13:54:07 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2013/04/01-ldp-irc
RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2013/04/01-ldp-irc ←
13:54:09 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs public ←
13:54:11 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be LDP
Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be LDP ←
13:54:11 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see SW_LDP()10:00AM scheduled to start in 6 minutes
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, trackbot; I see SW_LDP()10:00AM scheduled to start in 6 minutes ←
13:54:12 <trackbot> Meeting: Linked Data Platform (LDP) Working Group Teleconference
13:54:12 <trackbot> Date: 01 April 2013
13:54:20 <Arnaud> Arnaud has changed the topic to: Linked Data Platform WG -- http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/ -- current agenda http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2013.04.01
Arnaud Le Hors: Arnaud has changed the topic to: Linked Data Platform WG -- http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/ -- current agenda http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2013.04.01 ←
13:58:52 <Zakim> SW_LDP()10:00AM has now started
Zakim IRC Bot: SW_LDP()10:00AM has now started ←
13:58:59 <Zakim> +OpenLink_Software
Zakim IRC Bot: +OpenLink_Software ←
13:59:05 <Zakim> +Sandro
Zakim IRC Bot: +Sandro ←
13:59:09 <TallTed> Zakim, OpenLink_Software is temporarily me
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, OpenLink_Software is temporarily me ←
13:59:09 <Zakim> +TallTed; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +TallTed; got it ←
13:59:11 <TallTed> Zakim, mute me
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, mute me ←
13:59:11 <Zakim> TallTed should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: TallTed should now be muted ←
13:59:56 <Zakim> +JohnArwe
Zakim IRC Bot: +JohnArwe ←
14:00:21 <Zakim> +??P4
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P4 ←
14:00:27 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller] ←
14:00:52 <cody> zakinm, IPCaller is Cody
Cody Burleson: zakinm, IPCaller is Cody ←
14:00:55 <Zakim> +Arnaud
Zakim IRC Bot: +Arnaud ←
14:01:01 <nmihindu> Zakim, ??P4 is nmihindu
Nandana Mihindukulasooriya: Zakim, ??P4 is nmihindu ←
14:01:01 <Zakim> +nmihindu; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +nmihindu; got it ←
14:01:19 <cody> Zakim, IPCaller is Cody
Cody Burleson: Zakim, IPCaller is Cody ←
14:01:19 <Zakim> +Cody; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Cody; got it ←
14:01:30 <Ashok> zakim, code?
Ashok Malhotra: zakim, code? ←
14:01:30 <Zakim> the conference code is 53794 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), Ashok
Zakim IRC Bot: the conference code is 53794 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), Ashok ←
14:02:05 <Zakim> +Ashok_Malhotra
Zakim IRC Bot: +Ashok_Malhotra ←
14:02:16 <TallTed> Zakim, who's here?
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, who's here? ←
14:02:16 <Zakim> On the phone I see TallTed (muted), Sandro, JohnArwe, nmihindu, Cody, Arnaud, Ashok_Malhotra
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see TallTed (muted), Sandro, JohnArwe, nmihindu, Cody, Arnaud, Ashok_Malhotra ←
14:02:18 <Zakim> On IRC I see rgarcia, Ashok, SteveS, cody, JohnArwe, nmihindu, Zakim, RRSAgent, TallTed, jmvanel, ericP, bblfish, Arnaud, davidwood, thschee, sandro, Yves, trackbot
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see rgarcia, Ashok, SteveS, cody, JohnArwe, nmihindu, Zakim, RRSAgent, TallTed, jmvanel, ericP, bblfish, Arnaud, davidwood, thschee, sandro, Yves, trackbot ←
14:02:31 <Zakim> +[IBM]
Zakim IRC Bot: +[IBM] ←
14:02:35 <JohnArwe> regrets: cygri, sergio, serena, pierre-antoine
14:02:41 <SteveS> zakim, [IBM] is me
Steve Speicher: zakim, [IBM] is me ←
14:02:41 <Zakim> +SteveS; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +SteveS; got it ←
14:03:22 <ericP> Zakim, please dial ericP-office
Eric Prud'hommeaux: Zakim, please dial ericP-office ←
14:03:22 <Zakim> ok, ericP; the call is being made
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, ericP; the call is being made ←
14:03:24 <Zakim> +EricP
Zakim IRC Bot: +EricP ←
14:03:37 <JohnArwe> scribe: JohnArwe
(Scribe set to John Arwe)
<JohnArwe> chair: Arnaud
14:04:06 <Zakim> +??P11
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P11 ←
14:04:17 <rgarcia> zakim, ??P11 is me
Raúl García Castro: zakim, ??P11 is me ←
14:04:17 <Zakim> +rgarcia; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +rgarcia; got it ←
14:05:18 <SteveS> I have not looked
Steve Speicher: I have not looked ←
14:05:18 <cody> +1
Cody Burleson: +1 ←
14:05:23 <nmihindu> +1
Nandana Mihindukulasooriya: +1 ←
<JohnArwe> Topic: Admin
<JohnArwe> subTopic: Minutes of March 25
14:05:46 <JohnArwe> RESOLVED: approve minutes of March 25
RESOLVED: approve minutes of March 25 ←
14:07:32 <JohnArwe> Arnaud: any holidays next week? no response.
