edit

Provenance Working Group Teleconference

Minutes of 01 March 2012

Agenda
http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2012.03.01
Seen
Curt Tilmes, Daniel Garijo, David Corsar, Graham Klyne, James Cheney, Kai Eckert, Khalid Belhajjame, Luc Moreau, Michael Lang, Paolo Missier, Paul Groth, Sam Coppens, Sandro Hawke, Satya Sahoo, Simon Miles, Stephan Zednik, Stephen Cresswell, Ted Thibodeau, Timothy Lebo
Chair
Paul Groth
Scribe
Graham Klyne
IRC Log
Original
Resolutions
  1. Minutes of the Feb 23 2012 Telecon link
  2. Minutes of the second face to face meeting (F2F2) are approved link
  3. remove id and and attribute from alternateOf, specializationOf, and hasNote link
  4. adopt example catalog approach from agenda link
Topics
  1. Admin

    Beyond general admin, minutes of the F2F2 meeting were approved. The working group was reminded of the time change in the US.

  2. Timetable for Release

    A revised time table for the working group was presented by the chairs. The working group was reminded that this was an aggressive schedule but could be achieved through focused work.

  3. Update on PROV-DM:

    Luc presented the current status of the prov-dm and then discussed the plans for WD5 and highlighted the remaining issues left and also that an improved organization would be adopted in the document. The group approved the simplification of specializationOf, alternateOf and hasNote into binary relations.

  4. PROV-O

    an extensive status review of the prov-o progress was given. Tim presented a system for monitoring alignment based on the ProvRDF mappings page as well as progress in cataloging issues.

  5. Example Catalog

    Tim presented a comprehensive structure for creating and documenting examples. The group approved this structure and the notion of having such a catalog. Curt, Sam, Mike, Tim and Luc all agreed to populate the catalog.

  6. open discussion around accounts

    The group had a discussion about revisiting the F2F2 decision around simplification/removal of the account construct. It was agreed that this discussion could be reopened but with the proviso that this discussion not impact progress on the deliverables. It was also suggested that accounts may better be discussed in a note rather than a recommendation to ensure on time delivery.

16:01:42 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/03/01-prov-irc

RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/03/01-prov-irc

16:01:44 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world

Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs world

16:01:46 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be

Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be

16:01:46 <Zakim> I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot

Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot

16:01:47 <trackbot> Meeting: Provenance Working Group Teleconference
16:01:47 <trackbot> Date: 01 March 2012
16:01:56 <MacTed> RRSAgent, draft minutes

Ted Thibodeau: RRSAgent, draft minutes

16:01:56 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/03/01-prov-minutes.html MacTed

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/03/01-prov-minutes.html MacTed

16:02:02 <MacTed> RRSAgent, make logs public

Ted Thibodeau: RRSAgent, make logs public

16:02:08 <MacTed> Zakim, who's here?

Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, who's here?

16:02:08 <Zakim> sorry, MacTed, I don't know what conference this is

Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, MacTed, I don't know what conference this is

16:02:10 <Zakim> On IRC I see Luc, Zakim, RRSAgent, kai, Mike_, Curt, tlebo, SamCoppens, gk1, GK, MacTed, trackbot, stain, sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see Luc, Zakim, RRSAgent, kai, Mike_, Curt, tlebo, SamCoppens, gk1, GK, MacTed, trackbot, stain, sandro

16:02:11 <MacTed> Zakim, this is PROV

Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, this is PROV

16:02:14 <Zakim> ok, MacTed; that matches SW_(PROV)11:00AM

Zakim IRC Bot: ok, MacTed; that matches SW_(PROV)11:00AM

16:02:18 <MacTed> Zakim, who's here?

Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, who's here?

16:02:18 <Zakim> On the phone I see tlebo, +1.443.708.aaaa, SamCoppens, Curt_Tilmes, ??P4, [OpenLink], ??P18

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see tlebo, +1.443.708.aaaa, SamCoppens, Curt_Tilmes, ??P4, [OpenLink], ??P18

16:02:23 <Zakim> On IRC I see khalidbelhajjame, Luc, Zakim, RRSAgent, kai, Mike_, Curt, tlebo, SamCoppens, gk1, GK, MacTed, trackbot, stain, sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see khalidbelhajjame, Luc, Zakim, RRSAgent, kai, Mike_, Curt, tlebo, SamCoppens, gk1, GK, MacTed, trackbot, stain, sandro

16:02:27 <MacTed> Zakim, [OpenLink] is temporarily me

Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, [OpenLink] is temporarily me

