See also: IRC log
<plh> .... [going through list of changes]
<plh> ... [showing examples]
<plh> ... dl.switch
<plh> Bert: I have a proposal for annoying-boxes
<plh> Fantasai: yes, mine needs improvement
-> https://drafts.csswg.org/css-box-3/ spec with pure-css warning-box using HTML4 only
<plh> Richard: I'd like to have the TOC higher
<plh> Fantasai: markup changes are out of scope
<tripu> My PR for what r12a is mentioning
<plh> ... priority is on publication system
<plh> ... in 2016, I'd like to redo the entire spec templates
<plh> ... to take care of the above the fold issue
<plh> ... [show some possibilities]
<fantasai> http://fantasai.inkedblade.net/style/design/w3c-restyle/
<fantasai> by robin and I, based on karl's post in spec-prod
<plh> ... it will take time to change the markup
<plh> ... we should make changes to the markup all at once, so we don't have to do it every year
<plh> ... it will be good to have people with design experience
<plh> ... a large set is using respec
<plh> ... few are using xmlspec
<plh> ... some are using bikeshed
<plh> plh: webperf uses respec and doesn't care about the styling really
<plh> fantasai: do we want a side-by-side TOC?
<plh> ... rest is some cleaning and dealing with issues on github
<plh> ... [show demo of side TOC]
<plh> Tab: some issues on mobile, we need meta@viewport
<plh> plh: we might be able to convince the tooling and pubrules people
<plh> [folks are reporting issueson side TOC]
<TabAtkins> <meta name="viewport" content="width=device-width, initial-scale=1">
(Can't browsers honor the PDF bookmarks properties and auto-generate a ToC, outside the viewport?)
<TabAtkins> Could, but won't.
<fantasai> http://fantasai.inkedblade.net/style/design/w3c-restyle/2016/sample
Or rel=bookmark, then we can put the ToC in the <head>
<plh> plh: at 1920, it would be nice to hide the toc if size is 50% or less
<denis> [talking about max-width on TR documents]
<plh> Fantasai: couple of markup changes: meta viewport
<plh> ... and side-by-side section role=navigation (or nav)
<plh> ... and id=toc
<plh> ... plh should send a survey out about the questions
<denis> is there any plan regarding data extraction (microdata, rdfa, ...)?
<plh> ACTION: plh to publish the survey [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/10/28-restyle-minutes.html#action01]
<tripu> denis, do you think changing the ID of the TOC, or wrapping it with a new element would affect Specberus/Echidna?
<denis> there's no check on the TOC itself so it won't be a problem
<denis> actually, the old pubrules does check the TOC id but that's very easy to update
<plh> [discussion on em, zoom, and tutti frutti]
<plh> Richard: top page shouldn't be printed
<plh> ... and when the TOC disappears, jump to top of TOC instead of top page
<tripu> See my screenshots there for what r12a is saying
<tripu> I have it here: https://github.com/w3c/tr-design/pull/22/files#diff-915dc9cf09496fd0b920c7d65dddd05cR68
<plh> [various detailed tweaking discussions]
<plh> Karl: problem on big tables
<plh> [can't be fixed without js. default is to put the table into a scrollbox]
<TabAtkins> Bert2: Where'd you put the hyphens in the words?
<Bert2> ScribeNick: Bert1
<Bert2> Discussion about the top-left status image
<Bert2> SimonSapin: Can be vector grapics?
<Bert2> Tab: sure, more efficient for bandwidth.
<Bert2> … also need to make it fixed to the ToC, i f the ToC has a background, otherwise it'll be invisible.
<Bert2> r12a: Notes don't seem to say that they are notes.
<Bert2> … unlike examples
<Bert2> … and the highlighted text doesn't look normative, due to the colored bar.
<Bert2> fantsai makes new sample. Reload!
