13:42:14 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/08/25-rdfa-irc
RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/08/25-rdfa-irc ←
13:42:16 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs world ←
13:42:18 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 7332
Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be 7332 ←
13:42:18 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see SW_RDFa()10:00AM scheduled to start in 18 minutes
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, trackbot; I see SW_RDFa()10:00AM scheduled to start in 18 minutes ←
13:42:19 <trackbot> Meeting: RDF Web Applications Working Group Teleconference
13:42:19 <trackbot> Date: 25 August 2011
13:42:20 <manu1> Guest: Stéphane (scor) Corlosquet
13:42:21 <manu1> Guest: Henri (bergie) Bergius
13:42:22 <manu1> Guest: Niklas (lindstream) Lindström
13:50:19 <manu1> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdfa-wg/2011Aug/0048.html
13:50:24 <manu1> Chair: Manu
13:53:41 <Zakim> SW_RDFa()10:00AM has now started
(No events recorded for 11 minutes)
Zakim IRC Bot: SW_RDFa()10:00AM has now started ←
13:53:49 <Zakim> + +358.405.25aaaa
Zakim IRC Bot: + +358.405.25aaaa ←
13:53:59 <bergie> Zakim, aaaa is me
Henri Bergius: Zakim, aaaa is me ←
13:53:59 <Zakim> +bergie; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +bergie; got it ←
13:54:00 <ivan> zakim, dial ivan-voip
Ivan Herman: zakim, dial ivan-voip ←
13:54:00 <Zakim> ok, ivan; the call is being made
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, ivan; the call is being made ←
13:54:01 <Zakim> +Ivan
Zakim IRC Bot: +Ivan ←
13:54:06 <bergie> Zakim, mute me
Henri Bergius: Zakim, mute me ←
13:54:06 <Zakim> bergie should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bergie should now be muted ←
13:54:36 <ivan> zakim, drp me
Ivan Herman: zakim, drp me ←
13:54:37 <Zakim> I don't understand 'drp me', ivan
Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand 'drp me', ivan ←
13:54:39 <ivan> zakim, drop me
Ivan Herman: zakim, drop me ←
13:54:39 <Zakim> Ivan is being disconnected
Zakim IRC Bot: Ivan is being disconnected ←
13:54:41 <Zakim> -Ivan
Zakim IRC Bot: -Ivan ←
13:54:50 <ivan> zakim, dial ivan-voip
Ivan Herman: zakim, dial ivan-voip ←
13:54:50 <Zakim> ok, ivan; the call is being made
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, ivan; the call is being made ←
13:54:51 <Zakim> +Ivan
Zakim IRC Bot: +Ivan ←
13:55:04 <bergie> Zakim, unmute me
Henri Bergius: Zakim, unmute me ←
13:55:04 <Zakim> bergie should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bergie should no longer be muted ←
13:55:19 <bergie> Zakim, mute me
Henri Bergius: Zakim, mute me ←
13:55:19 <Zakim> bergie should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bergie should now be muted ←
13:55:28 <bergie> Zakim, unmute me
Henri Bergius: Zakim, unmute me ←
13:55:28 <Zakim> bergie should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bergie should no longer be muted ←
13:57:11 <Zakim> +??P8
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P8 ←
13:57:30 <Zakim> +scor
Zakim IRC Bot: +scor ←
13:57:36 <ivan> zakim, ??P8 is Benjamin
Ivan Herman: zakim, ??P8 is Benjamin ←
13:57:37 <Zakim> +Benjamin; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Benjamin; got it ←
13:57:39 <Benjamin> zakim, +??P8 is me
Benjamin Adrian: zakim, +??P8 is me ←
13:57:40 <Zakim> sorry, Benjamin, I do not recognize a party named '+??P8'
Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, Benjamin, I do not recognize a party named '+??P8' ←
13:57:52 <bergie> Zakim, mute me
Henri Bergius: Zakim, mute me ←
13:57:52 <Zakim> bergie should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bergie should now be muted ←
13:58:26 <Zakim> +??P13
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P13 ←
13:58:50 <gkellogg> zakim, ??P13 is me
Gregg Kellogg: zakim, ??P13 is me ←
13:58:50 <Zakim> +gkellogg; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +gkellogg; got it ←
14:00:16 <Zakim> +??P25
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P25 ←
