Meeting Record

Provenance Working Group Teleconference

Minutes of 03 June 2011

Seen

Daniel Garijo, Graham Klyne, James Frew, James Cheney, Jun Zhao, Jörn Hees, Luc Moreau, Paolo Missier, Paul Groth, Sandro Hawke, Stephan Zednik, Timothy Lebo, Unknown YolandaGil, Yogesh Simmhan

Scribe

Timothy Lebo

IRC Log

Original

Resolutions

None.

Topics

slide 3
slide 4
slide 5
slide 6
slide 7
slide 8
slide 9
slide 10
slide 11
slide 12
slide 13
slide 14
slide 16
slide 17
slide 17
slide 19
slide 21
slide 22
slide 25
slide 26
slide 30
slide 31
slide 32
slide 34
open to questions

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15:01:11 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/06/03-prov-irc

RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/06/03-prov-irc ←

15:01:13 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world

Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs world ←

15:01:15 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be

Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be ←

15:01:15 <Zakim> I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot

Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot ←

15:01:16 <trackbot> Meeting: Provenance Working Group Teleconference

15:01:16 <trackbot> Date: 03 June 2011

15:01:35 <tlebo> zakim, who is on the phone?

Timothy Lebo: zakim, who is on the phone? ←

15:01:35 <Zakim> sorry, tlebo, I don't know what conference this is

Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, tlebo, I don't know what conference this is ←

15:01:36 <Zakim> On IRC I see paolo, Zakim, RRSAgent, StephenCresswell, tlebo, GK_, dgarijo, YolandaGil, jun, frew, Yogesh, jorn, stain, sandro, trackbot

Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see paolo, Zakim, RRSAgent, StephenCresswell, tlebo, GK_, dgarijo, YolandaGil, jun, frew, Yogesh, jorn, stain, sandro, trackbot ←

15:01:43 <tlebo> zakim, this is #prov

Timothy Lebo: zakim, this is #prov ←

15:01:44 <Zakim> sorry, tlebo, I do not see a conference named '#prov' in progress or scheduled at this time

Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, tlebo, I do not see a conference named '#prov' in progress or scheduled at this time ←

15:01:51 <YolandaGil> Zakim, this will be prov-wg

Scribe problem: the name 'YolandaGil' does not match any of the 47 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Carl Reed Christine Runnegar Daniel Schutzer Daniel Garijo David Hau David Corsar Deborah McGuinness Ed Summers Edoardo Pignotti Eric Stephan Graham Klyne Helena Deus Iker Huerga Ilkay Altintas Irini Fundulaki James Myers James Frew James Cheney Jean-Pierre EVAIN Jun Zhao Jörn Hees Kai Eckert Khalid Belhajjame Linda Stewart Luc Moreau Maria Theodoridou Martin Doerr Olaf Hartig Paolo Missier Paul Groth Paulo Pinheiro da Silva Sam Coppens Sandro Hawke Satya Sahoo Simon Miles Simon Dobson Stephan Zednik Stephen Cresswell Stian Soiland-Reyes Ted Thibodeau Timothy Lebo Vinh Nguyen Yogesh Simmhan david schaengold Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Unknown YolandaGil: Zakim, this will be prov-wg ←

15:01:51 <Zakim> I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, YolandaGil

Zakim IRC Bot: I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, YolandaGil ←

15:01:53 <sandro> zakim, this will be prov

Sandro Hawke: zakim, this will be prov ←

15:01:53 <Zakim> ok, sandro, I see SW_(Prov WG)11:00AM already started

Zakim IRC Bot: ok, sandro, I see SW_(Prov WG)11:00AM already started ←

15:01:58 <Zakim> -??P8

Zakim IRC Bot: -??P8 ←

15:02:06 <tlebo> zakim, who is on the phone?

Timothy Lebo: zakim, who is on the phone? ←

15:02:06 <Zakim> On the phone I see frew, [ISI], tlebo, ??P2, +31.62.417.aaaa, sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see frew, [ISI], tlebo, ??P2, +31.62.417.aaaa, sandro ←

15:02:13 <Zakim> +??P7

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P7 ←

15:02:27 <sandro> RRSAgent, pointer?

