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14:00:32 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-irc
RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-irc ←
14:00:38 <Steven> rrsagent, make log public
Steven Pemberton: rrsagent, make log public ←
14:00:46 <Steven> zakim, this will be xhtml
Steven Pemberton: zakim, this will be xhtml ←
14:00:47 <Zakim> ok, Steven, I see IA_XHTML2()9:00AM already started
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, Steven, I see IA_XHTML2()9:00AM already started ←
14:00:52 <Steven> zakim, who is here?
Steven Pemberton: zakim, who is here? ←
14:00:52 <Zakim> On the phone I see +386.8.aaaa
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see +386.8.aaaa ←
14:00:53 <Zakim> On IRC I see RRSAgent, Zakim, Roland, alessio, oedipus, Steven, myakura, Lachy, krijn
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see RRSAgent, Zakim, Roland, alessio, oedipus, Steven, myakura, Lachy, krijn ←
14:01:03 <Steven> zakim, dial steven-617
Steven Pemberton: zakim, dial steven-617 ←
14:01:03 <Zakim> ok, Steven; the call is being made
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, Steven; the call is being made ←
14:01:05 <Zakim> +Steven
Zakim IRC Bot: +Steven ←
14:01:39 <Steven> zakim, aaaa is Roland
Steven Pemberton: zakim, aaaa is Roland ←
14:01:39 <Zakim> +Roland; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Roland; got it ←
14:01:45 <Zakim> +??P9
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P9 ←
14:02:11 <Steven> zakim, ??P9 is ALessio
Steven Pemberton: zakim, ??P9 is ALessio ←
14:02:11 <Zakim> +ALessio; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +ALessio; got it ←
14:02:21 <Steven> zakim, ALessio is Alessio
Steven Pemberton: zakim, ALessio is Alessio ←
14:02:21 <Zakim> +Alessio; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Alessio; got it ←
14:02:55 <Zakim> +??P14
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P14 ←
14:03:00 <Steven> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/xhtml2/wiki/2007-02-Venice-FtF
Steven Pemberton: http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/xhtml2/wiki/2007-02-Venice-FtF ←
14:03:04 <yamx> zakim, ??P14 is yamx
Scribe problem: the name 'yamx' does not match any of the 21 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'yamx' does not match any of the 21 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown yamx: zakim, ??P14 is yamx ←
14:03:04 <Zakim> +yamx; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +yamx; got it ←
14:05:35 <Zakim> +Gregory_Rosmiata
Zakim IRC Bot: +Gregory_Rosmiata ←
14:05:51 <markbirbeck> zakim, code?
Mark Birbeck: zakim, code? ←
14:05:51 <Zakim> the conference code is 94865 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), markbirbeck
Zakim IRC Bot: the conference code is 94865 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), markbirbeck ←
14:06:02 <oedipus> zakim, Gregory_Rosmiata is Gregory_Rosmaita
Gregory Rosmaita: zakim, Gregory_Rosmiata is Gregory_Rosmaita ←
14:06:02 <Zakim> +Gregory_Rosmaita; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Gregory_Rosmaita; got it ←
14:06:09 <Steven> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Jan/0015
14:06:22 <Steven> Steven has changed the topic to: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Jan/0015
Steven Pemberton: Steven has changed the topic to: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Jan/0015 ←
14:06:28 <Steven> Chair: Roland
14:06:29 <Zakim> + +20876aabb
Zakim IRC Bot: + +20876aabb ←
14:06:36 <markbirbeck> zakim, i am aabb
Mark Birbeck: zakim, i am aabb ←
14:06:36 <Zakim> +markbirbeck; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +markbirbeck; got it ←
14:08:03 <Steven> zakim, who is here?