14:00:17 <Zakim> +??P26
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P26 ←
14:00:21 <manu1> zakim, I am ??P25
Manu Sporny: zakim, I am ??P25 ←
14:00:21 <Zakim> +manu1; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +manu1; got it ←
14:00:32 <lindstream> zakim, I am ??P26
Niklas Lindström: zakim, I am ??P26 ←
14:00:32 <Zakim> +lindstream; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +lindstream; got it ←
14:00:49 <Zakim> +OpenLink_Software
Zakim IRC Bot: +OpenLink_Software ←
14:00:53 <MacTed> Zakim, OpenLink_Software is temporarily me
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, OpenLink_Software is temporarily me ←
14:00:53 <Zakim> +MacTed; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +MacTed; got it ←
14:00:55 <MacTed> Zakim, mute me
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, mute me ←
14:00:55 <Zakim> MacTed should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: MacTed should now be muted ←
14:01:43 <Zakim> +??P30
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P30 ←
14:01:43 <Zakim> +Knud
Zakim IRC Bot: +Knud ←
14:01:46 <ShaneM> zakim, I am ??P30
Shane McCarron: zakim, I am ??P30 ←
14:01:46 <Zakim> +ShaneM; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +ShaneM; got it ←
14:01:50 <Knud> zakim, mute me
Knud Möller: zakim, mute me ←
14:01:50 <Zakim> Knud should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: Knud should now be muted ←
14:02:20 <Benjamin> scribenick: Benjamin
(Scribe set to Benjamin Adrian)
14:02:53 <MacTed> Zakim, unmute me
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, unmute me ←
14:02:53 <Zakim> MacTed should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: MacTed should no longer be muted ←
14:03:19 <MacTed> Zakim, mute me
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, mute me ←
14:03:19 <Zakim> MacTed should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: MacTed should now be muted ←
14:03:21 <Zakim> -lindstream
Zakim IRC Bot: -lindstream ←
14:03:44 <MacTed> Zakim, who's here?
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, who's here? ←
14:03:44 <Zakim> On the phone I see bergie (muted), Ivan, Benjamin, scor, gkellogg, manu1, MacTed (muted), ShaneM, Knud (muted)
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see bergie (muted), Ivan, Benjamin, scor, gkellogg, manu1, MacTed (muted), ShaneM, Knud (muted) ←
14:03:44 <Zakim> On IRC I see Knud, ShaneM, lindstream, scor, Benjamin, Zakim, RRSAgent, MacTed, ivan, bergie, manu1, gkellogg, trackbot, manu
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see Knud, ShaneM, lindstream, scor, Benjamin, Zakim, RRSAgent, MacTed, ivan, bergie, manu1, gkellogg, trackbot, manu ←
14:04:20 <manu1> zakim, manu1 is lindstream
Manu Sporny: zakim, manu1 is lindstream ←
14:04:21 <Zakim> +lindstream; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +lindstream; got it ←
14:05:12 <Zakim> +??P26
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P26 ←
14:05:28 <manu1> zakim, I am ??P26
Manu Sporny: zakim, I am ??P26 ←
14:05:31 <Zakim> +manu1; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +manu1; got it ←
14:06:02 <manu1> Topic: Jeni's Write-up / formalize issues
14:06:12 <manu1> http://www.jenitennison.com/blog/node/165
Manu Sporny: http://www.jenitennison.com/blog/node/165 ←
14:06:38 <Benjamin> manu: Let's summarize Jeni's proposals on merging RDFa and Microdata
Manu Sporny: Let's summarize Jeni's proposals on merging RDFa and Microdata ←
14:07:38 <Benjamin> ivan: first issue is the interpretation of time element
Ivan Herman: first issue is the interpretation of time element ←
14:07:45 <manu1> q+ on datetime issue
Manu Sporny: q+ on datetime issue ←
14:08:19 <Benjamin> ... next issue is about microdata allowing link and meta elements to be used in content
... next issue is about microdata allowing link and meta elements to be used in content ←
14:08:40 <Benjamin> ... Jeni proposes RDFa to also allow these elements
... Jeni proposes RDFa to also allow these elements ←
14:09:22 <manu1> q?
