IRC log of aria-apg on 2023-03-07

Timestamps are in UTC.

18:17:46 [RRSAgent]

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logging to https://www.w3.org/2023/03/07-aria-apg-irc

18:18:01 [Jem]

rrsagent, make minutes

18:18:02 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/03/07-aria-apg-minutes.html Jem

18:18:18 [Jem]

rrsagent, make log public

18:19:42 [Jem]

regret+ Ariella_Gilmore

18:19:48 [Jem]

chair: Jemma

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19:00:25 [jugglinmike]

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19:02:48 [jugglinmike]

present+

19:02:51 [jugglinmike]

scribe+

19:03:00 [jugglinmike]

Mike Pennisi (Bocoup)

19:03:54 [jongund]

present+ jongund

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present+

19:04:42 [Matt_King]

present+

19:05:28 [jugglinmike]

Zakim, start the meeting

19:05:28 [Zakim]

RRSAgent, make logs Public

19:05:30 [Zakim]

please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), jugglinmike

19:05:35 [jugglinmike]

MEETING: ARIA Authoring Practices Task Force Weekly Teleconference

19:09:07 [howard-e]

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present+

19:09:29 [jugglinmike]

Topic: Setup and Review Agenda

19:10:19 [jugglinmike]

Jem: should we meet next week?

19:10:31 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: I'm available to meet

19:10:49 [jugglinmike]

[general agreement about holding a meeting next week]

19:10:59 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: Okay, then. Let's have a meeting next week!

19:11:01 [Jem]

https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/wiki/March-7%2C-2023-Agenda

19:11:11 [jugglinmike]

Topic: Editor's Draft Sunset Complete

19:11:27 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: the editor's draft was showing the old, large document

19:11:39 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: We've now replaced it with a nice list of links to the current site

19:11:52 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: In addition, all of the examples now link to the current site

19:12:26 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: For example, the Accordion Example page https://w3c.github.io/aria-practices/examples/accordion/accordion.html

19:12:43 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: If anyone finds an issue, please report and issue

19:13:56 [Jem]

https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/issues/2641

19:13:58 [jugglinmike]

Jem: a good question raised in https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/issues/2641 - how are we going to inform users about changes, since we're not doing the versions anymore?

19:14:30 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: We're still working this out. We can continue updating the change history page until we get better support for the change history that's built into the footer

19:15:19 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: For major changes (that don't expect just one page), we might want to continue offering a "change history"

19:15:42 [jugglinmike]

Jem: For now, I'll point them to the "change history" page in the "About page"

19:15:57 [jugglinmike]

Jem: Can we say how often we will update the "change history" page?

19:16:25 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: We want to automate it, and we have an issue to automate it, but that issue has been in the backlog since May

19:16:48 [jugglinmike]

Topic: New About Section Content

19:17:17 [jugglinmike]

Jem: We talked about this new content last week https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/pull/2558

19:17:27 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: I received some feedback that I still haven't implemented

19:17:33 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: I hope to implement it by next week's meeting

19:17:54 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: So by next week, we should have a preview which includes the actual design and I will have incorporated last week's feedback

19:19:48 [jugglinmike]

Topic: Status of Site Updates

19:20:12 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: We have a couple of fixes

19:20:51 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: A preview for a fix to the magnification issue https://deploy-preview-204--aria-practices.netlify.app/aria/apg/

19:22:30 [jugglinmike]

jongund: It looks like it's working--the headings are disappearing correctly

19:27:18 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: AlexFlenniken has approved this

19:27:33 [CurtBellew]

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19:27:35 [jugglinmike]

jongund: 2606 and 2601 describe the same issue

19:27:39 [CurtBellew]

present+

19:28:20 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: For support tables, it looks like Alex has shared a link to a patch

19:31:05 [jugglinmike]

Yup; it implements 11 of the 12 changes that Matt_King requested (we agreed to defer one of them). It's blocked right now on some fixes to the deployment process.

19:31:34 [jugglinmike]

I'm going to help out with that, so we should have a preview deployed within the next few days

19:31:46 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: I'll share out a preview link once it's available

19:34:01 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: We have two different features: same-level navigation and card list-view toggle. Do we have a preference between them?

19:35:52 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: A preference for which we work on first, that is

19:36:08 [jugglinmike]

jongund: I think same-level navigation is more important

19:36:16 [jugglinmike]

Jem: I agree

19:36:30 [jugglinmike]

CurtBellew: I lean that way, too

19:36:43 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: That's what Bocoup had tee'd up

19:38:09 [jugglinmike]

howard-e: I think merging 2640 right now would be good https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/pull/2640

19:38:48 [jugglinmike]

howard-e: I think we can rename 2636 to be about Node 18 specifically https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/issues/2636

19:39:36 [jugglinmike]

Topic: Pull Request Review

19:40:09 [jugglinmike]

Subtopic: Combobox Date Picker Example: Change previous and next month and year behavior for dates near end of month by jongund · Pull Request #2618 · w3c/aria-practices

19:40:12 [Github]

https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/pull/2618 : Combobox Date Picker Example: Change previous and next month and year behavior for dates near end of month

19:40:17 [jugglinmike]

github: https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/pull/2618

19:41:12 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: Do we have reviewers assigned?