Steven Pemberton: zakim, who is here? ←
14:08:03 <Zakim> On the phone I see Roland, Steven, Alessio, yamx, Gregory_Rosmaita, markbirbeck
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see Roland, Steven, Alessio, yamx, Gregory_Rosmaita, markbirbeck ←
14:08:05 <Zakim> On IRC I see markbirbeck, alessio_, yamx, RRSAgent, Zakim, Roland, oedipus, Steven, myakura, Lachy, krijn
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see markbirbeck, alessio_, yamx, RRSAgent, Zakim, Roland, oedipus, Steven, myakura, Lachy, krijn ←
14:08:31 <oedipus> scribe: Gregory
(Scribe set to Gregory Rosmaita)
14:08:37 <oedipus> scribeNick: oedipus
14:09:13 <Zakim> +??P18
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P18 ←
14:09:42 <Roland> Gerrie Shults from HP joining
Roland Merrick: Gerrie Shults from HP joining ←
14:09:58 <oedipus> SP: 3 announcements: HP joining group again, 2) have at long last a wiki (only one full page) (MarkUp/xhtml2/wiki); 3) made f2f page
Steven Pemberton: 3 announcements: HP joining group again, 2) have at long last a wiki (only one full page) (MarkUp/xhtml2/wiki); 3) made f2f page ←
14:11:07 <oedipus> SP: third announcement -- yahoo announced last week that new mobile widget platform is based on XForms -- backs up a lot of what we've been saying -- chose so as to enable platform to be directed to as many devices possible, in the most appropriate manner -- in phase one (transitional) but second will use straight XForms
Steven Pemberton: third announcement -- yahoo announced last week that new mobile widget platform is based on XForms -- backs up a lot of what we've been saying -- chose so as to enable platform to be directed to as many devices possible, in the most appropriate manner -- in phase one (transitional) but second will use straight XForms ←
14:11:22 <Steven> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/xhtml2/wiki/
Steven Pemberton: http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/xhtml2/wiki/ ←
14:11:25 <Steven> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/xhtml2/wiki/2007-02-Venice-FtF
Steven Pemberton: http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/xhtml2/wiki/2007-02-Venice-FtF ←
14:11:41 <oedipus> RM: Selectors API - anything to report?
Roland Merrick: Selectors API - anything to report? ←
14:11:42 <Steven> http://mobile.yahoo.com/developers/roadmap
Steven Pemberton: http://mobile.yahoo.com/developers/roadmap ←
14:12:07 <markbirbeck> Shame that XML will never be used on the web, though. ;)
Mark Birbeck: Shame that XML will never be used on the web, though. ;) ←
14:12:08 <oedipus> SP: webAPs have almost as many deliverables as we do -- at least 13
Steven Pemberton: webAPs have almost as many deliverables as we do -- at least 13 ←
14:12:18 <oedipus> RM: 2 Web Apps groups going to merge
Roland Merrick: 2 Web Apps groups going to merge ←
14:12:26 <oedipus> SP: part of review -- who will take up what
Steven Pemberton: part of review -- who will take up what ←
14:12:39 <Steven> Regrets: Christine
Scribe problem: the name 'Christine' does not match any of the 18 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami
14:12:42 <oedipus> RM: Rich not here, so perhaps postpone ARIA issue discussion
Roland Merrick: Rich not here, so perhaps postpone ARIA issue discussion ←
14:13:01 <oedipus> RM: alessio will update wiki with details for f2f -- everyone planning to attend
Roland Merrick: alessio will update wiki with details for f2f -- everyone planning to attend ←
14:13:15 <oedipus> [note: everyone on call planning to attend]
[note: everyone on call planning to attend] ←
14:13:30 <oedipus> AC: IWA Italy (host)
Alessio Cartocci: IWA Italy (host) ←
14:13:39 <oedipus> Yam: need to know for visa app
Toshihiko Yamakami: need to know for visa app ←
14:13:51 <oedipus> SP: populate wiki and let yam know
Steven Pemberton: populate wiki and let yam know ←
14:14:05 <oedipus> ACTION Alessio - add details to f2f wiki page
ACTION Alessio - add details to f2f wiki page ←
14:14:14 <oedipus> TOPIC: Modularization Transition
14:14:46 <oedipus> SP: sent an implementation request to RM and Shane -- in status of doc, discovered that still talks about HTML WG rather than XHTML2 WG -- needs change
Steven Pemberton: sent an implementation request to RM and Shane -- in status of doc, discovered that still talks about HTML WG rather than XHTML2 WG -- needs change ←
14:15:03 <oedipus> SP: will send info to all necessary channels
Steven Pemberton: will send info to all necessary channels ←
14:15:15 <oedipus> TOPIC: CURIES to Last Call
14:15:33 <oedipus> RM: datatype, etc. discussion at last week's call -- any answers?
