edit

Data on the Web Best Practices Working Group Teleconference

Minutes of 02 October 2014

Seen
Bernadette Farias Loscio, Eric Stephan, Hadley Beeman, Jeremy Debattista, Makx Dekkers, Mark Harrison, Phil Archer
Scribe
Jeremy Debattista
IRC Log
Original
Resolutions

None.

Topics
16:02:33 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-dwbp-irc

RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-dwbp-irc

16:02:35 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs 351

Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs 351

16:02:37 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be DWBP

Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be DWBP

16:02:37 <Zakim> ok, trackbot, I see DATA_DWBP()12:00PM already started

Zakim IRC Bot: ok, trackbot, I see DATA_DWBP()12:00PM already started

16:02:38 <trackbot> Meeting: Data on the Web Best Practices Working Group Teleconference
16:02:38 <trackbot> Date: 02 October 2014
16:02:40 <Zakim> -??P20

Zakim IRC Bot: -??P20

16:03:27 <ericstephan> Are you able to hear me on the phone?

Eric Stephan: Are you able to hear me on the phone?

16:03:44 <ericstephan> I thought I heard someone join, but then again... :-)

Eric Stephan: I thought I heard someone join, but then again... :-)

16:03:56 <hadleybeeman> I'm afraid I'm not on the phone.  Do you need me to dial in?  I'm only here for a few mins... but I can call, if you like.

Hadley Beeman: I'm afraid I'm not on the phone. Do you need me to dial in? I'm only here for a few mins... but I can call, if you like.

16:04:27 <ericstephan> No its fine, I just didn't know :-)

Eric Stephan: No its fine, I just didn't know :-)

16:05:09 <hadleybeeman> Okay.  Nice agenda, by the way!

Hadley Beeman: Okay. Nice agenda, by the way!

16:05:28 <hadleybeeman> I went to prepare the agenda for tomorrow and put in the wrong date... I was very confused to see that it was already done. :)

Hadley Beeman: I went to prepare the agenda for tomorrow and put in the wrong date... I was very confused to see that it was already done. :)

16:05:55 <ericstephan> Thank you, yes Phil has taught me well.

Eric Stephan: Thank you, yes Phil has taught me well.

16:06:28 <ericstephan> I think everyone else is on IRC

Eric Stephan: I think everyone else is on IRC

16:06:48 <Zakim> + +3567922aaaa

Zakim IRC Bot: + +3567922aaaa

16:06:48 <Zakim> + +44.796.910.aabb

Zakim IRC Bot: + +44.796.910.aabb

16:07:34 <markharrison> zakim, who is on the phone?

Mark Harrison: zakim, who is on the phone?

16:07:34 <Zakim> On the phone I see ericstephan, +3567922aaaa, +44.796.910.aabb

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see ericstephan, +3567922aaaa, +44.796.910.aabb

16:08:01 <jerdeb> Zakim +356 is me

Jeremy Debattista: Zakim +356 is me

16:08:04 <markharrison> zakim, aabb is markharrison

Mark Harrison: zakim, aabb is markharrison

16:08:04 <Zakim> +markharrison; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +markharrison; got it

16:08:09 <hadleybeeman> zakim, aaaa is jerdeb

Hadley Beeman: zakim, aaaa is jerdeb

16:08:10 <Zakim> +jerdeb; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +jerdeb; got it

16:10:05 <ericstephan> Hmmm the agenda was here....https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/__wiki/Meetings:Telecon20141002 I thought...

Eric Stephan: Hmmm the agenda was here....https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/__wiki/Meetings:Telecon20141002 I thought...

16:10:32 <jerdeb> there is an agenda here: https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon20141002

Jeremy Debattista: there is an agenda here: https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon20141002

16:10:59 <ericstephan> Ah perfect!

Eric Stephan: Ah perfect!

16:11:16 <hadleybeeman> hadleybeeman has changed the topic to: Vocabs agenda: https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon20141002

Hadley Beeman: hadleybeeman has changed the topic to: Vocabs agenda: https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon20141002

16:12:06 <jerdeb> scribe: jerdeb

(Scribe set to Jeremy Debattista)

16:12:33 <ericstephan> scribenick: jerdeb
16:12:50 <markharrison> zakim, scribenick is jerdeb

Mark Harrison: zakim, scribenick is jerdeb

16:12:50 <Zakim> sorry, markharrison, I do not recognize a party named 'scribenick'

Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, markharrison, I do not recognize a party named 'scribenick'

16:13:06 <ericstephan> ScribeNick: jerdeb
16:13:21 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]

Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller]

16:13:31 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, ipcaller is BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, ipcaller is BernadetteLoscio

16:13:31 <Zakim> +BernadetteLoscio; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +BernadetteLoscio; got it

16:14:09 <BernadetteLoscio> i cant hear

Bernadette Farias Loscio: i cant hear

16:14:10 <ericstephan> zakim, who is noisy?

Eric Stephan: zakim, who is noisy?

16:14:17 <markharrison> zakim, who is speaking?

