Kim: Apple announced iOS13
<kim> TOPIC iOS13 update accessibility
Jennifer: Promis that many things
will be more accessible
... default font would be a Mac type
... pre-rogrammed accessibility labels
<kim> https://www.apple.com/ios/ios-13-preview/features/
Kim: Changes look
significant
... more voice control options enabled
... historically you can't do much inside programs, so thi sis
building speech into the OS better
... with Siri you can do everything - use grid, show
labels
... turn it on and off, even of. say label
... wil be good example of instructional text
... Text about a11y has changed under "even more"
...Marc: Voice options listed at the top of Accessibility
now
Jennifer: Will be easier to set
up a11y settings out of the box
... Not so deeply nested, A11y now higher up the hierarchy
Kim: Another good thing is text
editing - more gestures
... haven't tried them yet
... also more keyboard shortcuts
Detlev: Any improvement for keyboard access on iOS with external keyboard?
Kim: iPad and iPhone split off, iPad haviong more options like opening the desktop version of web sites
Jennifer: Should be able to use voice control to assign gestures to a voice command so you can execute gestures with voice
Kim: dev version is out, not
public
... Has been in the works a long time, looks like deeply
integrated stuff
... Not sure how far "comprehensive voice operation" goes
... important would be to let users customise commands - not
sure if that is included
... possible on Mac, not sure if implemented also in iOS13
Detlev: hopes keyboard operability on iOS has changed
Jennifer: Android Q is out?
Jon: confirms.
Some new APIs
<jon_avila> https://developer.android.com/preview/features
Kim: Looks like it is all implemented (Android)
Marc: Not lloking as robust
Jon: Focus is more on other
features (not a11y)
... a111y timeouts, shortcut stuff
Kim: What are the things you want from mobile operating systems?
Jennifer: friend tried Android phone, but could not use it
Detlev: used to be more sluggish regarding gesture input
Jake: report about a guy who was
forced to use an Android device because iphone was broken
..conclusion: if there was better Braille support his next
phone would be an Android device
Jon: Voice Access (which used to be beta) ...
Jake: does its job but not as good as iOS, maybe dwon to accent a bit
<kim> https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1Q9md2AvmeTgvsT9GB62BsGvCaalDGtE6
Kim: Jake - is there stuff from last call (on gesture hints) - talk more about it?
Jake: Most changes were wording changes
<kim> v
<kim> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ouVFq4w-i0rchNHtTAG_JoRwHfYm9mN2MkxFBct1JSI/edit
Detlev: apologies for not havign read it - promis to read!
Jake: Input welcome
<scribe> ACTION: Detlev read doc, give feedback
<trackbot> Created ACTION-76 - Read doc, give feedback [on Detlev Fischer - due 2019-06-27].
Kim: Portrait/ Landscape, different content
<kim> TOPIC portrait/landscape
<jon_avila> the essential part seems incorrect as it talks about gestures
Jake: Not sure what the status of
this doc is, could be an older version
... lets skip it for no and go to touch target
Jake: was discussed on call Tues
Jon: reports concerns that touch target space between might not be (easily) testable
<kim> TOPIC concern about touch target testing
Jake: Comments were pointing out
that if you define layout via percentages of flex not css
pixels you might get different distances so space will depend
on viewport width etc.
... so measurement would involve things like screenshot,
programatic workout of positions seems not feasible
... inspector can in those cases not work out the distance
Kim: So is this a roadblock - can we get around it?
Jake: Cant see a solution apart form scoping to cases where offsets are defined in picels
Jon: Is this the same issue as with touch target size?
Jake: No, that one is always measurable in pixels
<jon_avila> I have to jump off. sorry
Jake: Distance, if not defined in pixels, you can only guess - no margins, paddings defined
Kim: How often does this happen?
Jake: The more these Techniques
are used the more difficult it gets
... If it is not 100% testable we don't even need to ask that
question - asking Wilco will probably have the same
result
... you can measure every pixel on screen but there are many
variations
... screenshot-based will be very awkward
Detlev (describing way of measuring)
Jake: When elements are close it could be 5,7 8 pixels, difficult to judge
Detlev: Use a ruler?
Jake: give it a background, see the touch area - it is an option but not easy
Detlev: was linked with target size - uncoupled it is less valuable (not as important for large targets)
Jake: We can look for elements without background padding positioned via flex / % we can ask people if they think it can be measured and discuss
Kim: Will we ask Wilco, will this be useful?
Jake: We can ask him
Kim: would be good
Jake: Can ask him, send an email
Detlev: Wondering if anything is in the works for single point activation for swiping / dragging, also for SR users on mobile - if not, we should try to put it in for 2.2
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.154 of Date: 2018/09/25 16:35:56 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: Irssi_ISO8601_Log_Text_Format (score 1.00) Default Present: MarcJohlic, jon_avila, Kim, Detlev, Jennifer, Jake Present: MarcJohlic jon_avila Kim Detlev Jennifer Jake No ScribeNick specified. Guessing ScribeNick: Detlev Inferring Scribes: Detlev Found Date: 20 Jun 2019 People with action items: detlev WARNING: IRC log location not specified! (You can ignore this warning if you do not want the generated minutes to contain a link to the original IRC log.)[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]