Arnaud Le Hors: any holidays next week? no response. ←
14:08:10 <JohnArwe> http://www.timeanddate.com/holidays/ might be useful. only 1 listed for next Mon, appears to be Jewish holiday.
http://www.timeanddate.com/holidays/ might be useful. only 1 listed for next Mon, appears to be Jewish holiday. ←
<JohnArwe> subTopic: Actions & Issues
14:08:28 <JohnArwe> pending actions: none
pending actions: none ←
14:08:56 <JohnArwe> open actions completed: none
open actions completed: none ←
14:08:57 <Kalpa> zakim, who is on IRC?
Kalpa Gunaratna: zakim, who is on IRC? ←
14:08:57 <Zakim> I don't understand your question, Kalpa.
Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand your question, Kalpa. ←
14:09:05 <JohnArwe> zakim, who's on irc?
zakim, who's on irc? ←
14:09:05 <Zakim> I don't understand your question, JohnArwe.
Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand your question, JohnArwe. ←
14:09:15 <JohnArwe> zakim, who is on the call?
zakim, who is on the call? ←
14:09:15 <Zakim> On the phone I see TallTed (muted), Sandro, JohnArwe, nmihindu, Cody, Arnaud, Ashok_Malhotra, SteveS, EricP, rgarcia
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see TallTed (muted), Sandro, JohnArwe, nmihindu, Cody, Arnaud, Ashok_Malhotra, SteveS, EricP, rgarcia ←
14:09:26 <JohnArwe> zakim, who's here?
zakim, who's here? ←
14:09:26 <Zakim> On the phone I see TallTed (muted), Sandro, JohnArwe, nmihindu, Cody, Arnaud, Ashok_Malhotra, SteveS, EricP, rgarcia
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see TallTed (muted), Sandro, JohnArwe, nmihindu, Cody, Arnaud, Ashok_Malhotra, SteveS, EricP, rgarcia ←
14:09:28 <Zakim> On IRC I see Kalpa, rgarcia, Ashok, SteveS, cody, JohnArwe, nmihindu, Zakim, RRSAgent, TallTed, jmvanel, ericP, bblfish, Arnaud, davidwood, thschee, sandro, Yves, trackbot
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see Kalpa, rgarcia, Ashok, SteveS, cody, JohnArwe, nmihindu, Zakim, RRSAgent, TallTed, jmvanel, ericP, bblfish, Arnaud, davidwood, thschee, sandro, Yves, trackbot ←
14:10:26 <JohnArwe> Arnaud: please work on issues gating forward progress. Let's use concrete proposals to progress; the default would be whatever the originator proposes, but others are welcome.
Arnaud Le Hors: please work on issues gating forward progress. Let's use concrete proposals to progress; the default would be whatever the originator proposes, but others are welcome. ←
<JohnArwe> Topic: Open Issues
14:10:44 <JohnArwe> subTopic: Issue-53
14:10:54 <TallTed> Zakim, unmute me
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, unmute me ←
14:10:54 <Zakim> TallTed should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: TallTed should no longer be muted ←
14:10:57 <TallTed> q+
Ted Thibodeau: q+ ←
14:11:03 <SteveS> q+
Steve Speicher: q+ ←
14:11:12 <JohnArwe> issue-53?
