See also: IRC log
<josema> scribe: josema
[usual one I guess]
john: thanks jose
john: recaps
http://www.w3.org/mid/88A6AFA61447AC4AB9F280FC6747F908117650B2@na-exch1.in.tna.local
kjetil: can we add current discussion on the list about use cases?
kevin: let's do before next steps but after topic areas
john: ok
john: I think nobody new, right?
[nothing heard]
http://www.w3.org/2007/eGov/IG/track/actions/open
[agenda at http://www.w3.org/mid/88A6AFA61447AC4AB9F280FC6747F908117650B2@na-exch1.in.tna.local]
trackbot, close ACTION-35
<trackbot> ACTION-35 Will prepare agenda and circulate to call pparticipants closed
ACTION-3 and ACTION-12 not pressing
john: on ACTION-14
... how we could present to organizations how they could present to
... decision makers the benefit of joining
<Zakim> kjetil, you wanted to say something open standards
kevin: in this time of economic crisis, we should try to find a way to engage more people, look more closely into the benefits
kjetil: engage through open standards
kevin: in my experience govs use the "wait and
see" approach
... we need to convince them to participate in what we are doing
john: for a government department Membership
fee is not expensive
... need to "sell" the way we work and the level of conversations we have
... compared to other expenditures, the ROI is very good
... coming back to the action, I'll post something to the Group on how we did
it
... how we achieved it, how we showed this is pretty low cost
josema: what about ACTION-30?
<kjetil> http://www.w3.org/2007/eGov/IG/track/actions/30
john: draft position paper to tell the workshop
we are finding some issues
... on governments using social media
W3C Workshop on the Future of Social Networking - Call for Participation
[deadline for position papers seems to be 20 Nov]
john: any additional input?
kevin: discussion last week, especially with Ari about this, related to TF2
rachel: I have a couple things I could
contribute
... on social media providers building apps for US federal gov
kevin: are you in touch with Michelle Springer (LoC)?
rachel: yes
... couple agencies negotiating individually
... but we are working on some generic framework/agreement for agencies
... best practices that we could replicate trough providers
... working on example agreement we could share
john: my responsibility is to manage Crown
copyright
... some videos posted to YouTube, need to look into that
... now it's possible to do that
... eg. Justice doing this and building Wordpress-based Web site
... integrating this plus images they archive on Flickr, etc.
... target audience is journalists
... also UK National Archives encouraging people to post to Flickr
... eg. paper documents
... some copyright issues to be solved, but once done, powerful stuff
... we've just started last week
kevin: reference point, LoC, you all probably
remember Commons
... project with Flickr, tremendous participation
john: we actually use LoC example
... much easier to show when someone already started
... understood as not so risky
... I'll post something a bit later wrt the paper
... please Rachel do same if possible within the next 24 hours
... I take responsibility of putting it together, a draft we can submit
kjetil: discussion on how to submit use
cases
... started with me submitting one on "Semantic My Page"
<kjetil> darobin, are you on the call?
scribe: jose mentioned SWEO; me also POWDER and
EXI prior experience, which is different from SWEO
... it's important for the Group to work about use cases that people will
commit to write
... not just those that look appealing to some
john: developing use cases in topic areas is
what I believe we should be doing
... if I understand you right, you propose to add an extra step to filter
them?
kjetil: how narrow are the topic areas? how people in the Group feel about them?
john: I think it gives a pretty clear idea of
where we are heading to
... conclusion at the F2F was that use cases should exemplify those
... to capture government requirements
... they are fairly broad, maybe quite government centric
kjetil: should they be even more use case
driven?
... should we try to go beyond that and think how governments should work in
the future?
john: do you mean what might be possible in
five years time?
... or what we should improve from now in the next five years?
kjetil: good observation
... I think that being use case driven we should be able to narrow the scope
more
... could help us in deciding what kind of focus we want
john: for me right now, it's clear that we need
to document the topic areas
... we already have, that would mean we have captured *something*
kevin: +1
... we need to focus on the ones we have, build use cases and then proceed
forward
kjetil: can people agree on the progress?