Mark Harrison: zakim, who is speaking?

16:14:21 <Zakim> ericstephan, listening for 10 seconds I could not identify any sounds

Zakim IRC Bot: ericstephan, listening for 10 seconds I could not identify any sounds

16:14:24 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

16:14:24 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

16:14:32 <Zakim> markharrison, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: markharrison (4%), ericstephan (10%)

Zakim IRC Bot: markharrison, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: markharrison (4%), ericstephan (10%)

16:17:00 <ericstephan> phila will you be able to join by phone?

Eric Stephan: phila will you be able to join by phone?

16:17:52 <ericstephan> TOPIC:  Review the UCR and see just what requirements are in there and think about how we're going to address them.

1. Review the UCR and see just what requirements are in there and think about how we're going to address them.

16:18:44 <jerdeb> ericstephan: generally how we are going to address them by vocabularies... discussing with bernadette what are the missing requirements

Eric Stephan: generally how we are going to address them by vocabularies... discussing with bernadette what are the missing requirements

16:18:55 <ericstephan> http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/usecasesv1.html

Eric Stephan: http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/usecasesv1.html

16:19:15 <Zakim> -markharrison

Zakim IRC Bot: -markharrison

16:19:39 <markharrison> lost audio connection - will try to rejoin

Mark Harrison: lost audio connection - will try to rejoin

16:20:15 <jerdeb> ericstephan: document on github (http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/usecasesv1.html) requirements - what kind of requirements do we need to propose?

Eric Stephan: document on github (http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/usecasesv1.html) requirements - what kind of requirements do we need to propose?

16:21:03 <Zakim> + +44.122.352.aacc

Zakim IRC Bot: + +44.122.352.aacc

16:21:21 <markharrison> zakim, aacc is markharrison

Mark Harrison: zakim, aacc is markharrison

16:21:21 <Zakim> +markharrison; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +markharrison; got it

16:22:06 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

16:22:06 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

16:22:21 <jerdeb> ericstephan: discussions we had in terms of the data usage vocab might have some synergies with the data quality and granularity vocab

Eric Stephan: discussions we had in terms of the data usage vocab might have some synergies with the data quality and granularity vocab

16:23:27 <jerdeb> Bernadette: requirements in usecase document are general.. they should be more specific..

Bernadette Farias Loscio: requirements in usecase document are general.. they should be more specific..

16:24:28 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]

Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller]

16:24:33 <phila> zakim, ipcaller is me

Phil Archer: zakim, ipcaller is me

16:24:33 <Zakim> +phila; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +phila; got it

16:24:40 <jerdeb> ericstephan: one of the more interesting things is that from certain use cases you cannot derive direct(?) information about data usage

Eric Stephan: one of the more interesting things is that from certain use cases you cannot derive direct(?) information about data usage

16:25:50 <phila> Looks Om to me

Phil Archer: Looks Om to me

16:26:10 <phila> http://philarcher1.github.io/dwbp-1/usecasesv1.html#UC-BuildingEye

Phil Archer: http://philarcher1.github.io/dwbp-1/usecasesv1.html#UC-BuildingEye

16:27:30 <jerdeb> ericstephan: the building eye use case has multiple perspectives: 1) vision of what open data can do

Eric Stephan: the building eye use case has multiple perspectives: 1) vision of what open data can do

16:28:14 <jerdeb> phila: reading individual use cases, it is true that you can pull a lot of different things and can be interpreted in different ways

Phil Archer: reading individual use cases, it is true that you can pull a lot of different things and can be interpreted in different ways

16:29:19 <jerdeb> phila: depends on the level of detail one wants to go in each use case to derive requirements

Phil Archer: depends on the level of detail one wants to go in each use case to derive requirements

16:29:23 <ericstephan> For example:  R-DataUnavailabilityReference: Some open data is related to data intentionally closed, taken offline, but the citation of the closed data source is important to data users as well as its designation as closed.

Eric Stephan: For example: R-DataUnavailabilityReference: Some open data is related to data intentionally closed, taken offline, but the citation of the closed data source is important to data users as well as its designation as closed.

16:31:27 <jerdeb> ericstephan: do we have enough requirements atm for data usage?

Eric Stephan: do we have enough requirements atm for data usage?

