See also: IRC log
<Rich> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-aria/2017Jan/0023.html
<Rich> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-aria/2017Jan/0023.html
<scribe> scribe: Janina
rs: Rich will do core HTML mappings review
rs: We're stuck! Between IA2 and UIA bridges
jd: Don't know the details, working on ATK+AT-SPI2 and have started, just barely though, on the ATTA for AXAPI
rs: Believe most are in
Firefox
... Don't know about Edge
... Will start filling in the test harness
... Would appreciate assistance from the group!
<Rich> https://www.w3.org/wiki/ARIA_1.1_Testable_Statements
rs: Anything else we can do accelerate the auto test harness?
jd: Written out testable
statements would really help
...
rs: Believe most JFW is
done
... Need to check with Domenic re Chrome
mk: If we have questions re
specific tests, where should we discuss that?
... Mailing list? Git?
... I've questions about grid
... unclear whose testing problems I'm seeing fall into ...
ARIA? HTML?
... Role=grid on table, and nothing on cells ...
rs: So what does a td convey?
mk: Hard for me to tell ...
mk Working off of observed screen reader behavior
jd: I can examine, if you like. Should be similar/same
mk: So, wondering whether we
should be testing propogation
... Seems grid is unique
... No other ARIA role does anything like that
rs: May not be just browser, may be AT
<clown> https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/core-aam/core-aam.html#role-map-gridcell
jd: IA2 has only role=cell
<clown> https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/core-aam/core-aam.html#role-map-cell
jd: Believe we need testable statements for anything that has changed since 1.0, including changed behavior
stefan: Wondering about Edge support ... Do we have? What's situation with JFW plus Edge
rs: We will test Edge, we have
mappings
... Whether JFW supports Edge isn't our department
... NOte that Edge does not expose DOM
... As to where to ask -- list is OK, and on the call is
OK.
<Rich> https://www.w3.org/TR/html51/semantics-embedded-content.html#the-picture-element
rs: We can go through these, but first some examples ....
<Rich> <style>
<Rich> img {display: block; margin: 0 auto;}
<Rich> </style>
<Rich> <picture>
<Rich> <source
<Rich> media="(min-width: 650px)"
<Rich> srcset="images/kitten-stretching.png">
<Rich> <source
<Rich> media="(min-width: 465px)"
<Rich> srcset="images/kitten-sitting.png">
<Rich> <img
<Rich> src="images/kitten-curled.png"
<Rich> alt="a cute kitten">
<Rich> </picture>
rs: Note the multiple source
support
... Best fit wins
... img is the fallback
... But, we don't want to map multiple sources -- It's only one
image
jd: So what's exposed to AT should be the rendered image
rs: Wondering where alt is ...
mc: Believe it's from the
fallback img
... So don't need new ARIA feature
rs: Need to decide whether we expose Picture and Source
<clown> https://w3c.github.io/html-aam/#el-picture (no corresponding aria role)
mc: Suspect you'd map
Picture
... So authoring error if img fallback with alt not
provided
mk: Would no alt on imate and ARIOA-Label on Picture be illegal?
<JF> +1 to Matt's suggestion - aria-label on the <picture> element
<MichaelC> mc: HTML mappings needs to say that img embedded in picture isn´t mapped
rs: What happens with tab index on a descendent
mc: Should take the parent
<MichaelC> because the picture itself is mapped to img
mc: Still not sure we've anything
to do here
... We're not in a special situation here
rs: Question is what to convey to user
<MichaelC> the text alternative algorithm should say get text alt from embedded img (preferred) but otherwise from aria-label on picture or something
jd: I believe we map to role=img
jn: Can't you also have text?
mc: If yes, could add to accessible mapping calculation
js: NO,
mc: So all HTML AAM, and not our spec
<clown> https://w3c.github.io/html-aam/#el-picture
mc: Note AAM isn't complete, and this issue may not have been considered
js: Yes, we're asked to review
rs: Not sure what for tab
index
... ARIA attribs on Picture allowed, but not mapped
js: No, not according to AAM
<Rich> Allowed ARIA state and property attributes:
<Rich> Global aria-* attributes
<Rich> DOM interface:
js: Maybe I'm looking at old
<clown> https://www.w3.org/TR/html-aria/#allowed-aria-roles-states-and-properties
rs: Not sure what with focus
<clown> https://w3c.github.io/html-aria/#allowed-aria-roles-states-and-properties
mc: Suspect it's underdefined
rs: Map Picture to Img
mc: NO, we do nothing
... Nothing to do in ARIA, but much to do with the AAM, which
is not us
rs: Assume content below picture,
one of which is the image. Don't want to map both
... In a web component?
