See also: IRC log
<trackbot> Date: 26 May 2015
<clown> agenda: this
<clown> action-1542?
<trackbot> action-1542 -- Joanmarie Diggs to Verify the commit for mozilla bug 1013584 and report the atk role to joseph. -- due 2015-05-01 -- OPEN
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1542
<scribe> scribe: joanie
<clown> action-1542?
<trackbot> action-1542 -- Joanmarie Diggs to Verify the commit for mozilla bug 1013584 and report the atk role to joseph. -- due 2015-05-01 -- OPEN
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1542
<clown> http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/core-aam/core-aam.html#role-map-presentation
JS: The second URL is the mapping
specification for presentation.
... I'm calling your attention to the ATK row.
... (Reads from spec)
<clown> "For objects that have required owned descendants (e.g., a grid owns gridcells, a list owns listitems), expose each leaf descendant as ROLE_SECTION."
JD: So that looks good.
<clown> "and the object is in the a11y tree, expose the descendant as ROLE_SECTION".
JD: Regarding the second item, I
think we want to add a statement similar to what is in the
first item, namely you only expose those owned children as
ROLE_SECTION if you are going to include them in the
tree.
... In other words, I don't need an empty div just because it
was an owned cell in a presentational table.
<clown> Proposeed: "For objects that have required owned descendants (e.g., a grid owns gridcells, a list owns listitems), and the descendant is in the a11y tree, expose it as ROLE_SECTION. User agents SHOULD prune empty descendants from the a11y tree".
JD: Looks great to me!
JS: I would like to see something
like this for other rows in here.
... I like AX API, "Not mapped"
<clown> RESOLVED: Assign action-1542 to Joseph, and modifiy ATK/AT-SPI mapping to include the above statement about descendants ("For objects that have required owned descendants (e.g., a grid owns gridcells, a list owns listitems), and the descendant is in the a11y tree, expose it as ROLE_SECTION. User agents SHOULD prune empty descendants from the a11y tree".)
RESOLUTION: Assign action-1542 to Joseph, and modifiy ATK/AT-SPI mapping to include the above statement about descendants ("For objects that have required owned descendants (e.g., a grid owns gridcells, a list owns listitems), and the descendant is in the a11y tree, expose it as ROLE_SECTION. User agents SHOULD prune empty descendants from the a11y tree".)
<clown> issue-635?
<trackbot> issue-635 -- Determine if uaig mappings for rowgroup are correct -- open
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/635
JS: The original issue, way back
when, rowgroup was not mapped at all.
... Then Mozilla decided to map it, I think to the group
role.
... We here came up with if it is focusable or interactive,
then it should have an accessible in the accessibility
tree.
... Otherwise, it wouldn't be mapped.
<clown> http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/core-aam/core-aam.html#role-map-rowgroup
JS: I haven't changed any of them (at above link).
BG: If it's mentioned using aria-owns, it also needs to be in the tree.
JS: I didn't do that in my example because there was no need for an explicit owns.
<clown> http://clown.idrc.ocad.ca/Fluid/aria/FocusableRowGroup.html
JS: The above is the example I
made for testing.
... It contains both a grid made up of divs and spans which has
rowgroups which are interactive, and one that is not.
... The other has table with three tbody elements which are
interactive, and one tbody which is not.
... Firefox has accessibles for all rowgroups.
... But in the case of tbody elements, Firefox only exposes the
interactive ones.
<clown> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-pfwg/2015May/0120.html
JS: So I sent email out to the list and James Craig.
s/
<clown> https://lists.w3.org/ArchivePublic/public-pfwg/2015May/0111.html
JS: No reply from James.
... Matt did reply and say it should be a table; not a
grid.
... I replied to his question.
... This starts to overlap with aria-interactive.
BG: The question I had was not about whether or not it was interactive, but when it appears in the accessibility tree.
JS: So if it's interactive, or focusable, or referenced by aria-owns, the rowgroup should have an accessible in the tree?
