11 Mar 2005


See also: IRC log


Andrew, Shadi, Shawn, Henk, Justin, Wayne, Judy, Jack, Roberto
alan, doyle



i can

your welcome

<scribe> scribenick: Justin

<shawn> scribenick: Justin

Wayne: I am teaching a class on Web Architecture and Usability and they will be working on retrofitting web sites.

Judy: We have a retrofitting document

Outreach Updates

<rcastaldo> Hi folks :-)

<Andrew> hi roberto

<rcastaldo> hi

Jack: There is fair amount of interest withiin folks in Boeing on retrofitting web sites. At some point and time we will be quite interested in it.

Judy: Daniel Dardailler (sp?) did a conf. talk about W3C standards in europe

Andrew: We ran a trial workshop on writing for the web with an emphasis on web usability and accessibility.

i am interested as well

Shawn: WAI IG had a discussion suggested EO do writing guidelines for web accessibility.

<Andrew> The NILS Web Writing Workshop is outlined at http://www.nils.org.au/ais/web/workshops/writing-melb.html

Selecting Web Accessibility Evaluation Tools

Shadi: While the structure stayed the same...I reworded a lot. As I worked on strategies for selecting it became its out section.
... If we can go at the last section I have grouped and worked some of the items that to me make some more sense...I would be interested in hearing people comments.
... In the considerations section I have added some examples, a little bit of users, and how it fits in the process.

Judy: Brief general reactions?

Henk: In the top navigation bar, most of the links are not numbered except one.

<rcastaldo> I've read section 1, and I do like it

Henk: We are not evaluating the checks we are evaluating the web sites. Would it be better to say to help users preform web accessibility checks.
... I struggled with the second sentence of the intro.

Shadi: Evaluation reviews

Henk: That would work.
... In what eval tools can't do...there is the word in the last sentence....precise results or accurate results. Which is better?

Judy: I am concerned with overall that that sentence is very discouraging.

<Andrew> "accurate" is better

Judy: It looks too exclusive.
... Whats the main thing we are trying to communicate?

Wayne: Is this trying to say that the user has to pay attention to learning the limitations of the tool that they use?

Shadi: Yes
... it is a tool and it needs to be used correctly.

Henk: I do agree with Judy...we have to deal with the two ends....there is no tool with which you can check and repair your whole site with everything.

Wayne: In that sentence...there maybe a skilll requirement to use some tools effectively.

Shadi: correct, i don't know any tool that doesn't require some skills - or basic understanding.

Judy: Section 2 - considerations

Andrew: I think this needs a little bit of copy editing...but its good

Wayne: The organization was explained. These are the big things we want people to think about.

not really

<rcastaldo> It looks fine and language sounds plain

Judy: I am not sure where to fit this in. The size of this document is a little overwhelming. I keep worrying about an individual who is looking for quick things and lands in this. I don't know if there is anything....the intro is very well broken out.
... In considerations...maybe those need to be h3's


h3's would help

Shawn: I had the same reaction when i tried to skim it. We talked about short slide set about these documents. It would be good to give people a version where its quick and link to more details.

Shadi: are the titles for the overall sections...are those descriptive enough...that a experienced user would jump to features. Can we play with the in page navigation?

Wayne: Being able to navigate to the places is the trick here.
... The content looks like the write stuff if your looking for a tool.

Henk: the content is not the problem...but the formatting is an issue for me.

Judy: shadi, maybe you can use the h3s and see how you react to the titles.
... Section 3 - Characteristics

Henk: in page feed back tools...last sentence use maybe and some.

Andrew: I had a problem with that sentence also

Shadi: The sequence in which the table cells are perceived....

Wayne: maybe features might be a little bit better and a little more plain language.

Henk: You might have one tool with many features...a tool with wizard interface feature

Shadi: I need some more discussion

Judy: Tools that generate reports

Wayne: What if you dropped off tools?

Shadi: It was exactly like that before....in the previous version I was approaching this from the user interface...now i realize its about the characteristics.

Henk: the word mediate is off.

Judy: The sentence is still kind of complex

<rcastaldo> I have to leave the call for few minutes

Judy: Section 4

Shadi: Is it easy to skim?

