<sandro> Guest: Kate Geyer
<sandro> Guest: Erik (dret) Wilde
<sandro> Guest: Jon Phipps
<sandro> Guest: Peter Krantz
<sandro> Guest: Luigi Montanez
<sandro> Guest: Rich Wolverton
<sandro> Guest: Niklas (lindstream) Lindström
<sandro> Guest: William (ww) Waites
<sandro> Guest: Dan (dan) Thomas
<sandro> Guest: Dan (danbri) Brickley
<sandro> chair: cygri
<sandro> scribe: sandro
(Scribe set to Sandro Hawke)
<sandro> Present: Cory_Casanave, David_James, Ed_Summers, Fadi_Maali, George_Thomas, Martín_Álvarez, Richard_Cyganiak, Sandro_Hawke, Vassilios_Peristeras, Li_Ding
15:10:46 <li> hi this is Li Ding from RPI
Li Ding: hi this is Li Ding from RPI ←
15:11:02 <li> I cannot join the telecon as I have a conflict telecon right now
Li Ding: I cannot join the telecon as I have a conflict telecon right now ←
15:11:24 <li> but I will stay in IRC, would there be anyone help scribing the conversation?
Li Ding: but I will stay in IRC, would there be anyone help scribing the conversation? ←
15:11:44 <sandro> topic: Introductions (several new people)
15:11:46 <Zakim> -Cory
Zakim IRC Bot: -Cory ←
15:12:09 <Zakim> +??P10
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P10 ←
15:12:10 <sandro> sandro
sandro ←
15:12:12 <sandro> david james
david james ←
15:12:39 <Cory> Zakim, ??p10 is Cory
Cory Casanave: Zakim, ??p10 is Cory ←
15:12:39 <Zakim> +Cory; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Cory; got it ←
15:12:40 <sandro> luigi
luigi ←
15:12:42 <sandro> Martín Álvarez
Martín Álvarez ←
15:13:29 <sandro> George Thomas
George Thomas ←
15:13:59 <RichW> Rich Wolverton from Comm of Mass Supporting ODI
Rich Wolverton: Rich Wolverton from Comm of Mass Supporting ODI ←
15:14:01 <sandro> Rich_Wolverton
Rich_Wolverton ←
15:14:52 <sandro> Erik Wilde
Erik Wilde ←
15:15:27 <sandro> Richard Cyganiak,
Richard Cyganiak, ←
15:15:44 <sandro> Fadi Maali
Fadi Maali ←
15:16:01 <sandro> Kate Geyer
Kate Geyer ←
15:16:24 <sandro> Jon Phipps
Jon Phipps ←
15:16:47 <sandro> Cory Casanave
Cory Casanave ←
15:16:56 <vassilios> Vassilios Peristeras from the DERI team
Vassilios Peristeras: Vassilios Peristeras from the DERI team ←
15:17:03 <sandro> Brand Neimann
Brand Neimann ←
15:17:28 <sandro> Niklas Lindström
Niklas Lindström ←
15:17:50 <sandro> Dan Thomas, DC
Dan Thomas, DC ←
15:19:13 <sandro> William (ww) Waites
William (ww) Waites ←
15:19:54 <sandro> next scribe: Ed Summers
next scribe: Ed Summers ←
15:20:16 <sandro> agenda: http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/Data_Catalog_Vocabulary/2010-04-22
15:20:33 <sandro> topic: Presentations of existing work
15:21:21 <sandro> cygri: please keep it short -- 3 to 5 minutes, pointers to more details
Richard Cyganiak: please keep it short -- 3 to 5 minutes, pointers to more details ←
15:21:27 <edsu> http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/Data_Catalog_Vocabulary/DC-SKOS
Ed Summers: http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/Data_Catalog_Vocabulary/DC-SKOS ←
15:21:37 <sandro> subtopic: Ed Summers, Brief Intro to Dublin Core and SKOS
15:22:11 <sandro> (page looks great, Ed)
(page looks great, Ed) ←
15:22:25 <sandro> edsu: I imagine most folks are familiar with DC and SKOS
Ed Summers: I imagine most folks are familiar with DC and SKOS ←
15:22:44 <sandro> edsu: DC started in 1995 to create a core set of elements to describe documents in the internet
Ed Summers: DC started in 1995 to create a core set of elements to describe documents in the internet ←
15:23:06 <sandro> edsu: ... workshop in Dublin, Ohio. 13 elements. Meeting every years since then.
Ed Summers: ... workshop in Dublin, Ohio. 13 elements. Meeting every years since then. ←
15:23:16 <sandro> ... turned into IETF and NISO/ISO standards
... turned into IETF and NISO/ISO standards ←
15:23:32 <sandro> ... co-evolved with RDF, due to people like Eric Miller
... co-evolved with RDF, due to people like Eric Miller ←
15:23:53 <sandro> ... DC has its own "Abstract Model", the way they make descriptions, very similar to RDF model
... DC has its own "Abstract Model", the way they make descriptions, very similar to RDF model ←
15:24:08 <sandro> ... expresses vocabulary in RDF, (DC Terms)
... expresses vocabulary in RDF, (DC Terms) ←
15:24:27 <sandro> ... I have links to how widely it's used.
... I have links to how widely it's used. ←
15:24:42 <DavidJames> I'm having trouble logging into the wiki. When the meeting is over, perhaps someone can help?
David James: I'm having trouble logging into the wiki. When the meeting is over, perhaps someone can help? ←
15:25:39 <Zakim> -martin
Zakim IRC Bot: -martin ←
15:25:41 <sandro> edsu: SKOS. 1999, mostly through EU projects. in 2004 moved to W3C. Jon Phipps was part of that.
Ed Summers: SKOS. 1999, mostly through EU projects. in 2004 moved to W3C. Jon Phipps was part of that. ←
15:25:58 <sandro> ... defined in "SKOS Reference" A W3C Recommendation in 2009.
... defined in "SKOS Reference" A W3C Recommendation in 2009. ←
15:26:42 <danbri> (the work started in DESIRE EU project - http://www.desire.org/html/research/deliverables/D3.6/d36b.html ... then Limber and SWAD-Europe. Thanks, EU taxpayers...)
Dan Brickley: (the work started in DESIRE EU project - http://www.desire.org/html/research/deliverables/D3.6/d36b.html ... then Limber and SWAD-Europe. Thanks, EU taxpayers...) ←
15:26:44 <sandro> ... People with various controlled vocabs; skos lets them easily mint URIs for them, without re-engineering that whole information space (eg to fit into OWL). Lightweight way to get existing data of that sort onto the web.
