W3C

HTML Issue Tracking Teleconference

26 Jun 2008

Attendees

Present
ChrisWilson, smedero, +49.251.280.aacc, Josh, Julian, dsinger, laura, DanC, Joshue
Regrets
Gregory_Rosmaita, Steve_Faulkner
Chair
ChrisWilson
Scribe
MikeSmith

Contents


Convene meeting and review action items

<ChrisWilson> first action pending review: 54 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/54

<Joshue> Can +2 be undropped?

<ChrisWilson> (Gregory's item)

Action-54

action-54?

<trackbot> ACTION-54 -- Gregory Rosmaita to work with SteveF draft text for HTML 5 spec to require producers/authors to include @alt on img elements -- due 2008-06-19 -- PENDINGREVIEW

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/54

<ChrisWilson> Joshue, were you +2?

<Joshue> @Chris, I may have been.

<Joshue> Can't hear anything now..

<Joshue> I will ring back in maybe?

<Laura> For action 54 we are still waiting for a reply from the PFWG for Action Item 54 regarding several issues:

<Laura> http://tinyurl.com/48uyqv

<Laura> http://tinyurl.com/3v68tn

<Laura> guidance.

<Laura> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2008Jun/0205.html

<Laura> No timeline was given in Al's email. Request for an Action Item 54 time extension until there is a response from the PFWG.

<DanC> action-54?

<trackbot> ACTION-54 -- Gregory Rosmaita to work with SteveF draft text for HTML 5 spec to require producers/authors to include @alt on img elements -- due 2008-06-19 -- PENDINGREVIEW

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/54

<Joshue> +2 is Josh

<oedipus> GJR notes that he has reminded the PFWG that it is the group whose review is pending

<oedipus> GJR trying to get issue addressed today at face2face, but is last day with a heavy agenda

<Laura> Thanks, Gregory.

<oedipus> thank, YOU, laura

Action-23

action-23?

<trackbot> ACTION-23 -- Gregory Rosmaita to coordinate tests using ARIA -- due 2008-06-21 -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/23

<DanC> action-23?

<trackbot> ACTION-23 -- Gregory Rosmaita to coordinate tests using ARIA -- due 2008-06-21 -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/23

<ChrisWilson> GJR: yes, I noted that we are discussing later today and moved date.

<oedipus> thanks, ChrisW!

<ChrisWilson> any issues people want to discuss?

<DanC> action-32?

<trackbot> ACTION-32 -- Michael(tm) Smith to change the product name of "HTML 5 authoring guidelines" in the tracker to something else, eventually -- due 2008-01-24 -- CLOSED

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/32

Action-32

<DanC> action-56?

<trackbot> ACTION-56 -- Chris Wilson to chris Wilson to work with MikeSmith and DanC on (re)plan of action for forms coordination with Forms WG -- due 2008-06-26 -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/56

Action-66

Action-56

action-56

action-56?

<trackbot> ACTION-56 -- Chris Wilson to chris Wilson to work with MikeSmith and DanC on (re)plan of action for forms coordination with Forms WG -- due 2008-06-26 -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/56

Joshue: want to extend this to the 24th of July
... waiting for formal response from PFWWWG

<Joshue> We are also awaiting a response from PF

<Laura> Headers Wiki Page

<Laura> http://esw.w3.org/topic/HTML/IssueTableHeaders

URI error handling

<Zakim> DanC, you wanted to bring up error handling in URIs

DanC: URI error handling seems to be what the editor is working on

<Laura> @ Table Summary Wiki Page

<Laura> http://esw.w3.org/topic/HTML/SummaryForTABLE

<Laura> Advice Request to PFWG

<Laura> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/wai-xtech/2008Jun/0073.html

DanC: it looks like this is a case where browsers do something different than what the specs say ...
... particular case relates to non-ascii chars in URIs ...

<Joshue> Laura has already started working on updating the wiki in relation to @summary. I am organising user tests with screen reader users who will use test cases/real world data tables that use @summary. I hope to offer vidoe footage of the tests to the WG

DanC: Hixie has made some test material available ...

<oedipus> [fyi] TAG "Finding" on Associating Resources with Namespaces (25 June 2008) - http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/nsDocuments/

DanC: I would like to get confirmation that browsers do what has been said ...

<DanC> ... http://esw.w3.org/topic/UriTesting#preview

<DanC> ... http://hixie.ch/tests/adhoc/uri/encoding/

related discussion: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/uri/2008Jun/thread.html#msg2

DanC: I can volunteer to give test results for one browser. Any volunteers to test other browsers?

<Julian> I can run with IE, which test?

<ChrisWilson> http://hixie.ch/tests/adhoc/uri/encoding/

<DanC> all the tests in http://hixie.ch/tests/adhoc/uri/encoding/

<Julian> All of them? :-) Arg.

<ChrisWilson> :P

<Julian> Will try.