16:02:29 <MacTed> Zakim, mute me

Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, mute me

16:02:30 <Zakim> +MacTed; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +MacTed; got it

16:02:37 <Zakim> MacTed should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: MacTed should now be muted

16:02:39 <Zakim> -??P18

Zakim IRC Bot: -??P18

16:02:43 <Luc> trackbot, start telcon

Luc Moreau: trackbot, start telcon

16:02:45 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world

Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs world

16:02:47 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be

Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be

16:02:47 <Zakim> I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot

Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot

16:02:48 <trackbot> Meeting: Provenance Working Group Teleconference
16:02:48 <trackbot> Date: 01 March 2012
16:02:55 <Zakim> +??P18

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P18

16:02:56 <Zakim> +Sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: +Sandro

16:03:04 <GK> zakim, ??p18 is me

Graham Klyne: zakim, ??p18 is me

16:03:04 <Zakim> +GK; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +GK; got it

16:03:14 <Luc> Zakim, this will be PROV

Luc Moreau: Zakim, this will be PROV

16:03:14 <Zakim> ok, Luc, I see SW_(PROV)11:00AM already started

Zakim IRC Bot: ok, Luc, I see SW_(PROV)11:00AM already started

16:03:31 <Luc> Agenda: http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2012.03.01
16:03:41 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]

Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller]

16:03:50 <Zakim> +??P22

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P22

16:03:56 <Luc> Chair: Paul Groth
16:04:04 <Luc> have we got a scribe?

Luc Moreau: have we got a scribe?

16:04:17 <Zakim> +??P25

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P25

16:04:26 <khalidbelhajjame> zakim, ??P25 is me

Khalid Belhajjame: zakim, ??P25 is me

16:04:26 <Zakim> +khalidbelhajjame; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +khalidbelhajjame; got it

16:04:29 <Luc> Scribe: GK

(Scribe set to Graham Klyne)

16:04:40 <Luc> Topic: Admin

1. Admin

Summary: Beyond general admin, minutes of the F2F2 meeting were approved. The working group was reminded of the time change in the US.

<pgroth> Summary: Beyond general admin, minutes of the F2F2 meeting were approved. The working group was reminded of the time change in the US.
16:05:09 <pgroth> Minutes of the Feb 23 2012 Telecon: http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/meeting/2012-02-23

Paul Groth: Minutes of the Feb 23 2012 Telecon: http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/meeting/2012-02-23

16:05:10 <Luc> rrsagent, make logs public

Luc Moreau: rrsagent, make logs public

16:05:16 <GK> Vote on minutes of last week telecon

Vote on minutes of last week telecon

16:05:21 <khalidbelhajjame> +1

Khalid Belhajjame: +1

16:05:23 <Curt> +1

Curt Tilmes: +1

16:05:24 <tlebo> +1

Timothy Lebo: +1

16:05:26 <SamCoppens> +1

Sam Coppens: +1

16:05:28 <dgarijo> +1

Daniel Garijo: +1

16:05:30 <satya> +1

Satya Sahoo: +1

16:05:31 <GK> OK, with revervartion per email

OK, with revervartion per email

16:05:35 <Mike_> +1

Michael Lang: +1

16:05:37 <kai> +0, wasn't there

Kai Eckert: +0, wasn't there

16:06:33 <Zakim> +??P30

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P30

16:06:35 <tlebo> gk: did we explicitly agree to 3 parts, or a nod to the editors?

Graham Klyne: did we explicitly agree to 3 parts, or a nod to the editors? [ Scribe Assist by Timothy Lebo ]

16:07:12 <GK> +1

+1

16:07:12 <pgroth> Vote Minutes of F2F2:

Paul Groth: Vote Minutes of F2F2:

16:07:16 <Paolo> +1

Paolo Missier: +1

16:07:18 <pgroth> http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/meeting/2012-02-02

Paul Groth: http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/meeting/2012-02-02

16:07:19 <tlebo> +1

Timothy Lebo: +1

16:07:21 <dgarijo> +1

Daniel Garijo: +1

16:07:24 <kai> +1

Kai Eckert: +1

16:07:25 <Zakim> +??P36

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P36

16:07:37 <Luc> ACCEPTED: Minutes of the Feb 23 2012 Telecon

RESOLVED: Minutes of the Feb 23 2012 Telecon

16:07:37 <pgroth> http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/meeting/2012-02-03

Paul Groth: http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/meeting/2012-02-03

16:07:50 <Zakim> +[IPcaller.a]

Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller.a]

16:08:04 <Curt> 0 (not present)