... People with various controlled vocabs; skos lets them easily mint URIs for them, without re-engineering that whole information space (eg to fit into OWL). Lightweight way to get existing data of that sort onto the web. ←
15:27:02 <sandro> ... see examples on the web page. http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/Data_Catalog_Vocabulary/DC-SKOS
... see examples on the web page. http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/Data_Catalog_Vocabulary/DC-SKOS ←
15:27:40 <fadi_> http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/Data_Catalog_Vocabulary/DERI_dcat_Demonstrator
Fadi Maali: http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/Data_Catalog_Vocabulary/DERI_dcat_Demonstrator ←
15:27:43 <sandro> subtopic: DERI's dcat, Fadi
15:28:09 <sandro> fadi: dcat is an RDF vocabulary to represent government data catalogs.
Fadi Maali: dcat is an RDF vocabulary to represent government data catalogs. ←
15:28:26 <sandro> ... design was informed by analyzing existing catalogs.
... design was informed by analyzing existing catalogs. ←
15:28:40 <sandro> ... we looked at what attributes existing catalogs used
... we looked at what attributes existing catalogs used ←
15:28:54 <sandro> ... then we looked at the data, to see how consistently it was used
... then we looked at the data, to see how consistently it was used ←
15:29:06 <sandro> ... main entities are Dataset and Catalog
... main entities are Dataset and Catalog ←
15:29:15 <ww> question re: dcat:granularity could perhaps be dcat:spatialGranularity and dcat:temporalGranularity?
William Waites: question re: dcat:granularity could perhaps be dcat:spatialGranularity and dcat:temporalGranularity? ←
15:29:39 <sandro> ... we tried to use skos:Concept
... we tried to use skos:Concept ←
15:29:59 <sandro> zakim, who is talking?
zakim, who is talking? ←
15:30:11 <Zakim> sandro, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: ??P27 (13%), cygri (37%)
Zakim IRC Bot: sandro, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: ??P27 (13%), cygri (37%) ←
15:31:11 <lindstream> Re. distribution/updates: quite orthogonal. I like how dady extends void with that.
Niklas Lindström: Re. distribution/updates: quite orthogonal. I like how dady extends void with that. ←
15:30:27 <sandro> subtopic: CTIC's Dataset Catalog Vocabulary and “meta-catalog” (Martin)
15:30:33 <sandro> martin???
martin??? ←
15:30:40 <sandro> zakim, where is martin?
zakim, where is martin? ←
15:30:40 <Zakim> sorry, sandro, I do not understand your question
Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, sandro, I do not understand your question ←
15:30:42 <martin> I cannot connect to the conference, Zakim sais that it's full
Martín Álvarez: I cannot connect to the conference, Zakim sais that it's full ←
15:30:54 <sandro> martin, press *0 to get the operator to add you
martin, press *0 to get the operator to add you ←
15:31:26 <sandro> if you can't get in, we'll do your presesntation next week. so sorry for not having enough space today.
if you can't get in, we'll do your presesntation next week. so sorry for not having enough space today. ←
15:31:43 <martin> I'm trying to contact an operator
Martín Álvarez: I'm trying to contact an operator ←
15:31:41 <sandro> subtopic: Sunlight Labs API proposal (David, Luigi)
15:31:41 <LuigiMontanez> http://nationaldatacatalog.com/
Luigi Montanez: http://nationaldatacatalog.com/ ←
15:32:02 <sandro> DavidJames: National Data Catalog
David James: National Data Catalog ←
15:32:03 <Zakim> +martin
Zakim IRC Bot: +martin ←
15:32:15 <LuigiMontanez> http://wiki.sunlightlabs.com/Government_Data_Catalog_Guidelines
Luigi Montanez: http://wiki.sunlightlabs.com/Government_Data_Catalog_Guidelines ←
15:32:25 <sandro> DavidJames: We're looking for a few things.
David James: We're looking for a few things. ←
15:32:30 <sandro> ... being ReSTful
... being ReSTful ←
15:32:50 <sandro> ... We view RDF as one way to express our data, but we're also looking for other formats
... We view RDF as one way to express our data, but we're also looking for other formats ←
15:33:23 <sandro> ... developers really gravidate to lightweight solutions, and don't feel like RDF is worthwhile, from what they can tell.
... developers really gravidate to lightweight solutions, and don't feel like RDF is worthwhile, from what they can tell. ←
15:33:43 <sandro> ... We're planning to add RDF support down the right, but at this point our key job is building buy-in
... We're planning to add RDF support down the right, but at this point our key job is building buy-in ←
15:33:57 <sandro> ... We think the RDF community really understand how to make the data interoperable
... We think the RDF community really understand how to make the data interoperable ←
15:34:12 <sandro> ... We want to adopt principals of RDF, even if we're not using the RDF formats right now.
... We want to adopt principals of RDF, even if we're not using the RDF formats right now. ←
15:34:41 <sandro> topic: Atom and dataset updates
15:34:47 <sandro> zakim, who is talking?
zakim, who is talking? ←
15:34:58 <Zakim> sandro, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: ??P27 (26%), cygri (60%), jonphipps (20%)
Zakim IRC Bot: sandro, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: ??P27 (26%), cygri (60%), jonphipps (20%) ←
15:35:13 <sandro> cygri: What are the reasons we should consider other solutions? Are there things not easily covered by RDF?
Richard Cyganiak: What are the reasons we should consider other solutions? Are there things not easily covered by RDF? ←
15:35:23 <sandro> zakim, who is talking?
zakim, who is talking? ←
15:35:30 <edsu> uhoh
Ed Summers: uhoh ←
15:35:32 <LuigiMontanez> cannot hear
Luigi Montanez: cannot hear ←
15:35:34 <Zakim> sandro, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: ??P27 (18%), cygri (49%)
Zakim IRC Bot: sandro, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: ??P27 (18%), cygri (49%) ←
15:35:36 <vassilios> +1
15:35:41 <dret> terrible noise
Erik Wilde: terrible noise ←
15:35:42 <sandro> zakim, mute ??P27
zakim, mute ??P27 ←
15:35:42 <Zakim> ??P27 should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: ??P27 should now be muted ←
15:35:48 <DavidJames> We are being jammed by touch tones
David James: We are being jammed by touch tones ←
15:35:54 <edsu> damn!
Ed Summers: damn! ←
15:36:05 <sandro> zakim, who is talking?
zakim, who is talking? ←
15:36:15 <Zakim> sandro, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: martin (3%), Sandro (46%), cygri (35%)
Zakim IRC Bot: sandro, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: martin (3%), Sandro (46%), cygri (35%) ←
15:36:27 <sandro> q+
q+ ←
15:37:48 <sandro> LuigiMontanez: It's mostly the tooling, as a developer. As a ruby or python developer. We're used to working with twitter or facebook API.
Luigi Montanez: It's mostly the tooling, as a developer. As a ruby or python developer. We're used to working with twitter or facebook API. ←
15:37:52 <dan> JSON is a notation scheme, RDF is structure. here is example of RDF in JSON notation: http://n2.talis.com/wiki/RDF_JSON_Specification
Dan Thomas: JSON is a notation scheme, RDF is structure. here is example of RDF in JSON notation: http://n2.talis.com/wiki/RDF_JSON_Specification ←
15:38:03 <sandro> ... they don't tread into RDF world, even though it might be good for them, too.
