07 Nov 2008



Shawn, Doyle, Song, Sharron, Andrew, Yeliz, Wayne, William
Alan, Anna, Jack, Lisa, Sylvie, Henny


Translation priorities

Shawn:We have a small group today and a short agenda. I've recruited a lot of translators. We'll also talk WCAG 2. First on the list is to consider the translation priorities. We do need to update the list of documents to be translated. Please look at the priorites of translating WAI documents.
... Song could you comment on translation priorities either on IRC or on the phone.
... and a reminder to everyone that we have three sections. First is the foundations document, then introduction docs, and third the techical materials which are harder. Think about thes need for translation of these documents. Not necessarily for a university class, or formal use. Which is more important for translation into other languages?
... looking through specifically, to move an item one bullet up or down is not a big deal. The main question is do you agree that these are the highest priority for translation?

William: Are there only two choices?

Shawn: Yes, for now. Let us look at the two lists of technical priorities.

Sharron: I think the WAI materials document looks ok except for the materials.

Shawn: Back when list was made, WCAG 2 was top priority. Is that still as important? What about WAI ARIA in 2009? Is that as high a priority?

Yeliz: I agree with Sharron. I thought Web content guidelines is appropriate.

Shawn: What about moving WCAG 2 to the first list but move it to the bottom of that list?

Sharron: Fine

Yeliz: Yes

Andrew: Yes

Wayne: Are there any time dependencies?

Shawn: Status is major revisions for 2008 November. If I talk to someone now. I'd say put it on your list and look for the updated coming out.

Wayne: Where are you moving it from?

Shawn: The introductory
... WCAG overview is up there and the update will move it from covering one, to focusing on WCAG 2.
... anything else?

Sharron: Did you say Shawn whether the WAI ARIA suite or WCAG 2 overview will have a higher priority?

Shawn: yeah.
... I tweaked the order of the priorities. Should we say lets' watch for WAI ARIA? And let's look at the other things down there.

Yeliz: What about the aging documents?

Shawn: We don't have anyything ready yet.

Yeliz: I have two done for Turkish.

Sharron: For 2008 or 2009 list?

Shawn: The point is for that these are mostly basically done. If you want to get started feel free but there will still be some changes. Does that make that a little more clear?

Andrew: Adding change the note under people documents.
... maybe use a slightly stronger color?
... and under business case for 2009 slightly higher priority for WCAG 2

Shawn: I am thinking of a Translator perspective. If a document has already been translated, how much change will be needed from a translation standpoint? Is it minor?

Andrew: Yes I suppose a 10% change.

Shawn: You don't have to do a major translation then.

Wayne: Should Standards Harmonisation move down from the top priority group?

Shawn: I moved it up when I was in Russia, they said we are working on Accessibility Guidelines. I said why don't you just do WCAG 2? For translation is that a higher priority?

Wayne: OK

Shawn: It depends upon the particular language or country area.

Sharron: That sounds pretty specific to Russia. Same high rates in other countries.

Shawn: In almost every country.

Andrew: In your own country!!

Sharron: okkkkkkkkkkk

William: So perhaps harmonization belongs higher on the list actually.

Shawn: It depends on the country but make for certain situations. Certain countries.
... Wayne are you ok leaving it there?

Wayne: Yes. But I think it may be changed at a later time. The document itself should be changed.

Shawn: We need a short version of it.

Wayne: Stay right up there.

Shawn: We thought we would move the WAI ARIA suite up too.
... OK anything else on top priority? Andrew and I will try to remember any of the WAI-AGE materials to add here. Comments on the more technical materials?
... we put the WCAG 2 materials in the to be completed. I will clarify that as well.

William:I feel strongly in agreement with Wayne that as a technical standard, it is vital that WCAG 2.0 have top priority of all this stuff.

Shawn: The first thing used to be WCAG 1, and we have moved that to the no longer recommeneded as it is now outdated. WCAG 2 is to be completed in 2008. Put the status as mostly complete but some changes in November.
... we leave up there.

William: It is ready for translation.

Shawn: We need to let people know it is ready for translation.

William: WAI is trying to get into the standards field. The one document where Wayne talks about this as a new way to talk about this from before. An actual intellectual standard.

Shawn: We need to make clear that it is ready for translation yet. We need to communicate that there are still some changes.

William: I've made my point.

Shawn: How about we move it up, but very clearly indicate the status of still making some changes.