Sandro Hawke: RRSAgent, pointer? ←

15:02:27 <RRSAgent> See http://www.w3.org/2011/06/03-prov-irc#T15-02-27

RRSAgent IRC Bot: See http://www.w3.org/2011/06/03-prov-irc#T15-02-27 ←

15:02:34 <YolandaGil> Zakim, this will be prov-wg

Unknown YolandaGil: Zakim, this will be prov-wg ←

15:02:34 <Zakim> I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, YolandaGil

Zakim IRC Bot: I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, YolandaGil ←

15:02:39 <dgarijo> Zakim, ??P7 is me

Daniel Garijo: Zakim, ??P7 is me ←

15:02:39 <Zakim> I already had ??P7 as ??P7, dgarijo

Zakim IRC Bot: I already had ??P7 as ??P7, dgarijo ←

15:02:44 <YolandaGil> Zakim, this will be prov

Unknown YolandaGil: Zakim, this will be prov ←

15:02:44 <Zakim> ok, YolandaGil, I see SW_(Prov WG)11:00AM already started

Zakim IRC Bot: ok, YolandaGil, I see SW_(Prov WG)11:00AM already started ←

15:03:16 <GK_> zakim, who is on the phone

Graham Klyne: zakim, who is on the phone ←

15:03:16 <Zakim> I don't understand 'who is on the phone', GK_

Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand 'who is on the phone', GK_ ←

15:03:25 <dgarijo> Zakim, ??P7 is dgarijo

Daniel Garijo: Zakim, ??P7 is dgarijo ←

15:03:25 <Zakim> +dgarijo; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +dgarijo; got it ←

15:03:28 <GK_> zakim, who is on the phone?

Graham Klyne: zakim, who is on the phone? ←

15:03:29 <Zakim> On the phone I see frew, [ISI], tlebo, ??P2, +31.62.417.aaaa, sandro, dgarijo, ??P9

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see frew, [ISI], tlebo, ??P2, +31.62.417.aaaa, sandro, dgarijo, ??P9 ←

15:03:40 <Zakim> -??P2

Zakim IRC Bot: -??P2 ←

15:03:41 <sandro> scribe: tlebo

(Scribe set to Timothy Lebo)

15:03:56 <Zakim> -??P9

Zakim IRC Bot: -??P9 ←

15:03:58 <Zakim> +??P2

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P2 ←

15:04:02 <sandro> zakim, who is on the call?

Sandro Hawke: zakim, who is on the call? ←

15:04:02 <Zakim> On the phone I see frew, [ISI], tlebo, +31.62.417.aaaa, sandro, dgarijo, ??P2

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see frew, [ISI], tlebo, +31.62.417.aaaa, sandro, dgarijo, ??P2 ←

15:04:04 <jorn> Zakim, ??P2 is me

Jörn Hees: Zakim, ??P2 is me ←

15:04:04 <Zakim> +jorn; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +jorn; got it ←

15:04:20 <Zakim> +??P11

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P11 ←

15:04:26 <Zakim> +Yogesh

Zakim IRC Bot: +Yogesh ←

15:04:33 <Zakim> -??P11

Zakim IRC Bot: -??P11 ←

15:04:34 <Zakim> +zednik

Zakim IRC Bot: +zednik ←

15:04:47 <dgarijo> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/prov/wiki/File:Provenance-XG-Overview.pdf

Daniel Garijo: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/prov/wiki/File:Provenance-XG-Overview.pdf ←

15:04:49 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]

Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller] ←

15:04:57 <jun> zakim, [IPcaller] is me

Jun Zhao: zakim, [IPcaller] is me ←

15:04:58 <Zakim> +jun; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +jun; got it ←

15:04:58 <GK_> Having trouble with conference passcode again

Graham Klyne: Having trouble with conference passcode again ←

15:05:02 <sandro> sandro has changed the topic to: Incubator Review Session, slides: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/prov/wiki/File:Provenance-XG-Overview.pdf

Sandro Hawke: sandro has changed the topic to: Incubator Review Session, slides: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/prov/wiki/File:Provenance-XG-Overview.pdf ←

15:05:07 <Zakim> +??P14

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P14 ←

15:05:25 <Zakim> +??P8

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P8 ←

15:05:36 <GK_> zakim, ??p8 is me

Graham Klyne: zakim, ??p8 is me ←

15:05:36 <Zakim> +GK_; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +GK_; got it ←

15:06:20 <tlebo> yolanda: notes the final report.