... they don't tread into RDF world, even though it might be good for them, too. ←
15:38:23 <sandro> ... it's not that RDF is more complicated; it's about the tooling.
... it's not that RDF is more complicated; it's about the tooling. ←
15:38:37 <sandro> ... ckan is the only one I know of.
... ckan is the only one I know of. ←
15:38:45 <sandro> ack sandro
ack sandro ←
15:38:49 <DavidJames> I just added a section called "Context / Philosophy" to http://wiki.sunlightlabs.com/Government_Data_Catalog_Guidelines
David James: I just added a section called "Context / Philosophy" to http://wiki.sunlightlabs.com/Government_Data_Catalog_Guidelines ←
15:38:50 <ww> dan: we've experimented with some success storing rdf/json in mongodb
Dan Thomas: we've experimented with some success storing rdf/json in mongodb [ Scribe Assist by William Waites ] ←
15:38:52 <sandro> http://code.google.com/p/linked-data-api/
http://code.google.com/p/linked-data-api/ ←
15:40:05 <lindstream> ww, cool
Niklas Lindström: ww, cool ←
15:40:35 <sandro> sandro: linked-data-api might be a good solution here [details]
Sandro Hawke: linked-data-api might be a good solution here [details] ←
15:40:51 <sandro> cygri: are you thinking about govt agencies, or developer/users?
Richard Cyganiak: are you thinking about govt agencies, or developer/users? ←
15:41:01 <sandro> Luigi: Both.
Luigi Montanez: Both. ←
15:41:12 <dan> ww: similarly working on crime summary vocab using this approach: http://www.ipublic.org/wiki/Crime_summary_vocabulary
William Waites: similarly working on crime summary vocab using this approach: http://www.ipublic.org/wiki/Crime_summary_vocabulary [ Scribe Assist by Dan Thomas ] ←
15:41:15 <sandro> Luigi: The govt agency usually just wants to make a website.
Luigi Montanez: The govt agency usually just wants to make a website. ←
15:41:27 <sandro> ... they say "Well, how do we provide the data/api"?
... they say "Well, how do we provide the data/api"? ←
15:41:38 <sandro> ... we say use existing/popular techniques
... we say use existing/popular techniques ←
15:41:44 <sandro> ... socrata [?]
... socrata [?] ←
15:42:00 <sandro> ... municipalities can get started very quickly that way
... municipalities can get started very quickly that way ←
15:42:30 <sandro> ... at sunlight we try to convcince gocts to put their data on line. we want to tell them to do the easiest thing for them, and unforunately right now, that's not RDF.
... at sunlight we try to convcince gocts to put their data on line. we want to tell them to do the easiest thing for them, and unforunately right now, that's not RDF. ←
15:42:59 <sandro> cygri: Quite a few catalogs are using simple structured forms, pre web, CSV. eg data.gov.
Richard Cyganiak: Quite a few catalogs are using simple structured forms, pre web, CSV. eg data.gov. ←
15:43:14 <sandro> cygri: So you want to go one step beyond this, eg json, xml.
Richard Cyganiak: So you want to go one step beyond this, eg json, xml. ←
15:43:37 <sandro> DavidJames: We're also looking for interop. I think that's where RDF really shines.
David James: We're also looking for interop. I think that's where RDF really shines. ←
15:43:56 <sandro> DavidJames: let's create this RDF spec, but make it easy for agencies and developers to adopt it.
David James: let's create this RDF spec, but make it easy for agencies and developers to adopt it. ←
15:44:01 <sandro> +1 sounds great!
+1 sounds great! ←
15:44:40 <li> we have been playing around with CSV based catalog at data.gov
Li Ding: we have been playing around with CSV based catalog at data.gov ←
15:44:51 <sandro> DavidJames: Gov't agencies are ... somewhat behind. Permanent URLs would be great. Feeds would be great.
David James: Gov't agencies are ... somewhat behind. Permanent URLs would be great. Feeds would be great. ←
15:44:55 <Cory> +q
Cory Casanave: +q ←
15:45:05 <sandro> DavidJames: THEN we can push for RDF, etc. There's a LOT to do.
David James: THEN we can push for RDF, etc. There's a LOT to do. ←
15:45:17 <li> at RPI. and there are some imperfect entries
Li Ding: at RPI. and there are some imperfect entries ←
15:45:21 <sandro> DavidJames: We want to be careful about what we ask for. Short term + Long Term.
David James: We want to be careful about what we ask for. Short term + Long Term. ←
15:45:31 <sandro> ack DavidJames
ack DavidJames ←
15:45:39 <sandro> cygri: Great concrete requirements
Richard Cyganiak: Great concrete requirements ←
15:45:50 <sandro> cygri:What do you mean "feeds". In which sense?
Richard Cyganiak: What do you mean "feeds". In which sense? ←
15:46:01 <li> for short time goal, we should consider work out a minimal set of vocabulary agreed by all
Li Ding: for short time goal, we should consider work out a minimal set of vocabulary agreed by all ←
15:46:07 <li> and promote it
15:46:12 <sandro> DavidJames: Something that makes it easy for automatic importers, so it's easy to see when a record has changed.
David James: Something that makes it easy for automatic importers, so it's easy to see when a record has changed. ←
15:46:39 <sandro> cygri: To be able to sync, to keep up with changes, which of 3000 data sets have changed in last week
Richard Cyganiak: To be able to sync, to keep up with changes, which of 3000 data sets have changed in last week ←
15:47:09 <sandro> LuigiMontanez: Yes. To see which data sets have updated, and so developer knows when to pull and update their copy of the data.
Luigi Montanez: Yes. To see which data sets have updated, and so developer knows when to pull and update their copy of the data. ←
15:47:14 <cygri> ack Cory
Richard Cyganiak: ack Cory ←
15:47:44 <George> you meant 'normal xml'
George Thomas: you meant 'normal xml' ←
15:47:56 <sandro> Cory: In making RDF, in the short term, the striped data format often gets overlooked. RDF *CAN* be written (striped) to look like normal XML, with an XML schema, and processed with normal XML tools. But it's ALSO normal RDF.
Cory Casanave: In making RDF, in the short term, the striped data format often gets overlooked. RDF *CAN* be written (striped) to look like normal XML, with an XML schema, and processed with normal XML tools. But it's ALSO normal RDF. ←
15:48:07 <LuigiMontanez> http://www.stripesframework.org/display/stripes/Home
Luigi Montanez: http://www.stripesframework.org/display/stripes/Home ←
15:48:10 <sandro> +1 cory using constrained RDF/XML is nice.
+1 cory using constrained RDF/XML is nice. ←
15:48:21 <lindstream> have you seen: http://code.google.com/p/oort/wiki/Grit ? (self-promotion ;] )
Niklas Lindström: have you seen: http://code.google.com/p/oort/wiki/Grit ? (self-promotion ;] ) ←
15:48:25 <sandro> George, I'm sure he did.