14:11:12 <trackbot> ISSUE-53 -- Which Content Types should be returned to bots? -- open
Trackbot IRC Bot: ISSUE-53 -- Which Content Types should be returned to bots? -- open ←
14:11:12 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/53
Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/53 ←
14:11:27 <ericP> -1 to silent
Eric Prud'hommeaux: -1 to silent ←
14:11:34 <TallTed> q-
Ted Thibodeau: q- ←
14:11:39 <Arnaud> ack steves
Arnaud Le Hors: ack steves ←
14:11:40 <JohnArwe> Arnaud summarizes: bots will not necessarily find Turtle (our current default) useful
Arnaud summarizes: bots will not necessarily find Turtle (our current default) useful ←
14:11:58 <ericP> q+
Eric Prud'hommeaux: q+ ←
14:12:00 <JohnArwe> SteveS: prefer non-silence; perhaps relax MUST
Steve Speicher: prefer non-silence; perhaps relax MUST ←
14:12:05 <Arnaud> ack ericp
Arnaud Le Hors: ack ericp ←
14:12:34 <TallTed> q+
Ted Thibodeau: q+ ←
14:13:26 <TallTed> his concern seems to be "Google doesn't index Turtle (plain-text)" except that they do...
Ted Thibodeau: his concern seems to be "Google doesn't index Turtle (plain-text)" except that they do... ←
14:14:10 <Arnaud> ack tallted
Arnaud Le Hors: ack tallted ←
14:14:14 <JohnArwe> ericp: we're concerned with machine-machine, issue is to make that work with existing infrastructure. Would like to say: if no accept header/preference, unless you have reason to believe based on other info (like user-agent) that the requestor would not find turtle useful.
Eric Prud'hommeaux: we're concerned with machine-machine, issue is to make that work with existing infrastructure. Would like to say: if no accept header/preference, unless you have reason to believe based on other info (like user-agent) that the requestor would not find turtle useful. ←
14:14:36 <sandro> they will? or they do?
Sandro Hawke: they will? or they do? ←
14:14:44 <JohnArwe> tallted: crawlers WILL index turtle, so what's the problem?
Ted Thibodeau: crawlers WILL index turtle, so what's the problem? ←
14:16:47 <JohnArwe> arnaud summarizes 3 options: (1) if client has preference, require them to express it (stay MUST turtle), (2) leave door open (SHOULD turtle), (3) remove it entirely aka remain silent. Don't hear anyone clamoring for (3). Is that right?
arnaud summarizes 3 options: (1) if client has preference, require them to express it (stay MUST turtle), (2) leave door open (SHOULD turtle), (3) remove it entirely aka remain silent. Don't hear anyone clamoring for (3). Is that right? ←
14:17:25 <sandro> how about "SHOULD" with an explanation that there may be app-specific reasons to do something differnt
Sandro Hawke: how about "SHOULD" with an explanation that there may be app-specific reasons to do something differnt ←
14:18:49 <JohnArwe> discussion about "SHOULD in MUST's clothing"
discussion about "SHOULD in MUST's clothing" ←
14:19:44 <rgarcia> Google already indexes OWL and RDF files. E.g., https://www.google.es/search?q=%22the+person-related+classes+have+been+refactored%22&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:es-ES:official&client=firefox-a
Raúl García Castro: Google already indexes OWL and RDF files. E.g., https://www.google.es/search?q=%22the+person-related+classes+have+been+refactored%22&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:es-ES:official&client=firefox-a ←
14:21:34 <Arnaud> Proposed: close Issue-53 changing MUST to SHOULD, adding a note on why it may be ok to send something else than Turtle (e.g., client info)
PROPOSED: close ISSUE-53 changing MUST to SHOULD, adding a note on why it may be ok to send something else than Turtle (e.g., client info) ←
14:22:16 <SteveS> +1
Steve Speicher: +1 ←
14:22:18 <TallTed> +1
Ted Thibodeau: +1 ←
14:22:19 <ericP> +1
Eric Prud'hommeaux: +1 ←
14:22:24 <cody> +1
Cody Burleson: +1 ←
14:22:24 <Ashok> +1
Ashok Malhotra: +1 ←
14:22:29 <rgarcia> +0.5
Raúl García Castro: +0.5 ←
14:22:30 <JohnArwe> +1
+1 ←
14:22:33 <nmihindu> +1
Nandana Mihindukulasooriya: +1 ←
14:22:35 <Kalpa> +1
Kalpa Gunaratna: +1 ←
14:22:56 <JohnArwe> RESOLVED: close Issue-53 changing MUST to SHOULD, adding a note on why it may be ok to send something other than Turtle (e.g., client info)
RESOLVED: close ISSUE-53 changing MUST to SHOULD, adding a note on why it may be ok to send something other than Turtle (e.g., client info) ←
14:23:08 <cody> Maybe he just means that he wants to present something that is actually useful to index (in the case of search results); such as a human-readable representation of a resource.