Manu Sporny: q? ←
14:09:26 <Benjamin> ... consequently HTML+RDFa would include parts of the HTML5 content module, which is tricky
... consequently HTML+RDFa would include parts of the HTML5 content module, which is tricky ←
14:09:28 <manu1> ack manu1
Manu Sporny: ack manu1 ←
14:09:28 <Zakim> manu1, you wanted to comment on datetime issue
Zakim IRC Bot: manu1, you wanted to comment on datetime issue ←
14:10:06 <lindstream> q+
Niklas Lindström: q+ ←
14:10:11 <Benjamin> manu: there is a chance that time element is going to be replaced by data elements. Data contains machine readable values about content
Manu Sporny: there is a chance that time element is going to be replaced by data elements. Data contains machine readable values about content ←
14:10:21 <manu1> ack lindstream
Manu Sporny: ack lindstream ←
14:10:30 <Benjamin> ivan: hence, it is an open issue and we should leave it for now
Ivan Herman: hence, it is an open issue and we should leave it for now ←
14:10:55 <manu1> q+ to note how we follow HTML5 via HTML+RDFa
Manu Sporny: q+ to note how we follow HTML5 via HTML+RDFa ←
14:11:13 <Benjamin> lindstream: there is a problem with versioning issues
Niklas Lindström: there is a problem with versioning issues ←
14:11:52 <manu1> q-
Manu Sporny: q- ←
14:12:21 <lindstream> my point was that html5 is a "living spec", which supposedly won't have versioning. So the rdfa spec, having versions, might have trouble "keeping up"
Niklas Lindström: my point was that html5 is a "living spec", which supposedly won't have versioning. So the rdfa spec, having versions, might have trouble "keeping up" ←
14:12:41 <lindstream> np :)
Niklas Lindström: np :) ←
14:14:04 <lindstream> q?
Niklas Lindström: q? ←
14:14:12 <Benjamin> ivan: HTML allows the use of meta only if it contains microdata content. This is a bit strange.
Ivan Herman: HTML allows the use of meta only if it contains microdata content. This is a bit strange. ←
14:14:42 <manu1> ISSUE: Determine if RDFa should normatively state that <link> and <meta> elements are supported in flow content.
ISSUE: Determine if RDFa should normatively state that <link> and <meta> elements are supported in flow content. ←
14:14:42 <trackbot> Created ISSUE-104 - Determine if RDFa should normatively state that <link> and <meta> elements are supported in flow content. ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/104/edit .
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ISSUE-104 - Determine if RDFa should normatively state that <link> and <meta> elements are supported in flow content. ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/104/edit . ←
14:15:07 <Benjamin> ivan: Next issue is about built in prefixes/terms.
Ivan Herman: Next issue is about built in prefixes/terms. ←
14:15:18 <Benjamin> ... RDFa has such a mechanism
... RDFa has such a mechanism ←
14:15:45 <Benjamin> ... Next issue is about the itemref functionality
... Next issue is about the itemref functionality ←
14:15:47 <manu1> ISSUE: Should RDFa support something like Microdata's @itemref attribute.
ISSUE: Should RDFa support something like Microdata's @itemref attribute. ←
14:15:47 <trackbot> Created ISSUE-105 - Should RDFa support something like Microdata's @itemref attribute. ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/105/edit .
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ISSUE-105 - Should RDFa support something like Microdata's @itemref attribute. ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/105/edit . ←
14:16:12 <manu1> ISSUE: Should RDFa support the creation of ordered lists?
ISSUE: Should RDFa support the creation of ordered lists? ←
14:16:12 <trackbot> Created ISSUE-106 - Should RDFa support the creation of ordered lists? ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/106/edit .
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ISSUE-106 - Should RDFa support the creation of ordered lists? ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/106/edit . ←
14:16:15 <Benjamin> ivan: There is an issue about the creation of ordered lists in RDFa
Ivan Herman: There is an issue about the creation of ordered lists in RDFa ←
14:17:18 <Benjamin> ivan: The next issue for us is about using the src attribute
Ivan Herman: The next issue for us is about using the src attribute ←
14:17:54 <manu1> ISSUE: Determine if @src attribute should be viewed in the object position instead of the subject position.
ISSUE: Determine if @src attribute should be viewed in the object position instead of the subject position. ←
14:17:55 <trackbot> Created ISSUE-107 - Determine if @src attribute should be viewed in the object position instead of the subject position. ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/107/edit .
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ISSUE-107 - Determine if @src attribute should be viewed in the object position instead of the subject position. ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/107/edit . ←
14:17:56 <Benjamin> manu: the concern about this is backward compatability.
Manu Sporny: the concern about this is backward compatability. ←
14:18:19 <gkellogg> @src is often a problem for example markup, one of the things I noted that people often get wrong.
Gregg Kellogg: @src is often a problem for example markup, one of the things I noted that people often get wrong. ←
14:18:58 <Benjamin> ivan: Jeni mentions link relations, which relates to the use of terms in RDFa1.1
Ivan Herman: Jeni mentions link relations, which relates to the use of terms in RDFa1.1 ←
14:19:22 <Benjamin> .. we might revise which terms are relevant or not
.. we might revise which terms are relevant or not ←
14:19:39 <manu1> ISSUE: Refine/deprecate Link relations for the RDFa 1.1 Default Profile.