George, I'm sure he did. ←
15:48:52 <LuigiMontanez> Oops, think my link was wrong
Luigi Montanez: Oops, think my link was wrong ←
15:49:00 <sandro> cygri: yes, regular serialization is one approach. GRDDL is another way.
Richard Cyganiak: yes, regular serialization is one approach. GRDDL is another way. ←
15:49:02 <lindstream> +q
Niklas Lindström: +q ←
15:49:04 <LuigiMontanez> This look more correct as to what Cory was referring: http://www.w3.org/2001/10/stripes/
Luigi Montanez: This look more correct as to what Cory was referring: http://www.w3.org/2001/10/stripes/ ←
15:49:19 <sandro> cygri: Also RDFa
Richard Cyganiak: Also RDFa ←
15:49:34 <sandro> cygri: Allows one to parse RDF graph out of HTML page.
Richard Cyganiak: Allows one to parse RDF graph out of HTML page. ←
15:49:38 <George> +1 Cory and cygri - developers need some schoolin'
George Thomas: +1 Cory and cygri - developers need some schoolin' ←
15:49:39 <li> regarding to the changes in data.gov, we even use twitter to publish the changes https://twitter.com/datagovwiki
Li Ding: regarding to the changes in data.gov, we even use twitter to publish the changes https://twitter.com/datagovwiki ←
15:49:55 <sandro> cygri: Ways to bridge RDF and what developers want.
Richard Cyganiak: Ways to bridge RDF and what developers want. ←
15:50:05 <sandro> ack lindstream
ack lindstream ←
15:50:13 <edsu> lindstream: you on the call?
Niklas Lindström: you on the call? [ Scribe Assist by Ed Summers ] ←
15:50:18 <sandro> lindstream....
lindstream.... ←
15:50:30 <lindstream> i hear you, you don't hear me?
Niklas Lindström: i hear you, you don't hear me? ←
15:50:31 <sandro> zakim, who is muted?
zakim, who is muted? ←
15:50:31 <Zakim> I see ??P27, Rich_Wolverton, +0789798aaee muted
Zakim IRC Bot: I see ??P27, Rich_Wolverton, +0789798aaee muted ←
15:50:56 <sandro> zakim, unmute ??P27
zakim, unmute ??P27 ←
15:50:56 <Zakim> ??P27 should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: ??P27 should no longer be muted ←
15:51:05 <edsu> sandro++
Ed Summers: sandro++ ←
15:51:35 <Cory> luigu - yes, http://www.w3.org/2001/10/stripes/ is it - often overlooked as a bridge. What this doesn't say is that it can also have an XSD
Cory Casanave: luigu - yes, http://www.w3.org/2001/10/stripes/ is it - often overlooked as a bridge. What this doesn't say is that it can also have an XSD ←
15:51:59 <sandro> lindstream: Regarding formats, that's a very important point. Not trick people into producing RDF, but make it transparent for them. They do namespaced XML and it just happens to be RDF. That's what I proposed with GRIT, a normalized RDF.
Niklas Lindström: Regarding formats, that's a very important point. Not trick people into producing RDF, but make it transparent for them. They do namespaced XML and it just happens to be RDF. That's what I proposed with GRIT, a normalized RDF. ←
15:52:13 <sandro> (I call this "rigid RDF" myself.)
(I call this "rigid RDF" myself.) ←
15:52:24 <ww> support for serialising striped xml in the usual tools?
William Waites: support for serialising striped xml in the usual tools? ←
15:52:27 <li> AT RPI we have already experimenting RDFa for metadata publishing, here is an example http://data-gov.tw.rpi.edu/wiki/Dataset_34, and the parsed RDFa can be found at http://data-gov.tw.rpi.edu/ws/lodcx.php?url=http%3A%2F%2Fdata-gov.tw.rpi.edu%2Fwiki%2FDataset_34&operation=test. Further more, the RDFa data can be used to enrich search result, e.g. http://dat
Li Ding: AT RPI we have already experimenting RDFa for metadata publishing, here is an example http://data-gov.tw.rpi.edu/wiki/Dataset_34, and the parsed RDFa can be found at http://data-gov.tw.rpi.edu/ws/lodcx.php?url=http%3A%2F%2Fdata-gov.tw.rpi.edu%2Fwiki%2FDataset_34&operation=test. Further more, the RDFa data can be used to enrich search result, e.g. http://dat ←
15:52:34 <li> http://data-gov.tw.rpi.edu/ws/lodcs.php?query=earthquake
Li Ding: http://data-gov.tw.rpi.edu/ws/lodcs.php?query=earthquake ←
15:52:57 <sandro> cygri: note on IRC the RPI examples
Richard Cyganiak: note on IRC the RPI examples ←
15:53:05 <sandro> cygri: Opinions on RDFa?
Richard Cyganiak: Opinions on RDFa? ←
15:53:27 <sandro> q+ to comment on dcat scope
q+ to comment on dcat scope ←
15:53:38 <sandro> cygri: Is RDF acceptable to folks?
Richard Cyganiak: Is RDF acceptable to folks? ←
15:53:47 <sandro> zakim, mute ??P27
zakim, mute ??P27 ←
15:53:47 <Zakim> ??P27 should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: ??P27 should now be muted ←
15:53:56 <lindstream> I like RDFa a lot, but's afaik it can only be viewed with an "RDF eye"
Niklas Lindström: I like RDFa a lot, but's afaik it can only be viewed with an "RDF eye" ←
15:54:01 <sandro> zakim, ??P27 is lindstream
zakim, ??P27 is lindstream ←
15:54:01 <Zakim> +lindstream; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +lindstream; got it ←
15:54:07 <sandro> lindstream, I muted you because of noise
lindstream, I muted you because of noise ←
15:54:42 <lindstream> (sandro, my line is very poor right now)
Niklas Lindström: (sandro, my line is very poor right now) ←
15:54:44 <sandro> ww: data.gov.uk rdfa is made by drupal front-end, it's completelye disconnected from backend rdf store
William Waites: data.gov.uk rdfa is made by drupal front-end, it's completelye disconnected from backend rdf store ←
15:55:13 <DavidJames> Luigi and I are taking a look at some fairly recent open source code for Ruby and RDF here: http://github.com/bendiken/rdf
David James: Luigi and I are taking a look at some fairly recent open source code for Ruby and RDF here: http://github.com/bendiken/rdf ←
15:56:04 <sandro> q?
q? ←
15:56:09 <li> At RPI, we add an extension to semantic wiki to export the backend RDF into RDFa
Li Ding: At RPI, we add an extension to semantic wiki to export the backend RDF into RDFa ←
15:56:33 <li> there are a little bit issues on usage of vocabulary, because RDFa consumers are more picky
Li Ding: there are a little bit issues on usage of vocabulary, because RDFa consumers are more picky ←
15:56:39 <edsu> q+ to suggest dcat+rdfa note
Ed Summers: q+ to suggest dcat+rdfa note ←
15:56:48 <li> e.g. yahoo and google are taking different RDFa vocabulary
Li Ding: e.g. yahoo and google are taking different RDFa vocabulary ←
15:56:48 <sandro> cyg: is there somewhere easy to start, here?