BG: Sounds reasonable to me.
JS: Ok, what should it be mapped to?
BG: Group makes sense to me.
<clown> http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/core-aam/core-aam.html#role-map-rowgroup
JS: (Reads from above URL)
JD: Map it to ROLE_PANEL for ATK/AT-SPI2.
JS: UIA is expose as group role. Is that correct?
CS: On IE a div was always
exposed as a group.
... With those caveats about it (i.e. interactive, focusable,
owned), group is correct.
... We do expose div a lot. And Firefox does too.
JS: You actually have an action about this.
<clown> action-1544?
<trackbot> action-1544 -- Cynthia Shelly to Document rowgroup mappings for ie 11 for both uia express and uia -- due 2015-02-03 -- OPEN
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1544
CS: I will see if I can have this done in two weeks.
JS: June 9th.
... You don't have an action to do this Joanie. I'll create a
new one.
<clown> ACTION: Joanie to provide mappings for role="rowgroup" for ATK/AT-SPI when there is an accessible in the a11y tree for the element. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/05/26-aapi-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-1643 - Provide mappings for role="rowgroup" for atk/at-spi when there is an accessible in the a11y tree for the element. [on Joanmarie Diggs - due 2015-06-02].
<clown> action-1643?
<trackbot> action-1643 -- Joanmarie Diggs to Provide mappings for role="rowgroup" for atk/at-spi when there is an accessible in the a11y tree for the element. -- due 2015-06-02 -- OPEN
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1643
JD: My action is done. :) ROLE_PANEL.
JS: I'll assign it to me then.
JS: David is not here. I'll ping
him or Alex.
... Rich is on vacation.
... His action was to update the test cases given the new
mapping.
... We'll leave it as-is so it will pop up next time.
<clown> action-1620?
<trackbot> action-1620 -- Cynthia Shelly to Propose UIA Express and UIA mappings for aria-placeholder. -- due 2015-05-19 -- OPEN
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1620
<clown> http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/core-aam/core-aam.html#ariaPlaceholder
JS: The mapping is at the above
URL.
... (Reads statement about UIA Express)
CS: That does sound right.
JS: UIA says the same thing.
CS: It's correct for now. I'd like to improve UIA in this area.
JS: I still need to ping Alex and/or David for IA2.
CS: Also, aria-placeholder will be used in the accessible name calculation as a last resort.
JS: The current last resort is title.
CS: I'm not sure what we'd do in that case.
JS: Could you check that?
CS: Yes, but please give me an action.
<clown> ACTION: Cynthia to check which is the actual last resort betwen @title and @aria-placeholder. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/05/26-aapi-minutes.html#action02]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-1644 - Check which is the actual last resort betwen @title and @aria-placeholder. [on Cynthia Shelly - due 2015-06-02].
<clown> action-1644?
<trackbot> action-1644 -- Cynthia Shelly to Check which is the actual last resort betwen @title and @aria-placeholder. -- due 2015-06-02 -- OPEN
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1644
JS: I sent him email.
... I don't believe I've heard from him.
... I'll ping him.
<clown> action-1585?
<trackbot> action-1585 -- Cynthia Shelly to Add to the section on differences among aapis highlighting the features of uia. -- due 2015-05-19 -- OPEN
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1585
CS: I've not yet done this. Please give me three weeks.
<clown> action-1625?
<trackbot> action-1625 -- Joseph Scheuhammer to Add interactive property to core mappings that propogates from grid or table to all grid aria grid or table structural elements. the interactive property should have same mapping as defined in issue 633 -- due 2015-05-22 -- OPEN
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1625
JS: I don't want to touch this
one yet because of the discussion currently taking place
regarding aria-interactive.
... I'm inclined to move this out a couple of months.
... And change it when and if the dust settles on the spec
side.
... September 8. Any objections?
BG: No.
JD: No.
JS: I'll try to keep it in mind so that when things move on the spec side, I'll be able to react quickly.
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