See also: IRC log
<janina_> /me michaelc: EMERGENCY: Can't get in on Webex for APA with 647 857 439
<janina_> Argh. Webex is misbehaving. The 9 digit code isn't working for me
<janina_> No go here either via SIP (my usual) or direct dial PSTN
<janina_> Will try again
<scribe> scribe: MichielBijl
JS: Hope to have Judy here today
are we doing enough?
are there missing pieces?
Welcome Ralph!
Any news or other relevant tidbits?
LW: We published a new update to HTML 5.2
Working draft update, no big milestone, nothing that impacts accessibility
JS: we did a lot of work to make sure HTML 5 supports everything we can reasonably expect
We went through and came up with all kind use cases
Came up with a notes document
<janina_> http://www.w3.org/TR/media-accessibility-reqs/
That is the basis by which we talked to HTML about how to support it
It should not be a surprise that some of them text
Some of them are binary
Like video or audio files
And some of this is fixed up in use cases
I know we’re listed in a charter
Has just been renewed for another year
Some of the folks there are familiar with what we’re about
In some cases I’m seeing new names
Not sure if they’re aware of what we’re about
In some cases it’s hard to find out what an API is about
There’re enormous opportunities to get this right
Users at home
Educational videos
In a school setting for example
Or even in a movie theatre
HTML should be an inter-operable device
Make it possible for hearing impaired users to use their smart device to listen to the main track or audio described track
Maybe we have to update the MAUR
We did for visual impaired users
Not sure we did for hearing impaired users
Might have documented some issues, but not the solutions
You can find plenty of examples where you have subtitles and audio description
RS: Thank you for inviting me
<Ralph> [Ralph notes http://www.daltonize.org/ for Daltonization]
JF: I’m just curious
You made mention of delivering solutions
Was my understanding that the MAUR was about documenting use cases
<Zakim> JF, you wanted to ask if it is the role of the MAUR to deliver "solutions", rather than articulating needs?
JB: Motivation was to find the support between HTML and ??
We wanted to achieve a technology neutral document
With of those things in hand it should facilitate the technology options
Until we have that each meeting there is a discussion
scribe: a debate between which technology better address some user needs, TTML, or WebVTT?
We noticed that since then there are a couple of groups
That from time to time work in areas that relate to media accessibility, but without realizing the tie-ins such as the need for APIs, nor the availability of the MAUR doc
One aspect is colour schemes
Another is flash mitigation
We can just capture the colour scheme aspect and the flash mitigation
Happy to tell more about
it
JS: And very important
Also some legal ramifications
Make sure developers are aware of them
What we need to follow through on
Most of us have non real time things in mind
There is the real time world as well that we’re working on
All of them will probably come into play
If we think of an entity like Canada
About some thing
That they would stream
Being Canadian they have to do it in English and French.
But you would also like to support the third scenario
??
Also automatically decide which language you need
Not sure WebRTC is appropriate for that
We don’t have a standardised control
JF: I’m struggling to understand what it is we’re trying to achieve
JB: There’s still a very active a11y effort in W3C
We’re opparating in different ways
And media a11y issues come up sometimes
In unexpected placed
I think it may be useful to look at this question of where are media a11y opportunities coming up
What would the APA need
We want to drive the support for media a11y support
JF: There have been two specific issues
??
The other is about, lost the thread, switching between languages etc
Real time support
That somehow they can choose they can choose which audio stream they want to select?
JS: Yeah, and also video
RS: The content has to be there
Our scope here is to say the content should be available
And we need the infrastructure support
for users to choose languages
JS: ANd that last point is what APA is running into to
We need to review whether it’s relevant
We know it’s related to audio or something else
I spend a lot of time on MEDIA
We weren’t only talking about real time, but it’s hard to tell sometimes where it fits
Where these APIs fit in the larger picture
For APA one thing that is missing is how to place the APIs in the larger scheme
Sometimes it’s hard to start the conversation on that.
<Zakim> Judy, you wanted to ask a question
<Judy> https://www.w3.org/TR/media-accessibility-reqs/#toc
JB: Are you asking hey let’s look at maybe how can we make the document better known?
If you look at the structure of the document
There’re three main sections
1. Summary of Accessible Media Requirements by Type of Disability
2. Alternative Content Technologies
3. System Requirements
*description of these categories, please refer to document itself*
<JF> I am still confused. The use-cases Janina has risen seems (to me) to be covered in the MAUR already. For example, the ability to switch language streams should be covered by this: [DAC-3] The user can browse the alternatives and switch between them.
<JF> and perhaps this: [DAC-7] During time-based media playback, the user can determine which tracks are available and select or deselect tracks. These selections may override global default settings for captions, descriptions, etc.
JB: I’m thinking maybe coming up with structure questions to focus people’s attention could get us farther
Does that match at all what you’re trying to achieve with this document?