Richard Cyganiak: is there somewhere easy to start, here? ←
15:57:10 <sandro> cyg: the updates/feeds issue was interesting. I don';t know how to handle that in pure RDF environment.
Richard Cyganiak: the updates/feeds issue was interesting. I don';t know how to handle that in pure RDF environment. ←
15:57:20 <sandro> q?
q? ←
15:57:42 <li> if we want to get major search engines to take the RDFa, we should probably convince them the value of RDFa vocabulary
Li Ding: if we want to get major search engines to take the RDFa, we should probably convince them the value of RDFa vocabulary ←
<sandro> topic: Scope of this Work
15:57:56 <sandro> cygri: I also wanted to talk about scope for this group. What do we want to deliver, what are the artificacts?
Richard Cyganiak: I also wanted to talk about scope for this group. What do we want to deliver, what are the artificacts? ←
15:58:08 <sandro> cyg: 1. Nail down a vocabulary, in a vocab reference document
Richard Cyganiak: 1. Nail down a vocabulary, in a vocab reference document ←
15:58:27 <sandro> ... 2. Implementor's guide, telling folks how to use it in practice.
... 2. Implementor's guide, telling folks how to use it in practice. ←
15:58:41 <sandro> ... 3. perhaps a Demonstrator
... 3. perhaps a Demonstrator ←
15:59:11 <sandro> ... 4. Use Cases? Requirements? Test Cases? Dunno if those are appropirate here.
... 4. Use Cases? Requirements? Test Cases? Dunno if those are appropirate here. ←
15:59:18 <edsu> +1
Ed Summers: +1 ←
15:59:21 <lindstream> Perhaps dcat should provide a separate "dcat distribution types" vocab? Or leave notification details out, and recommend (link to) existing or upcoming methods (AtomOwl, dady..)?
Niklas Lindström: Perhaps dcat should provide a separate "dcat distribution types" vocab? Or leave notification details out, and recommend (link to) existing or upcoming methods (AtomOwl, dady..)? ←
15:59:30 <sandro> proposed: extend by 15 mins
PROPOSED: extend by 15 mins ←
15:59:30 <Cory> +1
Cory Casanave: +1 ←
15:59:31 <sandro> +1
+1 ←
15:59:33 <DavidJames> +1 15 minute extension
David James: +1 15 minute extension ←
15:59:36 <RichW> +1
Rich Wolverton: +1 ←
15:59:37 <lindstream> + 1 15 min
Niklas Lindström: + 1 15 min ←
15:59:38 <ww> +1
William Waites: +1 ←
15:59:39 <kate_geyer> +1
Kate Geyer: +1 ←
15:59:39 <martin> +1
Martín Álvarez: +1 ←
15:59:42 <vassilios> +1
15:59:46 <sandro> resolved: extend by 15 mins
RESOLVED: extend by 15 mins ←
15:59:47 <dan> +1
Dan Thomas: +1 ←
16:00:21 <lindstream> (not, leave out dcat:distribution, but the details it refers to)
Niklas Lindström: (not, leave out dcat:distribution, but the details it refers to) ←
16:01:19 <dret> +1
Erik Wilde: +1 ←
16:01:41 <sandro> sandro: let's focus on building an RDF vocabulary, here, and deal with the RDF-world bridge elsewhere.
Sandro Hawke: let's focus on building an RDF vocabulary, here, and deal with the RDF-world bridge elsewhere. ←
16:01:41 <cygri> sandro: propose to focus on the RDF vocab in this group, being aware that there's more work to do afterwards
Sandro Hawke: propose to focus on the RDF vocab in this group, being aware that there's more work to do afterwards [ Scribe Assist by Richard Cyganiak ] ←
16:02:08 <sandro> sandro: also multiple implementions is better than one demonstrator.
Sandro Hawke: also multiple implementions is better than one demonstrator. ←
16:02:12 <Zakim> - +1.202.564.aaii
Zakim IRC Bot: - +1.202.564.aaii ←
16:02:20 <DavidJames> I like the idea of keeping this group focused on RDF.
David James: I like the idea of keeping this group focused on RDF. ←
16:02:22 <dret> what about patterns of how to expose certain services around the vocabulary in plain web ways?
Erik Wilde: what about patterns of how to expose certain services around the vocabulary in plain web ways? ←
16:02:33 <sandro> edsu: Yes, vocab note, and implementors guide. But also guide to how to use this outside of just RDF.
Ed Summers: Yes, vocab note, and implementors guide. But also guide to how to use this outside of just RDF. ←
16:02:35 <li> at RPI, we would also like to contribute some thought on data.gov vocabularies
Li Ding: at RPI, we would also like to contribute some thought on data.gov vocabularies ←
16:02:40 <DavidJames> Of course, for our work, we're interested in applying the principles to other formats as well.
David James: Of course, for our work, we're interested in applying the principles to other formats as well. ←
16:02:42 <li> based on our experience,
Li Ding: based on our experience, ←
16:02:44 <sandro> q?
q? ←
16:02:47 <sandro> ack sandro
ack sandro ←
16:02:47 <Zakim> sandro, you wanted to comment on dcat scope
Zakim IRC Bot: sandro, you wanted to comment on dcat scope ←
16:02:49 <sandro> ack edsu
ack edsu ←
16:02:49 <Zakim> edsu, you wanted to suggest dcat+rdfa note
Zakim IRC Bot: edsu, you wanted to suggest dcat+rdfa note ←
16:03:28 <sandro> vassilios: Maybe we're mixing two discussions that we don't need to mix. 1. the vocab; 2. the format for the vocab.
Vassilios Peristeras: Maybe we're mixing two discussions that we don't need to mix. 1. the vocab; 2. the format for the vocab. ←
16:03:41 <sandro> vassilios: Maybe have vocab in a neutral format, eg UML.
Vassilios Peristeras: Maybe have vocab in a neutral format, eg UML. ←
16:03:44 <dret> separating a data model and services provided around that vocabulary would be a very good idea.
Erik Wilde: separating a data model and services provided around that vocabulary would be a very good idea. ←
16:04:05 <lindstream> Re. updates w. Atom or alternatives: see summary by Leigh Dodds: http://www.ldodds.com/blog/2010/04/rdf-dataset-notifications/
Niklas Lindström: Re. updates w. Atom or alternatives: see summary by Leigh Dodds: http://www.ldodds.com/blog/2010/04/rdf-dataset-notifications/ ←
16:04:27 <sandro> cyg: I'd be concerned about leaving concrete rep open, then we wont really get interop.)