Scribe problem: the name 'yolanda' does not match any of the 47 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Carl Reed Christine Runnegar Daniel Schutzer Daniel Garijo David Hau David Corsar Deborah McGuinness Ed Summers Edoardo Pignotti Eric Stephan Graham Klyne Helena Deus Iker Huerga Ilkay Altintas Irini Fundulaki James Myers James Frew James Cheney Jean-Pierre EVAIN Jun Zhao Jörn Hees Kai Eckert Khalid Belhajjame Linda Stewart Luc Moreau Maria Theodoridou Martin Doerr Olaf Hartig Paolo Missier Paul Groth Paulo Pinheiro da Silva Sam Coppens Sandro Hawke Satya Sahoo Simon Miles Simon Dobson Stephan Zednik Stephen Cresswell Stian Soiland-Reyes Ted Thibodeau Timothy Lebo Vinh Nguyen Yogesh Simmhan david schaengold Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Unknown yolanda: notes the final report. ←

15:06:46 <dgarijo> the link to the final report: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/prov/XGR-prov-20101214/

Daniel Garijo: the link to the final report: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/prov/XGR-prov-20101214/ ←

15:07:20 <tlebo> topic: slide 3

1. slide 3

15:07:35 <Zakim> +??P22

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P22 ←

15:07:44 <jcheney> zakim, ??P22 is me

James Cheney: zakim, ??P22 is me ←

15:07:44 <Zakim> +jcheney; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +jcheney; got it ←

15:08:05 <tlebo> trust, what things are and what they mean, how it was collected. CLOSED SYSTEM - we know it all and trust it.

trust, what things are and what they mean, how it was collected. CLOSED SYSTEM - we know it all and trust it. ←

15:08:23 <GK_> Provenance: needed for operating in an open information system.  Make implicit expectations of closed system explicit.

Scribe problem: the name 'Provenance' does not match any of the 47 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Carl Reed Christine Runnegar Daniel Schutzer Daniel Garijo David Hau David Corsar Deborah McGuinness Ed Summers Edoardo Pignotti Eric Stephan Graham Klyne Helena Deus Iker Huerga Ilkay Altintas Irini Fundulaki James Myers James Frew James Cheney Jean-Pierre EVAIN Jun Zhao Jörn Hees Kai Eckert Khalid Belhajjame Linda Stewart Luc Moreau Maria Theodoridou Martin Doerr Olaf Hartig Paolo Missier Paul Groth Paulo Pinheiro da Silva Sam Coppens Sandro Hawke Satya Sahoo Simon Miles Simon Dobson Stephan Zednik Stephen Cresswell Stian Soiland-Reyes Ted Thibodeau Timothy Lebo Vinh Nguyen Yogesh Simmhan david schaengold Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Unknown Provenance: needed for operating in an open information system. Make implicit expectations of closed system explicit. [ Scribe Assist by Graham Klyne ] ←

15:08:24 <tlebo> contrast with OPEN SYSTEM - harder to use it because many contribute that you do not know.

contrast with OPEN SYSTEM - harder to use it because many contribute that you do not know. ←

15:08:45 <tlebo> consumer: how can I trust what I see?

Scribe problem: the name 'consumer' does not match any of the 47 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Carl Reed Christine Runnegar Daniel Schutzer Daniel Garijo David Hau David Corsar Deborah McGuinness Ed Summers Edoardo Pignotti Eric Stephan Graham Klyne Helena Deus Iker Huerga Ilkay Altintas Irini Fundulaki James Myers James Frew James Cheney Jean-Pierre EVAIN Jun Zhao Jörn Hees Kai Eckert Khalid Belhajjame Linda Stewart Luc Moreau Maria Theodoridou Martin Doerr Olaf Hartig Paolo Missier Paul Groth Paulo Pinheiro da Silva Sam Coppens Sandro Hawke Satya Sahoo Simon Miles Simon Dobson Stephan Zednik Stephen Cresswell Stian Soiland-Reyes Ted Thibodeau Timothy Lebo Vinh Nguyen Yogesh Simmhan david schaengold Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Unknown consumer: how can I trust what I see? ←

15:09:10 <GK_> (Slide 3)^

Graham Klyne: (Slide 3)^ ←

15:09:38 <tlebo> Yolanda listing examles of multiple sources from which we collect evidence. who created it, who is responsible, whom do I attribute?

Yolanda listing examles of multiple sources from which we collect evidence. who created it, who is responsible, whom do I attribute? ←

15:09:56 <Zakim> +??P24

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P24 ←

15:10:00 <tlebo> how old, who is managing repository? how can we veify these aspects?

how old, who is managing repository? how can we veify these aspects? ←

15:10:10 <tlebo> topic: slide 4

2. slide 4

15:10:45 <tlebo> in business - how do we ensure compliance with processes. e.g., outsourcing and getting results.

in business - how do we ensure compliance with processes. e.g., outsourcing and getting results. ←

15:11:18 <tlebo> in science - how are results obtained? papers can get retracted.

in science - how are results obtained? papers can get retracted. ←

15:11:33 <tlebo> in news -

in news - ←

15:11:37 <GK_> Wondering how much interaction is there between work on provenance and work on trust in open systems (e.g. trust conferences, etc.