mc: Don't know, but it's all auto
rs: Unclear how this is used in a component
mk: Don't get the difference
mc: Believe a component doing anything fance will be script based, and so this is up to the scripting
rs: So, an inconsistency in the mapping ...
mc: Noting Picture is a grouping,
you're only picking one image, and how the alt gets to the user
is underdefined
... Don't think we need to go to this level of situation
handling
rs: So we have to identify this inconsistency to Web Platforms
jf: Wonders what happens when fallback is missing
mc: We can't fix all errors
jf: Does it still end up something like image1765.jpg?
mc: That's not specified, of course
rs: Wondering where my issue is ...
js: Core AAM
<clown> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-aria/2017Jan/0006.html
js: Above contains links on where to file issues
<Rich> ACTION: Rich As part of HTML-AAM review: picture maps to img. name computation starts with aria-labelling on picture followed by alt text on the embedded img and last would be the URL of the chosen source. The image child is not mapped [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2017/01/12-aria-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-2132 - As part of html-aam review: picture maps to img. name computation starts with aria-labelling on picture followed by alt text on the embedded img and last would be the url of the chosen source. the image child is not mapped [on Richard Schwerdtfeger - due 2017-01-19].
<Rich> action-2132?
<trackbot> action-2132 -- Richard Schwerdtfeger to As part of html-aam review: picture maps to img. name computation starts with aria-labelling on picture followed by alt text on the embedded img and last would be the url of the chosen source. the image child is not mapped -- due 2017-01-19 -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/2132
rs: Continuing -- Iframes ... Do we need?
mc: Unsure
rs: Don't believe we need
<clown> https://w3c.github.io/html-aam/#el-iframe
mc: Suspect this would now be scripted
mk: Think no corresponding role is perfect, we want iframe to do nothing. Alternative is none
mc: Need access to content
mk: None preserves, and anything inside the iframe
jn: Can navigate by iframes
rs: Could be confusing in a mashup
jn: Yes, sometimes
mk: Agree we don't need a new
role for it
... Perhaps mapping to "none" might be a worthy discussion with
AT
... Maybe if we have title -- just like we treat section
jd: Are we pruning iframes from
the tree?
... Just want to avoid nested doc frames
rs: Leave as is?
jd: Yes, no ARIA role, but other expose may be useful
RESOLUTION: No new role for Iframes in ARIA
<clown> https://w3c.github.io/html-aam/#el-embed
jd: Believe we've morphed the
application role recently
... Believe Embed is like 1.1 Application -- Custom control
like
<Rich> https://www.w3.org/TR/html51/semantics-embedded-content.html#the-embed-element
<Rich> Allowed ARIA role attribute values:
<Rich> application, document or img or presentation.
rs: Don't believe there's
anything for us to do that adds value
... Believe we have what we need
RESOLUTION: No new role needed for Embed
mc: Also for Object?
rs: Yes
RESOLUTION: No ARIA role needed for Object either
rs: Pick up with Video and Audio
RESOLUTION: No ARIA role for Param element
https://www.disneymoviesanywhere.com/support
rs: So, for next week.
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.148 of Date: 2016/10/11 12:55:14 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/at-spi/ATK+AT-SPI2 and have started, just barely though, on the ATTA for AXAPI/ Succeeded: s/Also the Apple mappings// Succeeded: s/eMBED eLEMENT/Embed Element/ Found Scribe: Janina Inferring ScribeNick: janina Default Present: Joanmarie_Diggs, Rich_Schwerdtfeger, MichaelC, Janina, JF, Joseph_Scheuhammer, Léonie, matt_king Present: Joanmarie_Diggs Rich_Schwerdtfeger MichaelC Janina JF Joseph_Scheuhammer Léonie matt_king Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-aria/2017Jan/0023.html Found Date: 12 Jan 2017 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2017/01/12-aria-minutes.html People with action items: as html-aam maps of part picture review rich WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines. You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option.[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]