Richard Cyganiak: I'd be concerned about leaving concrete rep open, then we wont really get interop.) ←
16:04:34 <Cory> Not fully open - you need a closed set of rpresentations
Cory Casanave: Not fully open - you need a closed set of rpresentations ←
16:04:49 <vassilios> +1 to cory
Vassilios Peristeras: +1 to cory ←
16:04:49 <sandro> cyg: Also, if we document a number of different ways, then, again, we don't get interop.
Richard Cyganiak: Also, if we document a number of different ways, then, again, we don't get interop. ←
16:04:52 <dret> do you want to propose a standard, or best practices? i think this is a very important distinction to make
Erik Wilde: do you want to propose a standard, or best practices? i think this is a very important distinction to make ←
16:05:00 <sandro> +1 cygri interop is top priority.
+1 cygri interop is top priority. ←
16:05:49 <li> I think FOAF is a good case to follow
Li Ding: I think FOAF is a good case to follow ←
16:05:55 <sandro> erik: It's also important to have services. how you communicate updates, too.
Erik Wilde: It's also important to have services. how you communicate updates, too. ←
16:06:27 <sandro> erik: this big problems: not just modeling the data, but how you use the data, and build services on top of it.
Erik Wilde: this big problems: not just modeling the data, but how you use the data, and build services on top of it. ←
16:06:32 <sandro> ack DavidJames
ack DavidJames ←
16:06:55 <sandro> DavidJames: Where are people leaning on separating vocabulary from format
David James: Where are people leaning on separating vocabulary from format ←
16:07:27 <lindstream> .. my thoughts on this topic are mostly at: http://code.google.com/p/court/
Niklas Lindström: .. my thoughts on this topic are mostly at: http://code.google.com/p/court/ ←
16:07:36 <dret> vocabularies and servoces are two separate thongs, and both are essential for building interactions.
Erik Wilde: vocabularies and servoces are two separate thongs, and both are essential for building interactions. ←
16:07:46 <dret> things, actually ;-)
Erik Wilde: things, actually ;-) ←
16:08:01 <sandro> cyg: Difference between UML and RDF is fairly minor.
Richard Cyganiak: Difference between UML and RDF is fairly minor. ←
16:08:37 <Cory> We generaly do a UML model first, and produce RDF - but can also produce other formats
Cory Casanave: We generaly do a UML model first, and produce RDF - but can also produce other formats ←
16:08:39 <ww> however it should be encouraged that e.g. json type services represent their data in the same shape as the rdf (or abstract) model
William Waites: however it should be encouraged that e.g. json type services represent their data in the same shape as the rdf (or abstract) model ←
16:08:58 <Zakim> -lindstream
Zakim IRC Bot: -lindstream ←
16:09:26 <George> +1 sandro
George Thomas: +1 sandro ←
16:09:34 <li> if the vocabulary is fairly annotations and flat, we don't need a very complex description other than dublin core
Li Ding: if the vocabulary is fairly annotations and flat, we don't need a very complex description other than dublin core ←
16:09:44 <sandro> sandro: I don't see an advantage to going more abstract that what dcat does, RDF, with UML view of it.
Sandro Hawke: I don't see an advantage to going more abstract that what dcat does, RDF, with UML view of it. ←
16:09:47 <jonphipps> think abstract model is good idea, but not without concrete representations
Jon Phipps: think abstract model is good idea, but not without concrete representations ←
16:09:51 <Cory> +1 on model first
Cory Casanave: +1 on model first ←
16:09:53 <dret> servives?
Erik Wilde: servives? ←
16:10:36 <li> therefore, RDF rather than UML is good enough, I don't think Microformat vocabulary used UML for definition
Li Ding: therefore, RDF rather than UML is good enough, I don't think Microformat vocabulary used UML for definition ←
16:10:48 <sandro> cyg: Think of the UML diagram in dcat, and imagine it without prefixes. Should we do that? Is that an important deliverable?
Richard Cyganiak: Think of the UML diagram in dcat, and imagine it without prefixes. Should we do that? Is that an important deliverable? ←
16:10:50 <dret> +1
Erik Wilde: +1 ←
16:10:56 <sandro> -1 ehhh
-1 ehhh ←
16:10:58 <kate_geyer> kate_geyer agrees with edsu
Kate Geyer: kate_geyer agrees with edsu ←
16:10:59 <li> the general principle is to keep everything as simple as possible
Li Ding: the general principle is to keep everything as simple as possible ←
16:11:01 <George> -1
George Thomas: -1 ←
16:11:08 <fadi_> -1
Fadi Maali: -1 ←
16:11:11 <jonphipps> 1 edsu
Jon Phipps: 1 edsu ←
16:11:21 <li> requirement users to understand UML could be extra cost
Li Ding: requirement users to understand UML could be extra cost ←
16:11:25 <DavidJames> +1
David James: +1 ←
16:11:30 <George> +1 sandro
George Thomas: +1 sandro ←
16:11:47 <sandro> sandro: Maybe this is mostly editorial, for later.
Sandro Hawke: Maybe this is mostly editorial, for later. ←
16:11:57 <vassilios> do you believe that users understand better rdf than uml?
Vassilios Peristeras: do you believe that users understand better rdf than uml? ←
16:11:58 <DavidJames> I agree, deriving a JSON representation isn't a big problem (for this group at least)
David James: I agree, deriving a JSON representation isn't a big problem (for this group at least) ←
16:12:00 <dret> i like the idea of an abstract model, and would like to add a set of services around interactions.
Erik Wilde: i like the idea of an abstract model, and would like to add a set of services around interactions. ←
16:12:21 <edsu> dret, so rdfs isn't good enough for the model?
Ed Summers: dret, so rdfs isn't good enough for the model? ←
16:12:25 <DavidJames> And there are multiple, interchangable RDF serializations. I don't think we should worry about which is "official"
David James: And there are multiple, interchangable RDF serializations. I don't think we should worry about which is "official" ←
16:12:30 <sandro> cygri: so, should we do an RDF schema for classes/properties ---- the diagram with boxes and arrows. An abstract model, we can layer on?
Richard Cyganiak: so, should we do an RDF schema for classes/properties ---- the diagram with boxes and arrows. An abstract model, we can layer on? ←
16:12:36 <DavidJames> +!
David James: +! ←
16:12:37 <sandro> +1 (if I understood it right.)
+1 (if I understood it right.) ←
16:12:38 <DavidJames> +1
David James: +1 ←
16:12:39 <cygri> +1
Richard Cyganiak: +1 ←
16:12:43 <Cory> Yes, your model should be representation independent -
Cory Casanave: Yes, your model should be representation independent - ←
16:12:52 <vassilios> +1 to cory
Vassilios Peristeras: +1 to cory ←
16:12:56 <martin> +1
Martín Álvarez: +1 ←
16:12:58 <vassilios> this is the point
Vassilios Peristeras: this is the point ←
16:13:13 <vassilios> to make it computer independent model according to MDA
Vassilios Peristeras: to make it computer independent model according to MDA ←
16:13:29 <edsu> +1 for what sandro said, if uml means a nice human readable html page
Ed Summers: +1 for what sandro said, if uml means a nice human readable html page ←
16:13:29 <sandro> sandro: I'm understanding that we'll design it in RDFS terms, but also be aware of what it looks liek in UML terms.