Graham Klyne: Wondering how much interaction is there between work on provenance and work on trust in open systems (e.g. trust conferences, etc. ←

15:11:57 <tlebo> in law and IP - who owns or has released document with what permissions?

in law and IP - who owns or has released document with what permissions? ←

15:12:15 <tlebo> topic: slide 5

3. slide 5

15:12:44 <tlebo> TBL's oh yeah button quote 1997

TBL's oh yeah button quote 1997 ←

15:13:26 <tlebo> trust at the top of the layer cake.

trust at the top of the layer cake. ←

15:13:28 <tlebo> topic: slide 6

4. slide 6

15:13:59 <tlebo> provenance need quotes.

provenance need quotes. ←

15:14:16 <tlebo> topic: slide 7

5. slide 7

15:14:28 <tlebo> open government

open government ←

15:14:45 <Zakim> -frew

Zakim IRC Bot: -frew ←

15:15:09 <tlebo> John Sheridan UK National Archives data.gov.uk "Provenance is the number one issue that we face when publishing governmetn data in data.gov.uk"

John Sheridan UK National Archives data.gov.uk "Provenance is the number one issue that we face when publishing governmetn data in data.gov.uk" ←

15:15:28 <Zakim> +frew

Zakim IRC Bot: +frew ←

15:15:33 <tlebo> being able to qualify what the data means.

being able to qualify what the data means. ←

15:15:35 <tlebo> topic: slide 8

6. slide 8

15:15:52 <tlebo> provenance in science. not being able to reproduce results.

provenance in science. not being able to reproduce results. ←

15:16:25 <tlebo> research forensics - people that dissect publications failing to reproduce results. e.g. clinical trials being done are based on false results.

research forensics - people that dissect publications failing to reproduce results. e.g. clinical trials being done are based on false results. ←

15:17:22 <tlebo> e.g. Nobel prize winner's paper was retracted becuase couldn't be reproduced (not the prize paper)

e.g. Nobel prize winner's paper was retracted becuase couldn't be reproduced (not the prize paper) ←

15:17:59 <tlebo> some think "provenance is a no brainer; just do it :-)"

some think "provenance is a no brainer; just do it :-)" ←

15:18:13 <tlebo> topic: slide 9

7. slide 9

15:18:27 <tlebo> work done in incubator group

work done in incubator group ←

15:18:37 <tlebo> topic: slide 10

8. slide 10

15:18:38 <GK_> IMO, If we can't make it a (nearly) a no-brainer for developers, we'll struggle to make it happen

Graham Klyne: IMO, If we can't make it a (nearly) a no-brainer for developers, we'll struggle to make it happen ←

15:19:25 <tlebo> people don't know how to approach provenance.

people don't know how to approach provenance. ←

15:19:53 <tlebo> linked data community if facing the problem - querying the linked data and getting triples that don't make sense. what text extraction tools produced them?

linked data community if facing the problem - querying the linked data and getting triples that don't make sense. what text extraction tools produced them? ←

15:20:19 <tlebo> scattered terminology, confounded with "trust"

scattered terminology, confounded with "trust" ←

15:20:42 <GK_> Before "provenance", there was a fair amount of SemWeb interest in "Context"

Graham Klyne: Before "provenance", there was a fair amount of SemWeb interest in "Context" ←

15:20:50 <tlebo> increased interest in provenance: Luc claims 1/2 of provenance papers published in last two years.

increased interest in provenance: Luc claims 1/2 of provenance papers published in last two years. ←

15:20:53 <tlebo> topic: slide 11

9. slide 11

15:21:13 <tlebo> incubator group: state of art and develop road map

incubator group: state of art and develop road map ←

15:21:41 <tlebo> topic: slide 12

10. slide 12

15:22:06 <tlebo> topic: slide 13

11. slide 13

15:22:27 <tlebo> shared definition done at VERY END of group's work.

shared definition done at VERY END of group's work. ←

15:23:08 <tlebo> summarized 30 use cases by using 3 flagship scenarios

summarized 30 use cases by using 3 flagship scenarios ←

15:23:22 <tlebo> reviewed existing provenance vocabularies.

reviewed existing provenance vocabularies. ←

15:24:28 <tlebo> numbers (11/15) are dates

numbers (11/15) are dates ←

15:24:36 <tlebo> topic: slide 14

12. slide 14

15:24:46 <jorn> (month/day)

Jörn Hees: (month/day) ←

15:25:04 <tlebo> (slide assumes audience knows period of activity)

