13:33:56 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #rqtf
13:33:56 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2022/02/09-rqtf-irc
13:33:58 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
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13:34:00 <trackbot> Meeting: Accessible Platform Architectures Working Group Teleconference
13:34:00 <trackbot> Date: 09 February 2022
13:34:10 <jasonjgw> agenda+ Inaccessibility of CAPTCHA.
13:34:10 <jasonjgw> agenda+ Synchronization Accessibility User Requirements.
13:34:10 <jasonjgw> agenda+ Accessibility of Remote Meetings.
13:34:10 <jasonjgw> agenda+ Natural Language Interface Accessibility User Requirements.
13:34:32 <jasonjgw> zakim, list agenda
13:34:32 <Zakim> I see 4 items remaining on the agenda:
13:34:33 <Zakim> 1. Inaccessibility of CAPTCHA. [from jasonjgw]
13:34:33 <Zakim> 2. Synchronization Accessibility User Requirements. [from jasonjgw]
13:34:33 <Zakim> 3. Accessibility of Remote Meetings. [from jasonjgw]
13:34:33 <Zakim> 4. Natural Language Interface Accessibility User Requirements. [from jasonjgw]
13:34:54 <jasonjgw> agenda+ Miscellaneous topics.
13:35:09 <jasonjgw> chair: jasonjgw
13:35:19 <jasonjgw> present+
13:52:47 <janina> janina has joined #rqtf
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14:01:59 <janina> present+
14:02:08 <scott_h> scott_h has joined #rqtf
14:02:22 <janina> zakim, who's here?
14:02:22 <Zakim> Present: jasonjgw, janina
14:02:22 <Joshue108> present+
14:02:24 <Zakim> On IRC I see scott_h, JPaton, janina, Zakim, RRSAgent, MichaelC, jasonjgw, Joshue108, trackbot
14:02:26 <scott_h> present+
14:03:37 <jasonjgw> zakim, next item
14:03:37 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Inaccessibility of CAPTCHA. -- taken up [from jasonjgw]
14:03:58 <SteveNoble> SteveNoble has joined #rqtf
14:04:06 <SteveNoble> present+
14:05:03 <SteveNoble> jasonjgw: CAPTCHA discussion - issues we can keep working on?
14:05:30 <SteveNoble> janina: Still need to look at the Cloudfare implementation
14:06:03 <SteveNoble> janina: Need to get an handle on where the work on trust tokens is at
14:07:01 <SteveNoble> jasonjgw: seems like two parts - (1) trust tokens and privacy
14:07:25 <SteveNoble> jasonjgw: (2) overall conclusions and recommendations are the other
14:08:21 <SteveNoble> janina: Shifting responsibility to user agents and away from authors seems like the direction
14:08:57 <Lionel_Wolberger> Lionel_Wolberger has joined #rqtf
14:08:58 <SteveNoble> jasonjgw: Have not seen any new comments on github so far
14:09:05 <Lionel_Wolberger> present+
14:09:28 <Joshue108> agenda?
14:10:00 <Joshue108> SN: Lionel has joined
14:10:41 <SteveNoble> Lionel_Wolberger: Let's keep going and not slow track it
14:11:23 <SteveNoble> janina: Maybe asking is shifting to user agents may help generate comments?
14:12:07 <SteveNoble> Lionel_Wolberger: Maybe hardware tokens as well...emits a sound, for example
14:13:40 <SteveNoble> Lionel_Wolberger: Many organizations that people encounter have regularized processes - may need to look at those examples
14:14:07 <SteveNoble> Lionel_Wolberger: Mutually trusted third-party can broker a connection
14:14:33 <SteveNoble> jasonjgw: Any more at the moment to discuss?
