W3C

- DRAFT -

ACT Rules Community Group Teleconference

25 Jan 2024

Attendees

Present
CarlosD, jedi, Helen, Jean-Yves, Wilco, dan_tripp, Mark
Regrets
Chair
SV_MEETING_CHAIR
Scribe
Helen

Contents


<CarlosD> scribe+ Helen

Call for review https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/issues/461 

Carlos: Introduces Jedi and then himself

Jean-Yves: Introduces himself

Wilco: Introduces himself

Dan: Introduces himself

Mark: Introduces himself

Helen: Introduces herself

Jedi: Introduces himself

Carlos: We have 1 call for review

Assigned issues https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/issues?page=1&q=is%3Aissue+is%3Aopen 

Carlos: This PR started during our catch up in Seville at TPAC
... to include fonts that are not traditional Western ones
... We got it approved and this is where Jedi and Bobby are needed to let us know the issues with fonts to help improve it

Jedi: It takes a lot of time to review this due to our government agencies, and they just published a document that it is 14 pts in English but 16 points in Chinese
... This is different in Japanese for the requirements from Chinese
... We need to enforce the limitations to allow for any CJK language to work with the size of the font requirements
... I also want to say that even in Chinese there are different rules or approaches/needs to consider

Jean-Yves: From what I understand the same character can be used in more than 1 language and we need to cater for all the different needs
... we need to work out the small size for 4.5:1 for characters, and large for 3:1, and then we have variations where it is not clear so we should default to 3:1
... Some would pass 3:1 but should pass 4.5:1
... This can be set objectively once we know the limits of the languages

Wilco: I would like to know why the same character used in one language and passes would fail in another language

Jedi: In our culture we would display Japanese characters inline with Chinese, so people as used to them

Wilco: So borrowed words/phrases from a different language
... like if you mix Latin with Japanese and Chinese? What do we take - the highest one?

Helen: We should just make 3:1 N/A to make it easier

Carlos: Do we need anymore or can we proceed?

Wilco: Thanks Jedi!
... Would you be ok in helping us out in the TF as well?

Carlos: We have 0 issues as my computer overlord has forced me to do more efficient work
... can people look at 1845 please?

Jean-Yves: I have 1919 and 2076

<Wilco> https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/pull/2147

Wilco: I have the PR 2.2 wrapped up ready to be merged

Dan: Nothing done but worked on the discussion and doing fabulous work
... I will work on my others this week

Mark: I've been looking at the target size one and false positives like a video button with a frame surrounding it but the bounding boxes are correct
... It got reported and Adrian Roselli found other issues that are causing trouble too as the understanding document is left open to interpretation
... Patrick Lauke also weighed in - and this is making writing the rule difficult

Wilco: Will it impact the AAA target size rule?

Mark: If there are some interactions then there may have impacts on the enhanced rule

Carlos: We will keep an eye for now

Mark: I also am looking at the iframe title items like adding the role of presentation it completely breaks the frame and it will announce HTML code of the content in the frame
... The other thing that may affect this is an ADA Peabod case as they flagged unlabelled frames as part of the case - might be worth checking with US people in case it applies elsewhere

Helen: Working on things

Update from the ACT Task Force https://github.com/w3c/wcag-act/pull/522/files 

Wilco: Still working on the working draft and subjectivity to be wrapped up to be sent to you guys to review
... Please come on Feb the 8th for where we go next

Update from Manual Test Rules subgroup https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/issues/1952

<CarlosD> scribe+ CarlosD

<CarlosD> Helen: TF been working on subjectivity for test rules, which will be really useful for manual rules

<CarlosD> ... Dan's been preparing examples for tests with speech recognition users

<Wilco> https://www.w3.org/WAI/standards-guidelines/act/rules/qt1vmo/

<CarlosD> ... And I already have a set of participants drafted for testing

<CarlosD> Wilco: Can we use the Image accessible name is descriptive as a template to write X is descriptive?

<CarlosD> Helen: I can look at this when I get more time

scribe+

Jean-Yves: We had a long discussion so will skip to the next item
... This is looking in the role load on which element
... Should this rule apply to items not in the accessibility tree?
... The issue is only causing issues programmatic issues but the user does not see it - so it is like a 4.1.1 issues that is no longer relevant

Helen: Made a mistake on the last comment - it is not like 4.1.1 at all

Carlos: Should we have 2 rules, one for elements on the AT and one for those that are hidden

Jean-Yves: There are issues with the focusable items not being focused due to the rule applied
... There is a legalese issue of if it is an author role and causing issues...

Wilco: I don't think we should fail a hidden element having a wrong role as will not impact the user

Carlos: I agree we should ignore hidden items

Wilco: We can add to the background for the items not in the AT

Jean-Yves: That makes sense - but we would not have inapplicable item that is not visible in the AT with the wrong role
... also for the presentation role on a button as conflicts with the trigger?

Wilco: This is about the explicit role and the role presentation is different?

Jean-Yves: I think ARIA WG is working on the conflict with the role of presentation.

Wilco: We should maybe make this about items not hidden?

Jean-Yves: I will look into it

Carlos: Final thoughts?

Wilco: Loved the feedback from Jedi

Jean-Yves: I loved that too and people returning

Dan: Interesting listening

Mark: I will get the results added

Summary of Action Items

Summary of Resolutions

[End of minutes]

Minutes manually created (not a transcript), formatted by David Booth's scribe.perl version 1.200 (CVS log)
$Date: 2024/01/25 16:09:08 $

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