JS: It does for me
JB: John does it help you?
JF: I mean, you brought up a use case, I went and looked at the MAUR, we have two uses cases that fit your issues
JS: I think it might be point 2 and 3
Point 2 is a frequent issue for APA
What we expect a particular API to achieve
What could conceivable be picked up by implementers and the like
Then we start to look at do we ??
as well as APIs and so forth.
RS: John’s question makes an interesting point
As new WG are formed
It’s hard for different WGs to look at APIs and see what the intersections may be
If we remind them that the MAUR exists
If there is one thing I would encourage the APA to do
Is to publish an update
Would encourage to stage multiple updates
To get more exposure as you update regularly
JF: Want a sanity check
What I’m hearing is we’re talking about two things
1. Perhaps need to revisit MAUR and plug things
2. How do we socialise the MAUR
(within the W3C)
Am I understanding this correctly
JS & JB: Yes
JS: Or a spin off
MAUR 2: Die Harder
JS: Michael should we build this into the checklist?
Think we have an early draft
<Ralph> [publishing an update is one of the ways to socialize the resource]
Doesn’t include media yet
<MichaelC> http://w3c.github.io/pfwg/wtag/checklist.html
MC: So, I think in the APA we’ve been expected to come up with user requirements
<janina_> Yes to similar counterparts
Like payments(?)
<janina_> Like payments
The centralised checklist if you scroll down to the fourth big black bar (that’s WCAG fail Michael)
JB: Are you looking for volunteers?
JS: Yeah, I think so
A lot of us here are already overcomitted
JB: Iw ould be interested to contribute to ?? and the flash mitigation
GZ: I would volunteer
There are some standards coming up
For example how text is contained in frames
Something we should look at when we revise this document.
JS: Any other thoughts?
RS: Thanks for inviting me and would like to return from time to time
JS: Interested to learn how to socialise the MAUR
RS: One of our big goals
Judy has support from other seniors to spread this around
JS: Going once
going twice
sold!
JS: Michael, a question: are there any new publications?
JS: This is a WP set of issues
We lost Rich S.
He was the last to review
We do have some comments from back in November
LW: Did they make it as far as the group working on the spec
JS: They might need some cleanup before we formally put them forward
Not exactly sure how to go about the cleanup
LW: Don’t mind taking a look at them
The group that are working on them have a planned call around 13th of February
I’ll prioritise this
JS: Do you want two weeks?
<janina_> ACTION: Leonie to move forward from Rich's start re Input Events http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-apa/2016Nov/0005.html due +2 weeks [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2017/01/25-apa-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-2110 - Move forward from rich's start re input events http://lists.w3.org/archives/public/public-apa/2016nov/0005.html due +2 weeks [on Léonie Watson - due 2017-02-01].
LW: Yes, won’t be here next week, will try to respond to the list before then.
<MichaelC> action-2110 due 2 weeks
<trackbot> Set action-2110 Move forward from rich's start re input events http://lists.w3.org/archives/public/public-apa/2016nov/0005.html due +2 weeks due date to 2017-02-08.
<MichaelC> action-2110: https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/wiki/Input_Events
<trackbot> Notes added to action-2110 Move forward from rich's start re input events http://lists.w3.org/archives/public/public-apa/2016nov/0005.html due +2 weeks.
<MichaelC> action-2110: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-apa/2016Nov/0005.html
<trackbot> Notes added to action-2110 Move forward from rich's start re input events http://lists.w3.org/archives/public/public-apa/2016nov/0005.html due +2 weeks.
JS: There’re various DOM specs open for review
Do we need to keep bringing this up
SM: Have discussed this with Rich, please keep on the list
JS: Will do!
MC: That’s related to Shadow DOM, are there any other DOM specs we need to track?
JS: All of them
MC: What’re all the DOM specs?
JS: Steve F. send something to the chairs list, can’t find it at the moment
MC: I don’t see it either
Wondering if we’re missing something in our Wiki
JS: I’ll find it
Not right now, but I’ll find it or drop the question
*boom*
MC: Don’t feel it has had sufficient review
John has accepted to reviewed it
But nobody else has made any comments
LW: Is it worth asking some people outside the a11y community to get an outside review of it
MC: I’ve had some feedback, that it’s too wordy, needs editorial review
Give a couple weeks for that
And as a second round do what Léonie is suggesting
Not sure where to go there
But might be best to start with groups we work with
Ask them “will this make it easier to work with us”
Maybe the furthest we can go before the AC meeting
After that we can take it to a wider audience for input
JS: John, how much time do you think you need?
JF: Want to get the spreadsheet finished first
How about a week?
JS: Okay that sounds good
s/fine/good/
JS: Calling a CFC will put us all on record
Any other business
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