See also: IRC log
<trackbot> Date: 30 April 2015
<scribe> scribe: janina
rs: Scheduling DescribedAt conversation?
janina: Anytime
rs: before last week of may or later in June
<clown> action-1456?
<trackbot> action-1456 -- Richard Schwerdtfeger to Provide defintions in action 1454 for each of the annotation types -- due 2015-04-23 -- OPEN
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1456
<clown> action-1454?
<trackbot> action-1454 -- Joanmarie Diggs to Add aria-hasannotation attribute with values: comment, footnote, endnote, reference, insertion, deletion, modification, true, false, more where aria-hasannotation has only one value at a time -- due 2014-06-23 -- OPEN
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1454
rs: Noting coming annotations ml
for ARIA
... Need to get wider review
<clown> issue-709?
<trackbot> issue-709 -- Define an extension mechanism for WAI-ARIA -- open
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/709
rs: Expect discussion next week, please
mk: Module types?
rs: yes
<MichaelC> https://www.w3.org/2015/04/29-pf-minutes#item07
<MichaelC> ¨The PFWG accepts splitting the functions so long as the spec review remains a WG function and does not move to the IG¨
<Zakim> LJWatson, you wanted to ask how many people are in both COGA and ARIA TFs?
lw: Wonders about overlap between COGA and ARIA
rs: Not a lot, but is very important to IBM
mc: Judy is planning an updated
message to AC and will include a question about spec review
participation
... Will be looking for satisfactory level of spec review
commitments
rs: I will join APA
jn: Thought User Context would go to APA
mc: Would need to go to group chartered to develop technology specs
mk: COGA not doing spec?
mc: Gap analysis
... When we did gap analysis for ARIA we determined we neede
semantics to be added
... Still expect active coordination ongoing
rs: Don't care so much about where things go except that we get appropriate people working on them
<Zakim> Joseph_Scheuhammer, you wanted to ask what APA and IG stand for.
mc: APA == Accessible Platform Architectures; IG == Interest Group
<clown> issue-423?
<trackbot> issue-423 -- Introduce a table role to be a parent of grid, but non-interactive -- open
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/423
jd: Recalls we were asking
whether we need table roles
... I can't move forward until we have this answer
mk: We were concerned we don't have table cell
rs: Expect we want to support
table functionality vs interactive grid
... Couple ways to achieve this
... use grid market plus attrib that says "not
interactive"
... But it's frustrating if people see no difference between
how we treat grid vs table
... So, we could solve the other way; But let's not have too
many elements
mk: Pros and cons discussion now?
rs: sure
mk: Concerned for AT users should
we end up with multiple "flavors" of grid -- interactive false,
for instance
... If exposed as table, the issue goes away
... But revealed via APIs as grid, we end up with 3 kinds of
grid
... We have years of aclimation to tables
... So, what to do if author uses something other than table ml
to make a table
<clown> http://w3c.github.io/aria/core-aam/core-aam.html#role-map-grid
mk: What does ua do? grid in api then is-interactive?
rs: On ia2 and at-spi puts role of table in doc, but grid cell in object attrib
mk: In ff on win you see grid
<clown> http://w3c.github.io/aria/core-aam/core-aam.html#role-map-grid
rs: You "hear" grid, but get
role=systemtable
... Could drop roles win/linux; similar on mac
jd: Should be mapped, should be to table
mk: So if one made a table using grid, the user would see table
rs: yes
mk: Good. Very important
clown: if you make a table with divs, what role?
rs: grid; and think
interactive=false
... So everything is noninteractive unless further overwritten
somehow
<clown> <div role="grid" aria-interacive="false"> maps to "table role".
mk: Wonders about the other direction, table and interactive=yes
rs: believe not possible
<clown> <table aria-interactive="true"> maps to ?
rs: In AAM we can kill this
mk: Got the idea, see about 2k test cases!!
rs: What approach is preferred
clown: What's easiest for authoring
mk: The aria-interactive property
drives
... affects differently in table vs grid
rs: OK to go with grid and not intro new table roles?
<jamesn> +1
rs: focus on interactive property?
ss: grid only?
<joanie> +1 to no new table roles
mk: want to have that conversation, but should decide table first
cs: Concerned about not using the word "table"
mk: No, would show up as "table" for users
cs: With headings, scope, etc
mk: yes
rs: not scope, spans ...