ISSUE: Refine/deprecate Link relations for the RDFa 1.1 Default Profile. ←
14:19:40 <lindstream> q+
Niklas Lindström: q+ ←
14:19:40 <trackbot> Created ISSUE-108 - Refine/deprecate Link relations for the RDFa 1.1 Default Profile. ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/108/edit .
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ISSUE-108 - Refine/deprecate Link relations for the RDFa 1.1 Default Profile. ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/108/edit . ←
14:19:51 <manu1> ack lindstream
Manu Sporny: ack lindstream ←
14:20:06 <Benjamin> ... at the moment the RDFa HTML default profile still contains all tokens, which we should look at again
... at the moment the RDFa HTML default profile still contains all tokens, which we should look at again ←
14:20:16 <manu1> q+ to say we've discussed this before.
Manu Sporny: q+ to say we've discussed this before. ←
14:20:44 <Benjamin> lindstream: Jeni's problem was about the implied subject, when using these link relations.
Niklas Lindström: Jeni's problem was about the implied subject, when using these link relations. ←
14:20:53 <manu1> ack manu1
Manu Sporny: ack manu1 ←
14:20:53 <Zakim> manu1, you wanted to say we've discussed this before.
Zakim IRC Bot: manu1, you wanted to say we've discussed this before. ←
14:20:56 <ShaneM> Remember that ARIA cares about some of those relationships.
Shane McCarron: Remember that ARIA cares about some of those relationships. ←
14:21:04 <bergie> q+
Henri Bergius: q+ ←
14:21:08 <Benjamin> ivan: someone should lookup the list of necessary tokens in RDFa
Ivan Herman: someone should lookup the list of necessary tokens in RDFa ←
14:21:41 <bergie> Zakim, unmute me
Henri Bergius: Zakim, unmute me ←
14:21:41 <Zakim> bergie should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bergie should no longer be muted ←
14:21:42 <manu1> ack bergie
Manu Sporny: ack bergie ←
14:21:53 <Benjamin> manu: link relaitonships concern the HTML integration and should not be defined in RDFa core
Manu Sporny: link relaitonships concern the HTML integration and should not be defined in RDFa core ←
14:21:55 <lindstream> one example raising the subject issue is: rel="stylesheet alternate"
Niklas Lindström: one example raising the subject issue is: rel="stylesheet alternate" ←
14:22:57 <Benjamin> bergie: We should spend more explanations on these tokens and their relation to subjects
Henri Bergius: We should spend more explanations on these tokens and their relation to subjects ←
14:23:36 <bergie> Zakim, mute me
Henri Bergius: Zakim, mute me ←
14:23:36 <Zakim> bergie should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bergie should now be muted ←
14:23:47 <lindstream> for the record: one way out of this "mess" *might* be the idea of letting @property capture @href/@resource if present...
Niklas Lindström: for the record: one way out of this "mess" *might* be the idea of letting @property capture @href/@resource if present... ←
14:23:53 <Benjamin> ivan: these are the issues we can extract from Jeni's blog
Ivan Herman: these are the issues we can extract from Jeni's blog ←
14:24:07 <Benjamin> manu: That is four new issues.
Manu Sporny: That is four new issues. ←
14:24:26 <Benjamin> manu: Any other concerns about Jeni's writeup?
Manu Sporny: Any other concerns about Jeni's writeup? ←
14:24:31 <manu1> Topic: ISSUE-103: preserve @vocab declarations
14:24:39 <manu1> http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/103
Manu Sporny: http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/103 ←
14:24:44 <ivan> ISSUE-103?
14:24:44 <trackbot> ISSUE-103 -- Should RDFa Processors preserve @vocab declarations in the default graph? -- open
Trackbot IRC Bot: ISSUE-103 -- Should RDFa Processors preserve @vocab declarations in the default graph? -- open ←
14:24:44 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/103
Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/103 ←
14:25:34 <ivan> What about rdfa:has-vocab ?
Ivan Herman: What about rdfa:has-vocab ? ←
14:25:44 <lindstream> .. or rdfa:usesVocab ?
