13:28:04 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #adapt
13:28:04 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2022/07/18-adapt-irc
13:28:06 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
13:28:06 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #adapt
13:28:08 <trackbot> Meeting: WAI Adapt Task Force Teleconference
13:28:08 <trackbot> Date: 18 July 2022
13:28:21 <Sharon> agenda?
13:29:09 <Sharon> chair: Sharon
13:33:14 <Sharon> agenda+ CfC for Content Module 1.0 CR status and comments
13:34:44 <Sharon> agenda+ Announcement of the Content Module 1.0 CR Status for W3C news - https://www.w3.org/WAI/cc/wiki/WAI_Announcement_Drafts
13:34:58 <Sharon> agenda+ Blog post on Content Module 1.0 CR Status (Lionel)
13:36:58 <Sharon> agenda+ 3.6 edits / Editor's note for symbols (Janina action)
13:37:13 <Sharon> agenda+ TPAC 12-16 September 2022
13:37:26 <Sharon> agenda+ Disambiguate between HTML <rel> and WAI-Adapt specified "purpose/destination/ action."" (Lionel)
13:37:46 <Sharon> agenda+ Content Module Implementations Status, focus on new candidates
13:37:51 <Sharon> agenda?
13:52:56 <Matthew_Atkinson> Matthew_Atkinson has joined #adapt
14:01:10 <mike_beganyi> mike_beganyi has joined #adapt
14:01:32 <mike_beganyi> present+
14:03:51 <becky> becky has joined #adapt
14:04:09 <Matthew_Atkinson> scribe+ Matthew_Atkinson
14:04:17 <Matthew_Atkinson> present+
14:04:19 <CharlesL1> CharlesL1 has joined #adapt
14:04:28 <CharlesL1> present+
14:04:31 <Matthew_Atkinson> agenda?
14:04:39 <Matthew_Atkinson> zakim, next item
14:04:39 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- CfC for Content Module 1.0 CR status and comments -- taken up [from Sharon]
14:05:09 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Lionel_Wolberger_ has joined #adapt
14:05:12 <Lionel_Wolberger_> present+
14:05:24 <Lionel_Wolberger_> agenda?
14:05:41 <Matthew_Atkinson> Sharon: Saw Jason's concerns about the CfC regarding the EdNotes. Do we need to do any work on this?
14:05:47 <Matthew_Atkinson> rrsagent, make minutes
14:05:47 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/07/18-adapt-minutes.html Matthew_Atkinson
14:06:17 <becky> present+
14:06:17 <Matthew_Atkinson> Jason's email: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-apa-admin/2022Jul/0013.html
14:06:41 <Matthew_Atkinson> q+
14:07:05 <CharlesL1> q+
14:07:20 <Lionel_Wolberger_> q+
14:07:24 <Sharon> ack CharlesL1
14:07:29 <Matthew_Atkinson> Roy: We can remove EdNotes before transition. We may want to keep the one regarding prefixes.
14:07:44 <Matthew_Atkinson> CharlesL1: I think it's fine to keep EdNotes as-is at least until the second CR.
14:07:53 <Roy> Roy has joined #adapt
14:08:19 <Sharon> ack Matthew_Atkinson
14:08:43 <Sharon> ack CharlesL1
14:08:58 <CharlesL1> ack me
14:09:05 <Sharon> ack CharlesL
14:09:53 <Sharon> ack Lionel_Wolberger_
14:09:57 <Matthew_Atkinson> Matthew_Atkinson: Some of the content in EdNotes, e.g. relating to symbols, is really important to keep in the document. We should be able to do that in some way.
14:10:12 <CharlesL1> q+
14:10:23 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lionel_Wolberger_: I think Jason highlighted things we're aware of, and are working on.
14:10:26 <Matthew_Atkinson> ack Lionel_Wolberger_
14:10:28 <Matthew_Atkinson> q?