19:41:36 [jugglinmike]

Jem: Yup: shirsha, Matt_King, and James

19:41:53 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: I don't remember James agreeing to that, so we should remove them

19:41:56 [jugglinmike]

Jem: done

19:42:39 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: shirsha will be reviewing for functionality, and I think I asked AlexFlennikan to perform code review

19:43:00 [jugglinmike]

jongund: It also updates tests

19:43:50 [jugglinmike]

jongund: there's a file that was changed that shouldn't have been changed, so I'll fix that

19:44:01 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: I'll do editorial and functional review

19:44:13 [jugglinmike]

Subtopic: Listbox Examples: Update scrolling of listbox item with focus into view when page is magnified by jongund · Pull Request #2622 · w3c/aria-practices

19:44:13 [Github]

https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/pull/2622 : Listbox Examples: Update scrolling of listbox item with focus into view when page is magnified

19:44:22 [jugglinmike]

github: https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/pull/2622

19:44:35 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: This had a bunch of changes and it needed a bunch of review

19:45:26 [jugglinmike]

jongund: the ESLint linter is complaining about a coding pattern we're using in listbox.js

19:45:47 [jugglinmike]

jongund: I tried using modules, but the linter doesn't like that, either

19:46:13 [jugglinmike]

howard-e: I have no suggestion right now, but I can take a look

19:46:54 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: is the linter forcing a good practice? That's something I can't answer--it seems like a code style and engineering thing.

19:47:18 [jugglinmike]

jongund: A simple fix would be to define the listbox class in each of the four examples that use it, but then you'd have code duplicated.

19:52:34 [jugglinmike]

I'll take a look and give jongund some advice

19:52:49 [jugglinmike]

Subtopic: Landmark examples: Updated SkipTo script and configuration by jongund · Pull Request #2624 · w3c/aria-practices

19:52:51 [Github]

https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/pull/2624 : Landmark examples: Updated SkipTo script and configuration

19:53:00 [jugglinmike]

github: https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/pull/2624

19:53:09 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: I haven't gotten to this yet, so we'll keep it on the list

19:53:34 [jugglinmike]

subtopic: Landmark examples: Updated SkipTo script and configuration

19:53:40 [jugglinmike]

github: https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/pull/2624

19:53:49 [jugglinmike]

jongund: This is a simple fix

19:54:09 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: Kurt, I may assign this to you, but we can include it in next week's agenda

19:54:26 [jugglinmike]

jongund: This solution works for this example. I don't know if it work in a general way

19:54:37 [jugglinmike]

Topic: Accordion Animation

19:55:11 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: In a meeting a long time ago, people were complaining that the accordion was jerky, and they suggested to add animation

19:55:35 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: We decided that we could make it animated, and we put an issue in the backlog. That was almost five years ago!

19:56:25 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: JAWS-test recently commented that animation is a WCAG issue

19:56:47 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: But the type of animation you would add here does not seem like the type of animation that WCAG is referring to

19:57:19 [jugglinmike]

Jem: [reads the relevant text from https://www.w3.org/WAI/WCAG21/Understanding/animation-from-interactions.html]

19:58:06 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: We could agree to not add animation, or we add animation and use the CSS media query for "prefers reduced motion"

19:58:50 [jugglinmike]

CurtBellew: Oracle animates their accordions. They're useful--I think they make them easier to use visually

19:59:11 [jugglinmike]

CurtBellew: I don't feel strongly that animations are a necessity, though

20:01:29 [jugglinmike]

[general discussion about the value of animation]

20:02:31 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: This sounds like it would be a positive and it doesn't sound like it violates WCAG 2.3.3, especially if we use "prefers reduced motion"

20:03:08 [jugglinmike]

Matt_King: So let's go for it and resolve this old issue

20:03:12 [jugglinmike]

Jem: I'll mention this issue in Sarah's pull request

20:04:02 [jugglinmike]

Zakim, end the meeting

20:04:02 [Zakim]

As of this point the attendees have been jugglinmike, jongund, MarkMcCarthy, Matt_King, howard-e, CurtBellew

20:04:04 [Zakim]

RRSAgent, please draft minutes

20:04:05 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/03/07-aria-apg-minutes.html Zakim

20:04:42 [Zakim]

I am happy to have been of service, jugglinmike; please remember to excuse RRSAgent. Goodbye

20:04:42 [Zakim]

Zakim has left #aria-apg

20:04:42 [jugglinmike]

RRSAgent: leave

20:04:42 [RRSAgent]

I see no action items

20:04:42 [jugglinmike]

RRSAgent leave

20:04:42 [jugglinmike]

RRSAgent, leave

20:04:42 [RRSAgent]

I see no action items

20:04:42 [jugglinmike]

Come on, buddy

20:04:42 [MarkMcCarthy]

lol

20:04:42 [Matt_King]

present+