16:31:57 <jerdeb> phila: we have enough, but maybe not for the example just mentioned

Phil Archer: we have enough, but maybe not for the example just mentioned

16:33:34 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

16:33:34 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

16:33:46 <phila> GS1 Use case http://philarcher1.github.io/dwbp-1/usecasesv1.html#UC-GS1-Digital

Phil Archer: GS1 Use case http://philarcher1.github.io/dwbp-1/usecasesv1.html#UC-GS1-Digital

16:33:59 <jerdeb> ? : one use case we are interested in are consumer services for products on the web

? : one use case we are interested in are consumer services for products on the web

16:34:21 <BernadetteLoscio> markharrison is speaking

Bernadette Farias Loscio: markharrison is speaking

16:34:23 <phila> RRSAgent, make logs public

Phil Archer: RRSAgent, make logs public

16:34:55 <jerdeb> sorry cannot hear anything

sorry cannot hear anything

16:35:12 <phila> zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

Phil Archer: zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

16:35:12 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio was already muted, phila

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio was already muted, phila

16:35:44 <phila> phila: The use case you just gave, Mark, covering published but redacted data is interesting

Phil Archer: The use case you just gave, Mark, covering published but redacted data is interesting [ Scribe Assist by Phil Archer ]

16:35:56 <phila> markharrison: we could work on a UC with that aspect

Mark Harrison: we could work on a UC with that aspect [ Scribe Assist by Phil Archer ]

16:36:02 <jerdeb> ericstephan: can we get a number of requirements - maybe set up a wiki page to contribute to

Eric Stephan: can we get a number of requirements - maybe set up a wiki page to contribute to

16:36:21 <jerdeb> ericstephan: these would help in building the vocabularies

Eric Stephan: these would help in building the vocabularies

16:36:45 <jerdeb> ericstephan: this has to be done this week (this thursday 3/10 and next thursday 10/10)

Eric Stephan: this has to be done this week (this thursday 3/10 and next thursday 10/10)

16:37:16 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

16:37:16 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

16:37:25 <markharrison> phila: happy to do so re redacted data - I was thinking in particular of redacted traceability data for consumers, without revealing commercially sensitive details

Phil Archer: happy to do so re redacted data - I was thinking in particular of redacted traceability data for consumers, without revealing commercially sensitive details [ Scribe Assist by Mark Harrison ]

16:37:49 <jerdeb> phila: work on use cases and have them published by 14/10.. a week before tpac

Phil Archer: work on use cases and have them published by 14/10.. a week before tpac

16:38:59 <phila> The wiki page for additional use cases is at https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Use_Cases

Phil Archer: The wiki page for additional use cases is at https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Use_Cases

16:41:10 <markharrison> q+

Mark Harrison: q+

16:41:25 <jerdeb> phila: add new use cases suggested via email

Phil Archer: add new use cases suggested via email

16:42:41 <BernadetteLoscio> https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Data_Usage_Use_Cases

Bernadette Farias Loscio: https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Data_Usage_Use_Cases

16:43:25 <jerdeb> ericstephan: what are the things that are useful to talk about data usage activities taking part in the use cases?

Eric Stephan: what are the things that are useful to talk about data usage activities taking part in the use cases?

16:43:28 <ericstephan> ack markharrison

Eric Stephan: ack markharrison

16:43:34 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

16:43:34 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

16:44:04 <BernadetteLoscio> yes!

Bernadette Farias Loscio: yes!

16:44:05 <BernadetteLoscio> :)

Bernadette Farias Loscio: :)

16:44:12 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

16:44:12 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

16:45:47 <jerdeb> Bernadette: (re: wiki page) organise ideas about data usage.. different types of data usage activities and applications(?) .. how to describe data usage and feedback...

Bernadette Farias Loscio: (re: wiki page) organise ideas about data usage.. different types of data usage activities and applications(?) .. how to describe data usage and feedback...

16:46:20 <jerdeb> Bernadette: we need to discuss any overlaps(?) with data quality vocabulary..

Bernadette Farias Loscio: we need to discuss any overlaps(?) with data quality vocabulary..

16:47:03 <phila> q+ to quiz Bernadette a little

Phil Archer: q+ to quiz Bernadette a little

16:47:28 <jerdeb> Bernadette: extracting information from use cases for describing vocabularies... maybe we should try to write use cases to map them with the vocabularies

Bernadette Farias Loscio: extracting information from use cases for describing vocabularies... maybe we should try to write use cases to map them with the vocabularies

16:48:58 <phila> ack me

Phil Archer: ack me

16:48:58 <Zakim> phila, you wanted to quiz Bernadette a little

Zakim IRC Bot: phila, you wanted to quiz Bernadette a little

16:49:02 <ericstephan> ack phila

Eric Stephan: ack phila

16:49:25 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

16:49:25 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

16:50:20 <jerdeb> sorry phil, can you write the issue? i have a big echo here cannot hear you well

sorry phil, can you write the issue? i have a big echo here cannot hear you well

16:51:02 <phila> I'm saying that I'm a little concerned about spending more time on developing more use case. Do we have enough to make a start on the other deliverables?

Phil Archer: I'm saying that I'm a little concerned about spending more time on developing more use case. Do we have enough to make a start on the other deliverables?

16:51:03 <BernadetteLoscio> me too... echo here

Bernadette Farias Loscio: me too... echo here

16:51:10 <phila> zakim, who is noisy?

Phil Archer: zakim, who is noisy?