(slide assumes audience knows period of activity) ←

15:25:52 <GK_> I'd quite like to take this definition, and notes, into the WG work

Graham Klyne: I'd quite like to take this definition, and notes, into the WG work ←

15:26:31 <tlebo> provenance is the infrastructure that provides the BASIS to decide trust, verification, etc.

provenance is the infrastructure that provides the BASIS to decide trust, verification, etc. ←

15:27:01 <tlebo> trust algorithm operate over provenance records.

trust algorithm operate over provenance records. ←

15:27:40 <tlebo> provenance assertions of provenance assertions

provenance assertions of provenance assertions ←

15:28:02 <tlebo> infernece to handle incompleteness and errors.

inference to handle incompleteness and errors. ←

15:28:11 <tlebo> different accounts for same resource.

different accounts for same resource. ←

15:28:23 <jorn> s/infernece/inference/

15:28:39 <tlebo> topic: slide 16

13. slide 16

15:29:22 <tlebo> Three major dimensions to use to think about provenance.

Three major dimensions to use to think about provenance. ←

15:30:04 <tlebo> Dimention 1 - content = what are we representing?

Dimension 1 - content = what are we representing? ←

15:30:15 <tlebo> s/Dimention/Dimension/

15:31:45 <tlebo> (5 types of Dimension 1, Content: attribution, process, evolution and versioning, justification for decisions, and entailment)

(5 types of Dimension 1, Content: attribution, process, evolution and versioning, justification for decisions, and entailment) ←

15:31:54 <tlebo> Dimension 2 - Management

Dimension 2 - Management ←

15:32:40 <GK_> @tlebo, still talking to (1) content, I think

Graham Klyne: @tlebo, still talking to (1) content, I think ←

15:33:12 <tlebo> (4 types of Dimension 2, Management: publication, access, dissemintation control, scale)

(4 types of Dimension 2, Management: publication, access, dissemintation control, scale) ←

15:33:41 <tlebo> (@GK_ sorry, I confounded Data Access and Access)

(@GK_ sorry, I confounded Data Access and Access) ←

15:33:53 <Zakim> -??P14

Zakim IRC Bot: -??P14 ←

15:34:31 <tlebo> I know 2) Mangement - Access as "Discoverability and Accessibility"

I know 2) Mangement - Access as "Discoverability and Accessibility" ←

15:34:37 <Zakim> +??P14

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P14 ←

15:34:48 <paolo> zakim, ??P14 is me

Paolo Missier: zakim, ??P14 is me ←

15:34:48 <Zakim> +paolo; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +paolo; got it ←

15:34:50 <jorn> topic: slide 17

14. slide 17

15:35:18 <jorn> Zakim, who is noisy?

Jörn Hees: Zakim, who is noisy? ←

15:35:30 <Zakim> jorn, listening for 11 seconds I heard sound from the following: [ISI] (31%), jorn (26%), paolo (86%)

Zakim IRC Bot: jorn, listening for 11 seconds I heard sound from the following: [ISI] (31%), jorn (26%), paolo (86%) ←

15:35:46 <tlebo> Dimension 3 - Use includes (Understanding, interoperability, comparison, accountability, trust, imperfections, debugging)

Dimension 3 - Use includes (Understanding, interoperability, comparison, accountability, trust, imperfections, debugging) ←

15:35:49 <paolo> just muted myself, sorry

Paolo Missier: just muted myself, sorry ←

15:35:57 <tlebo> topic: slide 17

15. slide 17

15:36:58 <pgroth> zakim, who is on the phone?

Paul Groth: zakim, who is on the phone? ←

15:36:58 <Zakim> On the phone I see [ISI], tlebo, +31.62.417.aaaa, sandro, dgarijo, jorn, Yogesh, zednik, jun, GK_, jcheney, ??P24, frew, paolo

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see [ISI], tlebo, +31.62.417.aaaa, sandro, dgarijo, jorn, Yogesh, zednik, jun, GK_, jcheney, ??P24, frew, paolo ←

15:37:08 <tlebo> 3 Dimensions are a framework to think about provenance issues.

3 Dimensions are a framework to think about provenance issues. ←

15:37:11 <tlebo> topic: slide 19

16. slide 19

15:37:23 <pgroth> Zakim, +31.62.417.aaaa is me

Paul Groth: Zakim, +31.62.417.aaaa is me ←

15:37:23 <Zakim> +pgroth; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +pgroth; got it ←

15:37:23 <tlebo> 30 use cases from the community

30 use cases from the community ←

15:37:33 <GK_> I've wrestled with these 3 dimensions; still not completely sure, but seems to be (1) what does provenance consist of; (2) how make provenance available; (3) what can I do with provenance once I get it?

