HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference

25 Jul 2013

See also: IRC log


janina, Mark_Sadecki, [IPcaller], John_Foliot, Leonie, hober, Judy, Rich, paulc, [Microsoft]
MarkS, janina


<trackbot> Date: 25 July 2013

<janina> Meeting: HTML-A11Y Task Force Teleconference

<janina> Meeting: HTML-A11Y Task Force Teleconference

<janina> Chair: Janina_Sajka

<scribe> scribe: MarkS

Identify Scribe http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List

Canvas 2D Testing http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2013Jul/0052.html

Longdesc Status Update

JS: flurry of email following LCWD and some discussion. MathML was brought into the discussion. Would like to have James here, but he will be busy with Elijah.

TF Work Statement CFC http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2013Jul/0044.html

JS: I have asked chaals to make a word change, which he obliged to. No other comments.

<paulc> Will the ask to the HTML WG occur this week?

JS: we should now seek approval from the HTML WG and PFWG per Plan 2014

PC: when will the WG see it?

JS: probably next week.

Canvas 2D Testing http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2013Jul/0052.html

JS: touch base on Canvas 2D.
... we should prioritize this evaluation and provide feedback in clusters rather than one response at the end of the CfC

<richardschwerdtfeger> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2013Jul/0062.html

PC: please let us know if there are no comments on particular sections as well.

RS: I met with Dominc yesterday. Never really specified what a focus ring is supposed to look like.
... use system focus indicator. in windows, dotted ring
... author can override default indicator.
... this wouldn't force us to go back to CR
... any objection to go back to HTML to put this note in?

PC: file a bug?

RS: yes.

PC: mention that you have one implementation

RS: Dominic said the code went in yesterday

JS: what are our concerns with testing canvas 2d? is Path in jeopardy?

RS: focus is not in jeopardy. You can tab though fallback content on at least 3 browsers.
... showing the visible location on the canvas drawing surface, one implementation in Blink. Hopefully IE and Mozilla next.

TO: I think James is a good person to ask RE apple representative.

RS: Path and hit testing
... hit testing is not going to get into 5.0. Identified as at risk, implementors want to do something different with Shape
... Path, synchronize canvas closer to SVG. I think Path is at risk.

PC: yes, and hit regions

RS: If we don't have Path, then we may not have all the support we need.

<paulc> Path Object and Hit Regions are at risk: http://www.w3.org/TR/2012/CR-2dcontext-20121217/

JB: looking for clarification on how canvas can be accessible without path or hit regions.

RS: want to tell a magnifier where object is. Mags usually follow focus. focusring allows us to do that.
... the functionality that gets lost is the ability to zoom to arbitrary information on the drawing surface.
... everything on a web page has a location, mags can zoom to it.
... not everything in canvas has a location.
... what we can do, is put things in the tab order to control focus. not the best, but meets bare minimum.
... would tell authors to indicate tab index

JB: sounds as though the hit testing approach is not popular, but there is one that is more palatable? would it fill gap in the same approach?

RS: Developers have been want to use different object, Shape vs Path. Bind that to hit testing. Doesn't exist yet.

JB: would this work on multiple platforms?

RS: this is being discussed by Mozilla and WebKit and Blink. I don't know about MS
... this would allow us to not have to put everything in the tabbing sequence and allow us to zoom to important objects that are represented in fallback content.
... this may not have to wait until 5.1. there may be earlier implementations.

PC: if this is something that is well spec'ed, you could do an extension spec.

JB: Support the extension spec idea. lets capture this work and move it forward.

RS: i haven't seen shape object yet. I can talk to Rik Cabanier who was talking to Hixie for writing it up.

JS: I think I hear you saying that we should support Shape over Path

RS: I think we should support whatever will give us the location of objects.
... let me follow up with dbolter on where they are.

JB: if we are trying to insure that this graphics format is accessible, we can't support both approaches.
... lets be thoughtful about the timing on this.

RS: in the focusring drawing, two of the api's use the path object. they would drop off without path.

JS: so we would probably wan to keep path then...

RS: I think an extension spec for shape is great.
... i know that fallback content works well. I have a team that has demonstrated that now.

PC: does the TF have a schedule to review these two docs given that July is almost behind us.

JS: we need Rich to look through the canvas 2d spec to spot any accessibility snafus that may be in there.

MS: i am willing to help you out with that.

RS: are blink and webkit the same at this point?

PC: [clarifies the definition of unique implementations]

<paulc> 'Each implementation must be developed by a different party and cannot share, reuse, or derive from code used by another qualifying implementation. Sections of code that have no bearing on the implementation of this specification are exempt from this requirement."

<paulc> http://dev.w3.org/html5/decision-policy/public-permissive-exit-criteria.html

TO: there is at least one case in CSS where an Adobe developer has been working on code in both webkit and gecko and we have determined that this are not unique.

JF: google has announced that they will be supporting Longdesc. No indication from Safari. Evidence that these browsers are forking.

PC: same code, one implementation.
... would like to have a regular agenda item on Canvas and HTML testing.

HTML5 testing http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2013Jul/0053.html

<janina> scribe: janina

ms: Has been working with spec editors on plan to test using issues we found
... Also identified several items we reported as not requiring anything more than filing bugs
... Will report to the TF
... Expect this next week

Longdesc Status Update

Alt Edits Completed


<MarkS> JS: steveF has sent a note to the list that all changes from the standalone document have been ported to 5.1 and 5.0 heartbeat.

<MarkS> ...need everyone to take a really close look to verify that this is what we want in the spec

<MarkS> ...SteveF wants us to file bugs if you have any issues.

<MarkS> ...I think we need to move on this and close it.

<MarkS> ...there is one section, near the beginning RE: a logo, but the alt text does not mention that.

<MarkS> JF: we have a standard or convention that we preface the description with the type followed by a colon. more of a convention.

<MarkS> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-admin/2013Jul/0058.html

<MarkS> JS: next step, lets return to this topic next week to see how we should handle this.

<MarkS> JF: do we have a deadline on this, or can it wait until Steve's return.

<MarkS> JS: I think 2-3 weeks won't be a problem.

Summary of Action Items

[End of minutes]

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$Date: 2013-08-01 18:26:59 $