16:51:21 <Zakim> phila, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: markharrison (77%), ericstephan (54%)

Zakim IRC Bot: phila, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: markharrison (77%), ericstephan (54%)

16:51:21 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

16:51:23 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

16:51:28 <phila> zakim, mute markharrison

Phil Archer: zakim, mute markharrison

16:51:29 <Zakim> markharrison should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: markharrison should now be muted

16:51:54 <phila> ericstephan: I'm not talking about applying the template to the existing use cases

Eric Stephan: I'm not talking about applying the template to the existing use cases [ Scribe Assist by Phil Archer ]

16:52:04 <jerdeb> Bernadette: we can try to write some use cases from the pov of data usage

Bernadette Farias Loscio: we can try to write some use cases from the pov of data usage

16:52:10 <phila> BernadetteLoscio: I'm thinking that we could maybe write some use cases from the data usage vocab point of view

Bernadette Farias Loscio: I'm thinking that we could maybe write some use cases from the data usage vocab point of view [ Scribe Assist by Phil Archer ]

16:52:27 <jerdeb> Bernadette: we should show people what we mean by data usage

Bernadette Farias Loscio: we should show people what we mean by data usage

16:53:19 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

16:53:19 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

16:53:45 <jerdeb> phila: it is important to show what we mean by data usage... we can give some scenarios/examples where we can use it

Phil Archer: it is important to show what we mean by data usage... we can give some scenarios/examples where we can use it

16:53:58 <jerdeb> phila: similar to dcat, data cube

Phil Archer: similar to dcat, data cube

16:54:05 <ericstephan> q+

Eric Stephan: q+

16:54:32 <jerdeb> phila: suggesting that such scenarios should go in the documentation of the vocabulary

Phil Archer: suggesting that such scenarios should go in the documentation of the vocabulary

16:55:08 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

16:55:08 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

16:55:27 <jerdeb> phila: we can use some sample data to show the intended usage.. rather than working on some use case and then refer to it later

Phil Archer: we can use some sample data to show the intended usage.. rather than working on some use case and then refer to it later

16:55:44 <ericstephan> ack ericstephan

Eric Stephan: ack ericstephan

16:55:46 <phila> ack ericstephan

Phil Archer: ack ericstephan

16:55:56 <jerdeb> Bernadette: it would be nice if someone can answer our questions in the use case document rather than ourselves

Bernadette Farias Loscio: it would be nice if someone can answer our questions in the use case document rather than ourselves

16:57:05 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

16:57:05 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio was not muted, BernadetteLoscio

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio was not muted, BernadetteLoscio

16:57:44 <jerdeb> ericstephan: are we in agreement that we go through the requirements for the next week rather than a re-write of the use case documents?

Eric Stephan: are we in agreement that we go through the requirements for the next week rather than a re-write of the use case documents?

16:58:25 <jerdeb> phila: we need to make sure that what we do is grounded in reality... and that could be quite hard

Phil Archer: we need to make sure that what we do is grounded in reality... and that could be quite hard

16:58:50 <jerdeb> phila: we are trying to answer the question "what are people doing with my data?"

Phil Archer: we are trying to answer the question "what are people doing with my data?"

16:59:09 <MakxDekkers> +1 what phila said: grounded in reality

Makx Dekkers: +1 what phila said: grounded in reality

16:59:31 <jerdeb> phila: having a document is good, but we have to have something more concrete

Phil Archer: having a document is good, but we have to have something more concrete

16:59:41 <ericstephan> @phila good point, iterative process to produce and validate, and improve.

Eric Stephan: @phila good point, iterative process to produce and validate, and improve.

17:00:19 <jerdeb> phila: then we can go for input/feedback from the community

Phil Archer: then we can go for input/feedback from the community

17:00:37 <jerdeb> ericstephan: feedback is an important process

Eric Stephan: feedback is an important process

17:00:51 <markharrison> zakim, unmute markharrison

Mark Harrison: zakim, unmute markharrison

17:00:51 <Zakim> markharrison should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: markharrison should no longer be muted

17:01:32 <Zakim> -markharrison

Zakim IRC Bot: -markharrison

17:01:33 <Zakim> -ericstephan

Zakim IRC Bot: -ericstephan

17:01:33 <Zakim> -BernadetteLoscio

Zakim IRC Bot: -BernadetteLoscio

17:01:35 <Zakim> -phila

Zakim IRC Bot: -phila

17:01:36 <Zakim> -jerdeb

Zakim IRC Bot: -jerdeb

17:01:38 <Zakim> DATA_DWBP()12:00PM has ended

Zakim IRC Bot: DATA_DWBP()12:00PM has ended

17:01:38 <Zakim> Attendees were ericstephan, +3567922aaaa, +44.796.910.aabb, markharrison, jerdeb, BernadetteLoscio, +44.122.352.aacc, phila

Zakim IRC Bot: Attendees were ericstephan, +3567922aaaa, +44.796.910.aabb, markharrison, jerdeb, BernadetteLoscio, +44.122.352.aacc, phila

17:01:54 <phila> Did you see this BernadetteLoscio https://twitter.com/philarcher1/status/515767419076608000

Phil Archer: Did you see this BernadetteLoscio https://twitter.com/philarcher1/status/515767419076608000

