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Chatlog 2010-05-12

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12:48:03 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #egov
12:48:03 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/05/12-egov-irc
12:48:06 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #egov
12:48:32 <sandro> zakim, this will be egov
12:48:32 <Zakim> ok, sandro; I see T&S_EGOV()9:00AM scheduled to start in 12 minutes
12:56:35 <josema> josema has joined #egov
13:00:26 <Zakim> T&S_EGOV()9:00AM has now started
13:00:33 <Zakim> + +1.703.880.aaaa
13:00:36 <Chrisbeer> Chrisbeer has joined #egov
13:00:54 <Zakim> +Sandro
13:01:19 <Daniel_Bennett> Daniel_Bennett has joined #egov
13:02:07 <Zakim> + +1.202.319.aabb
13:02:19 <Daniel_Bennett> aabb is Daniel 
13:02:33 <Zakim> + +1.509.464.aacc
13:02:55 <Zakim> +[LC]
13:03:01 <edsu> Zakim, LC is edsu
13:03:01 <Zakim> +edsu; got it
13:04:39 <josema> trackbot, start telcon
13:04:42 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
13:04:44 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be EGOV
13:04:44 <Zakim> ok, trackbot, I see T&S_EGOV()9:00AM already started
13:04:45 <trackbot> Meeting: eGovernment Interest Group Teleconference
13:04:45 <trackbot> Date: 12 May 2010
13:04:59 <Zakim> + +03498429aadd
13:05:11 <josema> zakim aadd is me
13:05:16 <josema> zakim, aadd is me
13:05:16 <Zakim> +josema; got it
13:05:42 <sandro> music?
13:05:56 <edsu> that was cool :-)
13:06:29 <Daniel_Bennett> no prob
13:08:03 <Daniel_Bennett> http://docs.google.com/present/view?id=dfxgcdfc_224fvq2mwgv
13:08:19 <Rachel> Rachel has joined #egov
13:08:25 <OwenAmbur> OwenAmbur has joined #egov
13:09:20 <Zakim> - +1.509.464.aacc
13:09:50 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
13:09:59 <josema> sorry about my big mistake forgetting Daniel's item :(
13:10:04 <josema> let's start with this one
13:10:11 <josema> "Public Meeting Notices and Agendas"
13:10:36 <sandro> scribe: Cory
13:10:43 <Zakim> + +1.509.464.aaee
13:10:57 <sandro> Topic: Public Meeting Notices and Agendas
13:11:56 <cory> cory has joined #egov
13:12:01 <josema> chair: josema
13:12:04 <josema> regrets: george
13:12:16 <josema> zakim, mute me
13:12:16 <Zakim> josema should now be muted
13:12:54 <cory> Daniel - Checklist for public meetings and notices
13:17:13 <cory>  example: http://docs.google.com/present/view?id=dfxgcdfc_224fvq2mwgv
13:17:23 <Zakim> + +
13:19:41 <cygri> cygri has joined #egov
13:20:20 <josema> nope, W3C does not have "approved" process for sites' compliance
13:21:46 <Chrisbeer> zakim, aaff is me
13:21:46 <Zakim> +Chrisbeer; got it
13:23:10 <josema> [Daniel goes through slides]
13:23:43 <josema> s/example: http://docs.google.com/present/view?id=dfxgcdfc_224fvq2mwgv/example - http://sos.ri.gov/openmeetings/?page=meeting&id=86723
13:26:13 <LuigiMontanez> LuigiMontanez has joined #egov
13:28:34 <cory> W3C eGov and others can participate by:using listserv at publicmeetings.info
13:28:48 <josema> ack me
13:29:25 <cory> David completes slide presentation, asks for questions
13:29:34 <sandro> s/David/Daniel
13:29:48 <OwenAmbur> Good stuff, Daniel.
