See also: IRC log
<trackbot> Date: 16 September 2008
<scribe> scribe: erik
<scribe> scribeNick: ed
AE: as of right now, there are no
... DS you'll be tracking them as they come in?
DS: yes, I'll put them in the LC tracking tool
AE: it's up in two weeks
... not many responders
... three people coming
... want to remind everyone to respond
AE: still negotiation to be able
to go, but I think bitflash are sending someone
... do we have implementations to test except for the people that are coming?
DS: there's abbra, and I think chris contacted some people too
AE: so, at least one impl to
gather results for there
... and julian from spinetix
... we want to have good coverage, but we need to have enough people to do the testing
DS: the more people we have the better
AE: bitflash said they could send
additional people if we need more impls tested
... will send out an email about the testfest
... need to decide exactly where the meeting will be and so on
<scribe> ACTION: AE to move the ottawa testfest f2f page from the private to the public wiki, and add the location etc [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/16-svg-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-2192 - Move the ottawa testfest f2f page from the private to the public wiki, and add the location etc [on Andrew Emmons - due 2008-09-23].
AE: so in LC are we allowed to make any changes?
DS: got different answers
... the general consensus seem to be that it's ok to make changes in LC
... any change that affects an implementation that makes us reevaluate our test coverage isn't necessarily very good
AE: in this particular case, is this for SVG 1.1?
DS: i think it's for svg in general
AE: CL says adding an example might be a way forward
DS: i'm sceptical, it'd be
... we're making a spec for implementors
... we have an example that has xhtml in it, and it's using some bogus requiredExtension string
... it's a good idea to change the example, but I don't think it's enough
AE: should be raise it as an
... and discuss it over the course of our last call, to wait for further feedback
DS: we've already got
... question is if this is useful or if it harms anything
AE: what does everyone think of it?
ED: I'd be happy adding it
ED: proposed wording looks ok
AE: makes sense to make it generic like that
AE: my only hesitation is to be careful with making changes to the spec
DS: we'd need to make tests for it too
DS: how would you test it?
... abbra supports XHTML in foreignObject
AE: careful wording in the pass criteria would probably work
RESOLUTION: we'll clarify the wording in requiredextensions, adding the proposed wording from DS for XHTML and MathML
DS: do we want an errata item for 1.1 too?
<scribe> ACTION: DS to implement the resolution "we'll clarify the wording in requiredextensions, adding the proposed wording from DS for XHTML and MathML" and add a corresponding errata item for SVG 1.1 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/16-svg-minutes.html#action02]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-2193 - Implement the resolution \"we'll clarify the wording in requiredextensions, adding the proposed wording from DS for XHTML and MathML\" and add a corresponding errata item for SVG 1.1 [on Doug Schepers - due 2008-09-23].
RATIONALE: it's a proven interop issue, and the wording is ambigous, and we want interop
AE: CL said he fixed the second
... in the online version (so, for the next version)
... should we update the released package?
DS: I'd rather wait until we have new content
AE: the first part, is that something that could be changed in the script
AG: file permissions don't get stored with the file do they?
DS: follow up with doh?
<scribe> ACTION: AG to follow up with DOH on http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2008JulSep/0296.html regarding the first point [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/16-svg-minutes.html#action03]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-2194 - Follow up with DOH on http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2008JulSep/0296.html regarding the first point [on Anthony Grasso - due 2008-09-23].
AG: tests a specific part of
... the original tests didn't quite test it properly
AE: we shouldn't approve any new
tests until the f2f
... but assigning a reviewer is ok of course
... I'll review it
<scribe> ACTION: AE to review struct-discard-208-t.svg [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/16-svg-minutes.html#action04]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-2195 - Review struct-discard-208-t.svg [on Andrew Emmons - due 2008-09-23].
AG: opera passes
NH: ikivo passes
AG: quick question: are we still going to work on the testsuite after 1.2T goes to rec?
AE: agree, it'll probably be more tests added
DS: to push us over 500 approved tests, would be nice
AE: ok, back to the clip-paths
ED: haven't had time to look at the proposal in detail yet
DS: was trimmed down from what he had before
ED: would have to look at the CSS
box model to see if that's the most appropriate way of defining
exactly what's the size of the svg
... concerned about borders, margin, padding
DS: any objections to taking this on?