17:01:58 <markharrison> bye

Mark Harrison: bye

16:02:33 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-dwbp-irc

RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-dwbp-irc

16:02:35 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs 351

Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs 351

16:02:37 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be DWBP

Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be DWBP

16:02:37 <Zakim> ok, trackbot, I see DATA_DWBP()12:00PM already started

Zakim IRC Bot: ok, trackbot, I see DATA_DWBP()12:00PM already started

16:02:38 <trackbot> Meeting: Data on the Web Best Practices Working Group Teleconference
16:02:38 <trackbot> Date: 02 October 2014
16:02:40 <Zakim> -??P20

Zakim IRC Bot: -??P20

16:03:27 <ericstephan> Are you able to hear me on the phone?

Eric Stephan: Are you able to hear me on the phone?

16:03:44 <ericstephan> I thought I heard someone join, but then again... :-)

Eric Stephan: I thought I heard someone join, but then again... :-)

16:03:56 <hadleybeeman> I'm afraid I'm not on the phone.  Do you need me to dial in?  I'm only here for a few mins... but I can call, if you like.

Hadley Beeman: I'm afraid I'm not on the phone. Do you need me to dial in? I'm only here for a few mins... but I can call, if you like.

16:04:27 <ericstephan> No its fine, I just didn't know :-)

Eric Stephan: No its fine, I just didn't know :-)

16:05:09 <hadleybeeman> Okay.  Nice agenda, by the way!

Hadley Beeman: Okay. Nice agenda, by the way!

16:05:28 <hadleybeeman> I went to prepare the agenda for tomorrow and put in the wrong date... I was very confused to see that it was already done. :)

Hadley Beeman: I went to prepare the agenda for tomorrow and put in the wrong date... I was very confused to see that it was already done. :)

16:05:55 <ericstephan> Thank you, yes Phil has taught me well.

Eric Stephan: Thank you, yes Phil has taught me well.

16:06:28 <ericstephan> I think everyone else is on IRC

Eric Stephan: I think everyone else is on IRC

16:06:48 <Zakim> + +3567922aaaa

Zakim IRC Bot: + +3567922aaaa

16:06:48 <Zakim> + +44.796.910.aabb

Zakim IRC Bot: + +44.796.910.aabb

16:07:34 <markharrison> zakim, who is on the phone?

Mark Harrison: zakim, who is on the phone?

16:07:34 <Zakim> On the phone I see ericstephan, +3567922aaaa, +44.796.910.aabb

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see ericstephan, +3567922aaaa, +44.796.910.aabb

16:08:01 <jerdeb> Zakim +356 is me

Zakim +356 is me

16:08:04 <markharrison> zakim, aabb is markharrison

Mark Harrison: zakim, aabb is markharrison

16:08:04 <Zakim> +markharrison; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +markharrison; got it

16:08:09 <hadleybeeman> zakim, aaaa is jerdeb

Hadley Beeman: zakim, aaaa is jerdeb

16:08:10 <Zakim> +jerdeb; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +jerdeb; got it

16:10:05 <ericstephan> Hmmm the agenda was here....https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/__wiki/Meetings:Telecon20141002 I thought...

Eric Stephan: Hmmm the agenda was here....https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/__wiki/Meetings:Telecon20141002 I thought...

16:10:32 <jerdeb> there is an agenda here: https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon20141002

there is an agenda here: https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon20141002

16:10:59 <ericstephan> Ah perfect!

Eric Stephan: Ah perfect!

16:11:16 <hadleybeeman> hadleybeeman has changed the topic to: Vocabs agenda: https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon20141002

Hadley Beeman: hadleybeeman has changed the topic to: Vocabs agenda: https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon20141002

16:12:06 <jerdeb> scribe: jerdeb
16:12:33 <ericstephan> scribenick: jerdeb
16:12:50 <markharrison> zakim, scribenick is jerdeb

Mark Harrison: zakim, scribenick is jerdeb

16:12:50 <Zakim> sorry, markharrison, I do not recognize a party named 'scribenick'

Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, markharrison, I do not recognize a party named 'scribenick'

16:13:06 <ericstephan> ScribeNick: jerdeb
16:13:21 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]

Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller]

16:13:31 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, ipcaller is BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, ipcaller is BernadetteLoscio

16:13:31 <Zakim> +BernadetteLoscio; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +BernadetteLoscio; got it

16:14:09 <BernadetteLoscio> i cant hear

Bernadette Farias Loscio: i cant hear

16:14:10 <ericstephan> zakim, who is noisy?

Eric Stephan: zakim, who is noisy?

16:14:17 <markharrison> zakim, who is speaking?

Mark Harrison: zakim, who is speaking?

16:14:21 <Zakim> ericstephan, listening for 10 seconds I could not identify any sounds

Zakim IRC Bot: ericstephan, listening for 10 seconds I could not identify any sounds

16:14:24 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

16:14:24 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

16:14:32 <Zakim> markharrison, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: markharrison (4%), ericstephan (10%)

Zakim IRC Bot: markharrison, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: markharrison (4%), ericstephan (10%)

16:17:00 <ericstephan> phila will you be able to join by phone?