14:10:40 <Sharon> ack CharlesL
14:10:43 <Lisa> Lisa has joined #adapt
14:10:43 <Matthew_Atkinson> ack CharlesL1
14:10:49 <Lisa> present+
14:11:31 <CharlesL> q+
14:11:31 <Matthew_Atkinson> rrsagent, make minutes
14:11:31 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/07/18-adapt-minutes.html Matthew_Atkinson
14:11:37 <CharlesL> ack CharlesL
14:12:08 <janina> janina has joined #adapt
14:12:23 <Lionel_Wolberger_> q+
14:12:28 <Matthew_Atkinson> q?
14:12:31 <Sharon> q?
14:12:35 <Matthew_Atkinson> ack Lionel_Wolberger_
14:12:45 <Sharon> ack Lionel_Wolberger_
14:12:51 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lionel_Wolberger_: The "at risk pending implementations" EdNotes: what do they mean?
14:12:52 <Matthew_Atkinson> q+
14:13:02 <CharlesL> q+
14:13:27 <Sharon> ack Matthew_Atkinson
14:13:31 <Sharon> ack CharlesL
14:13:32 <Matthew_Atkinson> Matthew_Atkinson: I believe this means if nobody implements it, it may be removed.
14:13:34 <Matthew_Atkinson> ack Matthew_Atkinson
14:13:35 <Matthew_Atkinson> ack CharlesL
14:13:49 <Matthew_Atkinson> CharlesL: We need two implementations to pass CR.
14:14:07 <Matthew_Atkinson> CharlesL: These are the things that we anticipate may struggle to get two implementations.
14:14:31 <janina> present+
14:14:32 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lisa: +1 to CharlesL. There were some things that seemed to be getting traction, but others were more concerning.
14:14:48 <Matthew_Atkinson> rrsagent, make minutes
14:14:48 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/07/18-adapt-minutes.html Matthew_Atkinson
14:15:57 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: [confirms the requirement for two implementations]
14:16:39 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lionel_Wolberger_: If everything's at risk pending implementations, why are there 7 particular instances where this is called out?
14:16:41 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: We can remove them.
14:17:09 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lionel_Wolberger_: We could record this on the list, but I don't think it confers a better reading experience on the spec.
14:17:37 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: +1 - I thought maybe there were specific issues in the past that gave rise to these. If that's not the case let's take these out, as they're generally true for any requirement.
14:17:41 <Matthew_Atkinson> q?
14:17:51 <Lisa> +1 to remove them
14:17:52 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lionel_Wolberger_: We have a motion before us to remove those EdNotes.
14:18:16 <CharlesL> +1 to remove thats fine.
14:18:17 <Matthew_Atkinson> Sharon: Sounds like we all agree on this.
14:18:20 <Matthew_Atkinson> +1
14:18:30 <Matthew_Atkinson> Sharon: Let's make this an action item.
14:18:55 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lionel_Wolberger_: I'll record the action.
14:19:11 <CharlesL> q+
14:19:20 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: Jason gave us several editorial suggestions; didn't want to block the CR.
14:19:31 <Sharon> ack CharlesL
14:20:05 <Matthew_Atkinson> CharlesL: We were talking about the email earlier in the meeting and the suggestion to remove EdNotes; we want to keep the content of those EdNotes, but the only one that needs to remain an EdNote is the one about the prefix.
14:20:09 <Matthew_Atkinson> ack CharlesL
14:20:10 <Matthew_Atkinson> q?
14:20:16 <Matthew_Atkinson> rrsagent, make minutes
14:20:16 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/07/18-adapt-minutes.html Matthew_Atkinson
14:20:34 <Matthew_Atkinson> q+
14:20:47 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lionel_Wolberger_: can janina or Roy remove them?
14:20:51 <Matthew_Atkinson> Roy: I can
14:21:02 <CharlesL> q+
14:21:08 <Sharon> ack Matthew_Atkinson
14:21:58 <Sharon> ack CharlesL
14:22:04 <Roy> Change the ED note to Note.
14:22:22 <Matthew_Atkinson> Matthew_Atkinson: We need to change them to Notes, rather than EdNotes, so we don't lose the content [checking with Roy and janina that we can do that? -janina confirmed we can]
14:22:41 <Matthew_Atkinson> CharlesL: Roy: please can you make this change in a separate PR, so we can see the change specifically.
14:23:00 <Matthew_Atkinson> Sharon: And we are still going to remove the "at risk pending implementation" ones.