Cody Burleson: Maybe he just means that he wants to present something that is actually useful to index (in the case of search results); such as a human-readable representation of a resource. ←
14:23:32 <JohnArwe> subTOPIC: Issue-54
14:23:36 <JohnArwe> issue-54?
14:23:36 <trackbot> ISSUE-54 -- Which URIs should replace null relative URIs provided in LDPR representations? -- open
Trackbot IRC Bot: ISSUE-54 -- Which URIs should replace null relative URIs provided in LDPR representations? -- open ←
14:23:36 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/54
Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/54 ←
14:24:20 <TallTed> q+
Ted Thibodeau: q+ ←
14:24:56 <Arnaud> ack tallted
Arnaud Le Hors: ack tallted ←
14:25:33 <SteveS> q+
Steve Speicher: q+ ←
14:25:42 <JohnArwe> tallted: if server is just storing the content as a text file, should not resolve.
Ted Thibodeau: if server is just storing the content as a text file, should not resolve. ←
14:26:06 <Arnaud> ack steve
Arnaud Le Hors: ack steve ←
14:26:20 <JohnArwe> ...trouble with having base directives available means Created resource not always right base URI for what's inside them.
...trouble with having base directives available means Created resource not always right base URI for what's inside them. ←
14:27:34 <JohnArwe> SteveS: server mints URI, stores content, impl is allowed to keep them separate (store the content as text) and then serve it up as it needs to... e.g. if serving RDF, then resolve the URIs according to this rule.
Steve Speicher: server mints URI, stores content, impl is allowed to keep them separate (store the content as text) and then serve it up as it needs to... e.g. if serving RDF, then resolve the URIs according to this rule. ←
14:28:08 <JohnArwe> Arnaud: Tallted, are you worried about how it's stored or something else? If how stored, impl problem no?
Arnaud Le Hors: Tallted, are you worried about how it's stored or something else? If how stored, impl problem no? ←
14:28:54 <JohnArwe> TallTed: what spec says now is that incoming Turtle with relative URIs MUST be adjusted prior to storage. No longer have the SIMPLE LDP server we've been talking about.
Ted Thibodeau: what spec says now is that incoming Turtle with relative URIs MUST be adjusted prior to storage. No longer have the SIMPLE LDP server we've been talking about. ←
14:29:43 <ericP> i propose something like s/must resolve/must be interpreted as.../
Eric Prud'hommeaux: i propose something like s/must resolve/must be interpreted as.../ ←
14:29:49 <JohnArwe> Arnaud: had not read it that way... as you're reading it, would agree we do not want to impose that on servers.
Arnaud Le Hors: had not read it that way... as you're reading it, would agree we do not want to impose that on servers. ←
14:30:30 <JohnArwe> TallTed: to me this means clients cannot use base URIs in a number of scenarios where they'd otherwise make perfect sense
Ted Thibodeau: to me this means clients cannot use base URIs in a number of scenarios where they'd otherwise make perfect sense ←
14:31:15 <JohnArwe> ericp: usually say "is" rather than "must be interpreted" etc to sidestep this kind of problem. "is" talks about behavior.
