IRC log of xproc on 2012-05-24
Timestamps are in UTC.
- 13:58:20 [RRSAgent]
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- logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/05/24-xproc-irc
- 13:58:23 [Zakim]
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- 13:58:27 [Norm]
- zakim, this will be xproc
- 13:58:27 [Zakim]
- ok, Norm; I see XML_PMWG()10:00AM scheduled to start in 2 minutes
- 13:58:32 [Norm]
- zakim, passcode?
- 13:58:32 [Zakim]
- the conference code is 97762 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), Norm
- 13:59:47 [Zakim]
- XML_PMWG()10:00AM has now started
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- +vivienne
- 14:00:08 [Zakim]
- +Norm
- 14:00:10 [jfuller]
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- 14:00:29 [Norm]
- zakim, vivienne is Jim
- 14:00:30 [Vojtech]
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- 14:00:30 [Zakim]
- +Jim; got it
- 14:00:42 [Norm]
- zakim, Jim is jfuller
- 14:00:42 [Zakim]
- +jfuller; got it
- 14:00:59 [alexmilowski]
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- 14:01:08 [Norm]
- rrsagent, set logs world-visible
- 14:01:08 [Norm]
- Meeting: XML Processing Model WG
- 14:01:08 [Norm]
- Date: 24 May 2012
- 14:01:08 [Norm]
- Agenda: http://www.w3.org/XML/XProc/2012/05/24-agenda
- 14:01:08 [Norm]
- Meeting: 215
- 14:01:08 [Norm]
- Chair: Norm
- 14:01:10 [Norm]
- Scribe: Norm
- 14:01:12 [Norm]
- ScribeNick: Norm
- 14:01:25 [Zakim]
- +Jeroen
- 14:01:32 [Vojtech]
- zakim, jeroen is me
- 14:01:32 [Zakim]
- +Vojtech; got it
- 14:01:43 [ht]
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- 14:02:09 [Zakim]
- +Alex_Milows
- 14:02:39 [Zakim]
- + +1.805.452.aaaa
- 14:02:44 [Zakim]
- +??P34
- 14:03:01 [Norm]
- zakim, aaaa is cornelia
- 14:03:01 [Zakim]
- +cornelia; got it
- 14:03:07 [Norm]
- zakim, who's here?
- 14:03:07 [Zakim]
- On the phone I see jfuller, Norm, Vojtech, Alex_Milows, cornelia, ht
- 14:03:08 [Zakim]
- On IRC I see ht, alexmilowski, Vojtech, jfuller, Zakim, RRSAgent, Norm, Liam
- 14:03:32 [Norm]
- Present: Jim, Norm, Vojtech, Alex, Cornelia, Henry
- 14:03:44 [Norm]
- Topic: Accept this agenda?
- 14:03:44 [Norm]
- -> http://www.w3.org/XML/XProc/2012/05/24-agenda
- 14:03:50 [Norm]
- Accepted.
- 14:03:55 [Norm]
- Topic: Accept minutes from the previous meeting?
- 14:03:55 [Norm]
- -> http://www.w3.org/XML/XProc/2012/04/26-minutes
- 14:04:01 [Norm]
- Accepted.
- 14:04:07 [Norm]
- Topic: Next meeting: telcon, 31 May 2012
- 14:04:21 [Norm]
- Vojtech gives regrets for two weeks.
- 14:04:51 [Norm]
- Topic: Review of action items
- 14:05:10 [Norm]
- Present: Jim, Norm, Vojtech, Alex, Cornelia, Henry, Murray
- 14:05:21 [Zakim]
- + +1.778.440.aabb
- 14:06:11 [MoZ]
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- 14:06:27 [MoZ]
- Zakim, who is here ?
