https://hangouts.google.com/call/4UCkixKTnAw0nHmfS1CRAEEE
please join the hangouts link
Doc: Devanagari https://w3c.github.io/iip/gap-analysis/deva-gap.html
GitHub Open Issues: https://github.com/w3c/iip/issues
<atsushi> agendum working through github issues
Chapter 2: 2.1, 2.2: Abhijit Chapter 3: 3.1-3.6: Alolita Chapter 3: 3.7-3.12: Muthu Chapter 4: 4.1-4.8: Vivek Chapter 5: 5.1-5.5: Akshat and Abhijit Chapter 6: 6.1-6.2: Vivek and Alolita
<atsushi> Muthu: no time since last teleconference
<atsushi> http://w3c.github.io/i18n-activity/templates/gap-analysis/gap-analysis_template.html
We are using the new document
Introduction 1.1 Work flow 1.2 Prioritization 2. Text direction 2.1 Vertical text 2.2 Bidirectional text 3. Characters and phrases 3.1 Characters & encoding 3.2 Fonts 3.3 Font styles, weight, etc 3.4 Glyph shaping and positioning 3.5 Cursive text 3.6 Transforming characters 3.7 Text segmentation & selection 3.7.1 Grapheme clusters 3.7.2 Danda selection 3.7.3 Spans around partial orthographic syllables 3.8 Text decoration 3.8.1 Underline and Overline behavi[CUT]
<atsushi> Alolita: do we need to fit with the new gap-analysis section list, and is there any list of the newest one?
3.9 Quotations 3.9.1 Default quotation marks for q element 3.9.2 Default quotation marks in a new language section 3.9.3 Embedded quotations in a different language 3.10 Inline notes & annotations 3.11 Numbers, dates, etc. 3.11.1 Devanagari Numerals 3.12 Other inline features 4. Lines and Paragraphs 4.1 Line breaking 4.2 Hyphenation 4.3 Text alignment & justification 4.4 Word & letter spacing 4.4.1 Inter Character/Akshara spacing for Indian languages 4.5 [CUT]
4.5 Counters, lists, etc. 4.6 Styling initials 4.7 Baselines & inline alignment 4.7.1 Indian Scripts and Baselines 4.8 Other paragraph features 5. Page & book layout 5.1 General page layout & progression 5.2 Notes, footnotes, etc. 5.3 Page numbering, running headers, etc. 5.4 Forms & user interaction 5.5 Other page layout & pagination features 6. Other 6.1 Culture-specific features 6.2 What else?
<atsushi> Alolita: for indic language, we need to dig exsiting sections into subsections, like @@ (quotations?)
This is the new breakdown of what each of us are working on
Chapter 2: 2.1, 2.2: Abhijit Chapter 3: 3.1-3.6: Alolita Chapter 3: 3.7-3.12: Muthu Chapter 4: 4.1-4.8: Vivek Chapter 5: 5.1-5.5: Akshat and Abhijit Chapter 6: 6.1-6.2: Vivek and Alolita
<atsushi> ... Update sections by next Monday
<atsushi> cheat sheet for rrsagent: https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/wiki/Teleconference_cheat_sheet
<atsushi> Aolita: for use cases, could ask help from teams in relations, and also we may be better to ask collaborators in languages for getting wider participations
<atsushi> ... action items would be 1) request Vivek to sent out teams for samples, 2) Alolita post to Unicode slack channel for samples to local font designers
<atsushi> ... let's going through to complete as much as possible, by next Monday
<atsushi> Muthu: I'd propose to pick a language which is the least completed
https://w3c.github.io/iip/gap-analysis/taml-gap.html
<atsushi> Aolita: pick up Tamil
<atsushi> ... going through each section
2.0 Text direction
<Nedumaran> Hello
Hi
Looking at Tamil Section 2 Text direction
2.1 Vertical Text - is this a common use case
Muthu: There is some usage in modern signboards, decorative
Tamil is not formally written vertically
This is a non-issue in Tamil since its not used
2.2 Bidi text
There is no bidirectional text support needed for Tamil.
3.0 Characters and phrases
3.1 Characters & encoding
There are no encoding issues afaik (Muthu)
The only issue discussed is the way the conjunct sha is defined
ksha
ksha does not have a code point - the default is the conjunct form which is not commonly used
it is created with a zwj and this is more common
the non-conjugated form is the independent form is most common today - and it created with a zwj
the common usage of ksha is from English or non-native Tamil (from other Indian languages) and for Sanskrit
is using the decomposed form
Alolita will add an issue for noting the ksha usage
and Muthu will provide an example
3.2 Fonts
Do the standard fallback fonts used in browsers (eg. serif, sans-serif, cursive, etc.) match expectations? Yes
Vivek: In Sanskrit - there is a visarga - how is this represented in Tamil?
<Nedumaran> Aytham
Muthu: In Tamil - visarga is called aytham which represents the exception
<Nedumaran> எஃகு
Aytham stays independent, never comes before a vowel, can exist as an independent character on its own
<Nedumaran> ஃபோன்
In modern usage - the Aytham is coming in front - it is being used as a modifier of the consonant is after
pone becomes aytham + pone = phone
<Nedumaran> நமஹ
Aytham does not have the same meaning as visarga
<Nedumaran> ஜ ஹ ஷ ஸ ஶ
e.g. usage of 'ha' is only for Sanskrit (Grantha)
<Nedumaran> ஶ்ரீ
shri is a conjunct
<Nedumaran> ja ha sha sa sha
<Nedumaran> ஸர்பம்
classical Tamil - does not use these 5 characters
<Nedumaran> சர்பம்
Tamil does not have a character for each sound
The sound is created based on context
the orthographies are different
Are special font or OpenType features needed for this script that are not available?
Muthu: OpenType implementation is adequate
unlike Devanagari
<Nedumaran> லை
Since there are no conjuncts in Tamil - it is easier to represent in Open Type
3.7 needs issues in GitHub
<atsushi> alolita: please respond to email, and will file issues
For Devanagari - we will sync up next Monday
For Tamil - our discussion of each issue will be reviewed both by Vivek and Muthu