Curt Tilmes: 0 (not present)

16:08:08 <GK> +1 (I think)

+1 (I think)

16:08:08 <MacTed> +0

Ted Thibodeau: +0

16:08:11 <Mike_> 0 (not present)

Michael Lang: 0 (not present)

16:08:17 <khalidbelhajjame> +1

Khalid Belhajjame: +1

16:08:23 <smiles> +1 (from a very quick look)

Simon Miles: +1 (from a very quick look)

16:08:24 <SamCoppens> +0 (not present)

Sam Coppens: +0 (not present)

16:08:36 <jcheney> +1

James Cheney: +1

16:08:46 <Luc> ACCEPTED: Minutes of the second face to face meeting (F2F2) are approved

RESOLVED: Minutes of the second face to face meeting (F2F2) are approved

16:08:55 <pgroth>    http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/track/actions/open

Paul Groth: http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/track/actions/open

16:09:03 <GK> Open actions

Open actions

16:09:24 <GK> PROV-O - not yet due

PROV-O - not yet due

16:09:54 <GK> Action-63?  Khalid needs more time - con tinues

ACTION-63? Khalid needs more time - con tinues

16:10:07 <GK> Actions 64-67 continue

Actions 64-67 continue

16:10:18 <GK> Action 57 continues

ACTION-57 continues

16:10:18 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - 57

Trackbot IRC Bot: Sorry, couldn't find user - 57

16:10:24 <dgarijo> @Khalid: Jun said she was interested in helping you. Maybe she'll contact you.

Daniel Garijo: @Khalid: Jun said she was interested in helping you. Maybe she'll contact you.

16:10:43 <GK> All please note that next teleconferences 11 mar - 25 Mar are one hour earlier in Europe

All please note that next teleconferences 11 mar - 25 Mar are one hour earlier in Europe

16:10:55 <MacTed> sending .ics files as invitations, based on Boston-local-time, helps get correct times into calendars...

Ted Thibodeau: sending .ics files as invitations, based on Boston-local-time, helps get correct times into calendars...

16:11:08 <GK> NOTE - time shift ONLY for Europe

NOTE - time shift ONLY for Europe

16:11:13 <MacTed> Zakim, unmute me

Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, unmute me

16:11:13 <Zakim> MacTed should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: MacTed should no longer be muted

16:11:20 <pgroth> Timetable for Release

Paul Groth: Timetable for Release

16:11:24 <khalidbelhajjame> @Daniel, yes Jun sent me a document, which I will use in the structure that I ll propose

Khalid Belhajjame: @Daniel, yes Jun sent me a document, which I will use in the structure that I ll propose

16:11:30 <pgroth> Topic: Timetable for Release

2. Timetable for Release

Summary: A revised time table for the working group was presented by the chairs. The working group was reminded that this was an aggressive schedule but could be achieved through focused work.

<pgroth> Summary: A revised time table for the working group was presented by the chairs. The working group was reminded that this was an aggressive schedule but could be achieved through focused work.
16:11:39 <dgarijo> @Khalid: great

Daniel Garijo: @Khalid: great

16:11:55 <pgroth> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0An15kLxkaMA3dFVCWm9aREZFemNOYjlGQjdPRkdFZXc#gid=0

Paul Groth: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0An15kLxkaMA3dFVCWm9aREZFemNOYjlGQjdPRkdFZXc#gid=0

16:12:07 <GK> Timetable for syncronized release of PROV-DM and PROV-O

Timetable for syncronized release of PROV-DM and PROV-O

16:12:41 <GK> Paul: Timetable is very aggressive.

Paul Groth: Timetable is very aggressive.

16:12:47 <Zakim> +Satya_Sahoo

Zakim IRC Bot: +Satya_Sahoo

16:12:53 <GK> .. Many documents will follow same timeline

.. Many documents will follow same timeline

16:13:26 <GK> .. beginning March - aim top have public WD5 at end of March for internal review

.. beginning March - aim top have public WD5 at end of March for internal review

16:13:36 <GK> .. 2-week review period

.. 2-week review period

16:14:19 <GK> .. feedback by ?? April, last call for all specifications at end of May

.. feedback by ?? April, last call for all specifications at end of May

16:14:39 <GK> .. Candidate REC in August

.. Candidate REC in August

16:14:49 <GK> .. Proposed REC in October

.. Proposed REC in October

16:14:55 <GK> .. REC in Jan 2013

.. REC in Jan 2013

16:15:22 <GK> The next document needing to be looked at is PROV-O :

The next document needing to be looked at is PROV-O :

16:15:56 <GK> .. WD2 draft public mid-April, then same timeframe as DM

.. WD2 draft public mid-April, then same timeframe as DM

16:16:48 <GK> .. PROV0-AQ and Primer to follow same procedure as DM and Ont (End Mar internal, April(?) public)

.. PROV0-AQ and Primer to follow same procedure as DM and Ont (End Mar internal, April(?) public)

16:17:08 <pgroth> +q

Paul Groth: +q

16:17:13 <pgroth> q-

Paul Groth: q-

16:17:16 <Luc> q?