13:34:43 <cory> Chrisbeer: Has related juristictional metadata
13:35:00 <Chrisbeer> Chrisbeer: And agent metadata for organisations
13:35:08 <josema> s/Daniel -/Daniel:
13:35:24 <cory> Chrisbeer, would appriciate a link to that as well.
13:35:29 <Chrisbeer> one sec
13:35:48 <josema> agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-egov-ig/2010May/0020
13:36:15 <Chrisbeer> @ Cory, @ Daniel Jurisdiction RDF Schema : http://www.naa.gov.au/Images/RDFAglsJuri.rdfs_tcm2-8846.txt
13:36:35 <Chrisbeer> http://www.agls.gov.au/documents/AglsJuri/
13:36:44 <Chrisbeer> (thats to explanatory notes)
13:37:36 <Chrisbeer> Agency descriptions: http://www.naa.gov.au/records-management/create-capture-describe/describe/agls/encoding-scheme-agent.aspx
13:37:54 <Chrisbeer> (essentially just formal spec of a schema that uses DSCV)
13:38:08 <Zakim> + +1.202.731.aagg
13:38:09 <cory> Topic: Future of the group and our charter
13:38:14 <josema> current charter: http://www.w3.org/2009/06/eGov/ig-charter
13:39:12 <sandro> (only 7 months ago, not a year.)
13:41:26 <josema> ooops, you're right!
13:41:32 <sandro> zakim, who is here?
13:41:32 <Zakim> On the phone I see +1.703.880.aaaa, Sandro, +1.202.319.aabb, edsu, josema, [IPcaller], +1.509.464.aaee, Chrisbeer, +1.202.731.aagg
13:41:35 <Zakim> On IRC I see LuigiMontanez, cygri, cory, OwenAmbur, Rachel, Daniel_Bennett, Chrisbeer, josema, Zakim, RRSAgent, tlr, fadi, ww, edsu, sandro, trackbot
13:42:48 <josema> yeah, we certainly talk a lot, and I believe there are tons of good ideas in that talking but unfotunately not enough tangible stuff (i.e. +1 to Kevin)
13:43:18 <Zakim> + +03539149aahh
13:43:54 <Rachel> +1 to Kevin - lots of great talk but we need to produce some concrete, substantive work products to pass along knowledge
13:43:58 <Chrisbeer> +1
13:44:06 <josema> zakim, [IPCaller] is probably OwenAmbur
#13:44:06 <Zakim> +OwenAmbur?; got it
13:44:51 <josema> and they don't need to be anything long and complicated at all! short, to the point, should be enough and much appreciated by the community
13:46:17 <josema> I'm probably biased by our "gov-data" one, like it much, and would love to see its next iteration *soon*
13:47:12 <Zakim> - +1.202.319.aabb
13:47:15 <josema> this group was (and still is!) very good in bridging policy and technical layers in gov
13:47:21 <cory> Chrisbeer, we go from very broad and basic issues (best way to publish a PDF) to deep technical issues
13:47:58 <Zakim> + +1.202.319.aaii
13:50:47 <josema> pointer to Daniel's and Rachel's FOSE slides mentioned by Kevin?
13:50:53 <josema> anybody?
13:51:27 <cory> Rachel: "those on the ground making open gov hapen", get the big picture - need help with the practical steps for theory->practice
13:51:53 <josema> s/hapen/happen
13:52:28 <cory> SO, you sure you want me as a scribe :)
13:53:27 <cory> Daniel: Having deliverables moves things forward
13:54:33 <cory> Daniel: Like mobile publishing and html5
13:55:32 <cory> A lot of thismaterial is out there, but not specific to gov
13:56:02 <sandro> kevin: Our sweet spot:  people think government is different, so even if this stuff (eg html5 info) is out there, people want it in a govt context
13:57:34 <josema> +1 to kevin and I may have an example handy... yup... http://datos.fundacionctic.org/sandbox/asturias/sintrafor/canvas/
13:57:34 <cory> Chrisbeer: For LOD, how to set up a sparql endpoint (and what is it), etc.