- 14:06:50 [Zakim]
- On the phone I see jfuller, Norm, Vojtech, Alex_Milows, cornelia, ht, +1.778.440.aabb
- 14:06:50 [Norm]
- zakim, aabb is Murray
- 14:07:02 [Zakim]
- +Murray; got it
- 14:07:06 [Zakim]
- On IRC I see MoZ, ht, alexmilowski, Vojtech, jfuller, Zakim, RRSAgent, Norm, Liam
- 14:08:07 [Norm]
- Some discussion of the charter. It's now out for AC vote.
- 14:09:15 [Liam]
- [note, it was changed very slightly since Norm saw it, but I think not significantly (e.g. meeting frequency clarified), but comments can be made in the AC review.]
- 14:10:38 [Norm]
- A-206-02: Continued
- 14:10:38 [Norm]
- A-207-02: Completed, gone out to AC for review
- 14:10:38 [Norm]
- A-209-01: Continued
- 14:10:38 [Norm]
- A-210-01: Continued
- 14:10:38 [Norm]
- A-210-02: Continued
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- A-210-03: Continued
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- A-210-04: Continued
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- A-211-01: Continued
- 14:10:45 [Norm]
- A-213-01: Completed
- 14:10:47 [Norm]
- A-213-02: Completed
- 14:10:49 [Norm]
- A-213-03: Completed
- 14:10:51 [Norm]
- A-213-04: Completed
- 14:10:53 [Norm]
- A-213-05: Completed
- 14:10:55 [Norm]
- A-213-06: Completed
- 14:10:57 [Norm]
- A-213-07: Completed
- 14:11:00 [Norm]
- A-213-08: Completed
- 14:11:01 [Norm]
- A-214-01: Completed
- 14:11:03 [Norm]
- A-214-02: Completed
- 14:11:05 [Norm]
- Norm: Murray, I assume you'll insert them in the document.
- 14:11:07 [Norm]
- Murray: Yes, of course.
- 14:11:23 [Norm]
- A-213-04 is 5.27, still open on Alex.
- 14:11:49 [Norm]
- Topic: Sync/catchup/agenda review
- 14:12:16 [Norm]
- Norm: Anyone have anything to add?
- 14:13:07 [Norm]
- Cornelia: I was able to find the editor's draft of the use cases/requirements but only in email?
- 14:13:15 [Norm]
- Norm: Alex, is it checked in somewhere?
- 14:13:37 [Norm]
- ACTION: Norm to make sure everyone knows the stable URI for the use cases/requirements document
- 14:13:44 [Norm]
- A-215-01
- 14:14:15 [Norm]
- Henry: Once it's anywhere under the XProc CVS, it's available.
- 14:14:39 [Norm]
- Murray: Do you want me to mail a draft?
- 14:14:52 [Norm]
- Norm: No, let's get it checked in and send out the pointer to the stable pointer.
- 14:15:27 [Norm]
- Cornelia: There were use cases and requirements marked as satisified, are those old ones?
- 14:15:50 [Norm]
- Murray: The use cases/requirements document is the 1.0 version supplemented with original material.
- 14:16:00 [Norm]
- ...What we've been doing is improving those use cases.
- 14:16:06 [Norm]
- ...And assuring ourselves that we've satisfied them.
- 14:16:13 [jfuller]
- link to old use case document
- 14:16:13 [jfuller]
- http://www.w3.org/TR/xproc-requirements/
- 14:16:15 [Norm]
- ...But we're still detailing them.
- 14:16:31 [Norm]
- Cornelia: With the current version of XProc?
- 14:16:38 [Norm]
- Murray: Yes.
- 14:18:31 [Norm]
- Norm attempts to explain the motivation for repeating the use cases: to provide real pipelines and to look at how they might be simplified for V.next.
- 14:18:47 [Norm]
- Murray: We've also got DAISY requirements that we can incorporate in support of the work we've done.
- 14:19:08 [Norm]
- Topic: Updating schemas and library.xpl
- 14:19:15 [Norm]
- [SCRIBE: find pointer to email]
- 14:20:19 [Norm]
- Norm describes the problem of having "out-of-date" schemas and XPL wrt the new template note.
