See also: IRC log
<trackbot> Date: 20 August 2015
<scribe> scribe: nigel
nigel: We are adding ATSC liaison
to the agenda as requested.
... Any other business?
group: no other business
nigel: Looking ahead, I'm going to have difficulty meeting on Thursday 10th. Will anyone else have problems?
atai: Yes, I won't be able to join on that day.
nigel: We can leave it scheduled but dependent on members wishing to attend and join, or cancel that one if need be.
action-414?
<trackbot> action-414 -- Nigel Megitt to Add unicode liaison to weekly meeting agenda -- due 2015-08-20 -- PENDINGREVIEW
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/414
close action-414
<trackbot> Closed action-414.
https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-tt/2015Aug/0002.html
nigel: We received this liaison from ATSC. Would anyone like to take us through it?
mike: ATSC is heading down the
path of using IMSC 1 for its next generation TV. A member
... has proposed support for extensions for colorGamut and 3D
disparity.
... disparity is already in TTML2, but there's nothing I'm
aware of on HDR or wide color gamut
... in this group. The proposal is to get us to think about it
more than anything else.
... There are 2 specific proposals for pulling those features
into IMSC 1.
... There was a lively discussion on the reflector about color
gamut and what it might be useful
... for. I think that's down to, not so much that an author
would want to use a wide color gamut,
... but that it would help implementations if the text
signalled colors in a wide color gamut.
... That was more to get W3C TTWG thinking about the issue,
which was successful based on
... the email exchange. The rest is to do with logistics of
timing and in what form the requests
... might appear in the future.
nigel: I had a conversation with
Thierry and Pierre about the logistics side. Pierre and I
... concluded that the best thing for IMSC right now given the
process state that its in is to
... keep it closed to new features, but to add them into the
scope of TTML2 and IMSC 2.
mike: Any thoughts on the schedule for all this work?
nigel: It's clear that we're
already behind relative to our intended timescale on TTML2. If
we
... want to speed things up then we need more input from
members other than Glenn. IMSC 2
... is planned for as soon as possible after TTML2. I wouldn't
be surprised given the current
... state if that falls into 2016, it's hard to say exactly
when.
mike: With my TTWG hat on, I
agree that not delaying IMSC 1 is the right answer, though
it
... isn't necessarily what ATSC wants to hear. What's the
timescale for publishing IMSC 1?
nigel: That's entirely dependent
on implementation work on IMSC 1. We can't move on until
... we have met the exit criteria for the CR, which requires
implementation work.
mike: It sounds as though we need some feedback from pierre on that.
nigel: Yes, he's got the best view right now.
mike: We possibly need dave to come in on the colour mapping question.
nigel: It's not clear to me that
there's any specification work missing that we should take
on.
... I have the impression that the colour spaces are all well
defined and the semantic in TTML
... is also clear.
mike: We may need some additional
metadata to indicate where the sRGB 8 bits live in the
... 12 bit value space.
nigel: I'd like to see a proposal for that on the email reflector - I'm a little sceptical right now.
mike: Yes, I'll continue the
email thread. I'm also happy to start preparing a liaison
response for
... the liaison, to be sent back to ATSC.
nigel: Pierre also volunteered to
assist with that so between you two we should be able to
get
... something together. The key points are that we won't
include the features in IMSC 1 but
... will consider them for IMSC 2. For the color gamut question
we need to have more discussion
... and conclude on the issue before we respond.
Courtney: I talked to the webkit
team and they said they have no plans to add support for
... anything but WebVTT.
atai: There's nothing more from
me on this - we just need to think how to proceed.
... Nigel made a proposal to make it more concrete as to what
we should propose. We need
... to decide if we need to include that.
nigel: That's right. I had a
think about this and a look at the dash.js work, and the
simple
... approach is simply to replace the html content of a target
div element. That would be my
... baseline proposal, since it appears to work.
atai: I wonder if we could get
stuck in detail if we discuss this.