Roland Merrick: datatype, etc. discussion at last week's call -- any answers? ←
14:15:39 <Roland> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-html/2007Mar/0038.html
Roland Merrick: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-html/2007Mar/0038.html ←
14:15:47 <oedipus> SP: difference btw lexical value of CURIE and its value space
Steven Pemberton: difference btw lexical value of CURIE and its value space ←
14:16:19 <oedipus> SP: my claim is lexical value is as described in spec, value space is just URI -- think mark agreed, but shane dissented, but willing to let it pass
Steven Pemberton: my claim is lexical value is as described in spec, value space is just URI -- think mark agreed, but shane dissented, but willing to let it pass ←
14:17:21 <oedipus> RM: one more step -- pointing out that in Qnames talk about 2 components (2 seperate parts joined together for purpose) - value space, but alos prior stage when have 2 different parts -- left with mapping to URI plus suffix
Roland Merrick: one more step -- pointing out that in Qnames talk about 2 components (2 seperate parts joined together for purpose) - value space, but alos prior stage when have 2 different parts -- left with mapping to URI plus suffix ←
14:17:28 <oedipus> SP: why would we need to do that
Steven Pemberton: why would we need to do that ←
14:17:57 <oedipus> RM: point raised in email, if attempting to be backwards compatible applies to us, too
Roland Merrick: point raised in email, if attempting to be backwards compatible applies to us, too ←
14:18:12 <oedipus> Shane: posted to list on topic - http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Jan/0011.html
Shane McCarron: posted to list on topic - http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Jan/0011.html ←
14:20:05 <oedipus> SP: my question to mark is - is there any sense in our being backwards compatible with QNames -- problem: 2 CURIES that expand to same URI, but prefix and suffix different -- not case in QName -- if same prefix and suffix there is a one-to-one mapping; don't see value of triples
Steven Pemberton: my question to mark is - is there any sense in our being backwards compatible with QNames -- problem: 2 CURIES that expand to same URI, but prefix and suffix different -- not case in QName -- if same prefix and suffix there is a one-to-one mapping; don't see value of triples ←
14:21:16 <oedipus> RM: wants us to be clearer on whatever we decide -- we're dealing with specific case of QNames, not a general use of QNames -- if make clearer and say value space final URI cannonized by whatever cannonicalization thing supposed to use to compare 2 CURIES
Roland Merrick: wants us to be clearer on whatever we decide -- we're dealing with specific case of QNames, not a general use of QNames -- if make clearer and say value space final URI cannonized by whatever cannonicalization thing supposed to use to compare 2 CURIES ←
14:21:24 <oedipus> MB: happy with that if Shane is
Mark Birbeck: happy with that if Shane is ←
14:21:37 <oedipus> Shane: think i'm happy with that -- please refer to final paragraph
Shane McCarron: think i'm happy with that -- please refer to final paragraph ←
14:21:52 <oedipus> quote: Note that, as things stand right now, a CURIE used in a document like
Scribe problem: the name 'quote' does not match any of the 21 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown quote: Note that, as things stand right now, a CURIE used in a document like ←
14:21:52 <oedipus> XHTML+RDFa will NOT be expanded in the DOM. If you are writing portable
XHTML+RDFa will NOT be expanded in the DOM. If you are writing portable ←
14:21:52 <oedipus> scripts today, you will need to do that expansion yourself. I think
scripts today, you will need to do that expansion yourself. I think ←
14:21:52 <oedipus> that, given Steven and Mark's arguments, you MUST do this expansion if
that, given Steven and Mark's arguments, you MUST do this expansion if ←
14:21:52 <oedipus> you are going to attempt to do anything with CURIEs in a portable
you are going to attempt to do anything with CURIEs in a portable ←
14:21:53 <oedipus> script. If, on the other hand, you are just writing a script for your
script. If, on the other hand, you are just writing a script for your ←
14:21:55 <oedipus> own content, you could easily operate on the literal values, since you
own content, you could easily operate on the literal values, since you ←
14:21:57 <oedipus> know what the prefixes and references mean.
know what the prefixes and references mean. ←
14:22:11 <oedipus> Shane: now, scripts are effecting DOM
Shane McCarron: now, scripts are effecting DOM ←
14:22:19 <oedipus> RM: crack open and convert to URIs
Roland Merrick: crack open and convert to URIs ←
14:22:29 <oedipus> Shane: does nothing to help write script looking for roles
Shane McCarron: does nothing to help write script looking for roles ←
14:23:08 <oedipus> SP: script uses these parsers -- include script and API gives you the different bits; libraries for CURIES that do expansion for you -- don't query DOM to "give me this" but ask the API
Steven Pemberton: script uses these parsers -- include script and API gives you the different bits; libraries for CURIES that do expansion for you -- don't query DOM to "give me this" but ask the API ←
14:23:33 <oedipus> SP: agree with last paragraph -- not automatically in DOM -- have to construct yourself or use something that constructs it for you
Steven Pemberton: agree with last paragraph -- not automatically in DOM -- have to construct yourself or use something that constructs it for you ←
14:24:13 <oedipus> [scribe's note -- GJR mistook MB for RM)
[scribe's note -- GJR mistook MB for RM repeatedly) ←
14:24:23 <oedipus> RM: who will reply to tell what we will do
Roland Merrick: who will reply to tell what we will do ←
14:24:26 <oedipus> SP: candidates?
Steven Pemberton: candidates? ←
14:24:34 <oedipus> RM: the 3 people involved in the dialog
Roland Merrick: the 3 people involved in the dialog ←
14:24:38 <oedipus> Shane: i can do it
Shane McCarron: i can do it ←
14:24:48 <ShaneM> ACTION: Shane to add text about expanding CURIEs into URIs in scripting.