Niklas Lindström: .. or rdfa:usesVocab ? ←
14:25:46 <Benjamin> ivan: first thing is that the term i used in the mail was not good -- rdfa:hasVocab
Ivan Herman: first thing is that the term i used in the mail was not good -- rdfa:hasVocab ←
14:26:02 <ivan> <uriofrdfasource> a rdfa:source ;
Ivan Herman: <uriofrdfasource> a rdfa:source ; ←
14:26:07 <lindstream> q+
Niklas Lindström: q+ ←
14:26:41 <MacTed> provenance :-)
Ted Thibodeau: provenance :-) ←
14:27:01 <lindstream> if used, it should be rdfa:Source (uppercase 'S')
Niklas Lindström: if used, it should be rdfa:Source (uppercase 'S') ←
14:27:09 <Benjamin> ivan: other thing is that a link from triples to the original source is missing. Some people complained about that.
Ivan Herman: other thing is that a link from triples to the original source is missing. Some people complained about that. ←
14:27:19 <manu1> ack lindstream
Manu Sporny: ack lindstream ←
14:28:58 <manu1> So, the current proposal seems to be: <current-document> rdfa:hasVocabulary <iri-to-vocab> .
Manu Sporny: So, the current proposal seems to be: <current-document> rdfa:hasVocabulary <iri-to-vocab> . ←
14:29:05 <manu1> q+ to discuss an issue
Manu Sporny: q+ to discuss an issue ←
14:29:54 <lindstream> np; short version: I'm beginning to agree with Ivan's suggestion
Niklas Lindström: np; short version: I'm beginning to agree with Ivan's suggestion ←
14:30:15 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
14:30:22 <ivan> ack manu1
Ivan Herman: ack manu1 ←
14:30:22 <Zakim> manu1, you wanted to discuss an issue
Zakim IRC Bot: manu1, you wanted to discuss an issue ←
14:30:44 <manu1> ack ivan
Manu Sporny: ack ivan ←
14:31:42 <gkellogg> q+
Gregg Kellogg: q+ ←
14:31:47 <manu1> ack gkellogg
Manu Sporny: ack gkellogg ←
14:32:14 <lindstream> q+
Niklas Lindström: q+ ←
14:32:42 <ShaneM> q+ to say ask why the rdfs claim would matter?
Shane McCarron: q+ to say ask why the rdfs claim would matter? ←
14:32:53 <manu1> ack lindstream
Manu Sporny: ack lindstream ←
14:34:07 <gkellogg> vocab1 { dc:title rdfs:subPropertyOf rdfs:label } vocab2 { dc:title rdfs:subPropertyOf something else}
Gregg Kellogg: vocab1 { dc:title rdfs:subPropertyOf rdfs:label } vocab2 { dc:title rdfs:subPropertyOf something else} ←
14:34:29 <gkellogg> … expands all use of dc:title within document
Gregg Kellogg: … expands all use of dc:title within document ←
14:34:50 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
14:34:52 <manu1> ack ShaneM
Manu Sporny: ack ShaneM ←
14:34:52 <Zakim> ShaneM, you wanted to say ask why the rdfs claim would matter?
Zakim IRC Bot: ShaneM, you wanted to say ask why the rdfs claim would matter? ←
14:35:48 <Benjamin> Shane: initially, rdfs expansion was not in scope of the RDFa processor?
Shane McCarron: initially, rdfs expansion was not in scope of the RDFa processor? ←
14:36:04 <ShaneM> Benjamin: and it still is not
Benjamin Adrian: and it still is not [ Scribe Assist by Shane McCarron ] ←
14:36:25 <manu1> ack ivan
Manu Sporny: ack ivan ←
14:36:29 <lindstream> RDFS uses multiple inheritance FTW ;)
Niklas Lindström: RDFS uses multiple inheritance FTW ;) ←
14:37:14 <MacTed> +1
Ted Thibodeau: +1 ←
14:37:47 <Benjamin> manu: finally, there is no issue with the current proposal
Manu Sporny: finally, there is no issue with the current proposal ←
14:38:57 <Benjamin> ivan: let's accept the proposal
Ivan Herman: let's accept the proposal ←
14:39:00 <gkellogg> Also generate <> a rdfa:Source when @vocab encountered?
Gregg Kellogg: Also generate <> a rdfa:Source when @vocab encountered? ←
14:39:12 <MacTed> +1 uses
Ted Thibodeau: +1 uses ←
14:39:30 <manu1> PROPOSAL: Generate a triple in the default graph when the @vocab attribute is processed: <current-document> rdfa:usesVocabulary <iri-to-vocab> .