13:58:30 <josema> that's html5, but the important thing for gov is not tech, it's that they have a way to show people on iPhone, Android and other mobile phones their training courses in a very easy way, thay don't care if it's html5 or anything else
13:58:39 <Chrisbeer> (Cause I sure as hell don't know how to do it, and trying to explain that to my developers and why they should? Don't get me started lol)
13:59:09 <cory> Daniel: Sparql enpoint is a technical issue.  At the other end, gov has oversight over "time" that need xml/semantic validation
13:59:11 <Zakim> - +03539149aahh
13:59:46 <cory> Daniel: Government has more to do with the ontologies
14:00:09 <josema> before the "how to setup a SPARQL endpoint", we need a "why you should use SPARQL" and also a "what is SPARQL" and "how SPARQL compare to what I already have and I have invested so much money on" ;)
14:00:22 <Chrisbeer> +1 Jose
14:00:26 <Rachel> sorry I need to leave the call (another mtg) but will stay on IRC
14:00:30 <Chrisbeer> +10 :)
14:00:41 <Zakim> - +1.509.464.aaee
14:00:42 <josema> he :)
14:01:10 <sandro> cory: our sweet spot is helping govts right the requirements to their contractors
14:01:17 <josema> just using SPARQL as an example, btw
14:01:31 <OwenAmbur> Had to step away but back now.
14:01:38 <cory> Government will focus on requiremnts (for contractors), not the "hot to" at a technical level
14:01:48 <sandro> Daniel: our sweet spot is govts setting the standard ontologies, eg time
14:03:15 <josema> q?
14:03:36 <Chrisbeer> http://www.w3.org/TR/gov-data/ <-- Still in Draft, yet cited extensively. Example of how products like this are well received.
14:04:09 <josema> +1 to Chrisbeer
14:04:53 <josema> reminds me of *very* early IG discussions
14:07:08 <Chrisbeer> http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/Special:AllPages
14:07:34 <Chrisbeer>  eg: http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/Use_Case_10_-_Persistent_URIs
14:08:36 <josema> yup, another good example of great ideas in there
14:09:44 <josema> FYI, "gov-data" was formerly nicknamed "data.gov.* memo"
14:11:10 <sandro> (top ten list --- is that a FAQ?)
14:12:33 <sandro> wow, nice, Chrisbeer.
14:12:38 <Chrisbeer> @Ed - I'd make it heirarchical - start with e-Government. Then split to (for instance) service delivery and information publication. Then split it down further. Should cascase out logically.
14:12:53 <Chrisbeer> *cascade
14:13:28 <Chrisbeer> @sandro ?
14:13:48 <edsu> sorry all, i have to leave for another mtg -- will look for follow up on the discussion list :-)
14:13:56 <Zakim> -edsu
14:18:34 <sandro> chrisbeer: quick brainstorm -- what does govt do online?
14:18:51 <sandro> cory: govt services on the web -- from library books to grants
14:18:55 <sandro> cory: social networking
14:19:12 <sandro> chrisbeer: yeah, collaboration/egnagement
14:19:16 <sandro> cory: web applications
14:19:23 <sandro> kevin: what are the pain points?
14:19:50 <OwenAmbur> See the open gov plans at http://xml.gov/stratml/drybridge/index.htm#OpenGovDirective
14:19:56 <sandro> cory: not my area really, but "policy"
14:20:29 <sandro> chrisbeer: How you should engage online?   Who should engage online?   Archiving?   How to make social media part of govt record.   Security, Pricavy, Trust, Provenance
14:21:46 <josema> zakim, who's here?
#14:21:46 <Zakim> On the phone I see +1.703.880.aaaa, Sandro, josema, OwenAmbur?, Chrisbeer, +1.202.731.aagg, +1.202.319.aaii
14:21:48 <Zakim> On IRC I see LuigiMontanez, cygri, cory, OwenAmbur, Rachel, Daniel_Bennett, Chrisbeer, josema, Zakim, RRSAgent, tlr, ww, edsu, sandro, trackbot
14:22:45 <sandro> daniel: social media is currently like the early days of e-mail, when people used it without knowing what it is.    people might think tweets are inherently archived.