Sandro Hawke: I'm understanding that we'll design it in RDFS terms, but also be aware of what it looks liek in UML terms. ←
16:13:39 <Cory> The adavantage of UML for this is mostly that it is simpler to understand and can then map to multiple formats
Cory Casanave: The adavantage of UML for this is mostly that it is simpler to understand and can then map to multiple formats ←
16:13:46 <sandro> Yes, human readable. Not UML software readable.
Yes, human readable. Not UML software readable. ←
16:13:50 <sandro> q?
q? ←
16:13:52 <DavidJames> vassilios: what do you mean by MDA?
Vassilios Peristeras: what do you mean by MDA? [ Scribe Assist by David James ] ←
16:14:02 <vassilios> Model Driven Architecture
Vassilios Peristeras: Model Driven Architecture ←
16:14:10 <Cory> UML is software readable!
Cory Casanave: UML is software readable! ←
16:14:38 <George> this isn't an mda crowd - let the omg do that
George Thomas: this isn't an mda crowd - let the omg do that ←
16:14:50 <George> or someone like cory :)
George Thomas: or someone like cory :) ←
16:14:55 <sandro> edsu: RDF is a suitable data modeling language, and the right one for this crowd.
Ed Summers: RDF is a suitable data modeling language, and the right one for this crowd. ←
16:15:14 <dret> there are other structured data formats advocated by the w3c, with much wider availability of tooling and developers in the wild.
Erik Wilde: there are other structured data formats advocated by the w3c, with much wider availability of tooling and developers in the wild. ←
16:15:17 <lindstream> +1 on sticking to RDF for the modeling
Niklas Lindström: +1 on sticking to RDF for the modeling ←
16:15:39 <DavidJames> I am happy to go with the group consensus on how we model
David James: I am happy to go with the group consensus on how we model ←
16:15:40 <sandro> edsu: The toolchains around data formats ... people want to work on documents sometimes .... let's make sure there are examples with RDFa and JSON etc.
Ed Summers: The toolchains around data formats ... people want to work on documents sometimes .... let's make sure there are examples with RDFa and JSON etc. ←
16:16:15 <Cory> I don't see RDF/UML as conflicting, they are ways to express the same underlying concepts.
Cory Casanave: I don't see RDF/UML as conflicting, they are ways to express the same underlying concepts. ←
16:16:17 <edsu> atom and rss too :-)
Ed Summers: atom and rss too :-) ←
16:16:39 <George> +1 cygri
George Thomas: +1 cygri ←
16:16:56 <jonphipps> +1 cygri
Jon Phipps: +1 cygri ←
16:16:59 <sandro> cygri: We want to do a model thats independant from the concrete syntax or format that we might do in the end. We want to use RDFS as the modeling language. This DOES NOT mean folks have to use RDF/XML. It's about using RDFS as the way to construct our vocabulary.
Richard Cyganiak: We want to do a model thats independant from the concrete syntax or format that we might do in the end. We want to use RDFS as the modeling language. This DOES NOT mean folks have to use RDF/XML. It's about using RDFS as the way to construct our vocabulary. ←
16:17:00 <edsu> +1
Ed Summers: +1 ←
16:17:04 <sandro> +1 cygri
+1 cygri ←
16:17:07 <li> My point is not rejecting UML. For simplicity concern, we should have something simple enough for regular web developers to take
Li Ding: My point is not rejecting UML. For simplicity concern, we should have something simple enough for regular web developers to take ←
16:17:36 <dret> sorry for repeating myself, but i think having services is essential. this could also be abstract or concrete, but it would be very helpful as "best practices" for somebody trying to do this.
Erik Wilde: sorry for repeating myself, but i think having services is essential. this could also be abstract or concrete, but it would be very helpful as "best practices" for somebody trying to do this. ←
16:17:41 <DavidJames> I agree with modeling in RDF without thinking about particular serialization details. For this group, why should we care about the particular RDF serialization?
David James: I agree with modeling in RDF without thinking about particular serialization details. For this group, why should we care about the particular RDF serialization? ←
16:17:47 <jonphipps> +1 cygri: "using RDFS as the way to construct our vocabulary."
Jon Phipps: +1 cygri: "using RDFS as the way to construct our vocabulary." ←
16:17:47 <sandro> cory: A UML model is easy for people to understand. The equivalen RDF rep, the equiv JSON rep, ... not a problem.
Cory Casanave: A UML model is easy for people to understand. The equivalen RDF rep, the equiv JSON rep, ... not a problem. ←
16:18:22 <sandro> cygri: is that agreement, Cory?
Richard Cyganiak: is that agreement, Cory? ←
16:18:41 <DavidJames> +1 RDF schema
David James: +1 RDF schema ←
16:18:41 <sandro> cory: UML is more often used, but RDFS is okay.
Cory Casanave: UML is more often used, but RDFS is okay. ←
16:18:54 <sandro> (time check)
(time check) ←
16:18:58 <edsu> dret, i agree, i think i heard cygri addressing this in the 'demonstrator' piece?
Ed Summers: dret, i agree, i think i heard cygri addressing this in the 'demonstrator' piece? ←
16:19:14 <Zakim> -George
Zakim IRC Bot: -George ←
16:19:39 <sandro> cygri: Erik, you stress the imporance of services. Would you agree that having an abstract model in the first place is useful for defining those services? Or do you need the services first?
Richard Cyganiak: Erik, you stress the imporance of services. Would you agree that having an abstract model in the first place is useful for defining those services? Or do you need the services first? ←
16:20:15 <sandro> dret: It would be good to have the model first. It might be hard to follow, if it's all abstract. "You might want to expose this bit of JSON", etc, easier to understand.
Erik Wilde: It would be good to have the model first. It might be hard to follow, if it's all abstract. "You might want to expose this bit of JSON", etc, easier to understand. ←
16:20:33 <sandro> dret: look at data model as static structures, AND servces as the way people interact with the data in that model.
Erik Wilde: look at data model as static structures, AND servces as the way people interact with the data in that model. ←
16:20:35 <DavidJames> We already extended 15 minutes, so I think we should be aware of the time...
David James: We already extended 15 minutes, so I think we should be aware of the time... ←
16:21:17 <edsu> sandro, sounds almost like the w3c egov social media compone
Ed Summers: sandro, sounds almost like the w3c egov social media compone ←
16:21:19 <sandro> dret: recovery.gov initial folks were urged to publish as feeds, and didn't know how to do it. Having best practices and validation tools, so folks can test if their services are well behaved or not, that's goo dfor developers.