Luc Moreau: q?

16:17:18 <smiles> q+

Simon Miles: q+

16:17:20 <GK> Paul: Need to be aggressive in ,making progress, cull topics that inhibit progress.

Paul Groth: Need to be aggressive in ,making progress, cull topics that inhibit progress.

16:18:06 <GK> smiles: what happens after WD3 for Primer and PAQ?

Simon Miles: what happens after WD3 for Primer and PAQ?

16:18:22 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:18:25 <pgroth> ack smiles

Paul Groth: ack smiles

16:18:27 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:18:31 <GK> Paul: those are notes,m can be less aggressive, but need syncronized set for next round.

Paul Groth: those are notes,m can be less aggressive, but need syncronized set for next round.

16:18:37 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:18:53 <pgroth>  PROV-DM

Paul Groth: PROV-DM

16:19:03 <GK> Topic: Update on PROV-DM:

3. Update on PROV-DM:

Summary: Luc presented the current status of the prov-dm and then discussed the plans for WD5 and highlighted the remaining issues left and also that an improved organization would be adopted in the document. The group approved the simplification of specializationOf, alternateOf and hasNote into binary relations.

<pgroth> Summary: Luc presented the current status of the prov-dm and then discussed the plans for WD5 and highlighted the remaining issues left and also that an improved organization would be adopted in the document. The group approved the simplification of specializationOf, alternateOf and hasNote into binary relations.
16:19:41 <GK> Luc: going through comments, have raised issues for each.  This will lead to completion of WD4.

Luc Moreau: going through comments, have raised issues for each. This will lead to completion of WD4.

16:20:36 <pgroth> q/

Paul Groth: q/

16:20:39 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:20:45 <GK> .. plan for WD5 to tackle remaining issues in the charter, (collections, ..., ..., derivation).  Also Jun's comments about structure of DM (why core + common relations).  Edxpect all core technical issues to be addressed by WD5.

.. plan for WD5 to tackle remaining issues in the charter, (collections, ..., ..., derivation). Also Jun's comments about structure of DM (why core + common relations). Edxpect all core technical issues to be addressed by WD5.

16:20:52 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:21:28 <pgroth> http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/index.php?title=ProvDMWorkingDraft5&action=edit&section=2

Paul Groth: http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/index.php?title=ProvDMWorkingDraft5&action=edit&section=2

16:21:33 <GK> Paul: on agenda for 2-3 weeks, proposal for simplifying several relations in DM to make it more compatible with Ontology.

Paul Groth: on agenda for 2-3 weeks, proposal for simplifying several relations in DM to make it more compatible with Ontology.

16:21:43 <pgroth> Proposal: remove id and and attribute from alternateOf, specializationOf, and hasNote

PROPOSED: remove id and and attribute from alternateOf, specializationOf, and hasNote

16:21:56 <tlebo> +1

Timothy Lebo: +1

16:22:00 <dgarijo> +1

Daniel Garijo: +1

16:22:01 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:22:07 <Curt> +1

Curt Tilmes: +1

16:22:07 <GK> alternativeOf, specializationOf, hasNote to be binary relations.

alternativeOf, specializationOf, hasNote to be binary relations.

16:22:15 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:22:17 <GK> q+ to ask if these are still needed?

q+ to ask if these are still needed?

16:22:18 <khalidbelhajjame> +1

Khalid Belhajjame: +1

16:22:22 <Mike_> +1

Michael Lang: +1

16:22:25 <jcheney> q+

James Cheney: q+

16:22:48 <pgroth> ack GK

Paul Groth: ack GK

16:22:48 <Zakim> GK, you wanted to ask if these are still needed?

Zakim IRC Bot: GK, you wanted to ask if these are still needed?

16:23:24 <pgroth> ack jcheney

Paul Groth: ack jcheney

16:23:28 <GK> Paul: will deal with that separately.

Paul Groth: will deal with that separately.