PROPOSED: Generate a triple in the default graph when the @vocab attribute is processed: <current-document> rdfa:usesVocabulary <iri-to-vocab> . ←
14:39:34 <ivan> +1
Ivan Herman: +1 ←
14:39:35 <manu1> +1
Manu Sporny: +1 ←
14:39:37 <gkellogg> +1
Gregg Kellogg: +1 ←
14:39:37 <bergie> +1
Henri Bergius: +1 ←
14:39:37 <MacTed> +1
Ted Thibodeau: +1 ←
14:39:39 <ShaneM> +1
Shane McCarron: +1 ←
14:39:39 <Benjamin> +1
+1 ←
14:39:40 <lindstream> +1
Niklas Lindström: +1 ←
14:39:41 <Knud> +1
Knud Möller: +1 ←
14:39:54 <manu1> RESOLVED: Generate a triple in the default graph when the @vocab attribute is processed: <current-document> rdfa:usesVocabulary <iri-to-vocab> .
RESOLVED: Generate a triple in the default graph when the @vocab attribute is processed: <current-document> rdfa:usesVocabulary <iri-to-vocab> . ←
14:39:55 <lindstream> Topic: Generating provenance triples
14:39:55 <lindstream> and +1 to Gregg's "also rdfa:Source"
Niklas Lindström: and +1 to Gregg's "also rdfa:Source" ←
14:40:13 <ivan> <uriofdocument> a rdfa:Source .
Ivan Herman: <uriofdocument> a rdfa:Source . ←
14:40:47 <Benjamin> manu: Why is the triple useful?
Manu Sporny: Why is the triple useful? ←
14:40:59 <ShaneM> You need to know provenance. I agree
Shane McCarron: You need to know provenance. I agree ←
14:41:12 <Benjamin> ivan: At the moment there is no way to make preserve any provenance information
Ivan Herman: At the moment there is no way to make preserve any provenance information ←
14:41:25 <MacTed> Zakim, unmute me
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, unmute me ←
14:41:25 <Zakim> MacTed should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: MacTed should no longer be muted ←
14:41:49 <Benjamin> .. in terms of indexing, the index should contain links to originating sources
.. in terms of indexing, the index should contain links to originating sources ←
14:42:01 <lindstream> Maybe rdfa:Source will mean e.g. "this resource is data markup using RDFa" ?
Niklas Lindström: Maybe rdfa:Source will mean e.g. "this resource is data markup using RDFa" ? ←
14:42:38 <Benjamin> MacTed: That's also how we do it in our product.
Ted Thibodeau: That's also how we do it in our product. ←
14:43:05 <lindstream> q+
Niklas Lindström: q+ ←
14:43:29 <manu1> ack lindstream
Manu Sporny: ack lindstream ←
14:44:25 <MacTed> a look at an example... http://linkeddata.uriburner.com/about/html/http://linkeddata.uriburner.com/about/id/entity/http/cprtheory.referata.com/wiki/Main_Page
Ted Thibodeau: a look at an example... http://linkeddata.uriburner.com/about/html/http://linkeddata.uriburner.com/about/id/entity/http/cprtheory.referata.com/wiki/Main_Page ←
14:44:35 <Benjamin> manu: it is not related to the vocab attribute
Manu Sporny: it is not related to the vocab attribute ←
14:45:54 <Benjamin> MacTed: It's about this is document the processor extracted RDFa from
Ted Thibodeau: It's about this is document the processor extracted RDFa from ←
14:46:15 <lindstream> btw, rdfa:Source should be a subClassOf (e.g.) foaf:Document
Niklas Lindström: btw, rdfa:Source should be a subClassOf (e.g.) foaf:Document ←
14:46:23 <Benjamin> ShaneM: It is a provenance concern
Shane McCarron: It is a provenance concern ←
14:46:57 <Benjamin> MacTed: The minimum that I need is, this is document were I got the data from.
Ted Thibodeau: The minimum that I need is, this is document were I got the data from. ←
14:47:31 <lindstream> .. *if* we got data from it? (Even just from rel stylesheet?)
Niklas Lindström: .. *if* we got data from it? (Even just from rel stylesheet?) ←
14:47:37 <Benjamin> manu: That means in every default graph of an RDFa processor a triple shuld exist that says where the data comes from
Manu Sporny: That means in every default graph of an RDFa processor a triple shuld exist that says where the data comes from ←
14:48:03 <Benjamin> manu: But if we merge two graphs, such triples become useless
Manu Sporny: But if we merge two graphs, such triples become useless ←
14:48:30 <Benjamin> MacTed: Of course you have to add graph identifiers
Ted Thibodeau: Of course you have to add graph identifiers ←
14:48:32 <lindstream> q+
Niklas Lindström: q+ ←
14:48:37 <manu1> ack lindstream
Manu Sporny: ack lindstream ←
14:50:26 <lindstream> quads are beyond the scope of this issue...