<DanC> darn; the expected results aren't crystal clear to me in all cases.

<DanC> maybe I'll mail Ian

ChrisWilson: DanC, can you work with Hixie to see what the expected results are?

<ChrisWilson> Any other issues before we take up forms?

<scribe> ACTION: DanC to work with Hixie to confirm what expected results are for http://hixie.ch/tests/adhoc/uri/encoding/ tests [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-html-wg-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-68 - Work with Hixie to confirm what expected results are for http://hixie.ch/tests/adhoc/uri/encoding/ tests [on Dan Connolly - due 2008-07-03].

<ChrisWilson> OK, forms (based on http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/56)

Forms in HTML

<gsnedders> AFAIK the point of those tests is to find out what browsers do to document it, therefore they have no expected results

ChrisWilson: we have in our charter a requirement related to forms, had a Forms TF that so far has not produced any resolutions

<DanC> I gather he's found out and has expected results in mind as he writes the spec, gsnedders

ChrisWilson: It would be better at this point to include Web Forms 2.0 in the HTML5 spec ...
... so that we have some stated direction ...
... rather than not having a stated direction at all ...

<Philip> (On the subject of tests, though otherwise entirely off-topic, http://philip.html5.org/tests/canvas/suite/tests/results.html was recently updated and shows how browsers are doing at <canvas>)

DanC: my comment is that there are some parts of WF 2.0 that I think we should put in, and some parts we should omit
... e.g., repetition templates ...

ChrisWilson: form data types are important
... how should we proceed on evaluating what parts of WF 2.0 that should be included and which can possibly be omitted?

<DanC> +1 poll on a section basis

ChrisWilson: I would suggest we put out a poll for incorporating the various sections of WF 2.0

<ChrisWilson> gsnedders: chartered TF runs out next week, doesn't it?

<gsnedders> ChrisWilson: Yeah, true. And they'll have failed to produce their chartered deliverable

<ChrisWilson> ACTION DanC to produce poll

<trackbot> Created ACTION-69 - Produce poll [on Dan Connolly - due 2008-07-03].

<gsnedders> ChrisWilson: Actually, all the charter says is, "The Forms Task Force expects to be done by July 2008."

ChrisWilson: DanC will take a stab at writing up poll on forms, ChrisWilson and MikeSmith will review

<Zakim> MikeSmith, you wanted to suggest using comment part of poll to allow people to note which parts to omit

<DanC> I had in mind ~4 items

<Julian> uri tests in IE: I see a script error for http://hixie.ch/tests/adhoc/uri/encoding/015.html...

<ChrisWilson> Take up pending review issues:

<Philip> Julian, which version of IE?

<Julian> Philip: IE7

Issues pending review

<ChrisWilson> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/3

<ChrisWilson> style-attribute

<DanC> issue-3?

<trackbot> ISSUE-3 -- conformance of element level style attributes -- RAISED

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/3

issue-3 style-attribute

<DanC> this seems worth an "any objections?" mail to the WG.

<DanC> (whee! an actual design decision!)

<dsinger> oops

<Joshue> Gotta go. Thanks.

<ChrisWilson> Bye

issue-20, Improvements to the table-headers algorithm in the HTML 5 spec

<Laura> Editor added Headers to the spec

<Laura> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2008Mar/0215.html

DanC: I tried a related test case with v.nu and it gave me a thumbs down
... it appears to consider @headers on td to be valid, but not on @th

ChrisWilson: we will discuss table headers at PFWG f2f meeting this week

<ChrisWilson> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/32 is table summary issue

issue-32 Include a summary attribute for tables?

ChrisWilson: we can take this back to PFWG and get a clearer problem description

issue-41 Decentralized extensibility

ChrisWilson: David Orchard made a proposal, Ian rejected with note that it was by design that HTML5 does not provide a decentralized extensibility mechanism

<Julian> +1 on what Chris is saying

<ChrisWilson> ack

<Zakim> MikeSmith, you wanted to suggest that I don't see how this proposed mechanism could be implemented without added namespace support to text/html, if we are required to be consistent

<DanC> ah... found it... this is why I think it's Ian's considered opinion, and not a misunderstanding, that he doesn't consider it cost-effective to take on distributed extensibilty: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2008Apr/0205.html " we actively want to make sure that

<DanC> people can't willy nilly extend the language without coordination with

<DanC> anyone interested in the development of the language"

<DanC> I think distributed extensibility is valuable, but the cost is pretty high... maybe too high.

<ChrisWilson> Julian: could reserve hooks for future

<ChrisWilson> Adjourn?

<ChrisWilson> ADJOURNED.

Summary of Action Items

[NEW] ACTION: DanC to work with Hixie to confirm what expected results are for http://hixie.ch/tests/adhoc/uri/encoding/ tests [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-html-wg-minutes.html#action01]