Eric Stephan: phila will you be able to join by phone?

16:17:52 <ericstephan> TOPIC:  Review the UCR and see just what requirements are in there and think about how we're going to address them.

2. Review the UCR and see just what requirements are in there and think about how we're going to address them.

16:18:44 <jerdeb> ericstephan: generally how we are going to address them by vocabularies... discussing with bernadette what are the missing requirements

Eric Stephan: generally how we are going to address them by vocabularies... discussing with bernadette what are the missing requirements

16:18:55 <ericstephan> http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/usecasesv1.html

Eric Stephan: http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/usecasesv1.html

16:19:15 <Zakim> -markharrison

Zakim IRC Bot: -markharrison

16:19:39 <markharrison> lost audio connection - will try to rejoin

Mark Harrison: lost audio connection - will try to rejoin

16:20:15 <jerdeb> ericstephan: document on github (http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/usecasesv1.html) requirements - what kind of requirements do we need to propose?

Eric Stephan: document on github (http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/usecasesv1.html) requirements - what kind of requirements do we need to propose?

16:21:03 <Zakim> + +44.122.352.aacc

Zakim IRC Bot: + +44.122.352.aacc

16:21:21 <markharrison> zakim, aacc is markharrison

Mark Harrison: zakim, aacc is markharrison

16:21:21 <Zakim> +markharrison; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +markharrison; got it

16:22:06 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

16:22:06 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

16:22:21 <jerdeb> ericstephan: discussions we had in terms of the data usage vocab might have some synergies with the data quality and granularity vocab

Eric Stephan: discussions we had in terms of the data usage vocab might have some synergies with the data quality and granularity vocab

16:23:27 <jerdeb> Bernadette: requirements in usecase document are general.. they should be more specific..

Bernadette Farias Loscio: requirements in usecase document are general.. they should be more specific..

16:24:28 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]

Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller]

16:24:33 <phila> zakim, ipcaller is me

Phil Archer: zakim, ipcaller is me

16:24:33 <Zakim> +phila; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +phila; got it

16:24:40 <jerdeb> ericstephan: one of the more interesting things is that from certain use cases you cannot derive direct(?) information about data usage

Eric Stephan: one of the more interesting things is that from certain use cases you cannot derive direct(?) information about data usage

16:25:50 <phila> Looks Om to me

Phil Archer: Looks Om to me

16:26:10 <phila> http://philarcher1.github.io/dwbp-1/usecasesv1.html#UC-BuildingEye

Phil Archer: http://philarcher1.github.io/dwbp-1/usecasesv1.html#UC-BuildingEye

16:27:30 <jerdeb> ericstephan: the building eye use case has multiple perspectives: 1) vision of what open data can do

Eric Stephan: the building eye use case has multiple perspectives: 1) vision of what open data can do

16:28:14 <jerdeb> phila: reading individual use cases, it is true that you can pull a lot of different things and can be interpreted in different ways

Phil Archer: reading individual use cases, it is true that you can pull a lot of different things and can be interpreted in different ways

16:29:19 <jerdeb> phila: depends on the level of detail one wants to go in each use case to derive requirements

Phil Archer: depends on the level of detail one wants to go in each use case to derive requirements

16:29:23 <ericstephan> For example:  R-DataUnavailabilityReference: Some open data is related to data intentionally closed, taken offline, but the citation of the closed data source is important to data users as well as its designation as closed.

Eric Stephan: For example: R-DataUnavailabilityReference: Some open data is related to data intentionally closed, taken offline, but the citation of the closed data source is important to data users as well as its designation as closed.

16:31:27 <jerdeb> ericstephan: do we have enough requirements atm for data usage?

Eric Stephan: do we have enough requirements atm for data usage?

16:31:57 <jerdeb> phila: we have enough, but maybe not for the example just mentioned

Phil Archer: we have enough, but maybe not for the example just mentioned

16:33:34 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

16:33:34 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

16:33:46 <phila> GS1 Use case http://philarcher1.github.io/dwbp-1/usecasesv1.html#UC-GS1-Digital

Phil Archer: GS1 Use case http://philarcher1.github.io/dwbp-1/usecasesv1.html#UC-GS1-Digital

16:33:59 <jerdeb> ? : one use case we are interested in are consumer services for products on the web

? : one use case we are interested in are consumer services for products on the web

16:34:21 <BernadetteLoscio> markharrison is speaking

Bernadette Farias Loscio: markharrison is speaking

16:34:23 <phila> RRSAgent, make logs public

Phil Archer: RRSAgent, make logs public

16:34:55 <jerdeb> sorry cannot hear anything

sorry cannot hear anything

16:35:12 <phila> zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

Phil Archer: zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

16:35:12 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio was already muted, phila