ACTION: Shane to add text about expanding CURIEs into URIs in scripting. ←
14:24:51 <oedipus> SP: definitive reference for transition from IRI to what goes over wire
Steven Pemberton: definitive reference for transition from IRI to what goes over wire ←
14:25:13 <ShaneM> ACTION: Shane to respond to submitter of question about value space of CURIEs and their relation to the value space of qnames.
ACTION: Shane to respond to submitter of question about value space of CURIEs and their relation to the value space of qnames. ←
14:25:21 <Steven> http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc3987.txt
Steven Pemberton: http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc3987.txt ←
14:25:35 <oedipus> RM: CURIES issue 8010
Roland Merrick: CURIES ISSUE-8010 ←
14:25:54 <Roland> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-html-editor/2007JanMar/0051
Roland Merrick: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-html-editor/2007JanMar/0051 ←
14:25:58 <oedipus> s/for RM/for RM repeatedly
14:26:53 <oedipus> Shane: we've already done this eight months ago
Shane McCarron: we've already done this eight months ago ←
14:27:12 <oedipus> RM: final one on list also done?
Roland Merrick: final one on list also done? ←
14:27:36 <Roland> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-html-editor/2007AprJun/0000
Roland Merrick: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-html-editor/2007AprJun/0000 ←
14:28:12 <oedipus> "When a CURIE is used in an XML grammar, and the prefix on the CURIE is omitted, then the prefix MUST be interpreted as the current default XML namespace."
"When a CURIE is used in an XML grammar, and the prefix on the CURIE is omitted, then the prefix MUST be interpreted as the current default XML namespace." ←
14:28:42 <oedipus> Shane: was it our intent to remove ambiguity (he says "flexibility") and answer is a resounding YES -- i replied to norm on this
Shane McCarron: was it our intent to remove ambiguity (he says "flexibility") and answer is a resounding YES -- i replied to norm on this ←
14:29:21 <oedipus> SP: we do mean current namespace (in reference to NormW's last comment) -- must be interpreted as if had prefix of current default XML namespace
Steven Pemberton: we do mean current namespace (in reference to NormW's last comment) -- must be interpreted as if had prefix of current default XML namespace ←
14:29:39 <oedipus> Shane; draft change so can't have non-prefixed CURIES -- have to define prefix
Shane; draft change so can't have non-prefixed CURIES -- have to define prefix ←
14:29:41 <Steven> http://www.w3.org/TR/2007/WD-curie-20071126/
Steven Pemberton: http://www.w3.org/TR/2007/WD-curie-20071126/ ←
14:31:07 <oedipus> "When CURIES are used in a non-XML host language, the host language MUST provide a mechanism for defining the mapping from the prefix to an IRI. A host language MAY provide a mechanism for defining a default prefix value. In such a host language, if the prefix is omitted from a CURIE, the default prefix value is used. The concatenation of the prefix associated with a CURIE and its reference MUST be an IRI [IRI]. The CURIE prefix '_' is reserved. For this r
"When CURIES are used in a non-XML host language, the host language MUST provide a mechanism for defining the mapping from the prefix to an IRI. A host language MAY provide a mechanism for defining a default prefix value. In such a host language, if the prefix is omitted from a CURIE, the default prefix value is used. The concatenation of the prefix associated with a CURIE and its reference MUST be an IRI [IRI]. The CURIE prefix '_' is reserved. For this r ←
14:31:51 <oedipus> SP: mark, you said we made more flexible
Steven Pemberton: mark, you said we made more flexible ←
14:32:43 <oedipus> MB: both scenarios XML Schema uses default NS, XSLT uses none -- asking if removed that, we didn't -- if allow host language to define prefix, have SPARQL if not have RDF
Mark Birbeck: both scenarios XML Schema uses default NS, XSLT uses none -- asking if removed that, we didn't -- if allow host language to define prefix, have SPARQL if not have RDF ←
14:33:40 <oedipus> RM: second question - addressed as well
Mark Birbeck: second question - addressed as well ←
14:34:17 <oedipus> s/RM: second/MB: second/
14:34:32 <oedipus> "The default prefix? Do you not mean the default namespace?