14:26:39 <cory> Sandro or Jose - how is http://www.w3.org/TR/gov-data/ maintained?
14:27:00 <Rachel> basics that would be helpful for govt - if we could explain: 1) what it is, 2) why you should care about it it, 3) HOW to implement
14:27:23 <josema> rachel, example: http://www.w3.org/standards/webdesign/i18n
14:27:25 <Rachel> social media is a whole separate area - believe it is most helpful at this point to focus on "basics"
14:27:26 <cory> So Rache, a set of "basics" pages?
14:28:33 <Rachel> yes Josema - good example - if we can develop some docs like that, would be terrific!
14:28:53 <Chrisbeer> (I have one very quick agenda item by the way before we finish)
14:29:43 <Chrisbeer> Ed and I will make the initial page during the next fortnight!
14:29:52 <Rachel> let's come up w/a list of topics on  which we should develop 2-pg "basics" - such as "how to publish pdfs"
14:30:08 <Chrisbeer> @Rachel - yup - thats what the page will be :)
14:30:33 <josema> I think we all agree
14:30:34 <Rachel> GREAT!  Thanks!!!
14:31:31 <sandro> action: chrisbeer make a wiki page of 2 pagers
14:31:31 <trackbot> Could not create new action (unparseable data in server response: No child element named 'id') - please contact sysreq with the details of what happened.
14:31:43 <sandro> action: cbeer make a wiki page of 2 pagers
14:31:43 <trackbot> Could not create new action (unparseable data in server response: No child element named 'id') - please contact sysreq with the details of what happened.
14:32:08 <sandro> http://www.w3.org/egov/IG/track/actions/open
14:32:08 <OwenAmbur> How about a 2-pager expanding upon the definition of "open formats" in the eGov Directive? http://xml.gov/stratml/carmel/OGDwStyle.xml#_7d88050e-142e-11df-a454-3f207a64ea2a
14:32:34 <sandro> action: cbeer to make a wiki page of 2 pagers
14:32:34 <trackbot> Could not create new action (unparseable data in server response: No child element named 'id') - please contact sysreq with the details of what happened.
14:34:05 <cory> In addition to the "2 pagers", I would suggest a glossary
14:34:25 <Daniel_Bennett> +1 cory  
14:34:44 <Chrisbeer> @Rachel - will send you details via email tomorrow since you can't hear this bit btw
14:34:59 <Daniel_Bennett> thanks Chrisbeer for those links
14:36:13 <Zakim> -Sandro
14:36:15 <Zakim> - +1.202.731.aagg
14:36:18 <Zakim> -josema
14:36:20 <Zakim> - +1.202.319.aaii
14:36:21 <josema> [ADJOURNED]
14:36:21 <Zakim> -Chrisbeer
#14:36:23 <Zakim> -OwenAmbur?
14:36:24 <Zakim> - +1.703.880.aaaa
14:36:26 <Zakim> T&S_EGOV()9:00AM has ended
14:36:27 <Zakim> Attendees were +1.703.880.aaaa, Sandro, +1.202.319.aabb, +1.509.464.aacc, edsu, +03498429aadd, josema, +1.509.464.aaee, +, Chrisbeer, +1.202.731.aagg, +03539149aahh,
#14:36:29 <Zakim> ... OwenAmbur?, +1.202.319.aaii
14:37:36 <Chrisbeer> @Daniel - happy to expand on those links or assist with them if you need to - they are part of a whole Government based metadata standard. UK prob has similar - John S. or David Pullinger should be able to assist there.
14:37:42 <Chrisbeer> Night all!
14:38:12 <Daniel_Bennett> thanks. please send them along.
16:24:18 <Zakim> Zakim has left #egov