Graham Klyne: I've wrestled with these 3 dimensions; still not completely sure, but seems to be (1) what does provenance consist of; (2) how make provenance available; (3) what can I do with provenance once I get it? ←

15:38:02 <tlebo> spent a lot of time defining how to structure use cases.

spent a lot of time defining how to structure use cases. ←

15:38:05 <tlebo> topic: slide 21

17. slide 21

15:38:16 <tlebo> 3 flagship scenarios

3 flagship scenarios ←

15:38:20 <tlebo> topic: slide 22

18. slide 22

15:39:01 <tlebo> blogging news company needs to produce truthful and quality reports.

blogging news company needs to produce truthful and quality reports. ←

15:39:37 <tlebo> tweets of panda, NYTimes journalist - all different sources that the blogging news company can use.

tweets of panda, NYTimes journalist - all different sources that the blogging news company can use. ←

15:39:43 <jcheney> By the way Yolanda there are slides for the Disease Outbreak scenario at:  http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/prov/wiki/Analysis_of_Disease_Outbreak_Scenario

James Cheney: By the way Yolanda there are slides for the Disease Outbreak scenario at: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/prov/wiki/Analysis_of_Disease_Outbreak_Scenario ←

15:39:49 <tlebo> did the tweeter modify the image of the panda?

did the tweeter modify the image of the panda? ←

15:39:56 <jorn> "without getting sued" :)

Jörn Hees: "without getting sued" :) ←

15:40:50 <tlebo> manage heterogenous provenance records. how to present them, how to expose more details.

manage heterogenous provenance records. how to present them, how to expose more details. ←

15:40:53 <tlebo> topic: slide 25

19. slide 25

15:40:58 <tlebo> disease outbreak

disease outbreak ←

15:41:56 <tlebo> different communities analyzing the outbreak

different communities analyzing the outbreak ←

15:42:10 <tlebo> topic: slide 26

20. slide 26

15:42:24 <Zakim> +luc

Zakim IRC Bot: +luc ←

15:42:37 <tlebo> business scenario - how does a company show that they complied with a contract? letting the consumer run verification procedures.

business scenario - how does a company show that they complied with a contract? letting the consumer run verification procedures. ←

15:42:52 <tlebo> keeping some processes proprietary, but not breaking the verification.

keeping some processes proprietary, but not breaking the verification. ←

15:43:14 <tlebo> topic: slide 30

21. slide 30

15:43:20 <tlebo> start of art report

start of art report ←

15:43:40 <tlebo> topic: slide 31

22. slide 31

15:43:52 <tlebo> areas of research and application for provenance

areas of research and application for provenance ←

15:43:55 <tlebo> topic: slide 32

23. slide 32

15:43:58 <tlebo> Luc's survey

Luc's survey ←

15:44:57 <tlebo> (I organized the mappings at https://spreadsheets.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0ArTeDpS4-nUDdFBrQ3ZJMXROUHh4SmxRUVE5V0QwbVE&hl=en_US#gid=0)

(I organized the mappings at https://spreadsheets.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0ArTeDpS4-nUDdFBrQ3ZJMXROUHh4SmxRUVE5V0QwbVE&hl=en_US#gid=0) ←

15:45:40 <tlebo> yolanda enumerating the provenance vocabularies

yolanda enumerating the provenance vocabularies ←

15:46:33 <jorn> provenance surveys in literature: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/prov/wiki/Provenance_Survey

Jörn Hees: provenance surveys in literature: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/prov/wiki/Provenance_Survey ←

15:46:37 <tlebo> origina mappings that Yolanda mentioned: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/prov/wiki/Provenance_Vocabulary_Mappings#Mappings

origina mappings that Yolanda mentioned: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/prov/wiki/Provenance_Vocabulary_Mappings#Mappings ←

15:46:45 <tlebo> topic: slide 34

24. slide 34

15:47:15 <tlebo> short vs longer term recommendations for next steps.

short vs longer term recommendations for next steps. ←

15:47:33 <tlebo> reproducability should be longer term

reproducability should be longer term ←

15:48:19 <tlebo> topic: open to questions

25. open to questions

15:48:22 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q? ←

15:48:45 <Zakim> -jorn

Zakim IRC Bot: -jorn ←

15:48:56 <GK_> q+

Graham Klyne: q+ ←

15:48:58 <Zakim> +??P2

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P2 ←

15:49:06 <jorn> Zakim, ??p2 is me

Jörn Hees: Zakim, ??p2 is me ←

15:49:06 <Zakim> +jorn; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +jorn; got it ←

15:49:56 <tlebo> GK_: relationships to other work? Trust in open systems. Has provenance work interacted with work in trust in open systems and the Trust Conferences.