16:23:54 <kai> +1

Kai Eckert: +1

16:23:55 <GK> Jcheney: (can't hear clearly)

James Cheney: (can't hear clearly)

16:24:21 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:24:26 <GK> James asked if binary relations contained typo.  A> yes, there is typo.

James asked if binary relations contained typo. A> yes, there is typo.

16:24:27 <pgroth> Proposal: remove id and and attribute from alternateOf, specializationOf, and hasNote

PROPOSED: remove id and and attribute from alternateOf, specializationOf, and hasNote

16:24:30 <tlebo> +1

Timothy Lebo: +1

16:24:31 <Curt> +1

Curt Tilmes: +1

16:24:32 <jcheney> +1

James Cheney: +1

16:24:32 <smiles> +1

Simon Miles: +1

16:24:32 <MacTed> +1

Ted Thibodeau: +1

16:24:33 <kai> +1

Kai Eckert: +1

16:24:33 <Mike_> +1

Michael Lang: +1

16:24:33 <SamCoppens> +1+1

Sam Coppens: +1+1

16:24:33 <satya> +1

Satya Sahoo: +1

16:24:34 <stephenc> +1

Stephen Cresswell: +1

16:24:36 <dcorsar> +1

David Corsar: +1

16:24:36 <GK> +1

+1

16:24:37 <dgarijo> +1

Daniel Garijo: +1

16:24:39 <zednik> +1

Stephan Zednik: +1

16:24:41 <Paolo> +1

Paolo Missier: +1

16:24:42 <khalidbelhajjame> +1

Khalid Belhajjame: +1

16:24:50 <pgroth> accepted: remove id and and attribute from alternateOf, specializationOf, and hasNote

RESOLVED: remove id and and attribute from alternateOf, specializationOf, and hasNote

16:25:05 <pgroth> Topic: PROV-O

4. PROV-O

Summary: an extensive status review of the prov-o progress was given. Tim presented a system for monitoring alignment based on the ProvRDF mappings page as well as progress in cataloging issues.

<pgroth> Summary: an extensive status review of the prov-o progress was given. Tim presented a system for monitoring alignment based on the ProvRDF mappings page as well as progress in cataloging issues.
16:25:07 <tlebo> http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2012.03.01#PROV-O.27s_prov-wg_telecon_report_2012-03-01

Timothy Lebo: http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2012.03.01#PROV-O.27s_prov-wg_telecon_report_2012-03-01

16:25:11 <GK> Next topic: PROV-O :

Next topic: PROV-O :

16:25:12 <jcheney> @GK: sorry, lots of us are all in same room at Dagstuhl so trying to avoid feedback

James Cheney: @GK: sorry, lots of us are all in same room at Dagstuhl so trying to avoid feedback

16:26:12 <GK> (Missed something) Progress on design for catalogue of examples.  Hoping for this second round to be final structure for examples.

(Missed something) Progress on design for catalogue of examples. Hoping for this second round to be final structure for examples.

16:26:43 <GK> .. issues with alignment between DM, Primer and PROV-O.  Have overview wiki page (link?)

.. issues with alignment between DM, Primer and PROV-O. Have overview wiki page (link?)

16:27:01 <GK> .. fielding issues from reviewers

.. fielding issues from reviewers

16:27:41 <GK> .. planning organization for next rev of prov-o HTML doc, following style of SiOC/FOAF/OPMV...

.. planning organization for next rev of prov-o HTML doc, following style of SiOC/FOAF/OPMV...

16:27:46 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:27:50 <Luc> q+

Luc Moreau: q+

16:28:09 <Luc> q-

Luc Moreau: q-

16:28:17 <GK> Luc: were you going to ask DM people to do something similar.

Luc Moreau: were you going to ask DM people to do something similar.

16:28:40 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:28:43 <GK> Tim: asking for annotations in document to facilitate comparison.  Will send email with details.

Timothy Lebo: asking for annotations in document to facilitate comparison. Will send email with details.

16:28:46 <GK> q+

q+

16:28:51 <pgroth> ack GK

Paul Groth: ack GK

16:29:20 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:29:24 <tlebo> http://aquarius.tw.rpi.edu/prov-wg/provrdf-owl-coverage

Timothy Lebo: http://aquarius.tw.rpi.edu/prov-wg/provrdf-owl-coverage

16:29:35 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:29:41 <GK> Cool :)

Cool :)

16:30:02 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:30:21 <GK> (GK question was about use of services: github for compare and RPI service for formatting; A: yes)

(GK question was about use of services: github for compare and RPI service for formatting; A: yes)

16:30:48 <dgarijo> @tlebo:wasquotedFrom not mentioned?