14:14:58 <SteveNoble> Lionel_Wolberger: Not much to report this week
14:15:32 <SteveNoble> Lionel_Wolberger: Previous focus has been on proven humanity
14:15:50 <SteveNoble> Lionel_Wolberger: 2-factor authentication has been around for a while
14:16:28 <SteveNoble> Lionel_Wolberger: Maybe using 2-factor approach can allow someone to bypass CAPTCHA approach
14:17:38 <SteveNoble> Lionel_Wolberger: Example of people bypassing typical security screening at the airport by setting up TSA pre and such things
14:18:27 <SteveNoble> janina: Probably not much to add to the legacy CAPTCHA language
14:18:45 <jasonjgw> zakim, next item
14:18:45 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- Synchronization Accessibility User Requirements. -- taken up [from jasonjgw]
14:19:42 <Joshue108> JW: steve commited some changes
14:19:52 <Joshue108> do you have more?
14:19:54 <Lionel_Wolberger> Lionel thanks the group for its work on improving Captcha for people with disabilities. Looking forward to more progress next time.
14:19:59 <SteveNoble> https://github.com/w3c/apa/issues/211
14:20:04 <Joshue108> sn: we are close
14:20:20 <Joshue108> would like to address this, xr related
14:20:56 <Joshue108> i have created some text
14:21:14 <Joshue108> sn: reads text
14:21:22 <SteveNoble> Virtual reality and other forms of immersive digital environments are relatively new and can present a number of accessibility challenges. Both captioning of speech and video description of visual and auditory information presented in immersive environments are required to provide an inclusive experience. However, virtual reality, augmented reality, and other forms of interactive 360-degree audiovisual experiences generate particular access[CUT]
14:22:47 <janina> q+
14:23:35 <Joshue108> sn: that addresses john P and rajas comments
14:24:20 <Joshue108> rk: relating to blind and wayfinding a la noise in 360 - games use radar, maps and directional.
14:24:36 <Joshue108> we can brainstorm now
14:25:06 <Joshue108> or we could add the word, wayfinding which is indicative
14:25:32 <Joshue108> js: is a little concerned about scope
14:25:59 <Joshue108> we may deal with this in xaur
14:26:07 <Joshue108> more appropriate
14:26:43 <Joshue108> https://www.w3.org/TR/xaur/
14:27:00 <Joshue108> dont want to mix up too many things here
14:27:03 <Joshue108> q?
14:27:08 <Joshue108> ack jan
14:27:38 <Joshue108> jw: we can clarify research limits and indicate new directions
14:28:10 <Joshue108> js: didnt we do that in xaur?
14:28:25 <Joshue108> we should cross reference?
14:28:46 <Joshue108> q+
14:29:30 <SteveNoble> Joshue108: Wayfinding and directions are mentioned in the XAUR
14:29:52 <SteveNoble> Joshue108: Being able to translate into different modalities was covered
14:30:05 <Joshue108> https://www.w3.org/TR/xaur/#spatial-orientation-mono-audio-option
14:30:13 <Joshue108> ack me
14:30:39 <SteveNoble> janina: We may want to reopen XAUR to deal with new developments
14:30:43 <Joshue108> +1 to Janina
14:30:56 <Joshue108> on keeping the SAUR lean and focussed
14:31:13 <SteveNoble> janina: Better to keep SAUR focused on syncronization
14:31:56 <SteveNoble> raja: Keeping this focused on synchronization sounds good
14:32:41 <Joshue108> jw: will review the xaur again
14:33:01 <Joshue108> https://www.w3.org/TR/xaur/
14:33:08 <Joshue108> JW: Steve does that help?
14:33:13 <Joshue108> Sn: Yes
14:33:23 <Joshue108> We should link to the XAUR
14:34:29 <Joshue108> SN: to say John P is on the call
14:34:44 <Joshue108> JW: We can frame this as something that needs further research
14:35:01 <Joshue108> JS: We should re-read and compare both SAUR and XAUR etc
14:35:21 <Joshue108> JS: I'm concerned about saying the same things in two docs
14:35:29 <Joshue108> they can get out of sync
14:35:59 <Joshue108> SH: Asks a question about video descriptions - is that audio description?
14:36:12 <Joshue108> JS: We do want AGWG to clean up their language.
14:36:27 <Joshue108> JS: <MAUR was the first doc - history lesson>
14:37:08 <Joshue108> JS: Amazon has been challenging by creating audio out of text streams
14:37:22 <Joshue108> SH: So WCAG 3 will move to video description?