William: Make that a focus to get out.

Shawn: Refresh. And look under longer more technical materials.

William: I want it to be the very foremost thing to do.

Shawn: That is an interesting point...other thoughts?

Wayne: I agree with that.

William: OK yeah, most of us are not standards people. Not a world we live in but Wayne does. Putting out WCAG 2 as our very first real acceptable standard to the geek community.

Shawn: I am not sure about that, but thank you for that.

Andrew: Before top priority. Shall we mark it as super urgent.

Wayne: I think super urgent is true.

William: Start way before it is final. We need the feedback that effects what you put into the the original document. Translate in a minor language and there are missing issues.

Shawn: Any objections or concerns of moving into the top priority list?

Wayne: I think it is important, the Russian group that looked like an accessibity standard they would be ready to copy from that. Harmonization is a difficult thing. There is significant difference between law and standard. It can be different, because it is binding. Force you can put behind it.

Shawn: Refresh. William advocates putting up that first thing, or is it introduction and components first because they are short and easy, and then overview at a glance.

William: Short and easy does not merit being over the flagship item.

Shawn: For example if there is hardly any awareness in your language, what are the very first things you need available in your language? That everyone needs available in their native langauge?
... Song what things do you think are most useful? We'd love to hear your insights.

Song: Well, it already has been translated into Korean. We are printing WCAG 1 into 2.0. As to publishing 2.0 we have updated our national standards.

Shawn: So, for a country that does NOT have any accessibility information in their native langauge, do you think it is most important to have 2.0 first or introductory documents first?
... thoughts on that?

Song: In the Korean environment we have already made this choice. So the introduction does not need to be lower in priority.

Wayne: That is interesting that they have made that decision.

Shawn: Yes?

Wayne: There are two categories in the top priorit relate to the guidelines, and actually the web area. To make the guidelines complete, then we have a whole bunch of process documents. Put in a second group. Get our content and various levels of introductions up first and then talk about WAI stuff and all are important like what accessibility to leave to the particular translator.
... get the description of the guidelines first, then talk about WAI political priorities.

Shawn: Introduction to web accessibility is not WAI oriented.

Wayne: Thantis a ground level thing to have translated too. Top priority, intro, ...web content overview, and WCAG at a glance ...are essential and other things come below that.

Shawn: To support the point that these lists are too long and need sub listing.

Yeliz: I agree with Wayne. Have the introductory items as the top priorities. You can't find any documents in Turkish to find something that offers broad perspective. Have the overview documents as top priority. The technical documents are not as important.

Shawn: think about any other comments. I'll make another pass at a sub grouping. Will that work?

William: yes.

Andrew: It looks like harmonization will then drop down a level. That would be a shame. Let's look at the organiation that we can come up with.
... I think harmonization should come immediately after the guidelines. To understand why to follow than go on their own.

Shawn: I will plan to do next to make a few changes and if you would send an email for discussion.

Wayne: Make it a priority to include a summary version of harmonization in the first group.

Shawn: I agree.

Wayne: My reasoning is that we have learned a lot to refine WCAG 2.0 that we didn't have in mind when we wrote the harmonization document.

Shawn: We have on our list to do a short bit on that. A mini tutorial or presentation on this. Anything else? Next on the agenda.

WCAG 2.0 education and outreach for next few months. Recent announcements:

<andrew> clap clap clap

Shawn:Announcements : WAI IG email: WCAG 2.0 moves to last stage for expected final publication in December 2008.
... Blog post: With real world implementations WCAG 2.0 steps closer to expected December 2008 publication.
...any comments on the messaging so far?

Sharron: The blog posts have been terrific. What sort of response has there been?

Shawn: William was the first on the blog posts. We have had some comments, some pickup on Accessify and on another list. When you do something good, it is ignored. If the volume is overwelming what can you do?

Andrew: What makes the front page of the newspapers. Bad news not good news.

Shawn: At a SXSW panel Sharron Bob and I addressed all the issues and it did not get blogged. How do we generate positive excitement.

Sharron: I plan to write up that we use WCAG 2 for AIR criteria and that was very fun, and people enjoyed having all the materials geared to a new standard.

Shawn: What about doing a call for asking people get up to WCAG 2. They say hey we meet WCAG 2!

Sharron: Yes that's a good idea.

William: Writing anything in this vein. Have a subtext that most people don't know WCAG this is the introduction of accessibility to the web. Don 't have to writeit out, the new people coming are our most important audience.