Eric Prud'hommeaux: usually say "is" rather than "must be interpreted" etc to sidestep this kind of problem. "is" talks about behavior. ←
14:32:08 <SteveS> +1 to ericP's description of using "is" base uri
Steve Speicher: +1 to ericP's description of using "is" base uri ←
14:32:21 <JohnArwe> Arnaud: Ted, do we agree that the newly minted URI is the base URI of the newly created resource? yes.
Arnaud Le Hors: Ted, do we agree that the newly minted URI is the base URI of the newly created resource? yes. ←
14:32:40 <JohnArwe> TallTed: need to see revised wording to know if I'm ok with that.
Ted Thibodeau: need to see revised wording to know if I'm ok with that. ←
14:32:50 <Arnaud> james proposal: A LDPC receiving a POST of an RDF document D MUST resolve all relative URIs in D using the URI of the created resource.
Arnaud Le Hors: james proposal: A LDPC receiving a POST of an RDF document D MUST resolve all relative URIs in D using the URI of the created resource. ←
14:32:52 <TallTed> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/54
Ted Thibodeau: http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/54 ←
14:33:13 <cody> 5.4.8 In RDF representations, LDPC servers MUST interpret the null relative URI for the subject of triples in the LDPR representation in the request entity body as referring to the entity in the request body. Commonly, that entity is the model for the “to be created” LDPR, so triples whose subject is the null relative URI will usually result in triples in the created resource whose subject is the created resource.
Cody Burleson: 5.4.8 In RDF representations, LDPC servers MUST interpret the null relative URI for the subject of triples in the LDPR representation in the request entity body as referring to the entity in the request body. Commonly, that entity is the model for the “to be created” LDPR, so triples whose subject is the null relative URI will usually result in triples in the created resource whose subject is the created resource. ←
14:33:13 <cody> ISSUE-20
14:33:13 <trackbot> ISSUE-20 -- Identifying and naming POSTed resources -- closed
Trackbot IRC Bot: ISSUE-20 -- Identifying and naming POSTed resources -- closed ←
14:33:13 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/20
Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/20 ←
14:33:28 <ericP> -> http://www.w3.org/TR/2013/WD-ldp-20130307/#ldpc-5_4_8 text in question
Eric Prud'hommeaux: -> http://www.w3.org/TR/2013/WD-ldp-20130307/#ldpc-5_4_8 text in question ←
14:33:48 <Arnaud> A LDPC receiving a POST of an RDF document D MUST interpret all relative URIs in D using the URI of the created resource as the base.
Arnaud Le Hors: A LDPC receiving a POST of an RDF document D MUST interpret all relative URIs in D using the URI of the created resource as the base. ←
14:34:02 <ericP> s/LDPC servers MUST interpret the null relative URI for the subject of triples in the LDPR representation in the request entity body as referring to the entity in the request body
Eric Prud'hommeaux: s/LDPC servers MUST interpret the null relative URI for the subject of triples in the LDPR representation in the request entity body as referring to the entity in the request body ←
14:34:53 <ericP> /the base IRI per RFC3986 ladder diagram is IRI of the created resource
Eric Prud'hommeaux: /the base IRI per RFC3986 ladder diagram is IRI of the created resource ←
14:36:47 <ericP> 5.4.8 In RDF representations, the base URI for RFC3987 relative URI resolution is the IRI of the created resource.
Eric Prud'hommeaux: 5.4.8 In RDF representations, the base URI for RFC3987 relative URI resolution is the IRI of the created resource. ←
14:37:31 <sandro> q?
Sandro Hawke: q? ←
14:38:24 <Arnaud> proposed: close issue-54, adding to sectino 5.4.8: In RDF representations, the base URI for RFC3987 relative URI resolution is the IRI of the created resource.
PROPOSED: close ISSUE-54, adding to sectino 5.4.8: In RDF representations, the base URI for RFC3987 relative URI resolution is the IRI of the created resource. ←
14:38:29 <ericP> +1
Eric Prud'hommeaux: +1 ←
14:39:04 <sandro> q+ to ask about the RDF Model
Sandro Hawke: q+ to ask about the RDF Model ←
14:39:14 <sandro> issue-54?