Graham Klyne: relationships to other work? Trust in open systems. Has provenance work interacted with work in trust in open systems and the Trust Conferences. ←

15:50:22 <tlebo> Yolanda: published survey of Trust in CS and semweb 3/4 years ago. on prov-xg wiki state of the art report.

Scribe problem: the name 'Yolanda' does not match any of the 47 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Carl Reed Christine Runnegar Daniel Schutzer Daniel Garijo David Hau David Corsar Deborah McGuinness Ed Summers Edoardo Pignotti Eric Stephan Graham Klyne Helena Deus Iker Huerga Ilkay Altintas Irini Fundulaki James Myers James Frew James Cheney Jean-Pierre EVAIN Jun Zhao Jörn Hees Kai Eckert Khalid Belhajjame Linda Stewart Luc Moreau Maria Theodoridou Martin Doerr Olaf Hartig Paolo Missier Paul Groth Paulo Pinheiro da Silva Sam Coppens Sandro Hawke Satya Sahoo Simon Miles Simon Dobson Stephan Zednik Stephen Cresswell Stian Soiland-Reyes Ted Thibodeau Timothy Lebo Vinh Nguyen Yogesh Simmhan david schaengold Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Unknown Yolanda: published survey of Trust in CS and semweb 3/4 years ago. on prov-xg wiki state of the art report. ←

15:50:30 <jorn> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/prov/wiki/Provenance_Survey

Jörn Hees: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/prov/wiki/Provenance_Survey ←

15:51:22 <tlebo> trust: can you trust a certain entity. Can I authenticate to give access. Develop algorithms that I trust you and you trust another (transfer of trust) PLENTY of work this.

Scribe problem: the name 'trust' does not match any of the 47 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Carl Reed Christine Runnegar Daniel Schutzer Daniel Garijo David Hau David Corsar Deborah McGuinness Ed Summers Edoardo Pignotti Eric Stephan Graham Klyne Helena Deus Iker Huerga Ilkay Altintas Irini Fundulaki James Myers James Frew James Cheney Jean-Pierre EVAIN Jun Zhao Jörn Hees Kai Eckert Khalid Belhajjame Linda Stewart Luc Moreau Maria Theodoridou Martin Doerr Olaf Hartig Paolo Missier Paul Groth Paulo Pinheiro da Silva Sam Coppens Sandro Hawke Satya Sahoo Simon Miles Simon Dobson Stephan Zednik Stephen Cresswell Stian Soiland-Reyes Ted Thibodeau Timothy Lebo Vinh Nguyen Yogesh Simmhan david schaengold Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Unknown trust: can you trust a certain entity. Can I authenticate to give access. Develop algorithms that I trust you and you trust another (transfer of trust) PLENTY of work this. ←

15:51:37 <tlebo> LESS work on "can I trust this content" (as opposed to "can I trust this entity"

LESS work on "can I trust this content" (as opposed to "can I trust this entity" ←

15:51:59 <tlebo> trust you on movie recommendation or using one road over another.

trust you on movie recommendation or using one road over another. ←

15:52:09 <tlebo> content-based trust research is quite narrow.

content-based trust research is quite narrow. ←

15:52:19 <tlebo> trusting agents vs. trusting content.

trusting agents vs. trusting content. ←

15:52:41 <Zakim> -frew

Zakim IRC Bot: -frew ←

15:53:21 <tlebo> Yolanda: many say doing provenance is easy, just make a schema and do it.

Unknown Yolanda: many say doing provenance is easy, just make a schema and do it. ←

15:53:42 <tlebo> but the content in the provenance record is one, but how do you access, manage, and use those records?

but the content in the provenance record is one, but how do you access, manage, and use those records? ←

15:53:51 <tlebo> it requires many considerations.

it requires many considerations. ←

15:54:13 <tlebo> need for standards - many systems that track provenance by themselves, but how can other systems get, read and use those records?

need for standards - many systems that track provenance by themselves, but how can other systems get, read and use those records? ←

15:54:18 <GK_> q+ to test understanding of dimensions

Graham Klyne: q+ to test understanding of dimensions ←

15:54:28 <tlebo> need provenance in an open system where you don't have full control.

need provenance in an open system where you don't have full control. ←

15:54:39 <pgroth> ack GK_

Paul Groth: ack GK_ ←

15:54:39 <Zakim> GK_, you wanted to test understanding of dimensions

Zakim IRC Bot: GK_, you wanted to test understanding of dimensions ←

15:55:07 <dgarijo> not only that, but provide guidelines for publishing provenance should be important too

Daniel Garijo: not only that, but provide guidelines for publishing provenance should be important too ←

15:55:41 <tlebo> GK_ how do 3 dimensions apply to doing a user requirements analysis? "what, how, and why" a fair reflection?