14:23:00 <Roy> https://github.com/w3c/adapt/wiki/Implementations-of-Semantics
14:23:47 <Matthew_Atkinson> Roy: Some implementations are listed on this page.
14:23:57 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: They worked at the time, but don't believe these still work.
14:25:11 <Roy> https://www.w3.org/2021/Process-20211102/#transition-cr
14:26:09 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: We have historical experience of implementation, but no current implementations.
14:26:30 <Sharon> q?
14:26:36 <Matthew_Atkinson> Roy: Should be OK to transition to CR; need implementations afterwards [to get past CR].
14:27:01 <Matthew_Atkinson> Sharon: Roy: you're clear to remove the 7 "at risk pending implementation" notes, as part of this?
14:27:05 <Matthew_Atkinson> Roy: Yes
14:27:11 <Matthew_Atkinson> rrsagent, make minutes
14:27:11 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/07/18-adapt-minutes.html Matthew_Atkinson
14:27:56 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: Three things: (1) the "at risk" EdNotes come out; (2) all the EdNotes except one become Notes; (3) the EdNote that remains an EdNote is the one about us using data-* attributes for now.
14:28:00 <Matthew_Atkinson> Roy: ACK
14:28:10 <Matthew_Atkinson> rrsagent, make minutes
14:28:10 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/07/18-adapt-minutes.html Matthew_Atkinson
14:28:13 <Matthew_Atkinson> q?
14:28:16 <Matthew_Atkinson> zakim, next item
14:28:16 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- Announcement of the Content Module 1.0 CR Status for W3C news - https://www.w3.org/WAI/cc/wiki/WAI_Announcement_Drafts -- taken up [from Sharon]
14:29:21 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: I created a candidate 'blog post today. Corrected typos and dates (through TPAC for comments).
14:29:52 <Lionel_Wolberger_> q+
14:30:17 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: We're also asking for _no_ binary attachments, and either GitHub issues, or plain text email, for comments.
14:31:05 <Sharon> ack Lionel_Wolberger_
14:31:05 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: We're willing to work with anyone for whom this is an accessibility challenge.
14:31:29 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lionel_Wolberger_: I'd like to add to the 'blog post.
14:31:32 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: +1
14:31:48 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: We're either running out of time, or will miss our desired date of the 26th of July to move to CR.
14:31:57 <Sharon> q?
14:32:37 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lionel_Wolberger_: My feeling is that Shawn could take what's there at any moment. I could do a little more popularization. How does this group want to be involved? Make a subcomittee, or one or two people getting involved? Do we want to rewrite it now for a few minutes?
14:32:55 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lionel_Wolberger_: I think we should be pushing towards press releases and would like to tweak the language.
14:33:28 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: It's generally better to get things right than work to an artificial deadline. We'd like to get it done by the ADA anniversary, and that is at risk (need to decide today), but it's important to get it right.
14:33:35 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lionel_Wolberger_: Agree both are important.
14:34:03 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lionel_Wolberger_: E.g. the first sentence could be broken up.
14:34:17 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: Agree. Other things are taken directly from our Introduction or Explainer.
14:35:17 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lionel_Wolberger_: Is Shawn going to edit?
14:35:35 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: It needs all the chairs' approval. Right now it says it's not ready for review. Some of the links are not correct.
14:35:59 <Matthew_Atkinson> Sharon: Are we still trying to make the end of today?
14:36:41 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: The group should decide. Roy can clean up the markup; Shawn will help with the language. If we think this is close, I'd say let it go and let's meet the 26th deadline. If we tinker with it, changes will still be made.
14:36:53 <Matthew_Atkinson> Sharon: I'm fine with that. This has been a long time in the making.
14:37:21 <Matthew_Atkinson> Sharon: Any objections to getting it in today?
14:37:34 <CharlesL> q+
14:37:43 <Sharon> ack CharlesL
14:37:46 <Matthew_Atkinson> To quote one of my colleagues: Let's do this!
14:37:55 <Matthew_Atkinson> CharlesL: The only thing I would say we should do today is to get the links sorted.
14:37:59 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: Roy will do this.