<Wayne> II need to leave early now, goodbye

bye Wayne

Shadi: If i can some more comments on the structure rather then the content

Henk: We need more white space

<rcastaldo> I'm back

Henk: Reliability...false negatives and positives seemed like they are switched.
... How about reporting false failures?
... second explanation...detecting wrong ones, its reporting false failures

Shawn: Rather then going into the details of which is which....what if just sayed false negative or false positives and then here are the examples

<Andrew> Judy (and Andrew agreed) that the terms are used correctly

Judy: We could just give the examples and not use the terms.
... Its a strong concept that seems to resonate with people.

shadi: How about examples, then the terms

Andrew: Under checkpoint coverage...the whole idea of spidering seems to have been dropped.

Shadi: I was having difficulties with where to place that. its a more overaching issue.

Shadi; I grant your point about manual checkpoint coverage could be reworked...to reflect how tools can help.

Judy: How do we want to remind ppl to comment on the list?

Shadi: If you can send out a request to the list.

Judy: Ill point people to the changelog so people now what we have talked about

WAI Flyer

<shawn> start of requirements & changelog: http://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/changelogs/cl-flyer.html

Judy; the version in the agenda was a linear one

Judy: We use it mostly as a print document.
... Flyer on one side and quick tips poster on the other side.
... We have newer sponsors.
... If we can take a look at resources and activies.

<Zakim> shawn, you wanted to point out overlap with translations priorities

Shawn: We talked about the core set in the translation policies.


Judy: Can I see where people are at?

Andrew: Taking a look what this is for and who its for would be a good idea

Jack: I am still trying to get an idea of what this is for

<Andrew> Andrew: some things obvioulsy need to be included - documents/suites developed in the last few years

Jack: I get the idea this is for someone who is brand new.

Judy: this is a one pager to hand out at the conf.

<shawn> rough draft of translations core set from last week's f2f discussion:

<shawn> WAI QuickTips (short), http://www.w3.org/WAI/References/QuickTips/, translations of WAI Quick Tips

<shawn> Implementation Plan

<shawn> * Introduction to Web Accessibility

<shawn> * Essential Components of Web Accessibility

<shawn> * Why Standards Harmonization is Essential to Web Accessibility

<shawn> * Overview of the Web Accessibility Initiative, http://www.w3.org/Talks/WAI-Intro/, [note: updated quarterly... @@ Overview of the Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI) Slides ]

<shawn> How People with Disabilities Use the Web (medium-length)

<shawn> [Business Case Overview Slide Set]

<shawn> [Evaluation page(s) after revised]

<rcastaldo> I'm here

<shawn> what WAI does from redesigned home page:

<shawn> WAI develops...

<shawn> - guidelines widely regarded as the international standards for Web accessibility

<shawn> - support materials to help understand and implement Web accessibility

<shawn> - resources, through international collaboration

<shawn> WAI welcomes...

roberto: It is very difficult to find a good summary of the activities and resources of WAI

<shawn> - participation from around the world

<shawn> volunteers to review, implement, and - promote guidelines

<shawn> - dedicated participants in interest groups or working groups

Roberto: One of the most important things is that we have alot of educational materials.

Judy; I want to get this interim revision out soon.

<shawn> start of requirements (just revised from this discussion): http://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/changelogs/cl-flyer.html

<judy> http://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/changelogs/cl-flyer.html

Judy: reading the requirements doc
... This is the place where list our sponsors.
... The sponsor list is pretty outdated
... We need to see if the core set fits here.
... Roberto talk about how its key for first impressions


<judy> test?

Judy: For the core set what do people think about that?
... It doesn't include the guidelines
... No meeting next week

your welcome

<rcastaldo> HI all

<judy> thanks justin

<judy> bye all

ill do it to the minutes later

Summary of Action Items

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$Date: 2005/09/05 09:02:26 $

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Found ScribeNick: Justin
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Default Present: Andrew, Shadi, Shawn, Henk, Justin, Judy, Wayne, Jack, roberto
Present: Andrew Shadi Shawn Henk Justin Wayne Judy Jack Roberto
Regrets: alan doyle
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-eo/2005JanMar/0166.html
Got date from IRC log name: 11 Mar 2005
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2005/03/11-eo-minutes.html
People with action items: 

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