ISSUE-97: Remove/Discard the Meter Element

meter

Remove/Discard the Meter Element

State:
CLOSED
Product:
HTML 5 spec
Raised by:
Shelley Powers
Opened on:
2010-01-11
Description:
Evidently, the meter element came about primarily so that people don't use the
Progress element incorrectly[1]. This seems a poor reason to create a new
element. Either the Progress element needs to have a better definition in the
spec, to prevent incorrect use, or the progress element is so confusing or is
so capable of being misunderstood, it should be pulled from the spec,
altogether.

Regardless of what happens with Progress, there seems little use case,
interest, or need for the meter element.

The meter element is supposedly acting as some form of static gauge, but
there's no way to associate exactly what it is that's being gauged, with the
gauge value. There is no way to specifically tie the value contained in the
meter element with the object, in such a way that the information can be useful
for web bots or other user agents. In addition, it's not particularly useful
for accessibility reasons, when text within a span element would be just as
useful, and just as viable.

As for a graphical display, it's just as simple to provide an image, or use
CSS, SVG, or Canvas, with the associated fall back defined for each.
Regardless, there is little instruction about how the element is displayed,
which adds to the general confusion about what the element is, and how it
should be supported.

Even the graphical example about half way through the section, showing Usenet
subscriptions, doesn't really add much information. One can see that 618
subscribers is significantly more than 22, just by reading the numbers--one
doesn't to see a picture to comprehend the difference. On the contrary, without
understanding why there seems to be an upper range, the gauge doesn't mean a
lot. Is the upper range a Usenet limit? The largest Usenet membership? Some
arbitrary number picked so one can have a cool picture?

In addition, the section mixes instructions for authors and user agents, HTML
editing and parsing in a confusing mish-mash of instructions, compounded by a
list of confusing rules about the interaction of the element's attributes and
values. One can almost guarantee that this element will be used incorrectly,
and most likely implemented incorrectly.

[1] http://lists.whatwg.org/htdig.cgi/whatwg-whatwg.org/2009-August/021931.html

Change Proposal:
http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/removemeter