Daniel Garijo: @tlebo:wasquotedFrom not mentioned?

16:31:00 <tlebo> @gk, the commands in the email thread can be ignored. the wg can focus on the results at http://aquarius.tw.rpi.edu/prov-wg/provrdf-owl-coverage

Timothy Lebo: @gk, the commands in the email thread can be ignored. the wg can focus on the results at http://aquarius.tw.rpi.edu/prov-wg/provrdf-owl-coverage

16:31:29 <GK> Khalid: need to think about minimal ... examples for every concept and property ...

Khalid Belhajjame: need to think about minimal ... examples for every concept and property ...

16:32:00 <GK> ... details to help structure the ontology better.  Also structuring the ontology into "models" - what does this mean?

... details to help structure the ontology better. Also structuring the ontology into "models" - what does this mean?

16:32:13 <GK> @tlebo I was curious about thye tooling :)

@tlebo I was curious about thye tooling :)

16:32:21 <pgroth> Topic: Example Catalog

5. Example Catalog

Summary: Tim presented a comprehensive structure for creating and documenting examples. The group approved this structure and the notion of having such a catalog. Curt, Sam, Mike, Tim and Luc all agreed to populate the catalog.

<pgroth> Summary: Tim presented a comprehensive structure for creating and documenting examples. The group approved this structure and the notion of having such a catalog. Curt, Sam, Mike, Tim and Luc all agreed to populate the catalog.
16:32:32 <GK> Next Topic: example catalogue

Next Topic: example catalogue

16:32:50 <GK> Tim put together a structure for this

Tim put together a structure for this

16:32:53 <tlebo> http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/PROV_examples

Timothy Lebo: http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/PROV_examples

16:34:40 <GK> Tim: link to description of proposed structure.  Section 3 what we're trying to organize, section 4 patterns of organization.  Use number to ensure uniqueness.  Title optional, might change if that helps.  Different directories for different formats.

Timothy Lebo: link to description of proposed structure. Section 3 what we're trying to organize, section 4 patterns of organization. Use number to ensure uniqueness. Title optional, might change if that helps. Different directories for different formats.

16:34:53 <tlebo> http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/prov/file/tip/examples/eg-1/rdf/convert/asn/eg-1.asn

Timothy Lebo: http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/prov/file/tip/examples/eg-1/rdf/convert/asn/eg-1.asn

16:35:38 <GK> .. transcriptions section... above path indicates in and out formats, can be extended across multiple steps

.. transcriptions section... above path indicates in and out formats, can be extended across multiple steps

16:36:04 <GK> .. query directory for query tests; compare for comparing output of queries

.. query directory for query tests; compare for comparing output of queries

16:36:30 <GK> .. document at any level for adding notes

.. document at any level for adding notes

16:37:10 <GK> .. wiki namespace for references to wiki

.. wiki namespace for references to wiki

16:37:33 <GK> .. links to web pages

.. links to web pages

16:37:41 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:37:54 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:38:02 <GK> @tlebo looked good to me first time, and getting better I think :)

@tlebo looked good to me first time, and getting better I think :)

16:38:15 <tlebo> @gk, thanks. More feedback welcome :-)

Timothy Lebo: @gk, thanks. More feedback welcome :-)

16:38:28 <pgroth> Consensus that we adopt this example catalog approach

Paul Groth: Consensus that we adopt this example catalog approach

16:38:31 <Paolo> +1

Paolo Missier: +1

16:38:32 <satya> +1

Satya Sahoo: +1

16:38:33 <smiles> +1 looks good

Simon Miles: +1 looks good

16:38:36 <zednik> +1

Stephan Zednik: +1

16:38:39 <kai> +1

Kai Eckert: +1

16:38:39 <MacTed> +1

Ted Thibodeau: +1

16:38:40 <GK> Chair declares consensus to adopt this approach

Chair declares consensus to adopt this approach

16:39:00 <pgroth> Accepted:  adopt example catalog approach from agenda

RESOLVED: adopt example catalog approach from agenda

16:39:07 <tlebo> thanks, I'll press forward and make some real examples that people can follow.

Timothy Lebo: thanks, I'll press forward and make some real examples that people can follow.