... role=grid, aria-interactive=false would be default, and
that maps and is presented as "table'
DRAFT RESOLUTION: role=grid, aria-interactive=false would be default, and that maps and is presented as "table"
<richardschwerdtfeger> DRAFT RESOLUTION: Group will not create table, or cell roles, but rahter table will map to role=grid, aria-interactive=false as a default, and that maps and is presented as "table” and TD, inherits container interactivity from container
<richardschwerdtfeger> DRAFT RESOLUTION: Group will not create table, or cell roles, but rahter table will map to role=grid, aria-interactive=false as a default, and that maps and is presented as "table” and TD, inherits container interactivity from container. The default for grid will aria-interactive=“true”
<clown> http://w3c.github.io/aria/aria/aria.html#columnheader
<clown> "columnheader can be used as a column header in a table or grid"
jn: Concerned about purpose of overwriting at cell level
mk: Maybe not necessary
<richardschwerdtfeger> RESOLUTION: Group will not create table, or cell roles, but rahter table will map to role=grid, aria-interactive=false as a default, and that maps and is presented as "table” and TD, inherits container interactivity from container. The default for grid will aria-interactive=“true”
<clown> issue-423
<trackbot> issue-423 -- Introduce a table role to be a parent of grid, but non-interactive -- open
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/423
jd: Will review and apply good judgement on disposition ...
<richardschwerdtfeger> RESOLUTION: Close issue 423
jtopic: Issue 620
<clown> issue-633?
<trackbot> issue-633 -- listbox and tree may contain only static items; badly need interactive widgets that can contain interactive typed items -- open
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/633
<richardschwerdtfeger> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/633
trackbot, issue-633?
<trackbot> issue-633 -- listbox and tree may contain only static items; badly need interactive widgets that can contain interactive typed items -- open
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/633
<richardschwerdtfeger> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1505
trackbot, action-535?
<trackbot> action-535 -- James Craig to Split shared CSS into directory structure and email draft to Michael -- due 2010-11-30 -- CLOSED
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/535
<clown> action-1505?
<trackbot> action-1505 -- Matthew King to Create proposal for a role and strategy to address issue 633 -- due 2014-10-13 -- OPEN
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1505
mk: like approach from grid
... aria-interactive's effect on mapping
... good way to handle list, stac list, -- is the list
interactive?
... An interactive span, or par
fe: radio buttons out of span?
mk: get radio role
... we have structural and also widget branches of aria
ontology
... widgets are interactive
... Believe that interactive marking on structural elements
should be limited, with appropriate role mappings
... my curent thinking ...
fe: Interactivity determined by the role?
mk: combination of role and state ...
<jnurthen> which roles would accept interactive?
<jnurthen> list, toolbar, img, group?
<clown> compare w3c.github.io/aria/core-aam/core-aam.html#role-map-list and http://w3c.github.io/aria/core-aam/core-aam.html#role-map-listbox
<jnurthen> region?
rs: We need interactivity for
graphics
... suggest pick specific roles, apply, and see how that
works
mk: yes
clown: start small
jn: asking the difference
rs: Do we agree to limit roles
initially?
... Do people agree to aria-interactive?
<mattking> agree to a new property aria-interactive
<richardschwerdtfeger> RESOLUTION: Create new property called aria-interactive
fe: people will try to dynamically change
need scotch
mk: if we make it a state, we
have to support dynamic
... if property then static
fe: aria-live
rs: yes
... OK with name?
jn: trying to convey ...?
... that app is responsible for managing focus for widget
... widget, not doc
<clown> http://w3c.github.io/aria/aria/aria.html#application
mk: application provides no api
mapping of applying it
... this could false has effect
... so primary question is is it state or property?
rs: prefer property at this point
jn: want to tie to widget
mk: if it affects mapping, it's going to be ok
jn: widget always does
mk: good question
mk interactive chart better than "chart manages focus"
mk: don't see any name other than
"author must manage focus" that solves the problem!
... author-provided-script==true
<richardschwerdtfeger> RESOLUTION: Create new aria-interactive property for action 1505
<clown> action-1362?
<trackbot> action-1362 -- James Nurthen to Patch issue-640: managesfocus -- due 2015-04-02 -- OPEN
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1362
jn: kill it
<clown> issue-640?
<trackbot> issue-640 -- Investigate aria-hasmanagedfocus to indicate whether a region manages focus to enable complex widgets -- open
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/640
RESOLUTION: Close issue-640 and action-1362
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.140 of Date: 2014-11-06 18:16:30 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/comb/combination/ Found Scribe: janina Inferring ScribeNick: janina Default Present: Fred_Esch, janina, Michael_Cooper, Léonie_Watson, Joseph_Scheuhammer, Joanmarie_Diggs, James_Nurthen, Rich_Schwerdtfeger, +1.650.738.aaaa, Matt_King, +49.322.110.8.aabb, Stefan_Schnabel, [Microsoft], Cynthia Present: Fred_Esch janina Michael_Cooper Léonie_Watson Joseph_Scheuhammer Joanmarie_Diggs James_Nurthen Rich_Schwerdtfeger +1.650.738.aaaa Matt_King +49.322.110.8.aabb Stefan_Schnabel [Microsoft] Cynthia Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-pfwg/2015Apr/0283.html Found Date: 30 Apr 2015 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2015/04/30-aria-minutes.html People with action items: WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines. You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option.[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]