14:39:14 <trackbot> ISSUE-54 -- Which URIs should replace null relative URIs provided in LDPR representations? -- open
Trackbot IRC Bot: ISSUE-54 -- Which URIs should replace null relative URIs provided in LDPR representations? -- open ←
14:39:14 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/54
Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/54 ←
14:40:02 <sandro> q-
Sandro Hawke: q- ←
14:40:03 <ericP> PROPOSED: close ISSUE-54 changing the first sentence of 5.4.8 to "In RDF representations, the base URI for RFC3987 relative URI resolution is the IRI of the created resource."
PROPOSED: close ISSUE-54 changing the first sentence of 5.4.8 to "In RDF representations, the base URI for RFC3987 relative URI resolution is the IRI of the created resource." ←
14:40:31 <JohnArwe> I think in both cases the second sentence simply describes a consequence of the first. It adds no new normative requirements that I can see.
I think in both cases the second sentence simply describes a consequence of the first. It adds no new normative requirements that I can see. ←
14:43:14 <sandro> +1
Sandro Hawke: +1 ←
14:43:25 <ericP> +1
Eric Prud'hommeaux: +1 ←
14:43:31 <SteveS> +1
Steve Speicher: +1 ←
14:43:32 <TallTed> +1
Ted Thibodeau: +1 ←
14:43:34 <bblfish> That's what I proposed right?
Henry Story: That's what I proposed right? ←
14:43:40 <rgarcia> +1
Raúl García Castro: +1 ←
14:43:47 <sandro> (modulo IRI vs URI)
Sandro Hawke: (modulo IRI vs URI) ←
14:43:50 <bblfish> ( sorry am in a teleconf )
Henry Story: ( sorry am in a teleconf ) ←
14:43:56 <nmihindu> +1
Nandana Mihindukulasooriya: +1 ←
14:44:03 <sandro> No, bblfish, it gets rid of a MUST we didnt like.
Sandro Hawke: No, bblfish, it gets rid of a MUST we didnt like. ←
14:44:43 <bblfish> ah ok. sounds ok still
Henry Story: ah ok. sounds ok still ←
14:44:47 <JohnArwe> some discussion as to equivalence between Henry's proposal and eric's
some discussion as to equivalence between Henry's proposal and eric's ←
14:44:55 <JohnArwe> +1
+1 ←
14:44:58 <cody> +0.5 (could use some additional word-smithing in my opinion)
Cody Burleson: +0.5 (could use some additional word-smithing in my opinion) ←
14:45:02 <ericP> bblfish, it changes the "MUST resolve" language to "the base URI *is* "
Eric Prud'hommeaux: bblfish, it changes the "MUST resolve" language to "the base URI *is* " ←
14:45:23 <bblfish> +1 seems ok to me.
Henry Story: +1 seems ok to me. ←
14:45:28 <sandro> Arnaud: We're leaving it to the editors to fine-tune the wording. This is only about intent.
Arnaud Le Hors: We're leaving it to the editors to fine-tune the wording. This is only about intent. [ Scribe Assist by Sandro Hawke ] ←
14:45:33 <Arnaud> Resolved: close ISSUE-54 changing the first sentence of 5.4.8 to "In RDF representations, the base URI for RFC3987 relative URI resolution is the IRI of the created resource."
RESOLVED: close ISSUE-54 changing the first sentence of 5.4.8 to "In RDF representations, the base URI for RFC3987 relative URI resolution is the IRI of the created resource." ←
14:45:34 <cody> +1
Cody Burleson: +1 ←
14:46:03 <sandro> issue-55?
14:46:03 <trackbot> ISSUE-55 -- Hypermedia as the Engine of Application State (HATEOAS) Compliance -- open
Trackbot IRC Bot: ISSUE-55 -- Hypermedia as the Engine of Application State (HATEOAS) Compliance -- open ←
14:46:03 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/55
Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/55 ←
14:46:09 <JohnArwe> subtopic: issue-55
14:46:25 <JohnArwe> Chair, Chair's voice, WG members waffle
Chair, Chair's voice, WG members waffle ←
14:49:36 <JohnArwe> Arnaud: one advantage of current approach is that it's more under client control. have discussed this issue with erik previously as well, several possible approaches could be used.
