<allanj> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-low-vision-a11y-tf/2017Jul/0093.html

<allanj> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-low-vision-a11y-tf/2017Jul/0093.html

<JohnRochford> Can't get into WebEx or join by phone.

<scribe> scribe: erich

<scribe> new dial-in access - Access code:315 563 869

<JohnRochford> ok

<allanj> https://www.w3.org/2017/08/01-lvtf-info.html

<shawn> s/ new dial-in access - Access code:315 563 869 /

Any issues with any other SCs. Progress on Understanding

JA: need to start getting our understanding documents together, so let the group know if anyone needs help

Popup Interference (MetaData on Hover)

<allanj> Summary of issues from Tuesday AG meeting

<allanj> 1. popup, popover, custom tooltip - NOT tooltip or menu

<allanj> 2. tag name change - reduce popup interference (16 yes, 5 no)

<allanj> 3. scope - title attribute (yes/no), is anything else left out?

<allanj> 4. megamenu??

<allanj> Things for Understanding doc

<allanj> if you have to click it, it is not a popup

<allanj> button changing color is not a popup.

<allanj> this SC is intended for authors creating 'non-persistant information' on the screen so they don't interfer with other information

<allanj> Gower - would be nice if the Understanding docs also dissuaded the use of popups in general given the lack of usability for touchscreen users. (from comments on github)

<allanj> @title has support issues - Using the HTML title attribute

<allanj> other issues

<allanj> Seems folks want @title=tooltip covered. Including tooltip would eliminate the need for for the exception at the start.

<allanj> Tho there will be pushback - see https://github.com/w3c/wcag21/issues/75#issuecomment-270134757

<allanj> see @title on forms - https://github.com/w3c/wcag21/issues/75#issuecomment-270964479

<allanj> discussion of to include or exclude tooltip

<allanj> if we include tooltip, then telling authors to not use @title

<allanj> sr: did not get adding tooltip from AG discussion

<allanj> sr: change popup to something else, change interference to visability

SM: must be a concrete reason why term "popup" not accepted

<allanj> sr: no consistent term for popup

<allanj> hover box, hover card

<allanj> current SC

sh: is term "popup" being used elsewhere in wcag 2.0?

<allanj> Except where the visual presentation of a popup is controlled by the user agent and is not modified by the author, all of the following are true when a popup is visible:

<allanj> Trigger

<allanj> The Popup does not obscure any part of its trigger.

<allanj> Hover

<allanj> If the popup is triggered via pointer hover, then the pointer may be moved onto the popup without loss of popup visibility.

<allanj> Focus

<allanj> The Popup remains visible while its trigger or any of its components have focus, unless the user takes an explicit action to close the popup.

sr: don't believe so (term "popup" being used elsewhere in wcag 2.0)

<steverep> Hoverbox https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoverbox

<alastairc> We work the definition into the SC text? "For page content which appears only when a triggering element gains focus or mouse over, all of the following are true when that content is visible:"... something like that?

<alastairc> (Sorry, just got off a call, about to hop onto AGWG call)

<JohnRochford> +1 to visibility rather than interference

sr: can change 'interference' to 'visibility'

+1

<allanj> +1

sr: i can reach out to address the objection, though would ask them to propose an alternate suggestion

<allanj> change Focus: "The Popup remains visible while its trigger or any of the popup's components have focus"

<allanj> lowney comment: Exceptions for user canceling the popup should apply to both keyboard and pointer activation.

<allanj> SR will start email conversations with others on AG to solicit suggestions

<allanj> group likes "POPUP"

<allanj> Essential information can be printed with no loss of content.

sh: likely to avoid getting in to the muck, as with the term 'zoom' previously?

ja: what we have right now is pretty simple

sh: one question about testability section, do we remove text about SC being met with HTML and browsers?

<allanj> add to description - How authors can break printing

sh: also under the description. People will ask, 'what breaks this?' so we need to answer how it breaks

<allanj> remove technique G142

<allanj> jim to edit wiki to remove zoom stuff

<allanj> regrets for erich next week

<shawn> Testability

<shawn> Print the page. Check to see that essential content is printed, e.g. no truncated text on right edge of content, no overlapping content.

<shawn> -> Print the page. Check that all essential information is printed with no overlapping content, missing text on right edge of the page, etc.

<shawn> Related Techniques

<shawn> G146: Using liquid layout

<shawn> C28: Specifying the size of text containers using em units

<shawn> SCR34: Calculating size and position in a way that scales with text size

<shawn> include those, too? or not since they're referenced in G179

<shawn> delete "This success criteria is currently met with common HTML and browsers." under "Description" and "Testability" -- and add examples of when it breaks -- more than 100; set box sizes

<shawn> https://github.com/w3c/wcag21/issues/76

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FAILED: s/ new dial-in access - Access code:315 563 869 //
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Present: Shawn Jim Erich Scott John steverep allanj JohnRochford
Regrets: Marla Laura
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Found Date: 03 Aug 2017
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