HTML5-SPEC-SECTIONS [the-meter-element]
Related Actions Items:
No related actions
Related emails:
  1. {minutes} HTML WG Telecon 2010-12-09: status of actions, calls, new decisions (from Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com on 2010-12-16)
  2. Re: {agenda} HTML WG Telecon 2010-12-09: status of actions, calls, new decisions (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-12-09)
  3. {agenda} HTML WG Telecon 2010-12-09: status of actions, calls, new decisions (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-12-08)
  4. Working Group Decision on ISSUE-97 meter (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-12-07)
  5. HTML Working Group Status (from plh@w3.org on 2010-08-27)
  6. RE: {minutes} HTML WG telecon 2010-08-19: WG decisions, Decision Policy, TF reports (from adrianba@microsoft.com on 2010-08-19)
  7. {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-08-19: WG decisions, Decision Policy, TF reports (from Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com on 2010-08-17)
  8. {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-08-12: action 29; issues 116, 30, 109, 27; bugs 9894, 10066 (from rubys@intertwingly.net on 2010-08-11)
  9. RE: {minutes} HTML WG telecon 2010-08-04 [task force week] (from adrianba@microsoft.com on 2010-08-05)
  10. {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-08-04 [task force week] (from rubys@intertwingly.net on 2010-08-04)
  11. {minutes} HTML WG telecon 2010-07-29, WG decisions, issue review, WG surveys (from Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com on 2010-07-29)
  12. {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-07-29, WG decisions, issue review, WG surveys (from Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com on 2010-07-27)
  13. RE: {minutes} HTML WG telecon 2010-07-22 (from adrianba@microsoft.com on 2010-07-22)
  14. RE: {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-07-22 (from eliotgra@microsoft.com on 2010-07-22)
  15. RE: {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-07-22 (from krisk@microsoft.com on 2010-07-22)
  16. {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-07-22 (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-07-21)
  17. {minutes} HTML WG telecon 2010-07-15 (from Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com on 2010-07-15)
  18. {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-07-15: note new dial-in numbers for Paris and London (from rubys@intertwingly.net on 2010-07-14)
  19. {minutes} HTML WG telecon 2010-07-08: actions, issues, decisions, revised proposals, future surveys, TF reports (from Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com on 2010-07-08)
  20. FW: {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-07-08: actions, issues, decisions, revised proposals, future surveys, TF reports (from Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com on 2010-07-07)
  21. {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-07-08: actions, issues, decisions, revised proposals, future surveys, TF reports (from Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com on 2010-07-07)
  22. RE: {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-07-01: issues, surveys, decisions, publication status, TF reports (from Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com on 2010-06-30)
  23. {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-07-01: issues, surveys, decisions, publication status, TF reports (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-06-30)
  24. {minutes} } HTML WG telecon 2010-07-24: issues, surveys, decisions, publication status, TF reports (from Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com on 2010-06-25)
  25. Fwd: {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-07-24: issues, surveys, decisions, publication status, TF reports (from rubys@intertwingly.net on 2010-06-23)
  26. {minutes} HTML WG telecon 2010-06-10: action items, decision policy, task force reports, publication status (from adrianba@microsoft.com on 2010-06-10)
  27. Re: {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-06-10: action items, decision policy, task force reports, publication status (from laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com on 2010-06-10)
  28. FW: {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-06-10: action items, decision policy, task force reports, publication status (from Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com on 2010-06-10)
  29. {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-06-10: action items, decision policy, task force reports, publication status (from Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com on 2010-06-10)
  30. {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-06-03 (from rubys@intertwingly.net on 2010-06-02)
  31. RE: {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-05-27 (from adrianba@microsoft.com on 2010-05-27)
  32. Re: {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-05-27 (from faulkner.steve@gmail.com on 2010-05-27)
  33. Re: {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-05-27 (from laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com on 2010-05-27)
  34. {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-05-27 (from rubys@intertwingly.net on 2010-05-26)
  35. {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-05-20: Surveys close, Publishing new Working Drafts (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-05-19)
  36. minutes, 2010-05-13 HTML WG telcon (from mike@w3.org on 2010-05-14)
  37. World-readable issue survey results (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-05-13)
  38. {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2010-05-13: Action items, surveys, Task Force reports (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-05-12)
  39. ISSUE-97 - Removing the progress Element - Straw Poll for Objections (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-05-12)
  40. RE: {agenda} HTML WG telcon 2010-05-06: Action items, issues, decision policy, calls, surveys, publishing - minutes (from adrianba@microsoft.com on 2010-05-06)
  41. {agenda} HTML WG telcon 2010-05-06: Action items, issues, decision policy, calls, surveys, publishing (from rubys@intertwingly.net on 2010-05-05)
  42. HTML-A11Y Task Force Recommendation: ISSUES-90, 91, 93, 95, 96, & 97 (from janina@rednote.net on 2010-05-03)
  43. RE: {agenda} HTML WG telcon 2010-04-29: Action items, new issues, Task Force reports - minutes of the meeting (from adrianba@microsoft.com on 2010-04-29)
  44. {agenda} HTML WG telcon 2010-04-29: Action items, new issues, Task Force reports (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-04-28)
  45. Re: Zero-edit Change Proposal for ISSUE-90 figure, ISSUE-91 aside, ISSUE-93 details, ISSUE-95 hidden, ISSUE-96 progress, and ISSUE-97 meter (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-04-21)
  46. Minutes of HTML WG meeting, Apr 8 2010 (from Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com on 2010-04-08)
  47. {agenda} HTML WG telcon 2010-04-08: calls for proposals, issue status (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-04-07)
  48. Re: ISSUE-90, ISSUE-91, ISSUE-93, ISSUE-95, ISSUE-96, ISSSUE-97: (new semantic elements/attributes) - Chairs Solicit Alternate Proposals or Counter-Proposals (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-04-06)
  49. Fwd: native elements versus scripted (from shelley.just@gmail.com on 2010-04-06)
  50. Re: native elements versus scripted (from jonas@sicking.cc on 2010-04-06)
  51. Re: ISSUE-97 Change Proposal (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-04-06)
  52. native elements versus scripted (from shelley.just@gmail.com on 2010-04-06)
  53. Re: Removal of other semantic elements (from jonas@sicking.cc on 2010-04-04)
  54. Re: Removal of other semantic elements (from shelley.just@gmail.com on 2010-04-04)
  55. Re: Removal of other semantic elements (from faulkner.steve@gmail.com on 2010-04-04)
  56. Re: Removal of other semantic elements (from shelley.just@gmail.com on 2010-04-02)
  57. Re: Removal of other semantic elements (from shelley.just@gmail.com on 2010-04-02)
  58. Re: Removal of other semantic elements (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-04-02)
  59. RE: Removal of other semantic elements (from jfoliot@stanford.edu on 2010-04-02)
  60. Removal of other semantic elements (from jonas@sicking.cc on 2010-04-02)
  61. [minutes] 2010-04-01 HTML Teleconference (from rubys@intertwingly.net on 2010-04-01)
  62. Re: Change proposals uploaded to Wiki - URLs, suggestions on Issue 92 table (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-03-31)
  63. ISSUE-97 Change Proposal (from shelley.just@gmail.com on 2010-03-31)
  64. Re: {agenda} HTML WG telcon 2010-04-01: action items, decision policy update, issue status (from shelley.just@gmail.com on 2010-03-30)
  65. {agenda} HTML WG telcon 2010-04-01: action items, decision policy update, issue status (from Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com on 2010-03-30)
  66. {agenda} HTML WG telcon 2010-04-01: action items, decision policy update, issue status (from Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com on 2010-03-30)
  67. [minutes] 20100325 HTML teleconference (from plh@w3.org on 2010-03-30)
  68. Re: {agenda} HTML WG telcon 2010-03-25: decision policy, issue status, updates from meetings, task force reports (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-03-24)
  69. {agenda} HTML WG telcon 2010-03-25: decision policy, issue status, updates from meetings, task force reports (from rubys@intertwingly.net on 2010-03-24)
  70. Re: Breakdown of issues (from rubys@intertwingly.net on 2010-03-12)
  71. Breakdown of issues (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-03-12)
  72. Re: ISSUE-93 details - Call for Change Proposals (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-01-27)
  73. {agenda} HTML WG telcon 2010-01-28: (from mjs@apple.com on 2010-01-27)
  74. ISSUE-97 meter - Call for Change Proposals (from Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com on 2010-01-26)
  75. Re: {agenda} HTML WG telcon 2010-01-14: AIs, CfC/CfPs, TFs, plus: heartbeat docs (from shelley.just@gmail.com on 2010-01-13)
  76. {agenda} HTML WG telcon 2010-01-14: AIs, CfC/CfPs, TFs, plus: heartbeat docs (from rubys@intertwingly.net on 2010-01-13)
  77. [Bug 8555] Remove the Meter Element (from bugzilla@wiggum.w3.org on 2010-01-11)
  78. ISSUE-97 (meter): Remove/Discard the Meter Element [HTML 5 spec] (from sysbot+tracker@w3.org on 2010-01-11)

Related notes:

Change Proposal:
http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/removemeter

Laura Carlson, 10 May 2010, 13:09:59

Resolved by WG decision.

Maciej Stachowiak, 8 Dec 2010, 03:56:52

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