Erik Wilde: recovery.gov initial folks were urged to publish as feeds, and didn't know how to do it. Having best practices and validation tools, so folks can test if their services are well behaved or not, that's goo dfor developers. ←
16:21:28 <edsu> s/compone/component/
Ed Summers: s/compone/component/ ←
16:21:31 <sandro> cygri: out of time, thanks everyone!
Richard Cyganiak: out of time, thanks everyone! ←
<sandro> topic: Adjourn
16:21:43 <dret> thanks!
Erik Wilde: thanks! ←
16:21:46 <DavidJames> Thanks
David James: Thanks ←
16:21:49 <kate_geyer> thanks, all!
Kate Geyer: thanks, all! ←
16:21:49 <Zakim> -Sandro
Zakim IRC Bot: -Sandro ←
16:21:53 <Zakim> - +0789798aaee
Zakim IRC Bot: - +0789798aaee ←
16:21:54 <Zakim> -Kate
Zakim IRC Bot: -Kate ←
16:21:57 <lindstream> Erik, how open-ended a service? I'm thinking "an algorithmic resource for slices of time and/or category".. (delivering doc updates and/or changesets)
Niklas Lindström: Erik, how open-ended a service? I'm thinking "an algorithmic resource for slices of time and/or category".. (delivering doc updates and/or changesets) ←
16:21:59 <Zakim> -Rich_Wolverton
Zakim IRC Bot: -Rich_Wolverton ←
16:22:00 <Zakim> -Erik
Zakim IRC Bot: -Erik ←
16:22:01 <martin> thanks, bye
Martín Álvarez: thanks, bye ←
16:22:01 <Zakim> -??P48
Zakim IRC Bot: -??P48 ←
16:22:02 <Zakim> -edsu
Zakim IRC Bot: -edsu ←
16:22:02 <Zakim> -Cory
Zakim IRC Bot: -Cory ←
16:22:09 <lindstream> thanks all
Niklas Lindström: thanks all ←
16:22:09 <vassilios> thanks, bye
Vassilios Peristeras: thanks, bye ←
16:22:10 <Zakim> -martin
Zakim IRC Bot: -martin ←
16:22:11 <Zakim> -cygri
Zakim IRC Bot: -cygri ←
16:22:11 <Zakim> -jonphipps
Zakim IRC Bot: -jonphipps ←
16:22:28 <edsu> cygri, nice job :-)
Ed Summers: cygri, nice job :-) ←
16:22:53 <jonphipps> hmmm. having trouble logging into the wiki with w3 login
Jon Phipps: hmmm. having trouble logging into the wiki with w3 login ←
16:23:09 <jonphipps> anything different about it?
Jon Phipps: anything different about it? ←
16:23:09 <dret> services can be whatever you like them to be. as simple as a feed with very static semantics, or as complex as a query language exposed somewhere. often, the best idea is to have something in the middle "form-based queries", so to speak.
Erik Wilde: services can be whatever you like them to be. as simple as a feed with very static semantics, or as complex as a query language exposed somewhere. often, the best idea is to have something in the middle "form-based queries", so to speak. ←
16:23:11 <edsu> jonphipps, i think it got changed up recently
Ed Summers: jonphipps, i think it got changed up recently ←
16:23:19 <Zakim> - +1.410.336.aahh
Zakim IRC Bot: - +1.410.336.aahh ←
16:23:40 <cygri> martin, sorry for skipping your topic in the end! would you be willing to show it next time?
Richard Cyganiak: martin, sorry for skipping your topic in the end! would you be willing to show it next time? ←
16:23:54 <dret> bye.
Erik Wilde: bye. ←
16:23:56 <martin> ok, no problem
Martín Álvarez: ok, no problem ←
16:24:07 <jonphipps> I was able to get onto the swdwg wiki earlier in the week
Jon Phipps: I was able to get onto the swdwg wiki earlier in the week ←
16:24:10 <edsu> jonphipps, http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-egov-ig/2010Apr/0024.html
Ed Summers: jonphipps, http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-egov-ig/2010Apr/0024.html ←
16:24:24 <cygri> note to self: things always take twice as long as i'd like them to :-)
Richard Cyganiak: note to self: things always take twice as long as i'd like them to :-) ←
16:24:45 <jonphipps> oh, _very_ recently :-)
Jon Phipps: oh, _very_ recently :-) ←
16:25:02 <jonphipps> btw, nicely done cygri
Jon Phipps: btw, nicely done cygri ←
16:26:01 <edsu> fwiw, i added my dcat in atom strawman to the wiki http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/Data_Catalog_Vocabulary/AtomStrawman
Ed Summers: fwiw, i added my dcat in atom strawman to the wiki http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/Data_Catalog_Vocabulary/AtomStrawman ←
16:27:28 <lindstream> edsu, nice
Niklas Lindström: edsu, nice ←
16:28:06 <edsu> lindstream, i imagine i may have goofed some things up, please feel free to edit
Ed Summers: lindstream, i imagine i may have goofed some things up, please feel free to edit ←
16:28:20 <Zakim> disconnecting the lone participant, Sunlight, in T&S_EGOV(LD TECH)10:00AM
Zakim IRC Bot: disconnecting the lone participant, Sunlight, in T&S_EGOV(LD TECH)10:00AM ←
16:28:24 <Zakim> T&S_EGOV(LD TECH)10:00AM has ended
Zakim IRC Bot: T&S_EGOV(LD TECH)10:00AM has ended ←
16:28:26 <Zakim> Attendees were Sandro, +1.202.955.aaaa, Luigi, David, [CTIC], +1.202.690.aabb, martin, +1.617.521.aacc, +1.510.643.aadd, +0789798aaee, +03539149aaff, cygri, fadi_, +1.617.619.aagg,
Zakim IRC Bot: Attendees were Sandro, +1.202.955.aaaa, Luigi, David, [CTIC], +1.202.690.aabb, martin, +1.617.521.aacc, +1.510.643.aadd, +0789798aaee, +03539149aaff, cygri, fadi_, +1.617.619.aagg, ←
16:28:28 <Zakim> ... George, Erik, +1.410.336.aahh, +1.202.564.aaii, Rich_Wolverton, Kate, Cory, jonphipps, edsu, lindstream
Zakim IRC Bot: ... George, Erik, +1.410.336.aahh, +1.202.564.aaii, Rich_Wolverton, Kate, Cory, jonphipps, edsu, lindstream ←
16:29:31 <martin> cygri, thanks, I can present when you want
Martín Álvarez: cygri, thanks, I can present when you want ←
16:29:57 <lindstream> edsu, I'll take a closer look
Niklas Lindström: edsu, I'll take a closer look ←
16:31:07 <edsu> seeya lindstream
Ed Summers: seeya lindstream ←
Formatted by CommonScribe
This revision (#1) generated 2010-04-22 20:18:43 UTC by 'unknown', comments: 'good enough!'