... on the model for use case collection?
... a distillation of things we can build consensus around and not verbatim
copy of the use cases?
john: we have to do more than just capture them, I agree with that
kjetil: we need to make sure that we don't get
out of scope
... avoid things on the use cases that nobody will work on
john: +1
kevin: +1
john: I think is important for business
interest from my organization to identify some of the things
... we have been talking about
[rachel leaves call]
kjetil: we are in brainstorming mode for now, we should try not to prevent people from brainstorming, but we need to chop down to limit the scope for the Note
john: we structured these in terms of TF work
[ 5.1 Taskforce 1
Semantic Interoperability
Persistent URIs
Identification + Authentication
Digital Preservation + Authenticity
Temporal Data]
john: I'd like to hear opinions from those on
the call about the structure
... if you believe all of the above fit in TF1 or not
<josema> I've added "13.Multi channel delivery" to http://www.w3.org/2007/eGov/IG/wiki/Use_Cases#topics , still not sure about the opinion of the Chairs/Group if that was really missing
kjetil: I think it looks good but don't think
it should be set in stone
... until we produce the note
john: you mean we should allow topic areas to flow between TFs?
kjetil: yes, once the use cases note published they should be fairly strict
josema: two questions: is 13 really missing or not? and have TF coordinators agreed on the distribution of use cases, namely, do they have resources to commit?
<kevin> yes
<kevin> they each mentioned that they have the resources
josema: great news, and 13?
john: I don't recall us talking about this at the Chairs meeting
kevin: me neither
josema: opinion? I could take it
john: we may deal with 13 as well as 4 and 6
?
... postponing them for now
... unless someone could take any and move them forward at any point in
time
[rinke, tom leave call]
kevin: we could send a message to the list and see if someone is interested in going forward
john: good idea
ACTION jsherida to post and ask around about 4, 6, 13
<trackbot> Created ACTION-36 - Post and ask around about 4, 6, 13 [on John Sheridan - due 2008-11-19].
john: let's review the topic areas aligned with TF2
[ Performance Data + Citizen Choice
What Data? How does the government decide?
Participation in Social Media; what are the rules ?]
john: any comment about those three or their relation to TF2?
[none heard]
john: an observation on the issue of
performance data
... a colleague of mine asked recently people if they use decision support
tools
... eg. tripadvisor to plan a holiday: majority said "yes"
... same question on using public services, nobody said "yes"
... of course, to be able to do that, eg. "holidays were good", "restaurant
was good" you need some performance data
... moving to TF3
[Data Aggregation
Your Web Site is your API]
john: I know that "Your Web Site is your API" is something that Oscar is keen on taking on
kevin: there was a discussion on the Chairs
call with the connection between TF3 and TF1
... on some of this, they agreed on talking to each other, find out where's
the overlap
... then proceed
john: next steps, we encouraged the TF coordinators to go ahead, take some actions *soon*
kevin: agree, if not we'll be distracted because of the holidays
john: hopefully, we'll have some work to review
on the next Group call
... so next step is get done existing actions
kevin: I'll talk to TF coordinators to have this going
john: so you'll check if something done by them
during the last week
... and then back to existing actions
kevin: will also talk to tanya, randeep wrt potential spring workshop
john: not much more to say, just energize the Group, please go ahead
kevin: +1
john: next meeting: 26 Nov, 14:00Z
kevin: it's thanksgiving week in the US, people
in the government usually drop off completely that week
... we can leave the date as is and query the Group later to see
john: +1
... so let's stick to the 26th
... I expect similar agenda structure
... anything else before we adjourn?
[ADJOURNED]
ACTION-36 - Post and ask around about 4, 6, 13 [on John Sheridan - due 2008-11-19].
[End of minutes]