Niklas Lindström: quads are beyond the scope of this issue... ←
14:52:17 <MacTed> <current graph> foaf:primaryTopic <parsed-document>
Ted Thibodeau: <current graph> foaf:primaryTopic <parsed-document> ←
14:52:22 <lindstream> .. are we at risk of conflating documents and graphs here?
Niklas Lindström: .. are we at risk of conflating documents and graphs here? ←
14:52:35 <ivan> <base>
Ivan Herman: <base> ←
14:53:02 <lindstream> q+
Niklas Lindström: q+ ←
14:53:54 <MacTed> Topic: Default Graph vs. Output Graph Terminology
14:53:54 <MacTed> <graphURI> foaf:primaryTopic <htmlURI>
Ted Thibodeau: <graphURI> foaf:primaryTopic <htmlURI> ←
14:53:58 <gkellogg> Then we'd need to make assertions about graphs, which requires quads
Gregg Kellogg: Then we'd need to make assertions about graphs, which requires quads ←
14:54:13 <MacTed> <> foaf:primaryTopic <htmlURI>
Ted Thibodeau: <> foaf:primaryTopic <htmlURI> ←
14:54:15 <bergie> q+
Henri Bergius: q+ ←
14:55:00 <ivan> ack lindstream
Ivan Herman: ack lindstream ←
14:55:40 <bergie> Zakim, unmute me
Henri Bergius: Zakim, unmute me ←
14:55:40 <Zakim> bergie should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bergie should no longer be muted ←
14:55:48 <manu1> ack bergie
Manu Sporny: ack bergie ←
14:55:49 <MacTed> I'm also in Provenance WG... :-)
Ted Thibodeau: I'm also in Provenance WG... :-) ←
14:56:27 <ShaneM> Bless you. someone has to do it.
Shane McCarron: Bless you. someone has to do it. ←
14:57:10 <Benjamin> http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/prov/raw-file/default/model/ProvenanceModel.html
http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/prov/raw-file/default/model/ProvenanceModel.html ←
14:57:10 <MacTed> <> describes <sourceURI>
Ted Thibodeau: <> describes <sourceURI> ←
14:57:39 <gkellogg> Only different if document has html>head>base?
Gregg Kellogg: Only different if document has html>head>base? ←
14:59:05 <lindstream> ... while graph identifiers enable us to "have turtles all the way down", we're within the RDFa "turtle" and should stay here.
Niklas Lindström: ... while graph identifiers enable us to "have turtles all the way down", we're within the RDFa "turtle" and should stay here. ←
15:00:17 <lindstream> q+
Niklas Lindström: q+ ←
15:00:17 <bergie> so, my proposal was not to set a source URI for a given graph, since the graph itself doesn't have an identifier
Henri Bergius: so, my proposal was not to set a source URI for a given graph, since the graph itself doesn't have an identifier ←
15:00:33 <bergie> but instead to just say "this subject has data coming from this RDFa document"
Henri Bergius: but instead to just say "this subject has data coming from this RDFa document" ←
15:00:42 <ShaneM> I agree with Ted that this is a significant terminology issue.
Shane McCarron: I agree with Ted that this is a significant terminology issue. ←
15:00:45 <bergie> Zakim, unmute me
Henri Bergius: Zakim, unmute me ←
15:00:46 <Zakim> bergie was not muted, bergie
Zakim IRC Bot: bergie was not muted, bergie ←
15:01:02 <ShaneM> I also agree that we should have a way to reference our 'graph' in notation.
Shane McCarron: I also agree that we should have a way to reference our 'graph' in notation. ←
15:01:09 <bergie> Zakim, mute me
Henri Bergius: Zakim, mute me ←
15:01:11 <Zakim> bergie should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bergie should now be muted ←
15:01:23 <lindstream> +1 on "output graph". But let's *not* talk about identifiers for graphs in RDFa..
Niklas Lindström: +1 on "output graph". But let's *not* talk about identifiers for graphs in RDFa.. ←
15:01:26 <manu1> ISSUE: Resolve differences terminology for 'default graph' and 'output graph'.
ISSUE: Resolve differences terminology for 'default graph' and 'output graph'. ←
15:01:26 <trackbot> Created ISSUE-109 - Resolve differences terminology for 'default graph' and 'output graph'. ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/109/edit .