14:37:43 <Joshue108> SH: No one in OZ will understand that
14:38:24 <Joshue108> JS: Indeed - <discussed text description and pausing video to pause video>
14:38:32 <Joshue108> We have use cases that are not covered by audi
14:38:41 <Joshue108> s/audi/audio
14:38:53 <Joshue108> JS: MAUR could be updated also
14:39:04 <Joshue108> JW: Anything else Steve?
14:39:18 <Joshue108> SN: That takes care of the last issue in GH
14:40:15 <Joshue108> JW: I can merge that
14:40:19 <Joshue108> JOC: Go for it
14:40:21 <Joshue108> q+
14:40:24 <Joshue108> ack me
14:40:52 <SteveNoble> Joshue108: Messaging on SAUR update?
14:41:30 <SteveNoble> janina: Need to establish if this is going to be a joint publication first
14:42:03 <Joshue108> JOC: wfm
14:42:04 <SteveNoble> jasonjgw: This will change the messaging text
14:43:27 <jasonjgw> zakim, next item
14:43:27 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- Accessibility of Remote Meetings. -- taken up [from jasonjgw]
14:44:10 <SteveNoble> jasonjgw: Major work has been going on for Remote Meetings documents
14:44:41 <SteveNoble> jasonjgw: Lots of work by Scott!
14:46:02 <SteveNoble> scott_h: Have worked through most issues, a few remain
14:46:31 <SteveNoble> scott_h: Issue 266
14:47:19 <SteveNoble> scott_h: Insuring when a waiting room is used that status messages are accessible
14:48:47 <SteveNoble> scott_h: Broader considerations of the developer's perspective of how access to these messages is provided
14:49:36 <SteveNoble> scott_h: Proper to point to WAI spec about alert messages
14:50:05 <SteveNoble> jasonjgw: This was added to WCAG 2.1
14:50:47 <SteveNoble> jasonjgw: Meant to make sure this was available to API - applies to 4.1.2
14:51:49 <SteveNoble> janina: Providing these (according to 4.1.3) to the API is needed
14:52:08 <SteveNoble> scott_h: But all of these messages can be overwhelming
14:52:39 <SteveNoble> janina: Pinning some of these to a braille display is a good process
14:53:48 <SteveNoble> scott_h: Issue 292
14:54:20 <SteveNoble> scott_h: How all people should be able to see and hear each other in virtual and hybrid meetings
14:55:08 <SteveNoble> scott_h: The problem of how close to a microphone someone needs to be
14:55:52 <SteveNoble> janina: This is a bit overstated...do we really need to mention these?
14:56:14 <jasonjgw> zakim, next item
14:56:14 <Zakim> agendum 4 -- Natural Language Interface Accessibility User Requirements. -- taken up [from jasonjgw]
14:57:16 <Joshue108> https://github.com/w3c/apa/issues/262
14:57:24 <SteveNoble> jasonjgw: Document by MITRE on chatbot accessibility - this has been added to Github
14:57:44 <Joshue108> Take into account Mitre Corporation work on chatbot accessibility. #262
14:58:08 <Joshue108> q?
14:59:01 <SteveNoble> Joshue108: some COGA comments on voice menus - we will need to push dicsussion to next week
15:00:12 <SteveNoble> janina: APA meeting time is changing starting next week, starting at 10:00 AM Eastern, so will need to leave this meeting a bit early as regular course
15:00:53 <jasonjgw> zakim, bye
15:00:53 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been jasonjgw, janina, Joshue, scott_h, SteveNoble, Lionel_Wolberger
15:00:53 <Zakim> Zakim has left #rqtf
15:01:05 <jasonjgw> rrsagent, make minutes
15:01:05 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/02/09-rqtf-minutes.html jasonjgw
15:02:29 <SteveNoble_> SteveNoble_ has joined #rqtf
15:04:46 <jasonjgw> rrsagent, make minutes
15:04:46 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/02/09-rqtf-minutes.html jasonjgw