16:39:11 <khalidbelhajjame> Can we add a link to the wiki page created by Tim to the main wiki page

Khalid Belhajjame: Can we add a link to the wiki page created by Tim to the main wiki page

16:39:43 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:39:44 <GK> Paul: call for volunteers to populate with examples

Paul Groth: call for volunteers to populate with examples

16:39:47 <tlebo> +1

Timothy Lebo: +1

16:39:54 <Curt> +1

Curt Tilmes: +1

16:39:55 <SamCoppens> +1

Sam Coppens: +1

16:40:04 <Mike_> +1

Michael Lang: +1

16:40:27 <Luc> +1

Luc Moreau: +1

16:40:35 <pgroth> Volunteers - Curt, Sam, Mike, Tim, Luc

Paul Groth: Volunteers - Curt, Sam, Mike, Tim, Luc

16:40:49 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:40:49 <tlebo> please bug me if you have any questions about the organization.

Timothy Lebo: please bug me if you have any questions about the organization.

16:40:52 <GK> Paul: Others may contribute later!

Paul Groth: Others may contribute later!

16:41:00 <GK> (Slick chairing :)

(Slick chairing :)

16:41:05 <tlebo> q+

Timothy Lebo: q+

16:41:10 <pgroth> ack tlebo

Paul Groth: ack tlebo

16:41:40 <pgroth> Topic: open discussion around accounts

6. open discussion around accounts

Summary: The group had a discussion about revisiting the F2F2 decision around simplification/removal of the account construct. It was agreed that this discussion could be reopened but with the proviso that this discussion not impact progress on the deliverables. It was also suggested that accounts may better be discussed in a note rather than a recommendation to ensure on time delivery.

<pgroth> Summary: The group had a discussion about revisiting the F2F2 decision around simplification/removal of the account construct. It was agreed that this discussion could be reopened but with the proviso that this discussion not impact progress on the deliverables. It was also suggested that accounts may better be discussed in a note rather than a recommendation to ensure on time delivery.
16:41:44 <GK> Tim: asks to revisit F2F decision about accounts - believed we had removed account scoping, but still have bundles.

Timothy Lebo: asks to revisit F2F decision about accounts - believed we had removed account scoping, but still have bundles.

16:41:47 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:42:45 <Luc> q+

Luc Moreau: q+

16:43:16 <GK> GK: had same understanding, but wonderedf if "bundles" might be called "accounts".  But not strong feeling about this.

Graham Klyne: had same understanding, but wonderedf if "bundles" might be called "accounts". But not strong feeling about this.

16:44:01 <GK> Luc: mechanism for giving name to provenance assertions is outside scope of DM.  But assume that mechanism exists.

Luc Moreau: mechanism for giving name to provenance assertions is outside scope of DM. But assume that mechanism exists.

16:44:06 <khalidbelhajjame> That's was my understanding too. When we need to speak about the provenance of a collection of provenance assertions, then we simply use Entity

Khalid Belhajjame: That's was my understanding too. When we need to speak about the provenance of a collection of provenance assertions, then we simply use Entity

16:44:22 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:44:22 <GK> .. would like to see accounts in model, but OIK to compromose.

.. would like to see accounts in model, but OIK to compromose.

16:44:26 <pgroth> ack Luc

Paul Groth: ack Luc

16:44:45 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:44:55 <GK> I recall something along the lines of what Luc said, too (assume mechanism for labeling bundles)

I recall something along the lines of what Luc said, too (assume mechanism for labeling bundles)

16:45:26 <Luc> q+

Luc Moreau: q+

16:45:30 <GK> Paul: fundamentally agreed to make accounts a lot simpler.

Paul Groth: fundamentally agreed to make accounts a lot simpler.

16:45:48 <GK> .. deferred discussion about where the mechanism might lie.

.. deferred discussion about where the mechanism might lie.

16:46:08 <pgroth> ack Luc

Paul Groth: ack Luc

16:46:30 <GK> q+ to say I think the important thing may be to not prohibit private extensions for account-like functionality, but niot necessarily define now.

q+ to say I think the important thing may be to not prohibit private extensions for account-like functionality, but niot necessarily define now.

16:46:32 <tlebo> q+ to say that the can of worms was citing the asserter and having name scopes.

Timothy Lebo: q+ to say that the can of worms was citing the asserter and having name scopes.

16:46:56 <GK> Luc: can we reproduce something similar to what ? did for ?

Luc Moreau: can we reproduce something similar to what ? did for ?

16:47:23 <tlebo> I think Luc was citing http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/ProvRDF#Account

Timothy Lebo: I think Luc was citing http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/ProvRDF#Account

16:47:30 <GK> .. what is the minimal notion of accout we can put in, without getting bogged down in details.

.. what is the minimal notion of accout we can put in, without getting bogged down in details.

16:47:34 <tlebo> q?