"The default prefix? Do you not mean the default namespace? ←
14:34:56 <oedipus> MB: host language MAY is wording
Mark Birbeck: host language MAY is wording ←
14:35:20 <oedipus> SP: default prefix is issue
Steven Pemberton: default prefix is issue ←
14:35:44 <oedipus> Shane: if a language mapping permits defaults, it will define mechanism, if not, the language will not permit it
Shane McCarron: if a language mapping permits defaults, it will define mechanism, if not, the language will not permit it ←
14:36:20 <oedipus> SP: if language doesn't support default prefixes, production for CURIE wrong - prefix not optional
Steven Pemberton: if language doesn't support default prefixes, production for CURIE wrong - prefix not optional ←
14:36:29 <oedipus> Shane: not really -- syntax still right
Shane McCarron: not really -- syntax still right ←
14:37:41 <oedipus> MB: some kind of API? here are a whole lot of mappings, here is a CURIE, please tell me what the IRI is -- host language needs means of hosting and defining the CURIE through API -- language should inhibit the format that it doesn't like and not even call the API
Mark Birbeck: some kind of API? here are a whole lot of mappings, here is a CURIE, please tell me what the IRI is -- host language needs means of hosting and defining the CURIE through API -- language should inhibit the format that it doesn't like and not even call the API ←
14:38:13 <oedipus> Shane: arbitrary rules for prefix mapping -- can't have generic prefix mapping anyway -- there is no default prefix that is the rule
Shane McCarron: arbitrary rules for prefix mapping -- can't have generic prefix mapping anyway -- there is no default prefix that is the rule ←
14:39:10 <oedipus> RM: latest editors' draft -- slightly out-of-date compared with RDFa -- perhaps we need to reword
Mark Birbeck: latest editors' draft -- slightly out-of-date compared with RDFa -- perhaps we need to reword ←
14:39:35 <markbirbeck> http://www.w3.org/TR/rdfa-syntax/#s_curies
Mark Birbeck: http://www.w3.org/TR/rdfa-syntax/#s_curies ←
14:39:42 <oedipus> Shane: shouldn't be anything generic in RDFa that would cause problem unless something changed in last round of edits, which hasn't been made public
Shane McCarron: shouldn't be anything generic in RDFa that would cause problem unless something changed in last round of edits, which hasn't been made public ←
14:39:59 <oedipus> s/RM: latest/MB: latest
14:40:01 <oedipus> s/RM: latest/MB: latest/
14:40:38 <Zakim> -Steven
Zakim IRC Bot: -Steven ←
14:40:38 <oedipus> MB: whether define mapping to use for default prefix and when define way for authors to override that are 2 seperate things
Mark Birbeck: whether define mapping to use for default prefix and when define way for authors to override that are 2 seperate things ←
14:41:27 <oedipus> MB: need another draft
Mark Birbeck: need another draft ←
14:41:34 <oedipus> RM: objective is to issue LC draft
Roland Merrick: objective is to issue LC draft ←
14:41:52 <oedipus> RM: can we get these cleared this week so can make decision to go to LC next week?
Roland Merrick: can we get these cleared this week so can make decision to go to LC next week? ←
14:41:58 <Steven> zakim, dial steven-617
Steven Pemberton: zakim, dial steven-617 ←
14:41:58 <Zakim> ok, Steven; the call is being made
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, Steven; the call is being made ←
14:41:59 <Zakim> +Steven
Zakim IRC Bot: +Steven ←
14:42:18 <oedipus> MB: cleared -- think specific comments resolved/answered
Mark Birbeck: cleared -- think specific comments resolved/answered ←
14:42:27 <ShaneM> ACTION: Shane to reconcile CURIE draft with CURIE RDFa text so the processing model is consistent and the rules about default prefix processing are complete.
ACTION: Shane to reconcile CURIE draft with CURIE RDFa text so the processing model is consistent and the rules about default prefix processing are complete. ←
14:42:35 <oedipus> RM: draft ready for LC in time to review before next meeting
Roland Merrick: draft ready for LC in time to review before next meeting ←
14:42:43 <ShaneM> ACTION: Shane to produce a CURIE last call candidate for next week's call.
ACTION: Shane to produce a CURIE last call candidate for next week's call. ←
14:43:11 <oedipus> RM: done all can do today on CURIES -- any other issues?
Roland Merrick: done all can do today on CURIES -- any other issues? ←
14:43:17 <oedipus> [silence]
[silence] ←
14:43:26 <oedipus> TOPIC: RDFa Module
14:43:57 <Roland> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-html-wg/2007AprJun/0001.html
Roland Merrick: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-html-wg/2007AprJun/0001.html ←
14:44:10 <oedipus> RM: first item from last spring
Roland Merrick: first item from last spring ←
14:44:40 <Roland> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2007/ED-xhtml-rdfa-20070402/
Roland Merrick: http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2007/ED-xhtml-rdfa-20070402/ ←
14:44:48 <oedipus> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-html-wg/2007AprJun/0003.html
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-html-wg/2007AprJun/0003.html ←
14:45:08 <Roland> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-html-wg/2007AprJun/0008.html
Roland Merrick: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-html-wg/2007AprJun/0008.html ←
14:45:13 <oedipus> "Two quick points noted by the CC folks: 1) xmlns still not supported.... darn DTDs, right? What's the path to fixing the W3C validator in this regard? Does it have to be schema-based? 2) it seems the document must be served as application/xhtml+xml... but XHTML 1.1 should be servable as text/html, right? Is there a deeper issue here that I don't understand?"
