if so, what list do we use?

RB: yes, we should; I suggest www-style

AB: what do people think about starting a 2-week pre-LCWD comment review period?

<darobin> +1

RB: think that's a good idea

MC: agree

Arve: yes

AB: any objections?

<Steven> I'm OK with that

AB: OK, I'll start that review
... and then I'll forward that announcement to www-style
... OK?

RB: Yes, Mr Barstow

<scribe> ACTION: barstow start a 2-week pre-LCWD review period for the VMMF spec [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/03/04-wam-minutes.html#action02]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-507 - Start a 2-week pre-LCWD review period for the VMMF spec [on Arthur Barstow - due 2010-03-11].

AB: who is willing to contribute to the test suite?
... could be a pretty thin test suite

RB: there is only 1 normative assertion and it is a SHOULD

MC: could be about 10 test case
... there are 5 states plus error conditions
... there is also the fallback behavior

AB: anything else on this for today?

[ No ]


AB: Next and last call in March is March 18 (no calls on March 11 or 25)
... Heads-up: time for March 18 will be the same in US but 1 hour earlier in Europe (14:00 Paris)
... would that be problematic?

RB: should be ok

SP: US changes on Marc 13?

AB: yes

RB: I must send regrets for the 18th

AB: any other business for today?
... Meeting Adjourned

<Steven> bye

Summary of Action Items

[NEW] ACTION: barstow followup with Richard and Addison re the <span> and dir attribute discussions [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/03/04-wam-minutes.html#action01]
[NEW] ACTION: barstow start a 2-week pre-LCWD review period for the VMMF spec [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/03/04-wam-minutes.html#action02]
[End of minutes]

Minutes formatted by David Booth's scribe.perl version 1.135 (CVS log)
$Date: 2010/03/04 14:45:06 $

Scribe.perl diagnostic output

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This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.135  of Date: 2009/03/02 03:52:20  
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Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Succeeded: s/wit htat/with that/
Succeeded: s/RB: OK/RB: Yes, Mr Barstow/
Succeeded: s/shold/should/
Found ScribeNick: ArtB
Found Scribe: Art
Default Present: Art_Barstow, Marcos, Bryan_Sullivan, darobin, arve, Steven
Present: Art Bryan Marcos Robin Arve StevenP
Regrets: Marcin
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webapps/2010JanMar/0741.html
Found Date: 04 Mar 2010
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2010/03/04-wam-minutes.html
People with action items: barstow

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