14:38:01 <Matthew_Atkinson> CharlesL: +1 then
14:38:11 <Matthew_Atkinson> ack CharlesL
14:38:18 <Matthew_Atkinson> q+
14:38:59 <Matthew_Atkinson> Roy: There is a transition request process that requires the technical director's approval. Maybe need extra time.
14:39:11 <Sharon> ack Matthew_Atkinson
14:39:26 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: The reality is we may miss the 26th, but we can try.
14:39:30 <Matthew_Atkinson> ack me
14:39:51 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lionel_Wolberger_: Trying to break up the first sentence...
14:39:55 <Lionel_Wolberger_> With this CR publication W3C is breaking new ground in web accessibility.
14:40:00 <Lionel_Wolberger_> The specification provides for the first time an initial set of element level metadata semantics.
14:40:06 <Lionel_Wolberger_> The WAI-Adapt specification enables authors to add extra semantic information about content to enable personalization for the individual user.
14:40:12 <Lionel_Wolberger_> Content authors can employ these semantics to provide technological adaptations to address the needs of various persons with cognitive and learning disabilities.
14:40:16 <Lionel_Wolberger_> This provides extra support and facilitates user-agents for people with learning and cognitive disabilities.
14:41:55 <Lionel_Wolberger_> ABOVE THIS ALL IS THIS SENTENCE
14:41:58 <Lionel_Wolberger_> [WAI-Adapt - Content Module 1.0 as a Candidate Recommendation (CR)] (https://www.w3.org/TR/adapt-content/) and calling for implementations of this specification.
14:43:24 <Matthew_Atkinson> becky: suggest "for the first time, this specification provides" (minor nit)
14:43:32 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lionel_Wolberger_: +1 to the first time emphasis
14:44:47 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: Do we chairs approve this?
14:44:51 <Matthew_Atkinson> Matthew_Atkinson: +1
14:44:53 <Matthew_Atkinson> Roy: +1
14:45:07 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: Let's tell Shawn; I'll let her know.
14:45:21 <Matthew_Atkinson> Roy: I should post a draft 'blog post, and create a PR for the news on the WAI site.
14:45:29 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: Let Shawn make edits first.
14:45:48 <Sharon> q?
14:46:19 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lionel_Wolberger_: saying "this" specification "for the first time" seems wrong; seems "a" is better?
14:46:27 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: Maybe we remove the "first time" then.
14:46:43 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: Shawn is a great wordsmith, and will work on this.
14:47:32 <Matthew_Atkinson> zakim, next item
14:47:32 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- Blog post on Content Module 1.0 CR Status (Lionel) -- taken up [from Sharon]
14:47:44 <Matthew_Atkinson> zakim, close this item
14:47:44 <Zakim> agendum 3 closed
14:47:45 <Zakim> I see 4 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
14:47:45 <Zakim> 4. 3.6 edits / Editor's note for symbols (Janina action) [from Sharon]
14:47:46 <Matthew_Atkinson> zakim, next item
14:47:46 <Zakim> agendum 4 -- 3.6 edits / Editor's note for symbols (Janina action) -- taken up [from Sharon]
14:47:58 <Matthew_Atkinson> Sharon: Did we finish this?
14:48:09 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: Yes; PRs all merged.
14:48:11 <Matthew_Atkinson> zakim, close this item
14:48:11 <Zakim> agendum 4 closed
14:48:12 <Zakim> I see 3 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
14:48:12 <Zakim> 5. TPAC 12-16 September 2022 [from Sharon]
14:48:14 <Matthew_Atkinson> zakim, next item
14:48:14 <Zakim> agendum 5 -- TPAC 12-16 September 2022 -- taken up [from Sharon]
14:48:33 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: We should be talking about this soon.