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio was already muted, phila

16:35:44 <phila> phila: The use case you just gave, Mark, covering published but redacted data is interesting

Phil Archer: The use case you just gave, Mark, covering published but redacted data is interesting [ Scribe Assist by Phil Archer ]

16:35:56 <phila> markharrison: we could work on a UC with that aspect

Mark Harrison: we could work on a UC with that aspect [ Scribe Assist by Phil Archer ]

16:36:02 <jerdeb> ericstephan: can we get a number of requirements - maybe set up a wiki page to contribute to

Eric Stephan: can we get a number of requirements - maybe set up a wiki page to contribute to

16:36:21 <jerdeb> ericstephan: these would help in building the vocabularies

Eric Stephan: these would help in building the vocabularies

16:36:45 <jerdeb> ericstephan: this has to be done this week (this thursday 3/10 and next thursday 10/10)

Eric Stephan: this has to be done this week (this thursday 3/10 and next thursday 10/10)

16:37:16 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

16:37:16 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

16:37:25 <markharrison> phila: happy to do so re redacted data - I was thinking in particular of redacted traceability data for consumers, without revealing commercially sensitive details

Phil Archer: happy to do so re redacted data - I was thinking in particular of redacted traceability data for consumers, without revealing commercially sensitive details [ Scribe Assist by Mark Harrison ]

16:37:49 <jerdeb> phila: work on use cases and have them published by 14/10.. a week before tpac

Phil Archer: work on use cases and have them published by 14/10.. a week before tpac

16:38:59 <phila> The wiki page for additional use cases is at https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Use_Cases

Phil Archer: The wiki page for additional use cases is at https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Use_Cases

16:41:10 <markharrison> q+

Mark Harrison: q+

16:41:25 <jerdeb> phila: add new use cases suggested via email

Phil Archer: add new use cases suggested via email

16:42:41 <BernadetteLoscio> https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Data_Usage_Use_Cases

Bernadette Farias Loscio: https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Data_Usage_Use_Cases

16:43:25 <jerdeb> ericstephan: what are the things that are useful to talk about data usage activities taking part in the use cases?

Eric Stephan: what are the things that are useful to talk about data usage activities taking part in the use cases?

16:43:28 <ericstephan> ack markharrison

Eric Stephan: ack markharrison

16:43:34 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

16:43:34 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

16:44:04 <BernadetteLoscio> yes!

Bernadette Farias Loscio: yes!

16:44:05 <BernadetteLoscio> :)

Bernadette Farias Loscio: :)

16:44:12 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

16:44:12 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

16:45:47 <jerdeb> Bernadette: (re: wiki page) organise ideas about data usage.. different types of data usage activities and applications(?) .. how to describe data usage and feedback...

Bernadette Farias Loscio: (re: wiki page) organise ideas about data usage.. different types of data usage activities and applications(?) .. how to describe data usage and feedback...

16:46:20 <jerdeb> Bernadette: we need to discuss any overlaps(?) with data quality vocabulary..

Bernadette Farias Loscio: we need to discuss any overlaps(?) with data quality vocabulary..

16:47:03 <phila> q+ to quiz Bernadette a little

Phil Archer: q+ to quiz Bernadette a little

16:47:28 <jerdeb> Bernadette: extracting information from use cases for describing vocabularies... maybe we should try to write use cases to map them with the vocabularies

Bernadette Farias Loscio: extracting information from use cases for describing vocabularies... maybe we should try to write use cases to map them with the vocabularies

16:48:58 <phila> ack me

Phil Archer: ack me

16:48:58 <Zakim> phila, you wanted to quiz Bernadette a little

Zakim IRC Bot: phila, you wanted to quiz Bernadette a little

16:49:02 <ericstephan> ack phila

Eric Stephan: ack phila

16:49:25 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

16:49:25 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

16:50:20 <jerdeb> sorry phil, can you write the issue? i have a big echo here cannot hear you well

sorry phil, can you write the issue? i have a big echo here cannot hear you well

16:51:02 <phila> I'm saying that I'm a little concerned about spending more time on developing more use case. Do we have enough to make a start on the other deliverables?

Phil Archer: I'm saying that I'm a little concerned about spending more time on developing more use case. Do we have enough to make a start on the other deliverables?

16:51:03 <BernadetteLoscio> me too... echo here

Bernadette Farias Loscio: me too... echo here

16:51:10 <phila> zakim, who is noisy?

Phil Archer: zakim, who is noisy?