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ISSUE-109 - Resolve differences terminology for 'default graph' and 'output graph'. ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/109/edit . ←
15:02:00 <Benjamin> ivan: processors may have difficulties in generating such provenance triples because of the lack of names for originating graphs. We don't have a mechansim to name the output graph
Ivan Herman: processors may have difficulties in generating such provenance triples because of the lack of names for originating graphs. We don't have a mechansim to name the output graph ←
15:02:15 <bergie> +1 lindstream, on both points
Henri Bergius: +1 lindstream, on both points ←
15:03:17 <Benjamin> manu: This is end of the call. We need to define additional issues
Manu Sporny: This is end of the call. We need to define additional issues ←
15:03:36 <manu1> ISSUE: Should RDFa Processor output a triple for the source of a graph?
ISSUE: Should RDFa Processor output a triple for the source of a graph? ←
15:03:36 <trackbot> Created ISSUE-110 - Should RDFa Processor output a triple for the source of a graph? ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/110/edit .
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ISSUE-110 - Should RDFa Processor output a triple for the source of a graph? ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/110/edit . ←
15:03:57 <scor> The Definitive Guide to Drupal 7 book was published by Apress: http://definitivedrupal.org/ - one of the chapters I contributed is on Drupal and the Semantic Web, Linked Data and RDFa 1.0 (namespaces, prefixes, CURIEs, etc...)
Stéphane Corlosquet: The Definitive Guide to Drupal 7 book was published by Apress: http://definitivedrupal.org/ - one of the chapters I contributed is on Drupal and the Semantic Web, Linked Data and RDFa 1.0 (namespaces, prefixes, CURIEs, etc...) ←
15:05:45 <bergie> congrats about the book! hopefully the Drupal 8 edition will be able to talk about VIE as well :-)
Henri Bergius: congrats about the book! hopefully the Drupal 8 edition will be able to talk about VIE as well :-) ←
15:06:19 <Zakim> -Knud
Zakim IRC Bot: -Knud ←
15:06:20 <scor> thanks. sure! I still need to take a closer look at VIE though :)
Stéphane Corlosquet: thanks. sure! I still need to take a closer look at VIE though :) ←
15:06:25 <Zakim> -gkellogg
Zakim IRC Bot: -gkellogg ←
15:06:29 <Zakim> -MacTed
Zakim IRC Bot: -MacTed ←
15:06:31 <Zakim> -scor
Zakim IRC Bot: -scor ←
15:06:34 <Zakim> -bergie
Zakim IRC Bot: -bergie ←
15:06:35 <Zakim> -ShaneM
Zakim IRC Bot: -ShaneM ←
15:06:35 <bergie> scor: if you need any help or info, just ping me
Stéphane Corlosquet: if you need any help or info, just ping me [ Scribe Assist by Henri Bergius ] ←
15:06:43 <scor> alright will do!
Stéphane Corlosquet: alright will do! ←
15:06:48 <Benjamin> rrsagent, make minutes
rrsagent, make minutes ←
15:06:49 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/08/25-rdfa-minutes.html Benjamin
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/08/25-rdfa-minutes.html Benjamin ←
15:09:47 <MacTed> Named Graphs are a popular topic... http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2011.08.25
Ted Thibodeau: Named Graphs are a popular topic... http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2011.08.25 ←
15:10:49 <MacTed> also see http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/wiki/TF-Graphs
Ted Thibodeau: also see http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/wiki/TF-Graphs ←
15:10:49 <MacTed> and http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/wiki/TF-Graphs/RDF-Datasets-Proposal
Ted Thibodeau: and http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/wiki/TF-Graphs/RDF-Datasets-Proposal ←
15:11:55 <Zakim> -Benjamin
Zakim IRC Bot: -Benjamin ←
15:12:20 <manu1> Thanks for scribing, Benjamin!
Manu Sporny: Thanks for scribing, Benjamin! ←
15:13:14 <Zakim> -manu1
Zakim IRC Bot: -manu1 ←
15:15:26 <Zakim> -Ivan
Zakim IRC Bot: -Ivan ←
15:15:28 <Zakim> -lindstream
Zakim IRC Bot: -lindstream ←
15:15:30 <Zakim> SW_RDFa()10:00AM has ended
Zakim IRC Bot: SW_RDFa()10:00AM has ended ←
15:15:32 <Zakim> Attendees were +358.405.25aaaa, bergie, Ivan, scor, Benjamin, gkellogg, lindstream, MacTed, Knud, ShaneM, manu1
Zakim IRC Bot: Attendees were +358.405.25aaaa, bergie, Ivan, scor, Benjamin, gkellogg, lindstream, MacTed, Knud, ShaneM, manu1 ←
Formatted by CommonScribe
This revision (#2) generated 2011-08-26 09:46:55 UTC by 'ivan', comments: None