"Two quick points noted by the CC folks: 1) xmlns still not supported.... darn DTDs, right? What's the path to fixing the W3C validator in this regard? Does it have to be schema-based? 2) it seems the document must be served as application/xhtml+xml... but XHTML 1.1 should be servable as text/html, right? Is there a deeper issue here that I don't understand?" ←
14:46:11 <oedipus> Shane: done something really clever -- group member took collection of test cases and integrated them into a web page with ajax backend stuff that allows for easy browsing and use of tests -- try to find link for that
Shane McCarron: done something really clever -- group member took collection of test cases and integrated them into a web page with ajax backend stuff that allows for easy browsing and use of tests -- try to find link for that ←
14:46:40 <oedipus> Shane: decent approach to testing -- i think; don't know how to run tests against RDF
Shane McCarron: decent approach to testing -- i think; don't know how to run tests against RDF ←
14:46:50 <oedipus> MB: could use extended version of Manu's test suite locally
Mark Birbeck: could use extended version of Manu's test suite locally ←
14:47:00 <Steven> http://rdfa.digitalbazaar.com/rdfa-test-harness/
Steven Pemberton: http://rdfa.digitalbazaar.com/rdfa-test-harness/ ←
14:47:09 <oedipus> Shane: issues resolving references for URIs due to SPARQL queries
Shane McCarron: issues resolving references for URIs due to SPARQL queries ←
14:47:22 <oedipus> Shene: rules for dealing with test cases? not normative part of spec
Scribe problem: the name 'Shene' does not match any of the 21 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown Shene: rules for dealing with test cases? not normative part of spec ←
14:47:32 <oedipus> SP: no, not normative, but part of transition to PR
Steven Pemberton: no, not normative, but part of transition to PR ←
14:48:01 <oedipus> SP: issue CR spec with test suite -- here's CR spec, here's test suite, and then use to prove have 2 implementations
Steven Pemberton: issue CR spec with test suite -- here's CR spec, here's test suite, and then use to prove have 2 implementations ←
14:48:18 <oedipus> Shane: isn't a test suite document -- just bag of tests tell people to use
Shane McCarron: isn't a test suite document -- just bag of tests tell people to use ←
14:48:31 <oedipus> Shane: should draft reference drafts or part of transition announcement
Shane McCarron: should draft reference drafts or part of transition announcement ←
14:48:39 <oedipus> SP: part of transition announcement
Steven Pemberton: part of transition announcement ←
14:48:53 <oedipus> RM: near LC of RDFa
Roland Merrick: near LC of RDFa ←
14:49:14 <oedipus> Shane: WG needs to approve LC draft once there is a document --some strange outstanding issues that need to be resolved
Shane McCarron: WG needs to approve LC draft once there is a document --some strange outstanding issues that need to be resolved ←
14:49:45 <oedipus> RM: none of items on list for modularization are still pertinent, but will look through
Roland Merrick: none of items on list for modularization are still pertinent, but will look through ←
14:50:30 <oedipus> Shane: they are ALL closed off; implementation report, as part of most recent draft produced last week (thought would use for CR request)
Shane McCarron: they are ALL closed off; implementation report, as part of most recent draft produced last week (thought would use for CR request) ←
14:50:32 <oedipus> SP: i did
Steven Pemberton: i did ←
14:51:04 <oedipus> Shane: updated M12n candidate for CR transition -- you refer to last editors' draft, but that's not what we are pushing for CR
Shane McCarron: updated M12n candidate for CR transition -- you refer to last editors' draft, but that's not what we are pushing for CR ←
14:51:40 <oedipus> Shane: only thing changed recently is "prose versus implementation" -- should add text to clarify there is a prose spec and implementations, if inconsistencies, prose wins
Shane McCarron: only thing changed recently is "prose versus implementation" -- should add text to clarify there is a prose spec and implementations, if inconsistencies, prose wins ←
14:52:04 <oedipus> Shane: didn't agree to change MUST to SHOULD in M12n, just Role
Shane McCarron: didn't agree to change MUST to SHOULD in M12n, just Role ←
14:52:13 <oedipus> RM: not my recollection
Roland Merrick: not my recollection ←
14:53:00 <oedipus> Shane: changed in role and considered changing in access; argued that can't change in M12n -- no one thought of implications of importing all attributes in a namespace