<Bert2> liam: I like things aligned, so would be nice to have the logo aligned with the top of the ToC [in wide view]
<Bert2> fantasai: I'd like to redesign the whole top, for a next redesign
<Bert2> liam: Can we have 1 or 2 sentences at the start to explain what a spec is?
<SimonSapin> Proposal for an alternative W3C logo: http://i.imgur.com/f5bogpL.jpg
<Bert2> fantasai: Next year want to do a compact top with links to notes about status.
<Bert2> karlcow_: Want me to make a more mobile-friendly version of that?
<Bert2> fantasai: So far only a demo, Need proper design first.
<Bert2> plh: Process calls for final design by 30 Oct. Only tweaks afterwards.
<Bert2> fantasai: Removing the side ToC will be easy, just remove some CSS rules. Integrating comments may take more time.
<Bert2> plh: I'll need to start writing the e-mail soon. I'd need a stable snapshot that won't chnage after Oct 31
<Bert2> fantasai: I think people should see the latest, with their comments integrated.
<Bert2> fantasai: Not yet done much on styles for inline code and WebIDL.
<r12a> http://www.w3.org/International/docs/styleguide
<r12a> http://www.w3.org/International/docs/styleguide#inline
<Bert2> r12a: Extra whitespace between headings as you did is great. I vote in favor.
<tripu> +1 to extra spacing too
<Bert2> fantasai: CSS style had even more, but I got comments and reduced the space bit.
<plh> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/1/tr_toc_2016/
<Bert2> plh: Questionnaire [see url]. Any feedback?
<fantasai> where the window is sufficiently wide (i.e. the maximum line length recommended by a11y is satisfied and extra space is currently going to margins)
<Bert2> fantasai: I need to check question 3: the exact mark-up may be different from <nav id=toc>
<Bert2> plh: Echidna only accepts HTML5. But there will be other publications with HTML4.
<Bert2> … Need to tell people what to do in that case.
<Bert2> florian: Also applies to already published docs?
<fantasai> plh, s/wide window width/wide windows/
<Bert2> plh: No, only after Jan 1, 2016
<Bert2> … When we tried to chnage style a few years ago, people complained that their old docs changed. So we don't do that this time.
<SimonSapin> http://w3cmemes.tumblr.com/post/132000421517/it-hasnt-changed-in-years-republish-it-anyway
<Bert2> fantasai: Any other comments?
<Bert2> several: no, nice work!
<Bert2> fantasai: Comments aither on Github or mail to specprod
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.140 of Date: 2014-11-06 18:16:30 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/everyyear/every year/ Succeeded: s/something like that/nav/ Succeeded: s/that./that?/ Succeeded: s/inline styles for code/styles for inline code/ Succeeded: s/required/recommended/ Found ScribeNick: Bert1 WARNING: No scribe lines found matching ScribeNick pattern: <Bert1> ... Inferring Scribes: Bert1 WARNING: 3 scribe lines found (out of 123 total lines.) Are you sure you specified a correct ScribeNick? WARNING: No "Topic:" lines found. WARNING: No "Present: ... " found! Possibly Present: Bert Bert2 Fantasai Richard ScribeNick SimonSapin SteveZ Tab TabAtkins denis florian fsasaki https joined karl karlcow_ liam plh plinss r12a restyle several tripu You can indicate people for the Present list like this: <dbooth> Present: dbooth jonathan mary <dbooth> Present+ amy WARNING: No meeting title found! You should specify the meeting title like this: <dbooth> Meeting: Weekly Baking Club Meeting WARNING: No meeting chair found! You should specify the meeting chair like this: <dbooth> Chair: dbooth Got date from IRC log name: 28 Oct 2015 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2015/10/28-restyle-minutes.html People with action items: plh WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines. You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option. WARNING: No "Topic: ..." lines found! Resulting HTML may have an empty (invalid) <ol>...</ol>. Explanation: "Topic: ..." lines are used to indicate the start of new discussion topics or agenda items, such as: <dbooth> Topic: Review of Amy's report[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]
