IRC log of auto on 2021-04-27

Timestamps are in UTC.

09:29:29 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #auto
09:29:29 [RRSAgent]
logging to https://www.w3.org/2021/04/27-auto-irc
09:29:31 [Zakim]
RRSAgent, make logs Public
09:29:33 [Zakim]
Meeting: Automotive Working Group Teleconference
09:31:47 [ted]
Present+ Ashish, Hisao, Kenichi, Ted, Stephen, Adnan, Ulf, Arman, Erik, MagnusG, Sebastian
09:33:23 [ted]
Topic: Introductions
09:33:48 [ted]
agenda+ Renesas and Bosch additions to VISS version 1
09:33:48 [ted]
agenda+ major additional features in draft VISS version 2
09:33:48 [ted]
agenda+ testing, tooling, open source implementations
09:33:48 [ted]
agenda+ next steps
09:34:10 [ted]
Present+ Wenwen
09:34:22 [ted]
Present+ Yusuke
09:34:56 [ted]
Present+ Gunnar
09:40:05 [ted]
zakim, next agendum
09:40:05 [Zakim]
agendum 1 -- Renesas and Bosch additions to VISS version 1 -- taken up [from ted]
09:44:10 [ted]
Yusuke shares screen for presentation
09:44:49 [ted]
Yusuke: personal mobility requires connectivity
09:45:56 [ted]
… regarding W3C activity we have started to think about centralized, service architecture
09:46:37 [ted]
… there are three main issues, network availability, massive amount of data and integration and optimization of services
09:46:54 [ted]
… we created some different designs on how to connect to the cloud
09:47:13 [ted]
… taking advantage of edge and cloud computing
09:47:42 [ted]
… we're participating in R-Car consortium with ~250 partners
09:48:44 [ted]
… VISS is used as universal interface
09:48:59 [ted]
… used with a connected SDK
09:49:57 [ted]
… we have a CAN generator for simulating
09:50:38 [ted]
… we are are collaborating with various cloud providers
09:51:13 [ted]
… Renesas R-Car starter kit is available in MS Azure IoT environment
09:51:23 [ted]
… possible to create services around R-Car
09:51:50 [ted]
… CCPF starter kit for application development, some of the requirements come from the customer
09:54:04 [ted]
Ted: the connection SDK for off-boarding data?
09:54:23 [ted]
Yusuke: yes
09:56:07 [ted]
Stephen: simulator adds in some private data
09:57:04 [ted]
Yusuke: yes such as DMS (driver monitoring system)
09:57:33 [ted]
Ulf: the signals you mention like DMS, is that something you want to bring into the [data] standard (VSS)?
09:57:45 [ted]
Yusuku: current thinking is to share with partners
09:58:00 [ted]
Stephen: we are not a DMS supplier, so hard for us to define the signals
09:58:14 [ted]
… we can be helpful in identifying what should be added
09:58:42 [ted]
Ulf: makes sense but we need to work together to fill the gap
10:01:26 [ted]
Ted: @@ on building out VSS signals
10:02:17 [ted]
… anything you can share about access control in R-Car?
10:03:23 [ted]
Hisao: we have security capabilities but this was a trusted environment and not needed at this point
10:05:30 [ted]
Sebastian shares screen
10:05:45 [ted]
Sebastian: we are coming from VSS data point, we want the abstraction inside the vehicle
10:05:58 [ted]
… and bring it all the way up to the cloud
10:07:21 [ted]
… we have a VISSv1 server (Kuksa.val) and use if for various efforts on IoT events and bringing to MS cloud
10:07:51 [ted]
… components fill out the data tree and we have some test clients we can provide
10:08:40 [ted]
[example setting vehicle speed from command line]
10:09:31 [ted]
Sebastian: we have a rudimentary way to connect to the cloud
10:09:54 [ted]
… we have a MQTT server for exposing VSS as well
10:12:06 [ted]
… as Ted mentioned, VISS deferred on security. we are using JWT
10:12:29 [ted]
… token restricts what you can access
10:12:41 [ted]
… we want to be able to control access on individual signal level
10:13:03 [ted]
… we wanted to keep it as simple as possible and kept permissions flat
10:13:14 [ted]
… inside the vehicle we do not have model of roles
10:14:11 [ted]
Ulf: version 2 uses a role based access control model
10:14:42 [ted]
… there is more need for authorization server in the vehicle to determine which signals are allowed for a given role
10:14:49 [ted]
… you can also get granular per signal
10:15:08 [ted]
… using policy documents, which adds complexity and flexibility
10:15:56 [ted]
Sebastian: I see need for roles at some point. in our architecture we don't see that needed within the vehicle
10:16:09 [ted]
Ulf: agree, different flavors
10:18:57 [ted]
Ted: some of that comes from the different use cases and allowing for connections from the cloud in addition to in-vehicle
10:20:21 [ted]
Sebastian: we consider ourselves compliant with v1 and some additions
10:20:47 [ted]
… v2 has some advanced things for filtering which may also be something we don't want
10:21:12 [ted]
… v2 scope is larger and valid but maybe want some different feature levels
10:22:09 [ted]
Ulf: I agree, not everything needs to be implemented but can have common set for compliance
10:26:40 [ted]
Ted: we should start a couple issues to further discussion - filtering essential and optional; two flavors of access control for trusted (simpler) and untrusted environments/uses
10:27:12 [ted]
Ulf: we do have a reference implementation which fulfills 100% of the spec which may help consideration
10:34:23 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/04/27-auto-minutes.html ted
10:43:04 [ted]
s/@@ on building out VSS signals/we were not encouraging contributions of new signal definitions while refactoring VSS and have since only added a few around eg EV, we want to start creating more for ADAS, DMS etc and welcome help in enlisting contributions/
10:43:06 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/04/27-auto-minutes.html ted
10:45:51 [ted]
i/Sebastian: we have a rudimentary/Topic: major additional features in draft VISS version 2/
10:45:52 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/04/27-auto-minutes.html ted