16:51:21 <Zakim> phila, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: markharrison (77%), ericstephan (54%)

Zakim IRC Bot: phila, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: markharrison (77%), ericstephan (54%)

16:51:21 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

16:51:23 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

16:51:28 <phila> zakim, mute markharrison

Phil Archer: zakim, mute markharrison

16:51:29 <Zakim> markharrison should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: markharrison should now be muted

16:51:54 <phila> ericstephan: I'm not talking about applying the template to the existing use cases

Eric Stephan: I'm not talking about applying the template to the existing use cases [ Scribe Assist by Phil Archer ]

16:52:04 <jerdeb> Bernadette: we can try to write some use cases from the pov of data usage

Bernadette Farias Loscio: we can try to write some use cases from the pov of data usage

16:52:10 <phila> BernadetteLoscio: I'm thinking that we could maybe write some use cases from the data usage vocab point of view

Bernadette Farias Loscio: I'm thinking that we could maybe write some use cases from the data usage vocab point of view [ Scribe Assist by Phil Archer ]

16:52:27 <jerdeb> Bernadette: we should show people what we mean by data usage

Bernadette Farias Loscio: we should show people what we mean by data usage

16:53:19 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, mute BernadetteLoscio

16:53:19 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should now be muted

16:53:45 <jerdeb> phila: it is important to show what we mean by data usage... we can give some scenarios/examples where we can use it

Phil Archer: it is important to show what we mean by data usage... we can give some scenarios/examples where we can use it

16:53:58 <jerdeb> phila: similar to dcat, data cube

Phil Archer: similar to dcat, data cube

16:54:05 <ericstephan> q+

Eric Stephan: q+

16:54:32 <jerdeb> phila: suggesting that such scenarios should go in the documentation of the vocabulary

Phil Archer: suggesting that such scenarios should go in the documentation of the vocabulary

16:55:08 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

16:55:08 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio should no longer be muted

16:55:27 <jerdeb> phila: we can use some sample data to show the intended usage.. rather than working on some use case and then refer to it later

Phil Archer: we can use some sample data to show the intended usage.. rather than working on some use case and then refer to it later

16:55:44 <ericstephan> ack ericstephan

Eric Stephan: ack ericstephan

16:55:46 <phila> ack ericstephan

Phil Archer: ack ericstephan

16:55:56 <jerdeb> Bernadette: it would be nice if someone can answer our questions in the use case document rather than ourselves

Bernadette Farias Loscio: it would be nice if someone can answer our questions in the use case document rather than ourselves

16:57:05 <BernadetteLoscio> zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

Bernadette Farias Loscio: zakim, unmute BernadetteLoscio

16:57:05 <Zakim> BernadetteLoscio was not muted, BernadetteLoscio

Zakim IRC Bot: BernadetteLoscio was not muted, BernadetteLoscio

16:57:44 <jerdeb> ericstephan: are we in agreement that we go through the requirements for the next week rather than a re-write of the use case documents?

Eric Stephan: are we in agreement that we go through the requirements for the next week rather than a re-write of the use case documents?

16:58:25 <jerdeb> phila: we need to make sure that what we do is grounded in reality... and that could be quite hard

Phil Archer: we need to make sure that what we do is grounded in reality... and that could be quite hard

16:58:50 <jerdeb> phila: we are trying to answer the question "what are people doing with my data?"

Phil Archer: we are trying to answer the question "what are people doing with my data?"

16:59:09 <MakxDekkers> +1 what phila said: grounded in reality

Makx Dekkers: +1 what phila said: grounded in reality

16:59:31 <jerdeb> phila: having a document is good, but we have to have something more concrete

Phil Archer: having a document is good, but we have to have something more concrete

16:59:41 <ericstephan> @phila good point, iterative process to produce and validate, and improve.

Eric Stephan: @phila good point, iterative process to produce and validate, and improve.

17:00:19 <jerdeb> phila: then we can go for input/feedback from the community

Phil Archer: then we can go for input/feedback from the community

17:00:37 <jerdeb> ericstephan: feedback is an important process

Eric Stephan: feedback is an important process

17:00:51 <markharrison> zakim, unmute markharrison

Mark Harrison: zakim, unmute markharrison

17:00:51 <Zakim> markharrison should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: markharrison should no longer be muted

17:01:32 <Zakim> -markharrison

Zakim IRC Bot: -markharrison

17:01:33 <Zakim> -ericstephan

Zakim IRC Bot: -ericstephan

17:01:33 <Zakim> -BernadetteLoscio

Zakim IRC Bot: -BernadetteLoscio

17:01:35 <Zakim> -phila

Zakim IRC Bot: -phila

17:01:36 <Zakim> -jerdeb

Zakim IRC Bot: -jerdeb

17:01:38 <Zakim> DATA_DWBP()12:00PM has ended

Zakim IRC Bot: DATA_DWBP()12:00PM has ended

17:01:38 <Zakim> Attendees were ericstephan, +3567922aaaa, +44.796.910.aabb, markharrison, jerdeb, BernadetteLoscio, +44.122.352.aacc, phila

Zakim IRC Bot: Attendees were ericstephan, +3567922aaaa, +44.796.910.aabb, markharrison, jerdeb, BernadetteLoscio, +44.122.352.aacc, phila

17:01:54 <phila> Did you see this BernadetteLoscio https://twitter.com/philarcher1/status/515767419076608000

Phil Archer: Did you see this BernadetteLoscio https://twitter.com/philarcher1/status/515767419076608000

17:01:58 <markharrison> bye

Mark Harrison: bye



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