Shane McCarron: changed in role and considered changing in access; argued that can't change in M12n -- no one thought of implications of importing all attributes in a namespace ←
14:53:11 <oedipus> RM: think discussed in november
Roland Merrick: think discussed in november ←
14:53:36 <oedipus> RM: relaxed constraint for Role for ARIA
Roland Merrick: relaxed constraint for Role for ARIA ←
14:53:40 <oedipus> SP: yes
Steven Pemberton: yes ←
14:53:51 <oedipus> Shane: agree we would do in role, but not in M12n
Shane McCarron: agree we would do in role, but not in M12n ←
14:54:26 <oedipus> RM: have to change in M12n -- could be interpreted as change that could push back to LC -- will try and find pointer
Roland Merrick: have to change in M12n -- could be interpreted as change that could push back to LC -- will try and find pointer ←
14:54:32 <oedipus> GJR: think on second day of f2f
Gregory Rosmaita: think on second day of f2f ←
14:55:19 <oedipus> http://www.w3.org/2007/11/09-xhtml-minutes
http://www.w3.org/2007/11/09-xhtml-minutes ←
14:55:39 <oedipus> Shane: not even sure where to change
Shane McCarron: not even sure where to change ←
14:56:00 <oedipus> quote: <markbirbeck> When @role appears without a namespace in another language, it is because that language has added it to its own language. Just like @class in SVG is *not* @class in HTML, but they have given it the same semantics to make it easier for people to use
Scribe problem: the name 'quote' does not match any of the 21 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown quote: <markbirbeck> When @role appears without a namespace in another language, it is because that language has added it to its own language. Just like @class in SVG is *not* @class in HTML, but they have given it the same semantics to make it easier for people to use ←
14:56:22 <oedipus> quote: Steven: I would prefer just one, with an ENglish sentence "Rule 3.1.5 of modularization does not apply to this attribute" or somesuch
Scribe problem: the name 'quote' does not match any of the 21 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown quote: Steven: I would prefer just one, with an ENglish sentence "Rule 3.1.5 of modularization does not apply to this attribute" or somesuch ←
14:56:22 <oedipus> Roland: Good
Roland Merrick: Good ←
14:56:42 <oedipus> [scribe's note - Roland's comment "good" from minutes
[scribe's note - Roland's comment "good" from minutes ←
14:57:03 <Zakim> -??P18
Zakim IRC Bot: -??P18 ←
14:57:07 <Zakim> -Alessio
Zakim IRC Bot: -Alessio ←
14:57:08 <Zakim> -markbirbeck
Zakim IRC Bot: -markbirbeck ←
14:57:10 <oedipus> rssagent, draft minutes
rssagent, draft minutes ←
14:57:10 <Zakim> -Steven
Zakim IRC Bot: -Steven ←
14:57:11 <Zakim> -yamx
Scribe problem: the name 'yamx' does not match any of the 21 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Zakim IRC Bot: -yamx ←
14:57:12 <Zakim> -Roland
Zakim IRC Bot: -Roland ←
14:57:29 <Zakim> -Gregory_Rosmaita
Zakim IRC Bot: -Gregory_Rosmaita ←
14:57:30 <Zakim> IA_XHTML2()9:00AM has ended
Zakim IRC Bot: IA_XHTML2()9:00AM has ended ←
14:57:31 <Zakim> Attendees were +386.8.aaaa, Steven, Roland, Alessio, yamx, Gregory_Rosmaita, +20876aabb, markbirbeck
Zakim IRC Bot: Attendees were +386.8.aaaa, Steven, Roland, Alessio, yamx, Gregory_Rosmaita, +20876aabb, markbirbeck ←
14:58:06 <oedipus> rssagent, draft minutes
rssagent, draft minutes ←
14:58:18 <oedipus> zakim, please part
zakim, please part ←
14:58:50 <ShaneM> steven.... M12N says this: <p>Each of the attributes defined in an XHTML attribute collection
Shane McCarron: steven.... M12N says this: <p>Each of the attributes defined in an XHTML attribute collection ←
14:58:50 <ShaneM> is available for use when
Shane McCarron: is available for use when ←
14:58:50 <ShaneM> their corresponding module is included in an XHTML Host Language or an
Shane McCarron: their corresponding module is included in an XHTML Host Language or an ←
14:58:50 <ShaneM> XHTML Integration Set. In such a
Shane McCarron: XHTML Integration Set. In such a ←
14:58:50 <ShaneM> situation, the attributes are available for use in the definition
Shane McCarron: situation, the attributes are available for use in the definition ←
14:58:51 <ShaneM> of elements that are NOT
Shane McCarron: of elements that are NOT ←
14:58:53 <ShaneM> in the XHTML namespace when they are referenced using their
Shane McCarron: in the XHTML namespace when they are referenced using their ←
14:58:55 <ShaneM> namespace-qualified identifier (e.g., <code>xhtml:class</code>).