- 14:20:43 [Norm]
- Henry: We should have put those documents in date space at publication time. Then we could have a dated version that never changes and an undated version that you can keep up-to-date.
- 14:21:13 [Norm]
- ACTION: Henry to stage the dated and undated versions of updated schemas and library.xpl
- 14:21:39 [Norm]
- Topic: Naming of compound steps
- 14:22:36 [Norm]
- Norm: Mohamed summarizes the issue here:
- 14:22:38 [Norm]
- -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xml-processing-model-wg/2012May/0024.html
- 14:23:52 [Norm]
- Norm: The original problem was that the XSD for p:catch doesn't allow a name attribute, but it must be allowed to have one.
- 14:24:28 [MoZ]
- sure, but do we allow to have one on p:when and p:otherwise
- 14:24:41 [Norm]
- ACTION: Norm to clarify with Mohamed to see if he thinks there's really a problem here.
- 14:25:00 [Norm]
- Norm: Does anyone disagree that the XSD for XProc has bug?
- 14:25:03 [Norm]
- None heard
- 14:25:31 [MoZ]
- Basically my proposal is to fix the XSD
- 14:25:58 [Norm]
- ACTION: Henry to fix the bug where p:catch doesn't allow a name.
- 14:26:01 [MoZ]
- but the real question is whether we need to allow name on p:when and p:otherwise
- 14:26:04 [Norm]
- s/name./name in the XSD./
- 14:26:30 [Norm]
- MoZ, let's take that offline.
- 14:26:38 [MoZ]
- Norm, fine
- 14:26:55 [Norm]
- Topic: Extending p:log
- 14:27:22 [Norm]
- -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xml-processing-model-wg/2012May/0025.html
- 14:28:07 [Norm]
- Norm summarizes.
- 14:28:16 [jfuller]
- sounds good to me
- 14:29:39 [cornelia]
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- 14:30:03 [Norm]
- Murray: What about variables?
- 14:30:13 [Norm]
- Norm: I think Mohamed suggested we use a template style.
- 14:30:32 [Norm]
- Vojtech: But how can that work? Where would you set the parameters?
- 14:30:37 [Norm]
- Norm: Yeah. Maybe it doesn't work.
- 14:31:09 [Norm]
- Vojtech: Why can't we just use ordinary XPath expressions?
- 14:31:25 [Norm]
- Norm: So maybe you use the template style but you can't have any variable references because there are no parameters
- 14:31:32 [Norm]
- Murray: I guess I don't understand how this template thing would work.
- 14:31:45 [Norm]
- ACTION: Norm to consider the template idea and provide an example of how that might look
- 14:32:07 [Norm]
- Alex: I think the next thing you do with this thing would be to come up with some motivating examples.
- 14:32:35 [Norm]
- ...One of the things I have to do in other ways is to figure out what values variables have. It's not just the document, it's also the other bits that are coming into the step.
- 14:33:03 [Norm]
- Vojtech: I see two situations. If you put p:log in p:group then you can have variables or options that are inscope and you could say that those are visible in the log.
- 14:33:18 [Norm]
- ...But on the top-level, there's probably no way to refer to variables.
- 14:33:23 [Norm]
- ...Though maybe pipeline options.
- 14:33:32 [Norm]
- Alex: I'm assuimg there are limitations. You don't want to get into circularity.
- 14:33:50 [Norm]
- ...I think we need a short list at least of things that we expect to work.
- 14:34:34 [Norm]
- Henry: Can I come back on this question of template?
- 14:35:27 [Norm]
- ...These aren't common, garden variety steps. These are names in p:; we can make their content be evaluated in any context we choose.
- 14:36:05 [Norm]
- ...So I don't see any a priori reason why we can't say that p:assert with a body is effectively shorthand for a p:template with a connection to a template.
- 14:37:08 [Norm]
- Henry: I don't think the workaround Mohamed suggested is necessary, we can define the body to be evaluated as we wish.