AE: it sounds very powerful
RESOLUTION: we'll take on this work, and liaison with the CSS WG to make sure this is ok
DS: what spec would it go
... filters? compositing?
... clipping and masking?
AE: do we want to raise an issue for this then?
DS: I'll add to tracker
... we could originate it in its own spec, like an svg-css spec
... might be more work though
AE: still some work to analyze this
DS: would prefer to put it in a spec now
AE: this is similar to the enableBackground (where wording is different in two modules)
AG: problem is that we'll have to push changes to everywhere
AE: we could have the spec
scripts pull changes from a central location
... we need to solve how this is handled though
AG: yes, that's one way, I don't
really mind how we solve this
... the other option is to make a small spec for things that overlap, and include that in the modules
AE: problem with that is if you
need one little bit only
... and it's own testsuite etc
... 1) pull in wording for e.g enable-background from some central place for every module
... 2) have a small common module
DS: or 3) to have duplicated
wording in each module
... problem is maintainability
... the second way is the profile way
... sounds like it would be better if it was specced out in one spec first, and then pulled into core
AE: but do we want everything in
... for the common things
... because when you look at this it'd be a collection of stuff that has little relation (except in context with the depending specs)
DS: so I think it makes sense to add roc's wording to the filters spec, even the clipping case
AE: so with enable-background, does it need to say anything about filters or clipping or can it be generic?
ED: it's pretty specific in
filters, showing the algortihm for the background-image
... not sure how it looks like in clipping/compositing
AG: the way i've used in
compositing is different from the filters spec
... describing attributes etc
... so if you want to pull in things how do we handle the fact that specs are written in different style?
AE/DS: we should strive to have the same style
AE: we might change the filters
spec to be the same style
... how do we merge things between modules? and how do we make sure style is consistent?
<scribe> ACTION: ed to work with AG on integrating ROC's proposal into the filters spec [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/16-svg-minutes.html#action05]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-2196 - Work with AG on integrating ROC's proposal into the filters spec [on Erik Dahlström - due 2008-09-23].
<scribe> ACTION: AG to work with ED on integrating ROC's proposal into the compositing/clipping&masking spec [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/16-svg-minutes.html#action06]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-2197 - Work with ED on integrating ROC's proposal into the compositing/clipping&masking spec [on Anthony Grasso - due 2008-09-23].
RESOLUTION: we'll fold the clipping&masking into the compositing module
<shepazu> Rationale: the fewer modules, the easier the integration of features
AE: so how do we merge common elements and attributes in modules, and the stylistic things
<scribe> ACTION: AG to fold in the clipping&masking chapter into the compositing module [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/16-svg-minutes.html#action07]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-2198 - Fold in the clipping&masking chapter into the compositing module [on Anthony Grasso - due 2008-09-23].
DS: do we want to assign editors for the new modules?
AE: maybe we should first decide
... need to keep focused, and we need to have the style ready first
AG: yes, we need to do that
... so we don't waste time later on
DS: so with vector-effects, I'd just pull in the 1.2Full draft into the module
DS: we should probably reexamine
... if this is the right approach
... for vector-effects
AG: yeah, there are a lot of problems with it as it stands
AE: so is there anywhere in the wiki we could have for stylistic rules, like what should go in the primer etc
AG: that'd be helpful
AE: maybe we could all work on that
DS: AE do you want to start it up?
AE: I was thinking AG
AG: one example is in print, all requirements are highlighted in red boxes
ED: i think i have an action to add that to filters too, but haven't had time to do it yet
AE: it makes sense to have that on the wiki
<scribe> ACTION: AG to add a wikipage for new modules, describing common styling etc [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/16-svg-minutes.html#action08]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-2199 - Add a wikipage for new modules, describing common styling etc [on Anthony Grasso - due 2008-09-23].
DS: my wishlist: vector-effects (cool, but will take awhile before implemented), the features that bitflash put in (the z-index) and the 2.5D stuff
AE: yes, we want to have the 2.5D
soon to see what people have done so far
... and also from a market POV
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.133 of Date: 2008/01/18 18:48:51 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Found Scribe: erik Found ScribeNick: ed Default Present: aemmons, Andrew_Sledd, anthony, ed, Doug_Schepers Present: aemmons Andrew_Sledd anthony ed Doug_Schepers Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2008JulSep/0304.html Found Date: 16 Sep 2008 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2008/09/16-svg-minutes.html People with action items: ae ag ds ed[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]