Arnaud Le Hors: one advantage of current approach is that it's more under client control. have discussed this issue with erik previously as well, several possible approaches could be used. ←
14:49:55 <Arnaud> q?
Arnaud Le Hors: q? ←
14:50:36 <JohnArwe> SteveS: related but tangled. you'd always get non-member properties in the first page?
Steve Speicher: related but tangled. you'd always get non-member properties in the first page? ←
14:51:00 <JohnArwe> Arnaud: yes. could use link headers (erik did not think that was commonly done)
Arnaud Le Hors: yes. could use link headers (erik did not think that was commonly done) ←
14:51:25 <JohnArwe> SteveS: one argument for exposing URI templates ... not sure how that would work, some sort of home document
Steve Speicher: one argument was for exposing URI templates ... not sure how that would work, some sort of home document ←
14:51:33 <JohnArwe> s/for/was for/
14:52:07 <JohnArwe> Arnaud: either we give up on feature altogether, or get off of specific URLs
Arnaud Le Hors: either we give up on feature altogether, or get off of specific URLs ←
14:52:43 <JohnArwe> Arnaud: this seems to need more time, perhaps move on to 58
Arnaud Le Hors: this seems to need more time, perhaps move on to 58 ←
14:54:17 <JohnArwe> SteveS: does the binary resource resolution from the F2F influence our thinking here? about how to advertise it, instead of using a fixed string.
Steve Speicher: does the binary resource resolution from the F2F influence our thinking here? about how to advertise it, instead of using a fixed string. ←
14:54:52 <JohnArwe> subtopic: issue-58
14:55:03 <JohnArwe> zakim, who is making noise?
zakim, who is making noise? ←
14:55:14 <Zakim> JohnArwe, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: TallTed (31%), Arnaud (15%), rgarcia (26%)
Zakim IRC Bot: JohnArwe, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: TallTed (31%), Arnaud (15%), rgarcia (26%) ←
14:55:30 <rgarcia> zakim,mute me
Raúl García Castro: zakim,mute me ←
14:55:30 <Zakim> rgarcia should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: rgarcia should now be muted ←
14:56:36 <SteveS> q+
Steve Speicher: q+ ←
14:56:58 <Arnaud> ack steve
Arnaud Le Hors: ack steve ←
14:57:05 <Ashok> q+
Ashok Malhotra: q+ ←
14:57:49 <JohnArwe> SteveS: no problem with it; one option is using existing predicate instead, i.e. say nextpage=nil.
Steve Speicher: no problem with it; one option is using existing predicate instead, i.e. say nextpage=nil. ←
14:57:53 <Arnaud> ack ashok
Arnaud Le Hors: ack ashok ←
14:58:29 <JohnArwe> I don't think we can safely overload nextpage=nil. that only works of the response is not paged.
I don't think we can safely overload nextpage=nil. that only works if the response is not paged. ←
14:58:37 <JohnArwe> s/of the/if the/
14:58:50 <cody> q+
Cody Burleson: q+ ←
14:58:56 <Arnaud> ack cody
Arnaud Le Hors: ack cody ←
14:59:35 <JohnArwe> counter-example: I serve a 2-page response with 10% of the member triples in-lined. The client sees nextpage=nil on final page, should it interpret that as "all member triples inlined"? clearly not.
counter-example: I serve a 2-page response with 10% of the member triples in-lined. The client sees nextpage=nil on final page, should it interpret that as "all member triples inlined"? clearly not. ←
15:01:01 <JohnArwe> TallTed: would need a nextpage triple about each subject; some members might be nil and others not-nil
Ted Thibodeau: would need a nextpage triple about each subject; some members might be nil and others not-nil ←
15:02:05 <JohnArwe> Arnaud: back to cygri's proposal. We can always change the name later if we want to.
Arnaud Le Hors: back to cygri's proposal. We can always change the name later if we want to. ←
15:02:25 <JohnArwe> Scribe notes that mtg is running over.