14:48:38 <Matthew_Atkinson> zakim, close this item
14:48:38 <Zakim> agendum 5 closed
14:48:39 <Zakim> I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
14:48:39 <Zakim> 6. Disambiguate between HTML <rel> and WAI-Adapt specified "purpose/destination/ action."" (Lionel) [from Sharon]
14:48:40 <Matthew_Atkinson> zakim, next item
14:48:40 <Zakim> agendum 6 -- Disambiguate between HTML <rel> and WAI-Adapt specified "purpose/destination/ action."" (Lionel) -- taken up [from Sharon]
14:48:55 <Matthew_Atkinson> zakim, take up item 5
14:48:55 <Zakim> agendum 5 -- TPAC 12-16 September 2022 -- taken up [from Sharon]
14:49:03 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: I think we'll show our work to DPUB
14:49:15 <Matthew_Atkinson> CharlesL: Working on attending IRL.
14:49:29 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: same
14:50:26 <Matthew_Atkinson> zakim, close this item
14:50:26 <Zakim> agendum 5 closed
14:50:27 <Zakim> I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
14:50:27 <Zakim> 6. Disambiguate between HTML <rel> and WAI-Adapt specified "purpose/destination/ action."" (Lionel) [from Sharon]
14:50:40 <Matthew_Atkinson> zakim, next item
14:50:40 <Zakim> agendum 6 -- Disambiguate between HTML <rel> and WAI-Adapt specified "purpose/destination/ action."" (Lionel) -- taken up [from Sharon]
14:51:05 <Matthew_Atkinson> s/<rel>/@rel/
14:51:07 <Matthew_Atkinson> s/<rel>/@rel/
14:51:08 <Matthew_Atkinson> s/<rel>/@rel/
14:51:14 <Matthew_Atkinson> rrsagent, make minutes
14:51:14 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/07/18-adapt-minutes.html Matthew_Atkinson
14:51:20 <Matthew_Atkinson> Sharon: Do we have time for this?
14:51:28 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lionel_Wolberger_: We wanted to discuss it; maybe not time here.
14:52:05 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: We found from Lisa when last we were on the call that this was looked into, but decided that @rel was not relevant. Need to point to the documentation for that.
14:52:13 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lisa: IIRC this is covered in the [GitHub] wiki.
14:52:17 <Matthew_Atkinson> rrsagent, make minutes
14:52:17 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/07/18-adapt-minutes.html Matthew_Atkinson
14:52:53 <Lisa> https://github.com/w3c/adapt/wiki/Comparison-of-ways-to-use-vocabulary-in-content
14:53:31 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lisa: On inspection, @rel doesn't seem to be mentioned there.
14:55:02 <Lisa> https://github.com/w3c/adapt/wiki/Review-of-approaches-for-Action,-Destination,-and-Purpose
14:55:17 <Lionel_Wolberger_> https://github.com/w3c/adapt/issues/172
14:56:01 <Lionel_Wolberger_> John wrote,
14:56:02 <Lionel_Wolberger_> The difference between the @rel attribute values and @destination attribute values only has one apparent overlap: Help.
14:56:47 <Matthew_Atkinson> janina: Don't think we need this for CR, but we need to be ready with more information soon.
14:56:59 <Matthew_Atkinson> Lionel_Wolberger_: John called what we all were noticing; let's keep it on the agenda.
14:57:03 <Matthew_Atkinson> q?
14:57:13 <Matthew_Atkinson> zakim, close this item
14:57:13 <Zakim> agendum 6 closed
14:57:14 <Zakim> I see 1 item remaining on the agenda:
14:57:14 <Zakim> 7. Content Module Implementations Status, focus on new candidates [from Sharon]
14:57:19 <Matthew_Atkinson> rrsagent, make minutes
14:57:19 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/07/18-adapt-minutes.html Matthew_Atkinson
15:12:38 <Matthew_Atkinson> present+ CharlesL
15:12:40 <Matthew_Atkinson> present+ Roy
15:12:42 <Matthew_Atkinson> present+ Sharon
15:12:46 <Matthew_Atkinson> rrsagent, make minutes
15:12:46 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/07/18-adapt-minutes.html Matthew_Atkinson
15:29:20 <Matthew_Atkinson> zakim, bye
15:29:20 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been mike_beganyi, Matthew_Atkinson, CharlesL, Lionel_Wolberger_, becky, Lisa, janina, Roy, Sharon
15:29:20 <Zakim> Zakim has left #adapt
15:58:58 <CharlesL> CharlesL has left #adapt