GK_ how do 3 dimensions apply to doing a user requirements analysis? "what, how, and why" a fair reflection? ←

15:55:44 <tlebo> yolanda: yes

Unknown yolanda: yes ←

15:56:28 <tlebo> q+ to ask about scientific applications.

q+ to ask about scientific applications. ←

15:57:15 <tlebo> tlebo: scientific apps? observation and measurements?

Timothy Lebo: scientific apps? observation and measurements? ←

15:57:35 <tlebo> yolanda: use case 2, but there are MANY sociological aspects within that scientific process.

Unknown yolanda: use case 2, but there are MANY sociological aspects within that scientific process. ←

15:58:41 <tlebo> tlebo: is there a nugget of observation and measurement within the disease outbreak flagship scenario?

Timothy Lebo: is there a nugget of observation and measurement within the disease outbreak flagship scenario? ←

15:58:43 <tlebo> yolanda: yes.

Unknown yolanda: yes. ←

15:58:58 <tlebo> pgroth: notion of objects

Paul Groth: notion of objects ←

15:59:25 <Luc> thanks Yolanda!

Luc Moreau: thanks Yolanda! ←

15:59:29 <jun> thank you very much Yolanda!

Jun Zhao: thank you very much Yolanda! ←

15:59:30 <tlebo> +1 for Yolanda being helpful!

+1 for Yolanda being helpful! ←

15:59:31 <pgroth> +1 thanks

Paul Groth: +1 thanks ←

15:59:32 <jorn> yupp, thanks a lot :)

Jörn Hees: yupp, thanks a lot :) ←

15:59:33 <GK_> Thank you Yolanda.

Graham Klyne: Thank you Yolanda. ←

15:59:37 <paolo> thank you once again, Yolanda!

Paolo Missier: thank you once again, Yolanda! ←

15:59:38 <dgarijo> thank Yolanda!

Daniel Garijo: thank Yolanda! ←

15:59:49 <dgarijo> *thanks

Daniel Garijo: *thanks ←

15:59:57 <Zakim> -Yogesh

Zakim IRC Bot: -Yogesh ←

16:00:01 <Zakim> -jcheney

Zakim IRC Bot: -jcheney ←

16:00:03 <Zakim> -jun

Zakim IRC Bot: -jun ←

16:00:03 <Zakim> -GK_

Zakim IRC Bot: -GK_ ←

16:00:04 <Zakim> -jorn

Zakim IRC Bot: -jorn ←

16:00:04 <Zakim> -paolo

Zakim IRC Bot: -paolo ←

16:00:04 <Zakim> -dgarijo

Zakim IRC Bot: -dgarijo ←

16:00:05 <Zakim> -luc

Zakim IRC Bot: -luc ←

16:00:09 <Zakim> -??P24

Zakim IRC Bot: -??P24 ←

16:00:16 <YolandaGil> rrsagent, set log public

Unknown YolandaGil: rrsagent, set log public ←

16:00:25 <YolandaGil> rrsagent, draft minutes

Unknown YolandaGil: rrsagent, draft minutes ←

16:00:25 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/06/03-prov-minutes.html YolandaGil

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/06/03-prov-minutes.html YolandaGil ←

16:01:27 <Zakim> -[ISI]

Zakim IRC Bot: -[ISI] ←

16:01:29 <Zakim> -tlebo

Zakim IRC Bot: -tlebo ←

16:01:31 <Zakim> -sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: -sandro ←

16:01:34 <Zakim> -pgroth

Zakim IRC Bot: -pgroth ←

16:01:49 <Zakim> -zednik

Zakim IRC Bot: -zednik ←

16:01:50 <Zakim> SW_(Prov WG)11:00AM has ended

Zakim IRC Bot: SW_(Prov WG)11:00AM has ended ←

16:01:52 <Zakim> Attendees were frew, [ISI], tlebo, sandro, dgarijo, jorn, Yogesh, zednik, jun, GK_, jcheney, paolo, pgroth, luc

Zakim IRC Bot: Attendees were frew, [ISI], tlebo, sandro, dgarijo, jorn, Yogesh, zednik, jun, GK_, jcheney, paolo, pgroth, luc ←

Formatted by CommonScribe