Scribe notes that mtg is running over. ←
15:02:34 <Arnaud> Proposed: close issue-58, Adding a property (e.g, ldp:membersInlined) true/false. The default (if not specified) is false. If true, it means that a complete description of all members [on the current page] are inlined with the container document [or page], and therefore clients SHOULD NOT do GET on the member URIs to retrieve additional triples.
PROPOSED: close ISSUE-58, Adding a property (e.g, ldp:membersInlined) true/false. The default (if not specified) is false. If true, it means that a complete description of all members [on the current page] are inlined with the container document [or page], and therefore clients SHOULD NOT do GET on the member URIs to retrieve additional triples. ←
15:03:11 <SteveS> +1 agree that membersInlined is not an ideal name
Steve Speicher: +1 agree that membersInlined is not an ideal name ←
15:03:23 <JohnArwe> above is cygri's proposal; editors allowed to change the predicate name
above is cygri's proposal; editors allowed to change the predicate name ←
15:03:25 <Arnaud> Proposed: close issue-58, Adding a property (e.g, ldp:membersInlined) true/false. The default (if not specified) is false. If true, it means that a complete description of all members [on the current page] are inlined with the container document [or page], and therefore clients SHOULD NOT do GET on the member URIs to retrieve additional triples.
PROPOSED: close ISSUE-58, Adding a property (e.g, ldp:membersInlined) true/false. The default (if not specified) is false. If true, it means that a complete description of all members [on the current page] are inlined with the container document [or page], and therefore clients SHOULD NOT do GET on the member URIs to retrieve additional triples. ←
15:04:09 <rgarcia> +1 (I would prefer replacing "SHOULD NOT do" with "don to need to do GET")
Raúl García Castro: +1 (I would prefer replacing "SHOULD NOT do" with "do not need to do GET") ←
15:04:22 <JohnArwe> +0.5 (fine with first part, the SHOULD NOT consequence is an example to me)
+0.5 (fine with first part, the SHOULD NOT consequence is an example to me) ←
15:04:26 <Zakim> -Ashok_Malhotra
Zakim IRC Bot: -Ashok_Malhotra ←
15:04:32 <JohnArwe> abandoning poll until next week.
abandoning poll until next week. ←
15:04:38 <TallTed> +1 rgarcia
Ted Thibodeau: +1 rgarcia ←
15:04:45 <Zakim> -SteveS
Zakim IRC Bot: -SteveS ←
15:04:46 <Zakim> -EricP
Zakim IRC Bot: -EricP ←
15:04:46 <Zakim> -nmihindu
Zakim IRC Bot: -nmihindu ←
15:04:48 <Zakim> -TallTed
Zakim IRC Bot: -TallTed ←
15:04:49 <Arnaud> Meeting Adjourned
Arnaud Le Hors: Meeting Adjourned ←
15:04:51 <Zakim> -Sandro
Zakim IRC Bot: -Sandro ←
15:04:54 <rgarcia> s/don to/do not/
15:04:55 <Zakim> -Arnaud
Zakim IRC Bot: -Arnaud ←
15:04:57 <Zakim> -Cody
Zakim IRC Bot: -Cody ←
15:05:00 <Zakim> -JohnArwe
Zakim IRC Bot: -JohnArwe ←
15:05:09 <Zakim> -rgarcia
Zakim IRC Bot: -rgarcia ←
15:05:10 <Zakim> SW_LDP()10:00AM has ended
Zakim IRC Bot: SW_LDP()10:00AM has ended ←
15:05:10 <Zakim> Attendees were Sandro, TallTed, JohnArwe, Arnaud, nmihindu, Cody, Ashok_Malhotra, SteveS, EricP, rgarcia
Zakim IRC Bot: Attendees were Sandro, TallTed, JohnArwe, Arnaud, nmihindu, Cody, Ashok_Malhotra, SteveS, EricP, rgarcia ←
<JohnArwe> present: Sandro, TallTed, JohnArwe, Arnaud, nmihindu, Cody, Ashok_Malhotra, SteveS, EricP, rgarcia, kalpa
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