- Minutes -

WAI Coordination Call Teleconference

13 Feb 2019


tzviya, Joanmarie_Diggs, MichaelC, stevelee, Sharron, Judy, janina, jeanne, CharlesL, Kathy, Katie_Haritos-Shea, George, Jim (IRC)


Scribe, rrsagent, agenda, next meeting date

Judy: Next meeting will be on 27 Feb, any conflicts?


Judy: Charles regrets, also George, anyone else?

George: We are working on two SCs for exposing metadata to online retailers and would like to update the group - add an agenda item?

Upcoming announcements & publications

Janina: extensive number of revisions and updates, esp RECAPTCHA discussion.I owe Michael a to-do but there will be a blog post within a few days most likely. If you ahve not read it, would appreciate a close read and would like to publish as a W3C Note. Thanks.

Judy: You will post the request to the appropriate lists?

Knowledge Domain Community Group launched

<janina> http://www.w3.org/community/knowledge-domain/

Judy: Want to mention that there are four related agenda items.

Janina: We were getting into what can we do to do a better job on math and science, etc.Possible that some texts would use various notations etc, and so...

Judy: Can we table that for the full discussion later in the agenda, and focus instead on the Community Group

Janina: Sure, posted the URL and especially need non-accessiblity people, want to hear from the wider community. Want to know the best ways without foundational changes to HTML etc.

Judy: Any questions about logistices, etc of community groups from anybody?

Math discussions update

Judy: The Knowledge Domain topic is an umbrella for figuring out the single underlying mechanism to get these to work for the web. Backgrounds, communities, culture are all distinct. Will start with Math area, bringing together chairs, team contacts, and want all to think about where they may be impact on your own work.

<Ryladog> Apologies for coming in late

George: Math ML4 Community Groups looking at what might be added and subtracted from MathML3 to be (we hope) implemented in the browsers. Are optimistic that they will, not sure to what extent. Funding has been applied to putting it in Chromium, Edge is moving to Chromium, may get it in there. Need for highlighting, other supports require identify when things change for example from one type of

equation for example

Judy: These things are being implemented in the browsers before the standard is in place?

Charles: Judy, I think that becasue the work is done in the Community Group, we have developers involved from the various browsers and since they have received a grant award for the work, the idea is to do the work, allow it to be testable, and then as they update their own browser implementations it can be brought in.
... would then look for a Rec track and a WG to take it on.

George: I beleive the implementation in Chromium has begun, they are implementing the present specification.May help identify portions that are painful. That is just my own interpretation.

Geroge: At TPAC, some people wanted to drop MathML and another that wanted to improve it. Is that still true?

Charles: Yes, and quite unfortunate since we are such a small community would like to speak with one voice. The ones who want to ditch MathML and start from scratch seem to not consider how long that will take and so I am in favor of giving publishers what they need now - an immediate solution.

Judy: A very improtant question, thanks for raising it. Which is the ongoing work, starting from scratch or improving MathML

Janina: I beleive it was the MathML approach but not 100% certain.

Judy: Would recommend this gets clarified quickly. To determine which approach is being supported by W3C. Important for us to pay attention and bring things together where possible.

<CharlesL> Here is the TAG Response: https://github.com/w3ctag/design-reviews/issues/313#issuecomment-460523527

Joanie: This is similar to HTML and divs and spans controversy. Peter is suggesting using HTML and SVG and facing the problem of how to make it accessible. Many of them have become IEs for ARIA WG and are working with them to add missing theings and discuss it under this umbrella.

Judy: They are talking about how MathML can better integrate, sort out interoperability with CSS, computational representation, rendering, etc. It seems that it should be a priority to become an ongoing conversation, the TAG issue should still be open, not closed.
... looks like we need more communication between the groups for agreement about the best way forward. Can you reopen the issue?

George: I don't know enough about how to bring things togethr, but at some point, someone has to step up and tell us what to do. We should not have the wrong approach become embedded.

Judy: Michael, do you ahve ideas about the architectural question and how to pull tings together?

Michael: See no value in re-opening the TAG issue, they are not interested in reviewing it, should do what we need to do going forward.

Judy: They are on record to support the more integrated approach, leaves a potential problem if we go in another direction.

Michael: I see them on record to support MathML with consideration of other approaches in the long term

Tzvya: TAG may not have the full picture, while what is happening in ARIA-WG may be extrmely valueable. It's possible to see SVG and MathML working together.Joanie and the ARIA-WG have done so much work in exploring how HTML and SVG can work with MathML to support accessibility.

Judy: So I am worried at this point about getting through the agenda. Among next steps in Math, we should connect the TAG to this work and happy to take this off line.
... Do you ever have discussions with TAG about this?

Tzyva: Have commented on it as a publisher.

Judy: Would be good to have more in depth follow up.

George: If we in teh community saw a unified work effort that we could articulate, there is a much larger community of interest eager to find solutions.People now don't know where to put their efforts since there seems to be no good horse to ride.We need a unified voice to gather momentum behind it.

Chem discussions update

Judy: Excellent opportunity to keep in mind to get support for architectural approach and rallying support for it. Can I count on you to raise that again?

George: On the chemistry side, held a kick-off call wiht those who expressed interest and we will meet bi weekly.
... posted minutes, issue tracker, etc to the community group. Individuals, DIAGRAM list and DAISY list. Goals is to have best practices for publishers to be able to present chemistry and make it accessible and made people aware of Knwoledge Domain work.

KD architecture, initial take

Janina: Idea is to write up as briefly as possible the minimum you need to know when you open a book, what kind of domain specificity. For example, physics or musical notation, wuld use SVG, MathMl, etc we will have content that borrows from different Knowledge domains. What does the header have to say, how is the markup identified and such

Judy: Want to give people an idea of the problem.

Janina: yes so we can define

Judy: and these conversations will be taken in the Math and Chem discussions?

Janina: I expect that we will find that browser does not natively support this and it will require registries (dirty word) but may come back to something like that.

George: I think that sounds really good and it as it applies to symbology or even vocabulary in certain domains that rely on Knowlede Domains, acronyms etc. To get on the same wavelength.

Janina: I love that you are saying we need to consider the use of domain specific jargon.

George: Language changes depending upon context

COGA TF update

Judy: Recent F2F they are thinking of another soon.

CSUN coordination

Judy: I have been delayed in getting catering and AT prices, so I am hoping to settle quickly.

Jeanne: I have a couple of people lined up to speonsor or donate but I have no numbers to give them:

<CharlesL> I will be at CSUN Wednesday & Thursday

Judy: Need to ask what groups are needing.next meeting may be a good time to coordinate
... want to make sure that this is tracked and implemented as closely as possible.

George: we have forwarded this to ISO, they will ahve a F2F in Milan that most of us will attend remotely.

Judy: Is the coordiantion going smoothly?

<janina> Hoping the ISO specs are extensible, and can pickup meta data we define via knowledge domain?

George: Don't see any problems but not been widely reviewed

Judy: any coordination questions or input?

Michael: The group found F2F meeting useful, would find more meetings useful but doing it more than once a year is unlikely.

Infoshare: WG or TF updates

George: VitalSource is exposing schema accessiiblity metadata on their website now. It is confusing to read as it is. We have started a small group to create a guideline for the expression of metadata for ePub and ..
... not brought to the Publishing group as yet but close to making it more public via GitHub. They both could end up being a note.

Judy: any other info shares?

trackbot, end meeting