Shane McCarron: namespace-qualified identifier (e.g., <code>xhtml:class</code>). ←
14:58:57 <ShaneM> The semantics of the attributes remain the same regardless of whether
Shane McCarron: The semantics of the attributes remain the same regardless of whether ←
14:58:59 <ShaneM> they are referenced using their qualified identifier or not.
Shane McCarron: they are referenced using their qualified identifier or not. ←
14:59:01 <ShaneM> <strong>It is an error to use an XHTML namespace-qualified attribute on elements from the XHTML Namespace.</strong>
Shane McCarron: <strong>It is an error to use an XHTML namespace-qualified attribute on elements from the XHTML Namespace.</strong> ←
14:59:04 <ShaneM> </p>
Shane McCarron: </p> ←
14:59:05 <oedipus> rrsagent, publish minutes
rrsagent, publish minutes ←
14:59:05 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus ←
14:59:06 <ShaneM> or roland. Is that where you think there should be a change?
Shane McCarron: or roland. Is that where you think there should be a change? ←
14:59:13 <oedipus> rrsagent, publish minutes
rrsagent, publish minutes ←
14:59:13 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus ←
14:59:29 <Steven> Thanks Gegory!
Steven Pemberton: Thanks Gegory! ←
14:59:36 <Steven> Gregory
Steven Pemberton: Gregory ←
14:59:40 <oedipus> no problem, steven!
no problem, steven! ←
14:59:52 <Steven> Meeting: XHTML2 WG Weekly Teleconference
14:59:55 <oedipus> present+ Shane_McCarron
present+ Shane_McCarron ←
15:00:03 <oedipus> present+ Mark_Birbeck
present+ Mark_Birbeck ←
15:00:15 <oedipus> present- aaaa
present- aaaa ←
15:00:20 <Steven> rrsagent, make minutes
Steven Pemberton: rrsagent, make minutes ←
15:00:20 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-minutes.html Steven
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-minutes.html Steven ←
15:00:25 <oedipus> present- aabb
present- aabb ←
15:00:32 <oedipus> rrsagent, publish minutes
rrsagent, publish minutes ←
15:00:32 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus ←
15:00:54 <oedipus> steven, are you going to push the minutes -- it's no bother to me if i do
steven, are you going to push the minutes -- it's no bother to me if i do ←
15:01:09 <Steven> As you like
Steven Pemberton: As you like ←
15:01:18 <Steven> If you volunteer :-)
Steven Pemberton: If you volunteer :-) ←
15:01:32 <oedipus> aye, aye, cap'n!
aye, aye, cap'n! ←
15:01:51 <oedipus> present- [+386.8.aaaa]
present- [+386.8.aaaa] ←
15:02:32 <oedipus> steven, do you know to whom the mystery numbers belong?
steven, do you know to whom the mystery numbers belong? ←
15:02:40 <oedipus> rrsagent, publish minutes
rrsagent, publish minutes ←
15:02:40 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus ←
15:03:02 <Steven> Don't worry about it Gregory
Steven Pemberton: Don't worry about it Gregory ←
15:03:07 <Steven> Zakim getting confused
Steven Pemberton: Zakim getting confused ←
15:03:08 <oedipus> i think the atendees list is fille anyway
i think the atendees list is fille anyway ←
15:03:15 <oedipus> thank
thank ←
15:03:18 <oedipus> er, thanks
er, thanks ←
15:03:39 <oedipus> rrsagent, please part
rrsagent, please part ←
15:03:39 <RRSAgent> I see 4 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-actions.rdf :
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I see 4 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-actions.rdf : ←
15:03:39 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Shane to add text about expanding CURIEs into URIs in scripting. [1]
ACTION: Shane to add text about expanding CURIEs into URIs in scripting. [1] ←
15:03:39 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-irc#T14-24-48
RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-irc#T14-24-48 ←
15:03:39 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Shane to respond to submitter of question about value space of CURIEs and their relation to the value space of qnames. [2]
ACTION: Shane to respond to submitter of question about value space of CURIEs and their relation to the value space of qnames. [2] ←
15:03:39 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-irc#T14-25-13
RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-irc#T14-25-13 ←
15:03:39 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Shane to reconcile CURIE draft with CURIE RDFa text so the processing model is consistent and the rules about default prefix processing are complete. [3]
ACTION: Shane to reconcile CURIE draft with CURIE RDFa text so the processing model is consistent and the rules about default prefix processing are complete. [3] ←
15:03:39 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-irc#T14-42-27
RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-irc#T14-42-27 ←
15:03:39 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Shane to produce a CURIE last call candidate for next week's call. [4]
ACTION: Shane to produce a CURIE last call candidate for next week's call. [4] ←
15:03:39 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-irc#T14-42-43
RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-xhtml-irc#T14-42-43 ←
Formatted by CommonScribe