Timothy Lebo: q?

16:47:36 <pgroth> ack GK

Paul Groth: ack GK

16:47:36 <Zakim> GK, you wanted to say I think the important thing may be to not prohibit private extensions for account-like functionality, but niot necessarily define now.

Zakim IRC Bot: GK, you wanted to say I think the important thing may be to not prohibit private extensions for account-like functionality, but niot necessarily define now.

16:48:14 <pgroth> ack tlebo

Paul Groth: ack tlebo

16:48:14 <Zakim> tlebo, you wanted to say that the can of worms was citing the asserter and having name scopes.

Zakim IRC Bot: tlebo, you wanted to say that the can of worms was citing the asserter and having name scopes.

16:48:39 <GK> GK: thinks minimal notion of accounts may useful way move forwards

Graham Klyne: thinks minimal notion of accounts may useful way move forwards

16:49:20 <GK> Tim: think accounts are victiome of name scope issue, but minimal notion may avoid this problem, as long as timeline not impacted.

Timothy Lebo: think accounts are victiome of name scope issue, but minimal notion may avoid this problem, as long as timeline not impacted.

16:49:22 <Luc> q+

Luc Moreau: q+

16:49:29 <pgroth> ack Luc

Paul Groth: ack Luc

16:49:58 <GK> Paul: if we can do this without impacting timeline, that's good, but must not cause delay.

Paul Groth: if we can do this without impacting timeline, that's good, but must not cause delay.

16:50:06 <pgroth> q?

Paul Groth: q?

16:50:10 <GK> Luc: we could produce a NOTE on accounts if time runs out

Luc Moreau: we could produce a NOTE on accounts if time runs out

16:50:38 <smiles> bye

Simon Miles: bye

16:50:40 <GK> Meeting closed.

Meeting closed.

16:50:42 <Zakim> -[IPcaller]

Zakim IRC Bot: -[IPcaller]

16:50:43 <Zakim> -tlebo

Zakim IRC Bot: -tlebo

16:50:44 <dgarijo> bye

Daniel Garijo: bye

16:50:47 <Zakim> -MacTed

Zakim IRC Bot: -MacTed

16:50:49 <Zakim> -Satya_Sahoo

Zakim IRC Bot: -Satya_Sahoo

16:50:51 <Zakim> -??P22

Zakim IRC Bot: -??P22

16:50:53 <Zakim> -khalidbelhajjame

Zakim IRC Bot: -khalidbelhajjame

16:50:55 <Zakim> -Curt_Tilmes

Zakim IRC Bot: -Curt_Tilmes

16:50:57 <Zakim> -??P36

Zakim IRC Bot: -??P36

16:51:01 <Zakim> -[IPcaller.a]

Zakim IRC Bot: -[IPcaller.a]

16:51:03 <Zakim> -Sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: -Sandro

16:51:07 <Zakim> - +1.443.708.aaaa

Zakim IRC Bot: - +1.443.708.aaaa

16:51:13 <Zakim> -SamCoppens

Zakim IRC Bot: -SamCoppens

16:51:17 <pgroth> rrsagent, set log public

Paul Groth: rrsagent, set log public

16:51:22 <pgroth> rrsagent, draft minutes

Paul Groth: rrsagent, draft minutes

16:51:22 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/03/01-prov-minutes.html pgroth

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/03/01-prov-minutes.html pgroth

16:51:23 <Zakim> -??P30

Zakim IRC Bot: -??P30

16:51:29 <pgroth> trackbot, end telcon

Paul Groth: trackbot, end telcon

16:51:29 <trackbot> Zakim, list attendees

Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, list attendees

16:51:36 <GK> @paul: are you Ok from here - have meeting to retrun to now

@paul: are you Ok from here - have meeting to retrun to now

16:51:37 <trackbot> RRSAgent, please draft minutes

Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, please draft minutes

16:51:37 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/03/01-prov-minutes.html trackbot

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/03/01-prov-minutes.html trackbot

16:51:38 <trackbot> RRSAgent, bye

Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, bye

16:51:38 <RRSAgent> I see no action items

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I see no action items

16:51:39 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been tlebo, +1.443.708.aaaa, SamCoppens, Curt_Tilmes, MacTed, Sandro, GK, [IPcaller], khalidbelhajjame, Satya_Sahoo

Zakim IRC Bot: As of this point the attendees have been tlebo, +1.443.708.aaaa, SamCoppens, Curt_Tilmes, MacTed, Sandro, GK, [IPcaller], khalidbelhajjame, Satya_Sahoo



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