... Getting a general feeling about if people are willing to
implement this is more important.
<mike> I need to get to another meeting. thanks for the time on the ATSC liaison. hear you next week.
<tmichel> http://www.w3.org/2001/11/StdLiaison#main
nigel: Looking back at last week's minutes, there were 3 actions, Courtney's, mine and Thierry was going to check about WHATWG.
tmichel: There's actually no
liaison with WHATWG, so I contacted Michael Smith of the HTML
WG
... to discuss how we might contact WHATWG. He suggested the
best way might be to post
... to the public email address on this issue:
<tmichel> whatwg@whatwg.org
<tmichel> public mailing list for the WHATWG.
tmichel: And he said that if we
needed he could also help. He's not the formal liaison guy
but
... he knows those guys and has been working with WHATWG for
many years.
atai: I can do that, but it would be on my own - it would be better from TTWG.
tmichel: I agree it would be better to send it on behalf of TTWG to add leverage.
nigel: Okay, I'm happy to do that
then as chair.
... The draft text we have now is:
https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tt/2015Aug/0009.html
... Just rereading that, imagining WHATWG receiving it, I guess
it looks okay. I assume they
... know what TPAC is.
<tmichel> The people from who I would think you’d want to get most feedback on this
<tmichel> particular proposal are Philip Jägenstedt (Opera/Blink), Silvia Pfeiffer,
<tmichel> and Eric Carlson & Jer Noble (from Apple).
<tmichel> >
nigel: I'm happy to take an
action to edit the draft and share with those people for
initial
... input prior to posting to the public WHATWG list.
<tmichel> IanHickson right would not be the most productive, especially since at the
<tmichel> moment, he’s working on other things that don’t have much to to with the
<tmichel> HTML spec.
<scribe> ACTION: tmichel Send nigel email addresses of HTMLCue proposal reviewers [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/08/20-tt-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-415 - Send nigel email addresses of htmlcue proposal reviewers [on Thierry Michel - due 2015-08-27].
<scribe> ACTION: nigel Edit proposal and send to HTMLCue proposal reviewers as listed by tmichel, following Action-415 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/08/20-tt-minutes.html#action02]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-416 - Edit proposal and send to htmlcue proposal reviewers as listed by tmichel, following action-415 [on Nigel Megitt - due 2015-08-27].
nigel: If all the feedback is
positive I'll go ahead and send to WHATWG, otherwise I'll bring
it
... back to this group for further discussion.
... I'll CC interested folk too so you don't lose track of the
discussion.
nigel: I've not had any response
from Mark Davis yet, so as per our discussion last week
... I will create an issue ticket with Unicode, containing the
proposal.
<scribe> ACTION: nigel Create ticket with Unicode for CLDR proposal, or add to existing one. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/08/20-tt-minutes.html#action03]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-417 - Create ticket with unicode for cldr proposal, or add to existing one. [on Nigel Megitt - due 2015-08-27].
issue-402?
<trackbot> issue-402 -- The permitted delimiters for two value attributes like cellResolution and frameRateMultiplier are undefined -- closed
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/402
nigel: I raised this in error and it's already closed - thanks to Glenn for putting me right.
issue-403?
<trackbot> issue-403 -- The ordering of features in Appendix D differs from that in Appendix F -- raised
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/403
reopen issue-403
<trackbot> Re-opened issue-403.
nigel: There are now examples in the TTML2 ED for padding on span and for textAlign on span.
nigel: Is there anything to add
to the agenda, or does anyone need any assistance with
TPAC,
... e.g. with registration etc?
group: Nothing to add right now.
nigel: We've covered other
business as planned already.
... Just one note - referencing the earlier mention of dash.js,
if anyone is interested in discussing
... implementation work in that area, EBU is hosting an open
session at IBC, as per the email
... sent earlier in the week.
... Thanks very much everyone. [Adjourns meeting]