Spatial Data on the Web Working Group Teleconference

<trackbot> Date: 23 September 2015

<kerry> scribe: frans

<kerry> scribenick: frans

<jonblower> [apologies, slightly distracted today, trying to multitask on an urgent issue!]

<scribe> chair: kerry

<kerry> http://www.w3.org/2015/09/16-sdw-minutes.html

last meetingś minutes

<kerry> +1

<eparsons> +1

<jtandy> +1

<Linda> +1

<Alejandro_Llaves> +1

<Payam> +1

<MattPerry> +1

proposed: approve last meetings minutes

resolved: minutes accepted

patent call

<kerry> https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Patent_Call

kerry: we have lost Lewis as a BP editor
... two editors are present: jtandy and payam

linking theme in BP

bp linking

<kerry> https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/BP_Consolidated_Narratives#linking_data

kerry hands over to jtandy

<jtandy> https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Linking_Data#Best_Practice_theme:_Linking_Data

<jtandy> https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Linking_Data

jtandy: made a page with questions about linking spatial data
... related to the ´identifier´ and ´semantics´ themes
... would be happy if other people contribute to the wiki page

<eparsons> +1

<Linda> +1

<billroberts> +1

<kerry> +1

frans: are HTML pages with embedded data considered structured data?

jtandy: yes, the embedded data are structured data

ed: agrees, challenge is to make implicit data on html pages explicit

<kerry> +1

jtandy: letś encourage best practices regardless of data format
... Where do links commonly occur?
... please add more items to the list

kerry: please identify who you are when you add to the wiki page

<jtandy> [jtandy]

jtandy: we could use prefixes (if you are not jtandy)

<Zakim> kerry, you wanted to ask about how to do this

links also commonly occur in metadata

<billroberts> I need to mull it over but will add thoughts to the wiki - thanks jeremy

<kerry> https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/BP_Consolidated_Narratives#linking_data for lars -- we are here

subtopic: what should I link to?

jonblower: things could end up having two IDs
... clarifying the difference between both types of resources would be helpful

eparsons: likes to reinforces Jon´s point, the thing itself is more important than its spatial representation

<kerry> +1 to ed

kerry: identifiers is a different topic, so we need links between these two topics

jtandy agrees

jtandy: how do you link to things that do not have a URI?

eparsons hopes an answer is not expected

jon: do not have a answer but notes that hashtags can be made by the public and used as indentifiers

??: blank nodes could be used

<jonblower> (maybe I should say used for a similar role as identifiers. I didn't mean that hashtags are proper identifiers by themsleves. Just an example that the community will create these "anchors" if they don't exist)

LarsG: hashtags are not good as identifiers. They are not specific enough
... they do not uniquely identify places

kerry: firstly: twitters hashtags are a bad idea because they are not persistent
... secondly: why not create a new ID if you are unable to find an exsiting one?

jtandy: people sometimes are too lazy to find existing IDs

eparsons: much data are powered by wikidata. So why not contribute to the source wiki?

jtandy: lalalala

jon: there is a big community that use hashtags to link things. It is not a good practice, but it is happening.

<eparsons> Agree with Jon we need to acknowledge the community in developing links

jon: we need to be aware that not all practices can be top down

aharth: describes a dataset where blank nodes are used to group data, with possibilty of improvement later

billroberts: best practices should be realistic, describe ways of working with non ideal data.
... unprecise data are still valuable.

jtandy agrees

<aharth> aharth: i'd suggest to look at schema.org for inspiration re linking without identifiers

<eparsons> +1 to schema.org

<jonblower> imprecise != not useful

jtandy: we should work with real world content and encourage better practices

subtopic: what do links mean?

jtandy: please add your thoughts to the wiki and add your name

subtopic: How can I describe links in my format of choice?
... What else links to my subject of interest?

billroberts: reference area is often a dimension in data cubes
... it works with one or a few SPARQL endpoints
... but on the full web it becomes difficult
... catalogs could be part of the solution.

<jonblower> (Sorry, got to go now, but referencing a conversation from earlier in the call, I was trying to articulate the difference between Spatial Objects and Spatial Things, as described in https://data.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Designing_URI_Sets_for_Location-V1.0_10.pdf. These were the "two identifiers for the same thing" that I was trying to explain.)

eparsons: public catalog of places and relations between places can be useful
... but we need to accept that there are risks and complexities when working with spatial references in statistical data

subtopic: How can I manage links between sets of things (so that I don't have to manage individual links)?

jtandy: how can we make this easier?

subtopic: How can third parties assert links and relationships (and should I trust their assertions?)

jtandy: how valid or trustworthy are spatial assertions on the web?

eparsons: how can we can keep this discussion going?

<eparsons> +1

jtandy: we could make an e-mail thread for each subtopic

esparsons: likes the idea

<Alejandro_Llaves> +1

linda: nice work by jtandy
... but we have to keep things in scope (i.e. only spatial)

<kerry> recall invitation to pass generic thing to data on the web

jtandy: yes, at some point we have to cut off

<jtandy> https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/BP_Structure_Examples#Summary_points

Review submitted examples of best practice narratives

jtandy: please read this page react

linda: the examples I added were provided by Simeon Nedkov

<kerry> ACTION: jtandy to create thread for each linking theme [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/09/23-sdw-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-79 - Create thread for each linking theme [on Jeremy Tandy - due 2015-09-30].

<eparsons> +1

<Linda> +1

<scribe> ACTION: jtandy to create e-mail threads for each linking subtopic [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/09/23-sdw-minutes.html#action02]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-80 - Create e-mail threads for each linking subtopic [on Jeremy Tandy - due 2015-09-30].

<billroberts> +1 sounds like we have quite a bit of discussion to do, so email first then a wiki summary if we reach some consensus?

Prepare for seasonal time changes (starting October)

kerry: lost my IRC
... suggest to go back to old times (Australian summer)

eparsons: let us pick times that work well for Asia and Europe
... Australia is part of Asia

kerry: will put the new times on the mailing list.

<kerry> http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=SDWWG+Call&iso=20150211T20&ah=1

<eparsons> bye all

<LarsG> bye, thx

kerry: closes the meeting

<Alejandro_Llaves> thanks, bye!

<billroberts> bye

<eparsons> thanks frans

<Payam> thanks, bye

my pleasure