Shawn: I agree.

William: We have this standard for web accessibility, not just an update.

Shawn: There are certain people that are easy to get. Anyone one who subscribes already and is accessibility aware, we can get to really easy. Is that our first tier? Then looking more broadly a little more work, to reach people who don't know accessibility.

WilliamWe aren't called the in reach working group.

Shawn:But we do talk about in reach. Two or three years ago we had some project reviews. Now we think of doing reviews.

William: In the general society the notion of inclusion is important to get across.

Shawn: The next two months will be taken up with WCAG 2 but right after that. I want us to step out of WCAG to talk about authoring tools, and reach people who don't know. About the basics of accessbility.

Wayne: We have some very good generally compliant web developers. And then we have people who say they didn't know blind people could use the web. That attitude is very extensive in the actual practicing community. I don't think it is something to get depressed over. Just something to be aware of.

Shawn: I like that group of people who don't know yet. They get excited about accessibility. Around accessibility and where we need to go after that.

William: Korea and Australia have already been done address in Korea we should take leadership from them.

Shawn: How does that impact the next few months?

William: We have a role model to go for. Instead of being the role model anymore. We are not the number one language on the web.

Shawn: Other thoughts to message in the next two months? What documents we work on, blogs to write, press releases to send?

Wayne: At a glance is important and would be helpful. Writing a blog about WCAG is long because it is layered. We can't expect people to read it all at once. Look at one level, keep going down levels set it up to be useful at a particular task. A serial blog would be very efficient in that regard.

Shawn: One of the things to revise in the next couple of weeks. That point needs to come through very clearly Wayne. If you can help with revisions to make that point come through clearly.

William: WCAG quick tips is not there.

Sharron: It is on the list as at a glance.

Shawn: Yeliz any thoughts? Problem areas is the UK. Talked to a reported in the UK in Russia going out about taking so long on WCAG 2. UK is one area is the toughest. What can we do in the UK?

Yeliz: In what area do you mean?

Shawn: In terms of the next two months preparing for the final announcment of WCAG 2 in December, what we can do for the adoption and attitudes about that in the UK.

Yeliz: Working with an organization like RNIB in collaboration would be good.

Shawn: We do have a couple of people at least three people from RNIB in France. And two others from there, we have a good connection there. What about the blogsphere? Is tis a chance to bring some our critics on board?

William: Find a blog that is a critic and reply to those comments.

<shawn> http://accessify.com/news/2008/11/wcag2-proposed-recommendation/

Sharron: If a small cadre of us can consistantly respond to ill informed or mistaken comments , it could very effective to maintain a constant message.

Shawn: W3C tracks online see a blog or thread. If you come across one we haven't seen please send it in.

William: If you find one that is supportive you must also reply.

Shawn: That a good point. Kind of a "thanks for spreading the news" comment.

William: I get the feeling that while the decisions will be made in executive session, but it will be for us to deal with. The pending public relations should be announced.

Shawn: It is member space it is not hidden. We will do it in EO in the next few weeks.

Wayne: When we ask European or Australian people that have the same level as 508 is, how their guidelines are used and implemented now in other places. Worth going to the next question - How to super impose WCAG on those documents. I am certain WCAG covers everything. Isn't there a Europen or UK we can reconcile?

Shawn: A few are yes.

Wayne: Like in CSUN to move your standards over to WCAG 2. Realize that what they are required that WCAG 2 is it, and not needed for a whole lot more. Save them some work.

Shawn: LisaP is working on the document transitioning to WCAG 2. Have you seen that Wayne? Have something from that in the next couple of weeks.

Yeliz: Last week I was at an event where they were looking at the public sites. Presenter was from ability net. Have we worked with them? They help government organizations to work with as well?

Shawn: We have some connections. I'll look at who is doing what.

Yeliz: They work closely with the government now.

Shawn: Andrew have you interacted with Ability net?

Andrew not in the last three four months. I'll try to reach some of them.

Yeliz: I exchanged emails with Robin Christopher, head of accessbility services. Gave a presentation which was really good. A good person for outreach in UK.

Shawn: Anything else?
... then the next couple of weeks be looking for WCAG 2 documents, maybe some other WAI age materials in December.

William: FCC freed up some space for a wireless web in the U.S. It changes everything.

Shawn: Have a great weekend.

Summary of Action Items

[End of minutes]

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