W3C

- DRAFT -

Mobile Accessibility Task Force Teleconference

01 Aug 2014

Agenda

See also: IRC log

Attendees

Present
Jan, Jeanne, KathyW, Kim_Patch, MikeS, TomB, WuWei
Regrets
Alan, Brent_Shiver, Gavin
Chair
Kimberly_Patch
Scribe
jeanne

Contents


<trackbot> Date: 01 August 2014

<KimPatch> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/New_WCAG_2.0_Techniques

<KimPatch> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/66524/20140512_survey/results

<kw> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/WCAG_2.0_Techniques_Applicable_to_Mobile_without_Changes

<Jan> Thurs 11 ET works for me too

<scribe> scribe: jeanne

<kw> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/Technique_Development_Assignments

<kw> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/WCAG_2.0_Techniques_Applicable_to_Mobile_without_Changes

KW: We are in the process of identifying Techniques that are applicable to mobile
... I need someone to verify that the native app techniques are labeled.

MS: I'd be happy to work with someone on this.

KW: We have the technique listed, but we need to say whether it applies to Native Web and/or Native Apps and put it in the column.

<kw> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/WCAG_2.0_Techniques_Applicable_to_Mobile_without_Changes

<kw> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/WCAG_2.0_Techniques_Applicable_to_Mobile_without_Changes#CSS_Applicable_to_Mobile_without_Changes

<kw> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/Technique_Development_Assignments

KW: This link is for WCAG TEchnique writing assignments.
... If there are techniques that you want to work on, put your name on it, or let me know
... we will talk about more next week

<kw> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/66524/20140512_survey/results#xq29

New Mobile WCAG Techniques & Best Practices survey – continue to review survey

kW: We are starting at #29 on the survey

https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/66524/20140512_survey/results#xq29

[KW reads comments in the survey]

MS: It is the actionable nature of it, rather just than it is a link.
... in modern design, text is being used without any indication that it is actionable.

KW: Also knowing whether something can be swiped, it is not clear that you can go from page to page

MS: This should be a separate technique, you just have to intuit that there is something in another page to get via swipe.

JR: This is too vague, if the platform UI metaphors are not doing a good job of identifying actionable elements. The platform has to make sense of semantic code. Now, if it is custom work, then the onus is on the designer

KW: This would be very hard to be testable. Even at Advisory, it would be difficult to be testable.

JR: My suggestion is to make the Technique: Do not suppress the platform's behavior of distinguishing links.
... then we could have another Technique to say that if you do suppress the platform behavior, then you have to make it distinguishable -- and that would be hard to test.

MS: I'm concerned about saying not to break the platform behavior. I have worked on projects where we improved the plaform behavior, making it more accessible than the platform.
... Clearly defined role, make sure the platform renders it correctly.

JR: I agree, I just think that they are different techniques. One advisory, don't suppress the platform behavior, another advisory, that if you do, make it distinguishable.

MS: I think they should be sufficient

JR: They go under WCAG 1.3.1
... but I am still concerned about testability of the custom

KW: We do have a technique about not relying on color alone. We could add to that as a sufficient technique'

RESOLUTION: An advisory technique for not supressing the platform behavior of links and other actionable elements; and modify the Technique for 1.3.1 about not relying on color; and look at a new Technique for identifying available swiping gestures

Survey #29 Touch Target sizes

KW: it could fall under keyboard access -- being able to activate an element

JR: That's using a keyboard, I think it would be confusing

MS: Keyboard would not require the object to be large enough.

KW: WCaG is oriented toward mouse and keyboard, it really belongs with IndieUI.

MS: Then there are also the devices where you don't actually touch, like gestures over a touch target like the WII or Kinect.
... Could tell people to follow the platform guidelines

KW: We could say that this is an important accessibility issue and it doesn't fit under WcAG.

MS: When we were working with voiceover, we thought when you get close to it and then swipe, that would be sufficient when items were really small.

JR: I think WCAG knew that zoom was coming and then it would not be an issue

<KimPatch> Jeanne: I do think this is still an accessibility issue – minimum sizes. I'm not sure that zoom adequately covers it. It's an issue on the desktop as well. People with different kinds of mobility have a very difficult time with small objects.

Kw: Why not make it a best practice

<KimPatch> Jeanne – I think it's a blocker for people, there are so many places were zoom doesn't apply particularly in native apps that I think we should have it.

KW: relying on zoom is a high cognitive load.

<KimPatch> Jeanne: important for us to keep a list of things we think should be in a future version of WCAG

RESOLUTION: Mark this as a new possible WCAG success criteria as sufficient, and temporarily as an Advisory under 1.4.4 Resize Text.

Survey #30 Inactive Space around active elements

KW reads comments from survey

MS: Use case of a weather table when there is no padding.

KW: the problem is that people can accidently touch two at once.

MS: The solution is #29 -- not 30.

JR: 29 takes care of it by virtue of putting a minimum.

MS: Should we have any techniques about addressing blank or dead space. There is no technique or recommendation that there is dead space and that there are small elements elsewhere in the space. This is especially important for tablets, rather than rubbing finger around the screen and nothing happening.

TB: If you don't have blank spaces properly represented can be problematic. But I think when the controls stretch out until the next element, that can increase accessibility for blind.

RESOLUTION: to drop #30 in favor of #29

Next meeting

Please select a technique that you want to work on

scribe: we are trying to work more asynchronously to accommodate the people who have trouble with specific meeting times.

<kw> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/Technique_Development_Assignments

scribe: people will be able to work on techniques, even if they can't attend the meeting.

KW: Looking at the individual technques, there are notes from the people who reviewed it. It should not be restrictive, if there are thing to add, you can.

Josh and Andrew are going to attend an upcoming meeting to talk about how to write techniques

KP: The next meeting is Friday 8 August. The following meeting will be 14 August, at the new time which is 11:00 US EAstern, 8:00 US Pacific and 1500 UTC

Summary of Action Items

[End of minutes]

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Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Succeeded: s/Survey #30/Survey #30 Inactive Space around active elements/
Found Scribe: jeanne
Inferring ScribeNick: jeanne
Default Present: +1.978.760.aaaa, Kim_Patch, Jeanne, +1.408.425.aabb, KathyW, MikeS, Jan, TomB, WuWei
Present: Jan Jeanne KathyW Kim_Patch MikeS TomB WuWei
Regrets: Alan Brent_Shiver Gavin
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-mobile-a11y-tf/2014Jul/0034.html
Found Date: 01 Aug 2014
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2014/08/01-mobile-a11y-minutes.html
People with action items: 

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